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Mrcloudy
Stranger than you.


Registered: 10/01/13
Posts: 2,889
Loc: Northeast US
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Plastination as a way to preserve mushrooms.
#23426831 - 07/09/16 02:30 PM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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For some time now I have been working on some ideas for the long term preservation of fungi.
The basic idea behind plastination is to remove the water from the specimen and replace it with a liquid polymer usually a resin of some sort which is then cured. I have experimented with using various different different resins and come up with my own process for using wax in place of a liquid resin.
Left to right, Polyester, silicone, and acrylic, the bottom specimen was done using a wax mixture.

Paraffin and polyethylene wax plastination

Megacollybia rodmanii slice plastinated and encased in polyester.

Typically plastination is done with silicone resin, but silicone is rather expensive the the plastination process with silicone can take over a month. So I have been heavily experimenting with alternatives. The process itself is pretty straight forward, you dehydrate the specimens through a standard acetone or alcohol dehydration method until little or no water is left, then you submerge the specimen in resin and place in a vacuum chamber, you carefully control the vacuum to evaporate the solvent and draw the plastic into the voids. This process is slow and tedious. But it results in a specimen that is resistant to rot and holds the shape it had when it was fresh. There is some issues with color and shrinkage depending on what material is used but I am working on solving those issues
If the admins think this belongs in a different forum, by all means feel free to move it. I posted it here because the advanced mycology forum is a bit dead and the hunting and identification forum is the closest thing to a general mycology forum on this site.
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10 different Ganoderma species from across the USA AMU MrCloudys guide to North American GanodermaUpdated A rough guide to North American Ganoderma species, with an emphasis on the laccate species.
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ToxicMan
Bite me, it's fun!


Registered: 06/28/02
Posts: 6,725
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Re: Plastination as a way to preserve mushrooms. [Re: Mrcloudy]
#23427272 - 07/09/16 05:46 PM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Keep this up, and keep us posted on how it's going. It would be great to be able to preserve some collections in a natural-appearing state for display and educational purposes.
I don't know what you've investigated as far as prevention of color changes, but one possible area of research would be to look into the preservatives that are used in canning. They need to make what they can look appetizing - who wants to eat stuff that's discolored?
-------------------- Happy mushrooming!
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xzylocybin
Stranger



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Re: Plastination as a way to preserve mushrooms. [Re: ToxicMan]
#23427301 - 07/09/16 05:59 PM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Dude! plasticized amanita muscaria pin necklaces, you could make a killing at hippie festies
a plasticized psilocybe cyanescen necklace would be awesome , maybe little wavy capped ones upside down for earings
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NothingsChanged
Striving for Excellence


Registered: 05/28/11
Posts: 10,207
Loc: North/Western WA
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Re: Plastination as a way to preserve mushrooms. [Re: xzylocybin]
#23427608 - 07/09/16 08:00 PM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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cool. I've seen spore prints incased in some kind of resin and made into necklaces. Keep us updated please. thanks
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Mrcloudy
Stranger than you.


Registered: 10/01/13
Posts: 2,889
Loc: Northeast US
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Re: Plastination as a way to preserve mushrooms. [Re: ToxicMan]
#23427728 - 07/09/16 08:56 PM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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So far the color change seems mostly from the physical properties of what ever resin I am using. Silicone has the color closest to being true. But the silicone is a tricky process that I need to modify my system to be able to successfully do more of it. Polyester and wax both add transparency to the specimen making it translucent and darkening the color. I am currently experimenting with different additives to alter the resin properties to see if the color change can be mitigated.
Polyester renders morels quite transparent.


I have already figured out a way to reduce the transparency of the wax method. This particular species has a hollow stem which collapses when the pressure is returned to normal after the vacuum process is complete, so I came up with a protocol to prevent this collapse, I tried both solutions on the specimen on the left and both worked. The mushroom kept its shape and is far less translucent than my first one on the right.
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10 different Ganoderma species from across the USA AMU MrCloudys guide to North American GanodermaUpdated A rough guide to North American Ganoderma species, with an emphasis on the laccate species.
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NothingsChanged
Striving for Excellence


Registered: 05/28/11
Posts: 10,207
Loc: North/Western WA
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Re: Plastination as a way to preserve mushrooms. [Re: Mrcloudy]
#23428029 - 07/09/16 11:28 PM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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bloodycarcass
Stranger Danger



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Re: Plastination as a way to preserve mushrooms. [Re: NothingsChanged]
#23428446 - 07/10/16 05:48 AM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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I know of a few people who are big in arts and craft, would probably buy some if you were selling any
-------------------- Back at it like a crack addict, with asthmatic lung disease
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lovelaughlibs
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Re: Plastination as a way to preserve mushrooms. [Re: bloodycarcass]
#23428488 - 07/10/16 06:34 AM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Very interesting, how long would you say this method lasts compared to more orthodox methods?
-------------------- Ask and ye shall receive; Seek and ye shall find.
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laughingsol
Dirt Farmer


Registered: 01/01/12
Posts: 389
Loc: The beautiful hills of Io...
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Re: Plastination as a way to preserve mushrooms. [Re: lovelaughlibs]
#23433600 - 07/11/16 10:36 PM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Inspirational. Commendations once again cloudy.
-------------------- Be Well, Be Blessed Trade List
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Matai


Registered: 05/04/14
Posts: 1,016
Loc: NZ
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Re: Plastination as a way to preserve mushrooms. [Re: laughingsol]
#23433889 - 07/12/16 02:01 AM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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That's really cool. What do you use for a vacuum chamber?
-------------------- All that we see or seem Is but a dream within a dream
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Mrcloudy
Stranger than you.


Registered: 10/01/13
Posts: 2,889
Loc: Northeast US
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Re: Plastination as a way to preserve mushrooms. [Re: Matai]
#23436116 - 07/12/16 09:03 PM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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I purchased a vacuum chamber from ebay from a company going out of business so the price was not too bad, unfortunately the solvent, acetone used in the process is incredibly harsh on the acrylic lid so I have had to get creative with protective measures. Some of the processes require a vacuum time of up to a week so that is a lot of acetone exposure and actually caused my silicone experiment to be cut short. I am also using various mason jars with modified lids for smaller experiments, mostly those involving wax so the jar can sit in a hot water bath keeping the wax melted during the process.
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10 different Ganoderma species from across the USA AMU MrCloudys guide to North American GanodermaUpdated A rough guide to North American Ganoderma species, with an emphasis on the laccate species.
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Matai


Registered: 05/04/14
Posts: 1,016
Loc: NZ
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Re: Plastination as a way to preserve mushrooms. [Re: Mrcloudy]
#23436721 - 07/13/16 12:56 AM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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What sort of a vacuum chamber is it? Does it have a dedicated roughing pump? And what sort of pressures do you need to get down to? I work a little with vacuum stuff, so there's a bit of professional curiosity on my end.
Acetone is a bit of a gnarly solvent for plastics and acrylics, yeah. Could you possibly use anhydrous isopropyl alcohol or something similar instead? You can wash most plastics with IPA no worries.
-------------------- All that we see or seem Is but a dream within a dream
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fry day


Registered: 07/19/13
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Re: Plastination as a way to preserve mushrooms. [Re: Matai]
#23445428 - 07/15/16 10:40 PM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Mrcloudy, this is fucking amazing.
I want. I'll build your ecommerce website to hawk these if you send me a few. And host it. I've been doing that for almost 20 yrs.
SRSLY
This kinda made my day. ;-) Though I do confess to imbibing a few ales when I haven't done any alc for ages.
-------------------- "Shrub, 30-90 cm. Leaves 2.5-) 4-9 cm, sessile or amplexicaul, broadly ovate to ovate-oblong, obtuse or rounded to subapiculate or subacute, when crushed not smelling of goats." "The initial quake was a 6.6 but fairly shallow. I felt it as a prolonged up and down vibration followed by a jolt forward and then to the left, like square dancing."
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Gwenpool
Stranger



Registered: 05/17/16
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Re: Plastination as a way to preserve mushrooms. [Re: fry day]
#23445945 - 07/16/16 04:33 AM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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I want a wax cube lol
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Mrcloudy
Stranger than you.


Registered: 10/01/13
Posts: 2,889
Loc: Northeast US
Last seen: 4 months, 20 days
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Re: Plastination as a way to preserve mushrooms. [Re: Matai]
#23451896 - 07/18/16 05:33 AM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Matai said: What sort of a vacuum chamber is it? Does it have a dedicated roughing pump? And what sort of pressures do you need to get down to? I work a little with vacuum stuff, so there's a bit of professional curiosity on my end.
Acetone is a bit of a gnarly solvent for plastics and acrylics, yeah. Could you possibly use anhydrous isopropyl alcohol or something similar instead? You can wash most plastics with IPA no worries.
Its an aluminum vacuum chamber with an acrylic, or possibly polycarbonate lid. A single stage rotary vane pump. It does not need too strong of a vacuum, though i'd like to get a bit lower than I do. Right now my pump pulls down about 28 inches of mercury, with certain plastics though I cant go below 29.5 so it works out ok.
Alcohol works but is said to cause some shrinkage. I am experimenting a little bit replacing the acetone with denatured ethanol.
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10 different Ganoderma species from across the USA AMU MrCloudys guide to North American GanodermaUpdated A rough guide to North American Ganoderma species, with an emphasis on the laccate species.
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Mrcloudy
Stranger than you.


Registered: 10/01/13
Posts: 2,889
Loc: Northeast US
Last seen: 4 months, 20 days
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Re: Plastination as a way to preserve mushrooms. [Re: fry day]
#23451899 - 07/18/16 05:39 AM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
fry day said: Mrcloudy, this is fucking amazing.
I want. I'll build your ecommerce website to hawk these if you send me a few. And host it. I've been doing that for almost 20 yrs.
SRSLY
This kinda made my day. ;-) Though I do confess to imbibing a few ales when I haven't done any alc for ages.
I might take you up on that if I get into production, right now I am focusing on producing some specimens of reasonable quality to fulfill donations since my project is mostly funded by crowdfunding. So far I don't really have anything that I consider high enough quality to send off except maybe the sheet plastinate and the silicone morel. Sheet plastination is easy but the silicone is tricky, it took several months to fully cure, but is actually finally cured and looks great even though I had to cut the impregnation short. I do plan on embedding full plastinated specimens into blocks of polyester resin once I get some decent molds. Full specimens produce some stunning results. I just need to get some better molds.
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10 different Ganoderma species from across the USA AMU MrCloudys guide to North American GanodermaUpdated A rough guide to North American Ganoderma species, with an emphasis on the laccate species.
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Mrcloudy
Stranger than you.


Registered: 10/01/13
Posts: 2,889
Loc: Northeast US
Last seen: 4 months, 20 days
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Re: Plastination as a way to preserve mushrooms. [Re: lovelaughlibs]
#23451901 - 07/18/16 05:45 AM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
lovelaughlibs said: Very interesting, how long would you say this method lasts compared to more orthodox methods?
They will last indefinitely, At least the ones that cure properly, the polyester morels above seem to draw moisture and get flexible on humid days but I have some ideas i'd like to try to fully cure the polyester. It is tricky since you have to apply the hardener to the outside and hope it works its way in deep enough to be effective. The wax specimen seems to get soft during exceptionally hot (90+) weather, but it is also a very fragile mushroom with a hollow stem, a thicker mushroom won't be affected so much.
The colors may fade with time and some plastics have a tendency to yellow over the years so it will be interesting to see how the embedded specimens hold up.
I am thinking of waxing some of the more interesting specimens in my Ganoderma herbarium before insects get to them. I think they will become more art pieces then though as the wax modifies the look and texture of the tissue to the point it becomes useless taxonomically but I think microscopy would be largely unaffected within reason.
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10 different Ganoderma species from across the USA AMU MrCloudys guide to North American GanodermaUpdated A rough guide to North American Ganoderma species, with an emphasis on the laccate species.
Edited by Mrcloudy (07/18/16 05:47 AM)
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leschampignons
Biochemistry + Mycology



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Re: Plastination as a way to preserve mushrooms. [Re: Mrcloudy]
#23452870 - 07/18/16 01:01 PM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Thayendanegea
quiet walker



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Re: Plastination as a way to preserve mushrooms. [Re: leschampignons]
#23453072 - 07/18/16 02:11 PM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Pretty cool stuff Cloudy.
-------------------- Look Deep Into Nature,and Then You Will Understand Everything Better. Albert Einstein
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catnip40
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Re: Plastination as a way to preserve mushrooms. [Re: Mrcloudy]
#23893109 - 12/04/16 08:13 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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sorry for bumping an old post but it's very interesting and i don't want to lose this thread
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