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OfflineFlyOnTheWall
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Re: #Blacklivesmatter is more racist than I thought [Re: koods]
    #23451247 - 07/17/16 09:23 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

http://www.globalresearch.ca/youre-55-times-more-likely-to-be-killed-by-a-police-officer-than-a-terrorist/5434934

Americans are 55 times more likely to be killed by a cop than a terrorist.

I assume/hope that number is high, but it wouldn't surprise me if it wasnt.

Considering the police aren't even able to keep accurate numbers on how many people they kill (I wonder why that is?), it is hard to say.


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Offlineqman
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Re: #Blacklivesmatter is more racist than I thought [Re: koods]
    #23451256 - 07/17/16 09:27 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

koods said:
You seriously can't see all of this is a reaction to police violence? People are fed up with the intransigence and arrogance of law enforcement. They see no accountability for wrong doing. Cops behave in ways that would get any other person fired from their job or prosecuted. Cops need to start respecting the citizens who pay their salaries, and not demand that everyone respect them simply because of who they are. You have to earn respect. We are not their servants, they are our servants. They need to be accountable to us, not themselves.




Really, so what are the solutions?  Less cops?  New cops?  New policing tactics?  New laws?

Stop blaming the fucking cops, your boys own them!

The vast majority of the population are just fine with the cops today, why is that?





Why don't you read Obama's task force report that I posted.




Obama doesn't give a fuck, 7 years later and you still haven't figured it out.  Nothing is going to change unless the majority of people want it to change.
Quote:

koods said:
Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

koods said:
You seriously can't see all of this is a reaction to police violence? People are fed up with the intransigence and arrogance of law enforcement. They see no accountability for wrong doing. Cops behave in ways that would get any other person fired from their job or prosecuted. Cops need to start respecting the citizens who pay their salaries, and not demand that everyone respect them simply because of who they are. You have to earn respect. We are not their servants, they are our servants. They need to be accountable to us, not themselves.




Really, so what are the solutions?  Less cops?  New cops?  New policing tactics?  New laws?

Stop blaming the fucking cops, your boys own them!

The vast majority of the population are just fine with the cops today, why is that?





Why don't you read Obama's task force report that I posted.




Yeah, it's a 100 pages of a pipedream, it isn't worth the paper its written on, why in the world would anyone give that thing any credence?


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OfflineMrBlueYoMind
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Re: #Blacklivesmatter is more racist than I thought [Re: FlyOnTheWall] * 1
    #23451269 - 07/17/16 09:30 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

So since the justice system is so racist and black people always get more time than white people for the same crime, why do cases like this exist:

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/18/us/teenagers-found-guilty-in-rape-in-steubenville-ohio.html

The black kid got one year, the white one got 2 years.  Same crime, same judge.  Doesn't fit your narrative that the system itself is racist. 

If you compare two different cases of the same crime from different judges in different places, the discrepancies in punishment can not justifiably be considered racist as it is unknown if the people switched judges if the sentences would be the same.  It is not a rational inference.

There are LAWS on the books which literally force businesses to deny people jobs based on their skin color, but you probably don't think that is systemic racism do you?


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Offlineqman
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Re: #Blacklivesmatter is more racist than I thought [Re: koods]
    #23451278 - 07/17/16 09:33 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

FlyOnTheWall said:
Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
He condemns the attack, the violence, because he has to, but it's with a wink and a nod

Notice he NEVER condemns the hateful rhetoric of BLM?

"What do we want?"
"Dead cops!"
"When do we want it?"
"Now!"

He even invited these lunatics to the White House:facepalm:




Probably because he is smart enough to realize that it is high time a group made the police feel a little less safe.

If the cops wanted people to be on their side, they should've played nicer.




The people are on the cops side, the anti-cop or BLM movement can't win, the backlash will not be pretty. :shrug:




The backlash. Listen to yourself. The backlash on who? Are you suggesting the police will squash dissent? They're gonna roundup agitators?




No, the public doesn't support cops killers or BLM retards, breaking the law to protest existing laws isn't acceptable, how's the dissent been working so far?


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OfflineFlyOnTheWall
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Re: #Blacklivesmatter is more racist than I thought [Re: MrBlueYoMind]
    #23451282 - 07/17/16 09:35 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

MrBlueYoMind said:
So since the justice system is so racist and black people always get more time than white people for the same crime, why do cases like this exist:

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/18/us/teenagers-found-guilty-in-rape-in-steubenville-ohio.html

The black kid got one year, the white one got 2 years.  Same crime, same judge.  Doesn't fit your narrative that the system itself is racist. 





I don't have a narrative. I am stating statistics, and you bringing up one case does not even slightly disprove any of them.

Quote:

MrBlueYoMind said:
There are LAWS on the books which literally force businesses to deny people jobs based on their skin color, but you probably don't think that is systemic racism do you?




Don't just try to project the opposite of whatever you agree with on to me, I don't necessarily agree with affirmative actions laws, either.


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Offlineqman
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Re: #Blacklivesmatter is more racist than I thought [Re: FlyOnTheWall]
    #23451287 - 07/17/16 09:37 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

FlyOnTheWall said:
Quote:

koods said:

The backlash. Listen to yourself. The backlash on who? Are you suggesting the police will squash dissent? They're gonna roundup agitators?




LOL, right?

Are you a cop qman? What the fuck is wrong with you?




There's nothing wrong with me, you don't have a fucking clue.

You blame cops for enforcing existing laws? Why do you do that? 

It's time to grow up and figure out why those laws exist, you're too dam lazy to figure it out, instead you blame people that make a small paycheck, open up your mind.


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OfflineFlyOnTheWall
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Re: #Blacklivesmatter is more racist than I thought [Re: qman]
    #23451294 - 07/17/16 09:40 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:

It's time to grow up and figure out why those laws exist, you're too dam lazy to figure it out, instead you blame people that make a small paycheck, open up your mind.




I've already figured it out. They exist because the people who run prisons want to make money, and the people who are willing to enforce the laws are immoral idiots who impose their will on other people.

You can act like I'm a fool, but I'm not the one going out and ruining peoples lives.

The worst thing I do is rant about cops on the shroomery.

My conduct is not the problem here.

Maybe cops should try getting their small paycheck by doing something that doesn't require them to lock non-violent drug offenders in cages.


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Offlineqman
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Re: #Blacklivesmatter is more racist than I thought [Re: koods]
    #23451299 - 07/17/16 09:41 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

koods said:
Quote:


why doesnt the criminal culture need to change? should we be telling people that
then need to resist cops at every step 'because they have rights' because that's
the mentality that has people getting killed, we all know that the cop is either
taking you in or he's going to beat you and take you in, the way always depends
on how the arrestee decides to act. it would seem liberals want to inform these
people that they need to assert their rights with force in the streets




Criminals are not public servants, cops are. The people get to dictate how their public servants should behave.  Public servants should be accountable to the people and their elected representatives.

As for rights, if you don't assert them, then they aren't really worth a damn are they? Cops bend the rules all the time. Stop and frisk is clearly outside the bounds of the constitution, but somehow it still happens.




Yet, no one but criminals are concerned about it.  Who supports the laws and tactics?  The voters and politicians!!!



The way you think is really disturbing. You're suggesting that someone who doesn't approve of the tactics used now are branded as criminals. No dissent allowed.




No, I'm saying it's a minority view without the power to change anything.

Dissent is fine if you can convince others, why can't they convince others that there's an injustice taking place?  Most people don't have an issue. :shrug:


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OfflineFlyOnTheWall
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Re: #Blacklivesmatter is more racist than I thought [Re: FlyOnTheWall]
    #23451302 - 07/17/16 09:42 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Why would I support someone who wants to hurt me?

Why would I appreciate the threat of imprisonment?

Why should I respect cops any more than an extremist Muslim trying to impose sharia law on me?

Why are they different?


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OfflineFlyOnTheWall
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Re: #Blacklivesmatter is more racist than I thought [Re: qman]
    #23451309 - 07/17/16 09:45 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Most people don't have an issue. :shrug:




Just because you say that doesn't mean it is true. A lot of people are not happy with the cops right now.


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Offlineqman
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Re: #Blacklivesmatter is more racist than I thought [Re: FlyOnTheWall]
    #23451315 - 07/17/16 09:48 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

FlyOnTheWall said:
Quote:

qman said:

It's time to grow up and figure out why those laws exist, you're too dam lazy to figure it out, instead you blame people that make a small paycheck, open up your mind.




I've already figured it out. They exist because the people who run prisons want to make money, and the people who are willing to enforce the laws are immoral idiots who impose their will on other people.

You can act like I'm a fool, but I'm not the one going out and ruining peoples lives.

The worst thing I do is rant about cops on the shroomery.

My conduct is not the problem here.

Maybe cops should try getting their small paycheck by doing something that doesn't require them to lock non-violent drug offenders in cages.




You still don't get it, the vast majority of the people support the existing laws and the people in power also support it.

You're in a small minority of people that disagree with it, you're the outcast, cops are NOT the outcast.

If you want change, you don't start with the cops. :huxleyfacepalm:


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Offlinekoods
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Re: #Blacklivesmatter is more racist than I thought [Re: MrBlueYoMind] * 1
    #23451318 - 07/17/16 09:49 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

MrBlueYoMind said:
So since the justice system is so racist and black people always get more time than white people for the same crime, why do cases like this exist:

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/18/us/teenagers-found-guilty-in-rape-in-steubenville-ohio.html

The black kid got one year, the white one got 2 years.  Same crime, same judge.  Doesn't fit your narrative that the system itself is racist. 




Not the same crime. If you're gonna post an article to make a point, maybe you should read it first.

Quote:

Mr. Mays’s minimum sentence is twice as long as Mr. Richmond’s because he was found to be delinquent beyond a reasonable doubt — the juvenile equivalent of guilty — not just of rape but also of distributing a nude image of a minor




--------------------
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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: #Blacklivesmatter is more racist than I thought [Re: FlyOnTheWall] * 2
    #23451324 - 07/17/16 09:52 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

If you hate the big banks, do you take it out on the bank guard? The teller? Why not?

Cops are same way, working for an overlord, just trying to survive just everyone else in this messed up world

Or... Don't hate the playa, hate the game:lol:


--------------------
http://www.countdowntotrump.com





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Offlineqman
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Re: #Blacklivesmatter is more racist than I thought [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #23451334 - 07/17/16 09:55 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
If you hate the big banks, do you take it out on the bank guard? The teller? Why not?

Cops are same way, working for an overlord, just trying to survive just everyone else in this messed up world

Or... Don't hate the playa, hate the game:lol:




Yes, I blame the janitor who cleans the toilets at the banks, it's his fault.  :flowstone:


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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: #Blacklivesmatter is more racist than I thought [Re: hostileuniverse] * 2
    #23451336 - 07/17/16 09:55 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Cops are convicted of excessive force and brutality all the time, but it doesn't help when the force is found to be justified, when the fucking president has already proclaimed the cops in the wrong, blamed it on racism, and praised the efforts of BLM. THAT is what has led to these cop killings, cops have been roughing up hoods for decades, only now, that they know they have the president on their side, are they emboldened and encouraged to react idiotically





if a cop is convicted then the force wasnt found to be justified

but you're right, we dont need a racist in the whitehouse destroying race
relations by claiming everything is racism against black people while
proclaiming criminals are innocent victims


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OfflineMrBlueYoMind
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Re: #Blacklivesmatter is more racist than I thought [Re: koods]
    #23451342 - 07/17/16 09:58 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Quote:

MrBlueYoMind said:
So since the justice system is so racist and black people always get more time than white people for the same crime, why do cases like this exist:

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/18/us/teenagers-found-guilty-in-rape-in-steubenville-ohio.html

The black kid got one year, the white one got 2 years.  Same crime, same judge.  Doesn't fit your narrative that the system itself is racist. 




Not the same crime. If you're gonna post an article to make a point, maybe you should read it first.

Quote:

Mr. Mays’s minimum sentence is twice as long as Mr. Richmond’s because he was found to be delinquent beyond a reasonable doubt — the juvenile equivalent of guilty — not just of rape but also of distributing a nude image of a minor







Thanks

:thumbup:

I still think you would have to look at individual courts and judges and their sentencing trends rather than comparing different courts from different jurisdictions to declare racism.

And even then past convictions and community standings come into play.


--------------------
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EVOLUTION REQUIRES REPRODUCTION


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Offlinekoods
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Re: #Blacklivesmatter is more racist than I thought [Re: qman]
    #23451345 - 07/17/16 09:58 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

FlyOnTheWall said:
Quote:

qman said:

It's time to grow up and figure out why those laws exist, you're too dam lazy to figure it out, instead you blame people that make a small paycheck, open up your mind.




I've already figured it out. They exist because the people who run prisons want to make money, and the people who are willing to enforce the laws are immoral idiots who impose their will on other people.

You can act like I'm a fool, but I'm not the one going out and ruining peoples lives.

The worst thing I do is rant about cops on the shroomery.

My conduct is not the problem here.

Maybe cops should try getting their small paycheck by doing something that doesn't require them to lock non-violent drug offenders in cages.




You still don't get it, the vast majority of the people support the existing laws and the people in power also support it.

You're in a small minority of people that disagree with it, you're the outcast, cops are NOT the outcast.

If you want change, you don't start with the cops. :huxleyfacepalm:




51% of Americans are not confident police only use force when necessary.

Quote:

When it comes to the use of lethal force, only 49 percent of Americans are confident the police only use it when necessary. Another 45 percent believe the police are too quick to pull the trigger. Some may find it quite troubling that on such an important issue, only half are confident in police officers’ decisions.



http://reason.com/poll/2014/10/10/poll-47-say-cases-of-excessive-force-by


--------------------
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“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”


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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: #Blacklivesmatter is more racist than I thought [Re: koods]
    #23451411 - 07/17/16 10:23 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Quote:


why doesnt the criminal culture need to change? should we be telling people that
then need to resist cops at every step 'because they have rights' because that's
the mentality that has people getting killed, we all know that the cop is either
taking you in or he's going to beat you and take you in, the way always depends
on how the arrestee decides to act. it would seem liberals want to inform these
people that they need to assert their rights with force in the streets




Criminals are not public servants, cops are. The people get to dictate how their public servants should behave.  Public servants should be accountable to the people and their elected representatives.





the people do dictate how public servants behave, in the 80s when crack gained
popularity and cocaine was flowing into the country more freely, the violence
escalated and so did the response by police, in police encounters when people
decide to resist and fight with the cops, the cops responded with greater force
so in realty, the public does dictate how the police behave, maybe if the
criminals calling themselves the public would tone it down they wouldnt be
getting shot. I know, it's a difficult concept for you to grasp but it is a
reality for the rest of us


Quote:

As for rights, if you don't assert them, then they aren't really worth a damn are they? Cops bend the rules all the time. Stop and frisk is clearly outside the bounds of the constitution, but somehow it still happens.





you can say "i do not consent to a search", that's asserting your rights, do you
think people should be physically engaging a cop to prevent them from searching?
is the place to fight an illegal search on the side of the road?

it's kinda funny that a man that wants to strip me of my second amendment rights
is trying to tell me what my rights are, lol...


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Offlineqman
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Re: #Blacklivesmatter is more racist than I thought [Re: koods]
    #23451421 - 07/17/16 10:27 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

FlyOnTheWall said:
Quote:

qman said:

It's time to grow up and figure out why those laws exist, you're too dam lazy to figure it out, instead you blame people that make a small paycheck, open up your mind.




I've already figured it out. They exist because the people who run prisons want to make money, and the people who are willing to enforce the laws are immoral idiots who impose their will on other people.

You can act like I'm a fool, but I'm not the one going out and ruining peoples lives.

The worst thing I do is rant about cops on the shroomery.

My conduct is not the problem here.

Maybe cops should try getting their small paycheck by doing something that doesn't require them to lock non-violent drug offenders in cages.




You still don't get it, the vast majority of the people support the existing laws and the people in power also support it.

You're in a small minority of people that disagree with it, you're the outcast, cops are NOT the outcast.

If you want change, you don't start with the cops. :huxleyfacepalm:




51% of Americans are not confident police only use force when necessary.

Quote:

When it comes to the use of lethal force, only 49 percent of Americans are confident the police only use it when necessary. Another 45 percent believe the police are too quick to pull the trigger. Some may find it quite troubling that on such an important issue, only half are confident in police officers’ decisions.



http://reason.com/poll/2014/10/10/poll-47-say-cases-of-excessive-force-by




Wonderful, a few people taking survey. Are these people willing to defend criminals?  NOPE.

Everyone is a humanitarian in a survey, where are they when it counts?


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Offlineendogenous
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Re: #Blacklivesmatter is more racist than I thought [Re: qman]
    #23451746 - 07/18/16 02:07 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
He condemns the attack, the violence, because he has to, but it's with a wink and a nod

Notice he NEVER condemns the hateful rhetoric of BLM?

"What do we want?"
"Dead cops!"
"When do we want it?"
"Now!"

He even invited these lunatics to the White House:facepalm:



The "dead cops" quote was NOT from BLM. It also wasn't from the Millions March NYC which had been accused of it originally.

http://www.msnbc.com/the-reid-report/the-truth-about-the-dead-cops-chant :
"The chant I didn’t hear on Dec. 13 was the one captured on a cell phone video and uttered by a small group numbering a few dozen, marching in a cluster behind a makeshift banner:

“What do we want? Dead cops! When do we want it? Now!”

The video of that particularly venal bromide was taken from a window high above Murray Hill, an upscale neighborhood in the middle part of Manhattan’s east side. It has been replayed and repeated over and over as part of the coverage of the tragic killing of officers Ramos and Liu, including on MSNBC.

Some are attributing the chant not just to organizers of the New York march but even to Rev. Al Sharpton, whose National Action Network had nothing to do with the New York march and held its own separate rally earlier that day in Washington, D.C. with the spouses and parents of Eric Garner, Michael Brown, Trayvon Martin, Amadou Diallo and others, and televised on CSPAN and MSNBC.

And yet, evidence shows the group that engaged in the death chant against police weren’t part of Millions March NYC. And if they did indeed march on Dec. 13, they did so long after the larger protest had moved downtown. They were not part of the main group.

For one thing, according to the video, which was posted to Youtube the same day as the protest, the “dead cops” chant took place after sunset. You can see from the video that city lights are already on. The group starts by chanting “hands up, shoot back,” before switching to the death chant, and then an unintelligible chant at the end of the approximately 2 minute clip...

The official march ended at One Police Plaza at 6:30 p.m., when the march’s permit expired, a point reinforced by a tweet sent by the organizers at 7:26 p.m.

“Once the march reached 1 Police Plaza the march ended and there was a tweet that went out saying that anything that happens afterward was not organized by the MMNYC,” communications director Kate McNeely told me.

McNeely added that some fellow activists took offense to the tweet.

“We caught backlash for that tweet,” she said. “Because people felt we were separating ourselves from other protesters. Our clarification on Facebook made it clear that we support any non-violent direct action done by those who desire an end to systemic police abuse and violence disproportionately impacting black people.”

Millions March organizers told me they don’t know the identity of the group was that was caught on cellphone camera marching through Murray Hill chanting about “dead cops.” But in response to press inquiries in the wake of the two officers’ slaying, the group released the following statement:

“On behalf of the Millions March NYC, we express our deepest condolences to the families of the officers who were killed on Saturday. Our march last weekend was a peaceful outcry that senseless violence in our society is harmful to trust, community, and security. This tragedy is in no way connected to our march, or ongoing protests against police brutality, discrimination, and profiling – and we condemn, and are disappointed with any entity that would try to imply such connection. As New Yorkers, we will continue to march for a peaceful society, where trust between communities and law enforcement is finally achieved.”"


--------------------
The Day of the Lord has come like a thief in the night. -- It is there but no one knows it.


Edited by endogenous (07/18/16 02:09 AM)


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