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Offlinetopdog82
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Safety of pranayamas?
    #23433841 - 07/12/16 01:02 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Hey so I have been doing yoga and meditation daily for a while. I ended up adding pranayama' to my daily routine for a bit. Doing all three when I have time led to some PROFOUNDLY deep states of meditation. Probably some of the deepest states I have experienced

Anyways; I was wondering if it was "safe"? I decided to stop pranayams completely as you are basically playing with your bodies' energies and toying with some serious stuff. I feel it's something you can't just jump into casually

Organizations like the art of living teach pranayamas openly and they seem to enhance ppl's health. But I feel that these excercises were taught teacher to student in a context where the teacher understood the student and the students' body very well. I get mixed advice on the net

I was looking up ab/core excercises on the net to add into my fitness routine. This link was where I ended up
https://yogainternational.com/article/view/guide-to-agni-sara

And I feel that some sources portray pranayamas as "for everyone" and others are a little more cautionary in tone. What is a definitive guide/set of guidelines to find which ones work for me?


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Offlinetopdog82
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Re: Safety of pranayamas? [Re: topdog82]
    #23433845 - 07/12/16 01:08 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Apologies; I should have specified. I was looking up core excercises and began reading about the stomach "vaccum". It's a legit core movement. Doing multiple holds and pumps works the core like fuck

And then I read it was found in yoga. Looked it up and that was how I found out about Agni sara


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OfflineChakra Shock
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Re: Safety of pranayamas? [Re: topdog82]
    #23439371 - 07/13/16 10:33 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

topdog82 said:

Organizations like the art of living teach pranayamas openly and they seem to enhance ppl's health. But I feel that these excercises were taught teacher to student in a context where the teacher understood the student and the students' body very well. I get mixed advice on the net






Precisely, for deeper pranayama it's entirely encouraged to have an instructor.
You summed up the risks of pranayama well, it's a delicate system of ours, and breathing that deeply and that slowly will not only alter our blood oxygenation and brain chemistry, but it can also effect your nervous system. Too much of it can lead to complications with the expansive consciousness, it's just that powerful. Then of course oxygenation levels are important as well, the body can only take so much of that kind of breathing. It takes preparing the body and mind gradually over a long period of time, like years, to really benefit from the deeper pranayama.

I think if you just stick to the beginner routines, and really pay attention to your body / mind, then you could gradually increase the intensity, just don't over do it.

I'm sure I need a refresher on all of this info too, I'm typing this off of memory from a yoga university I attended for a month in Bengaluru, India.

best of luck!  :bunnypeace:


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Offlinetopdog82
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Re: Safety of pranayamas? [Re: Chakra Shock]
    #23439754 - 07/14/16 01:06 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Chakra Shock said:
Quote:

topdog82 said:

Organizations like the art of living teach pranayamas openly and they seem to enhance ppl's health. But I feel that these excercises were taught teacher to student in a context where the teacher understood the student and the students' body very well. I get mixed advice on the net






Precisely, for deeper pranayama it's entirely encouraged to have an instructor.
You summed up the risks of pranayama well, it's a delicate system of ours, and breathing that deeply and that slowly will not only alter our blood oxygenation and brain chemistry, but it can also effect your nervous system. Too much of it can lead to complications with the expansive consciousness, it's just that powerful. Then of course oxygenation levels are important as well, the body can only take so much of that kind of breathing. It takes preparing the body and mind gradually over a long period of time, like years, to really benefit from the deeper pranayama.

I think if you just stick to the beginner routines, and really pay attention to your body / mind, then you could gradually increase the intensity, just don't over do it.

I'm sure I need a refresher on all of this info too, I'm typing this off of memory from a yoga university I attended for a month in Bengaluru, India.

best of luck!  :bunnypeace:



Well in that case, it is best I just stick with the yoga excercises. Best not to play with fire. Unless I get a proper teacher etc.

Thanks


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InvisibleRepertoire89
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Re: Safety of pranayamas? [Re: topdog82]
    #23440985 - 07/14/16 02:02 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Eh, I don't think you need to worry about it.

I've practiced pranayama for the better part of a decade
As well as classical vocal exercises, which are essentially the same thing

This means there are often 10hr periods of time with extremely controlled breathing, taking 2 or 3 breaths in a minute, large output of diaphragmatic force, all kinds of contortions of the pulmonary system up to the facial mask and the crown of the head.

No issues, just feel better the longer and more often I practice.




If you want to stay on the safe side, just stick to basic concepts.

Personally my view of extremist monks is negative. Doing asanas and breathing exercises all day, eating 500 calories, abstaining from sex, etc.
Distractions from living out your dharma.
Distractions from going within.
Distractions from bringing what you find in communion out.

The basic concepts are effective for what the whole practice is worth, and they're not dangerous.


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Offlinetopdog82
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Re: Safety of pranayamas? [Re: Repertoire89]
    #23442161 - 07/14/16 09:29 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Repertoire89 said:
Eh, I don't think you need to worry about it.

I've practiced pranayama for the better part of a decade
As well as classical vocal exercises, which are essentially the same thing

This means there are often 10hr periods of time with extremely controlled breathing, taking 2 or 3 breaths in a minute, large output of diaphragmatic force, all kinds of contortions of the pulmonary system up to the facial mask and the crown of the head.

No issues, just feel better the longer and more often I practice.




If you want to stay on the safe side, just stick to basic concepts.

Personally my view of extremist monks is negative. Doing asanas and breathing exercises all day, eating 500 calories, abstaining from sex, etc.
Distractions from living out your dharma.
Distractions from going within.
Distractions from bringing what you find in communion out.

The basic concepts are effective for what the whole practice is worth, and they're not dangerous.



Ya thats what I am doing. I am sticking with the basics so to speak. Nothing overbearing or complex


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OfflineTheSheph
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Re: Safety of pranayamas? [Re: topdog82]
    #23442317 - 07/14/16 10:22 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Very interesting topic. My wifey is a yogini and when she has led me through certain sequences I find that the pranayama can bring me to very strange feelings. It's hard to describe, but I'll try anyway, lol. I feel like I am too aware, almost like I am in a state that is more real or fake than the normal state my mind exists in on a normal basis. It is at times fairly uncomfortable, like I am engaged with every nerve in my body and the energy flow is too much. It is an incredible feeling, but it can also be a bit frightening, to the point that I will pass on practicing given a current mood I might be in. That being said I have practiced zen breath practice for over a decade and it does not give me the same experience. Very cool subject, thanks for bringing it up, it was cool to reflect on the topic.


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Offlinetopdog82
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Re: Safety of pranayamas? [Re: TheSheph]
    #23442753 - 07/15/16 01:57 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

could you post a link to the zen breath?


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OfflineTheSheph
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Re: Safety of pranayamas? [Re: topdog82]
    #23443348 - 07/15/16 09:07 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Part one of this book was my introduction to zazen and what I use personally as a reference:
http://www.arvindguptatoys.com/arvindgupta/zenmind.pdf

I think there are audio files of the book on YouTube as well:


I think Suzuki is worth while as he was a large part of making Zen Buddhism access able to the American mind.


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OfflineChakra Shock
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Re: Safety of pranayamas? [Re: Repertoire89]
    #23443719 - 07/15/16 11:44 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Repertoire89 said:





If you want to stay on the safe side, just stick to basic concepts.

Personally my view of extremist monks is negative. Doing asanas and breathing exercises all day, eating 500 calories, abstaining from sex, etc.
Distractions from living out your dharma.
Distractions from going within.
Distractions from bringing what you find in communion out.

The basic concepts are effective for what the whole practice is worth, and they're not dangerous.




Cool reflection, that's pretty much how I feel about it too. It's more difficult to be in the world and yet still remain connected to your inner life. If you just run away from the world then sure, you can sit in samadhi for hours every day, but what are you really doing with that? Just letting yourself escape without coming down from the mountain to help others do it too.


Sticking with the basics will definitely keep you safe, and it's an immensely healthy thing to do. It's just when you're doing thirty minutes of breath of fire followed by rabbit and dog breathing leading into full lotus alternate nostril breathing for an hour, you could definitely pass out :lol:


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InvisibleRepertoire89
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Re: Safety of pranayamas? [Re: Chakra Shock]
    #23445306 - 07/15/16 09:41 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Chakra Shock said:

Cool reflection, that's pretty much how I feel about it too. It's more difficult to be in the world and yet still remain connected to your inner life. If you just run away from the world then sure, you can sit in samadhi for hours every day, but what are you really doing with that? Just letting yourself escape without coming down from the mountain to help others do it too.




Yeah, a big part of it from my perspective, is that I don't view samadhi as the end goal.
Anymore than having perfect intonation alone, without practical use of melody, rhythm and harmony.

Intonation is step one.


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Offlinetopdog82
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Re: Safety of pranayamas? [Re: Repertoire89]
    #23445496 - 07/15/16 11:09 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

thanks for the links!

Also; I feel that once I am much older, I can dedicate my time towards that. Just have some isolated property and fuck around with my wife maybe a few dogs


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: Safety of pranayamas? [Re: topdog82]
    #23454664 - 07/18/16 11:21 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)



--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


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Offlinetopdog82
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Re: Safety of pranayamas? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #23455304 - 07/19/16 08:19 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

MarkostheGnostic said:
https://www.ramdass.org/burden-of-doubt/

https://www.ramdass.org/death-lsd-maharaji/



Well damn...these two just scared me straight out of ever doing pranayams sober or on LSD

I mean then again. Messing with those breathing excercises while on any drug seems unwise at least in my opninion


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: Safety of pranayamas? [Re: topdog82]
    #23457282 - 07/19/16 07:17 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

topdog82 said:
Quote:

MarkostheGnostic said:
https://www.ramdass.org/burden-of-doubt/

https://www.ramdass.org/death-lsd-maharaji/



Well damn...these two just scared me straight out of ever doing pranayams sober or on LSD

I mean then again. Messing with those breathing excercises while on any drug seems unwise at least in my opninion





You can push he envelope on psychedelics, and once I seemed to experience prolonged cessation of breath (Khumbaka)* - either that or I was so into the moment, living between the 'mind-moments' that it seemed to go on and on. Another time I experienced the Taoist 'inner-breathing' where it seemed another form of breathing was moving independently of diaphragmatic breathing. And then, there was this blessed fellow who first inspired me from the movie Woodstock both to learn Kundalini Yoga (and to grow my hair long and even braid it to symbolize the channels of Ida, Pingala, and Sushumna):

*  "Rechaka is expiration, Puraka is inhalation of air and Kumbhaka is retention. Kumbhaka alone is Pranayama. Rechaka and Puraka are natural state of breath. Kumbhaka is of 3 types. Bahya kumbhaka is retention of breath at the end of expiration."



--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


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Offlinetopdog82
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Re: Safety of pranayamas? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #23457403 - 07/19/16 08:02 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Thats a cool clip/input. but I would be a little skeptical about this comparison of yogic practices to psychedelics like DMT. I feel that yoga/meditation is the opposite side of the coin of psychedelics. I feel that the superconcious states I get into by psychedelics are the sort of equivalent opposite if that makes sense. Similar in its own way, but apples to oranges. Just my 2 cents

I mean the DEEPEST states of meditation I have experienced, with non-thought, and not breathing for a breif period is utter nothingness. Its similar to what I imagine ketamine to be like. I have never done ketamine/MXE but the main reason I wish to try them is that it supposedly activates that nothingness state which for me at least, took like a year or two of daily meditation/yoga to hit regularly

And psyches on the flipside are like an utter engagement. The mind and body full of "somethingness". The very abscense of nothingness. I was watching a TV show and felt deeply for each character in it. Even though the show was just a random nonsensical show

IDK if I am making sense. I am missing a lot of terminology here :lol:. But I hope you catch my drift


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InvisibleRepertoire89
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Re: Safety of pranayamas? [Re: topdog82]
    #23457436 - 07/19/16 08:13 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Psychedelics are pretty similar to my meditative experiences, only much more chaotic and with a feeling of impermanence... when I have what I would consider a profound experience, it is well beyond the scope of a psychedelic for the feeling of authenticity alone.

There is definitely a similarity, but psychedelics in my experience just don't go as far in any way.


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