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Offlineoverthrow
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Low on spores, safest way?
    #23466711 - 07/22/16 04:54 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

This is my first time cultivating shrooms and I started the whole process by sending a letter to Free Spore Ring Earth. It took a month before I received the B+ spore print back.

In the meantime, I spent a lot of time reading through this forum to gather information and be prepared for when I actually had the print. I collected every item required for the PF Tek with the exception of the 1/2 pint jars which simply do not exist where I live (I've looked everywhere online and on multiple stores). So instead I bought regular glasses and I'm using aluminum foil + rubber bands to seal.

I have also built a glovebox which seems to have turned out really well.

And, I have the required items to make this liquid culture. I'd be using honey instead of Karo though since I've read it works.

Now...

The spore print that I got back is really small. I have not yet opened it so I don't know if it is any good. I've already sent them another letter and am going to buy prints online now that I know I can actually receive them here without a problem. However, it will take at least a month before I have a chance to put my hands on another print.

I am as of right now steaming (90min on regular pan) the BRF glasses + a shot glass also topped with aluminum foil that I will remove once inside the GB. The recipe of 2 cups vermiculte, 1 cup BRF and 1 cup water gave me exactly two glasses instead of 4-5 jars as per the tut.

Will that be a problem?

And, considering I have limited spores, the options that I can think of are:
#1 Make the liquid culture first so I have more room to screw up later (considering I don't fuck this up)
#2 Inoculate these two glasses (and if I have any left then I do #1).

I guess my main question is what are the chances of success of #1 or #2 in my specific case? Other ideas?



Edited by overthrow (07/22/16 08:42 PM)


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Offlinemrmazdarx9
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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: overthrow]
    #23466757 - 07/22/16 05:09 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

How big are those glasses there is a reason they fill 4-5 jars because large jars tend to stall with that amount of Pf mix I can usually do 4-5 half pint jars with a bit to spare
Where do you live I struggled with jars in UK but jam jars pretty much the same as the american ball/Kerr jars plus I just found ball jars cheap enough for me to buy 40 quid for 18 nearly 2 quid a jar ain't too bad


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Edited by mrmazdarx9 (07/22/16 05:36 PM)


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Offlinelukehighwalker710
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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: mrmazdarx9] * 1
    #23466777 - 07/22/16 05:18 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

I don't know anything about the PF tek so I can't help ya there..

But a glovebox is outdated equipment, nowadays cultivators use an SAB (still air box) which is similar but without the gloves attached because they cause more problems than good.

The print is plenty big, no matter how big it really is. First, don't open it until in a proper SAB and ready to be used. But there are enough spores on one print to make many syringes! You just need a tiny scraping off the orint to work with.

Spores to LC is (almost) guaranteed to have problems. The proper way to start an LC is with agar which is how I suggest you go about germinating your spores in the first place. Then transfer till you have clean growth. Then you can start and LC or Li if you wanted.

Invest in a pressure cooker!!! Seriously.

Edit: if you're trying to make cakes in a drinking glass with a tinfoil lid you're destined for failure. You need to do a lot more reading, and get the proper equipment ready.


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Edited by lukehighwalker710 (07/22/16 05:20 PM)


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Offlinespacechildo
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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: lukehighwalker710]
    #23466936 - 07/22/16 06:01 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

follow www.mushroomvideos.com vid 1-4 and do it right, that's the easiest way to guarantee at least 1 mushroom to print and do more grows with!


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Offlineoverthrow
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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: spacechildo]
    #23467119 - 07/22/16 07:04 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

The glasses are about 400ml.

I have spent a full month looking for the 1/2 pint wide mouth jars and they definitely do not exist where I live. I have looked online, in specialized stores as well as in the grocery store for products that come in jars that I could possibly use and absolutely none of them would work for not being shoulderless.

I will have to work with whatever the second best solution is, even if I have to buy smaller glasses or whatever. I'll be in the US in December and will bring jars from there.

Also I have read that the ideal definitely is to have a PC and I will surely invest in a good one eventually but for now I'll have to make do with a regular pan. I've read that for the PF Tek it is completely viable to do a 90min roll and I guess I could watch my BRF glasses without inoculating just to see if nasty things grow out of them.

As for the glove box, I had no idea, I'll look into it. I can easily detach the gloves and make adjustments.

Considering that my glasses might be too big and the growth might stop, I am pending on going with this other LC tek that I just found.


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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: overthrow]
    #23467182 - 07/22/16 07:19 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

jars should be around 250mL / 1 cup and be as tall as they are wide.
everything you need to know about SABs is in the videos.


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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: spacechildo]
    #23467239 - 07/22/16 07:35 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Why not just scrape some of the spores into a jar of sterilized water and suck up the spore laden water in a syringe and use that to nocc your cakes? I feel like that'd be safer than going to LC, where the nutrients and sugars can allow bacteria and contams to flourish. Also, you can get plastic (pp5) jars and lids and use those, however I don't know about boiling them just PCing. But whatever you use, it needs to have a proper fitting lid.


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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: lukehighwalker710]
    #23467438 - 07/22/16 08:33 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

The answers here have been really helpful so far but I'm still kinda lost. In the LC tek that I just linked to he mentions his first grow ever starting with a LC.

My cakes are probably too big and of course not the best solution which would have been the jars. I'm still pissed about not being able to find them here. However, I have seen a video  (check below @ 6m40s) where the dude is using 3 sheets of aluminum foil on a jar so I thought a glass should do the trick too.

That's why I am still pending on trying the LC so I can fuck up later. Earlier replies made me rather pessimistic about trying the cakes. In case I don't have enough to inoculate them + make the LC at least I'll leave one to see if I would have had contamination.

Also for a noob it's kind of tricky to know what is outdated and what is the norm. I totally had no clue about the glovebox. Now I am really curious why no gloves attached is better and I will do the research before I prepare to make the syringe tomorrow.

By the way I watched the videos on www.mushroomvideos.com multiple times. It just sucks that I can't follow them 100% for living in a place where I can't find shit. It would have been a no brainer if I had the right containers.



Edited by overthrow (07/22/16 08:38 PM)


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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: overthrow]
    #23467686 - 07/22/16 10:04 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

You should really look into agar you can stretch those spores out to months and months worth of grows ... and Goto Amazon.com for the proper jars idk where you live but Amazon has all you need and if you get a PC get either the 16 or 23 quart they are from 60-96$ on there


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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: Boogieman47]
    #23468159 - 07/23/16 01:18 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Do not try to use LC to stretch out spores, that is not the purpose.  Use agar to stretch out spores, and use that to incoulate LC.


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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: Inocuole]
    #23468281 - 07/23/16 03:09 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Use SAB.

Make spore syringe as its the easiest way for noobs not lc but if you can use agar then go for it.

Did you find perlite?

Good luck mate


Edited by oontribe (07/23/16 03:10 AM)


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Offlineoverthrow
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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: oontribe]
    #23468329 - 07/23/16 05:21 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Yes, I have found perlite here but no use until I have the cakes ready.


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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: overthrow]
    #23468335 - 07/23/16 05:32 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Guys thanks for all the answers. So I've learnt the best/safest way is agar using a SAB.

And yes I know how important a PC is. However I've read in different places + seen in the RogerRabbit videos him using a regular pot to steam for 90min. Now, I know I am a noob but the dude knows what he is doing and apparently for the PF Tek it is not absolutely necessary. In his videos he does use a SAB and it was my mistake to think that he could do that for being a pro. Still on my list to get a PC though.


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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: overthrow]
    #23468345 - 07/23/16 05:40 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

overthrow said:
Guys thanks for all the answers. So I've learnt the best/safest way is agar using a SAB.

And yes I know how important a PC is. However I've read in different places + seen in the RogerRabbit videos him using a regular pot to steam for 90min. Now, I know I am a noob but the dude knows what he is doing and apparently for the PF Tek it is not absolutely necessary. In his videos he does use a SAB and it was my mistake to think that he could do that for being a pro. Still on my list to get a PC though.



That's the point though mate he does know what he's doing its better for a newbie to PC it'll give you a much better chance of success


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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: mrmazdarx9]
    #23468356 - 07/23/16 05:50 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

You can make agar without a pressure cooker too.

If i were you i would find some agar agar first of all, find a recipe that suits you. Easiest would be something like Yeast+agaragar+malt extract or PDYA.

those ingredients are super easy to find in any town, you'll have to get petri dishes or do it the pasty way:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/19208976

So..

spore print -> LC -> 2 options Failure/Win the way i see it :shrug:
Spore print -> agar -> infinite options such as clean LC, LI and whatever

Should also say if you go the agar way, then you will be able to use that B+ print for 1000's of jars


Edited by Yerow (07/23/16 05:52 AM)


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Offlinemrmazdarx9
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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: Yerow]
    #23468358 - 07/23/16 05:52 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Or just buy some premade PDA its not expensive really to have a play with before making your own in large quantities buying all the ingredients and equipment


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Edited by mrmazdarx9 (07/23/16 05:53 AM)


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Offlinespacechildo
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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: overthrow]
    #23468476 - 07/23/16 07:30 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

overthrow said:
Guys thanks for all the answers. So I've learnt the best/safest way is agar using a SAB.

And yes I know how important a PC is. However I've read in different places + seen in the RogerRabbit videos him using a regular pot to steam for 90min. Now, I know I am a noob but the dude knows what he is doing and apparently for the PF Tek it is not absolutely necessary. In his videos he does use a SAB and it was my mistake to think that he could do that for being a pro. Still on my list to get a PC though.




you dont need a PC for pf-tek but you really dont need agar for it either.


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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: spacechildo]
    #23469415 - 07/23/16 02:00 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

That's not why we are telling him to get all the stuff he was trying to put his only spore print straight into LC


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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: Boogieman47]
    #23469506 - 07/23/16 02:35 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Today I made two 10cc syringes using a bit less than half of the print. I had no idea whether it would be packed or what. It was a very decent print of a very small shroom.

So in the end I might be able to try all of the above and if I fail everything including the syringes I can still make, then I guess I need the month's wait to do more research and equipment improvement.

Learning about agar now and also I might have to move away from cakes and maybe think of grains or something else since I definitely can find jars, just not the ones appropriate for the PF Tek.


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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: overthrow]
    #23469520 - 07/23/16 02:41 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Goto Amazon.com can't you order from there where you live ?


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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: overthrow]
    #23469547 - 07/23/16 02:50 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Get yourself a PC and make some small jars or bottles of sterilized water, and scrape about a square centimeter of the print into it to make syringes with. I use sterilized flat tip toothpicks for this. About 100 to 200ml of water to about 1 square cm of print is a good ratio for a beginner. The PC will also allow you to make agar dishes and grain jars properly. Patience is a virtue in mycology, better to wait and do it right that rush and have an epic fail.


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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: Eywa_devotee]
    #23469613 - 07/23/16 03:04 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

A pencil-tip sized dot per syringe would've been better.  A quarter of a print per syringe is a bit much..


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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: overthrow]
    #23469632 - 07/23/16 03:11 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

overthrow said:
Today I made two 10cc syringes using a bit less than half of the print. I had no idea whether it would be packed or what. It was a very decent print of a very small shroom.

Learning about agar now and also I might have to move away from cakes and maybe think of grains or something else since I definitely can find jars, just not the ones appropriate for the PF Tek.




1 print should make 20 syringes easily, less is more when it comes to spore inoculation.

yeah agar usually means grains, but you dont NEED wide mouth canning jars, you dont even have to birth the cakes you can just open the lid and put them in the sgfc!
just try to find jars that are about as tall as they are wide, those gives the fastest colonization and doesnt stall as often as taller ones do.


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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: overthrow]
    #23469642 - 07/23/16 03:13 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Fuckkkk yeaaahh, i started the exact same way, used FSRE (they are saints in sporetorn areas) and even chose B+ :offthehook:

Don't sell yourself short, agar is definitely the way to stretch spores and cultures and is necessary (extremely helpful) down the line.
( https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/19208976 , https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21922023

I'd personally choose to make Liquid Inoculant to shoot up your cakes with over making a LC
( https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/20429745 , https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22833314 )
Once you get into agar this hobby gets really fun.


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Edited by MysticMoteToter (07/23/16 03:16 PM)


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Offlineoverthrow
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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: MysticMoteToter]
    #23470151 - 07/23/16 06:14 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Ordering is fine, receiving is not. A couple of months ago my friend in the US sent me 2 t-shirts as a gift and they got stuck in customs after over a month. They tax anything above 25USD if I remember well and the volume of packages is big so it is a major cluster fuck to even pay for the taxes and receive anything from abroad. My friend asked for the package to be returned and sent it to my home country instead where it arrived in two weeks at my parents place just fine, no hassle.

Also my roommate from the US once ordered something online that came from Korea or China and even though I received the required notice letter that the package was in customs (which I did not for the t-shirts), I could not go get it for him and pay the taxes for him because it was on his name and he had already returned to the US when it got here and he wouldn't be back for a few months.

I'm going to be in my home country for a month in October and could try then, but most likely will wait until December to get them in the US.

There must be other teks that I can follow 100% that do not require shoulderless jars so that's what I am thinking I'll do for now even though I am sure I'll need a PC but am fine with that.


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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: MysticMoteToter]
    #23470179 - 07/23/16 06:24 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks for the incentive MysticMoteToter!

I am definitely sold on the usefulness of agar and it's my next project before I even try another tek.

My next choices of strains are golden teacher, thai and brazil. Let's see what they send me next time.


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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: Eywa_devotee]
    #23470219 - 07/23/16 06:37 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks for the tip... as a noob you just feel the need to actually see the spores in the water and I get it now that I had/have a very decent print and didn't have to worry about that. Will buy more syringes and use way less this time. I'm using bottled distilled water for now but as I put my hands on a PC, it sure seems a lot more practical to just do it in the final recipient, scrape the spores and suck it in :smile:


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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: Inocuole]
    #23470229 - 07/23/16 06:42 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Can too many spores cause a problem? I've seen in videos/pics of spore syringe suppliers and some of them come really packed to the point you have to break it up and water gets dark. Wondering if that is more of a marketing thing than it is practical.


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Re: Low on spores, safest way? [Re: overthrow]
    #23470240 - 07/23/16 06:45 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Stop bumping your thread. It's hard to respond to a question when 3 new ones popup instantly. It's also against the rules.

You can do BRF in shouldered jars. You just can't birth it. Simply leave the cake in the jar, case the top and fruit from the top. It does fine.

Top fruited brf cakes



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