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OfflineInebriaveritSaepe
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Cannabis Alternative...
    #23423557 - 07/08/16 01:04 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

So, I've been looking into alternatives for Cannabis. I want to relax at the end of a long work day with the assistance of a delicious smoked plant, but it's illegal here and I'm distancing myself from illicit activities.
So, I've been doing some research into alternatives, and have found all the common replacements such as skullcap, dagga, passionflower, blue lotus, etc. The issue is that from what I've read, none of these come close, and I don't believe any of them activate cannabinoid receptors.

I know there has to be a suitable herbal alternative, there are so many sedating and uplifting herbs one would think it would just take the right combo.

So, I did some googling for other plants with cannabinoids, and have found something interesting. THC activates both CB1 and CB2 receptors, and there are other plants that effect these same receptors, but to my knowledge a natural chemical has not been found that activates both EXCEPT for THC. HOWEVER, there are other plants that activate one or the other, either selectively or non-selectively.

My research has turned up the following info:
DIM 3,3: Found in the Brassica genus, selective CB2 agonist.
Rutamarin: Found in the Puta Graveolens plant, selective CB2 agonist.
Falcarinol: Found in Apiacae Spp., non selective CB1 agonist.
N-Alkylamide, found in Echinacea Spp., selective CB2 agonist.

My thought are that these 4 chemicals may provide a similar high to cannabis, without all the nasty legality issues. Am I insane, or is this worth pursuing? Either way, I'm thinking of trying for it, after I find some info on the toxicity of these chemicals and the other actives in the plants they're found in. Might require an extraction, and may not be smokeable, but I feel it might be worth looking into.


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Edited by InebriaveritSaepe (07/08/16 01:06 PM)


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Offlinemackblack
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Registered: 06/28/16
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Re: Cannabis Alternative... [Re: InebriaveritSaepe]
    #23423642 - 07/08/16 01:33 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Sounds like a great idea, man. Can't wait to hear your results.


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Invisibleferrel_human
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Registered: 06/26/09
Posts: 16,320
Loc: Texas Flag
Re: Cannabis Alternative... [Re: mackblack] * 1
    #23423701 - 07/08/16 01:57 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)



That being said there is nothing like a cold hoppy beer to put you to sleep.

Like you sir i have smoked my fair share of herbs. Trying to chase that elusive legal thc high. Synthetic marijuana is a a chemical laden bitch. Pulmonary actions are hindered when done in excess. I dont recommend it. Ive smoked damiana and thats ok. But not marijuana like high.

I dont know what to tell you. Having been in jobs that require alot from you and to be at your 100% all the time, marijuana is like the aurora borealis. You know they occur but youve never seen it.

I dont think that made any sense but i hope you find what you are looking for.


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Nature is my church and walking through it is gospel. It tells no lies and reveals all to those who look, and listen, closely.
-Karode


Looking for Mimosa tenuiflora seeds. Buttons for trade


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Offlinetump
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Re: Cannabis Alternative... [Re: ferrel_human]
    #23425515 - 07/09/16 02:59 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Op there isn't really alternative to mj smoking that being said if you found lets say sab exaction Apiacae and skullcap mixed at 65% to 35% ratio felt the same as drone pot. Don't you think it would be banned in a few years after because the feds are always looking to crack down on highs. Have fun wink wink.

P.s. wild carrots cause miscarriages. Be safe


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OfflineBarbaraBlue
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Registered: 05/04/16
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Re: Cannabis Alternative... [Re: tump]
    #23425721 - 07/09/16 06:08 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

I Have tried Damiana and Salvia but would never try to replace MJ by any other smokable herb despite the law.


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“I allowed my life to be guided by a strange language, which I call ‘signs’. I know the world is talking to me, and I need to listen to it — and if I do that, I will always be guided toward what is most intense, passionate, and beautiful.”
—Paulo Coelho


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: Cannabis Alternative... [Re: BarbaraBlue]
    #23427626 - 07/09/16 08:08 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Kratom is the only other herb even comparable IME but it doesn't effect cannabinoid receptors to my knowledge at least.

For me its effects are a lot like cannabis except they last longer since you eat it instead of smoking, it also is a lot cheaper when bought in bulk.

Personally they are around equally addicting but some people do claim kratom can cause fairly bad dependence especially if you have a bad history with opiates.


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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Invisiblemodern.shaman
San Mescalito
I'm a teapot


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Registered: 05/09/12
Posts: 3,224
Loc: Zone 13
Re: Cannabis Alternative... [Re: musiclover420]
    #23427741 - 07/09/16 09:01 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Smoke caapi, rue or passion flower but at higher concentrate or make tea. Combine with other herbs but be very careful as maoi with certain drugs can be fatal especially with opiates and benzos. The herbs you mentioned in OP have stronger effect when taken as a tea rather then smoked. Concentrates not always easy to smoke.

Nothing will match mj but there are quite a lot of herbs available. So you can try a few and combine those you like. Most have minor effects but at high concentrates will be noticeable.

Another plant besides kratom is kava. Kava has a reverse tolerance so the longer you take it the more the effect. Stronger roots will be noticeable effect at 2 tablespoon.


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InvisibleMushiez
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Re: Cannabis Alternative... [Re: InebriaveritSaepe]
    #23428542 - 07/10/16 07:19 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Breath awareness meditation can liberate you from all chemicals and rebalance the neural system to make you feel positive more throughout the day

outside chemicals work too, but if you master meditation you can produce the natural chemicals from within


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OfflineTheHumungus
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Registered: 08/01/13
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Re: Cannabis Alternative... [Re: InebriaveritSaepe]
    #23430192 - 07/10/16 07:31 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Depending on the legality of Salvia in your region. You can try a low to mid dose SD extract mixed with harmine freebase from peganum harmala.


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: Cannabis Alternative... [Re: TheHumungus]
    #23430490 - 07/10/16 08:53 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

TheHumungus said:
Depending on the legality of Salvia in your region. You can try a low to mid dose SD extract mixed with harmine freebase from peganum harmala.




What effects do you get from this combo?


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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OfflineTheHumungus
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Registered: 08/01/13
Posts: 68
Last seen: 3 years, 5 months
Re: Cannabis Alternative... [Re: musiclover420]
    #23441634 - 07/14/16 06:43 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

musiclover420 said:
Quote:

TheHumungus said:
Depending on the legality of Salvia in your region. You can try a low to mid dose SD extract mixed with harmine freebase from peganum harmala.




What effects do you get from this combo?




Salvia at a low dose is relaxing and it spurs the mind into topics in ways similar to cannabis. By adding the harmala you are gaining another relaxing agent, that at higher doses will induce dream like states of consciousness.

I just tried it for the first time recently. I had taken a harmala freebase in a capsule orally, about 60mg. And then smoked a small dose of a salvia extract half hour later.


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: Cannabis Alternative... [Re: TheHumungus]
    #23441815 - 07/14/16 07:42 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Interesting, out of all the occasions I smoked salvia I would only describe 1 as relaxing and that was with a lot of cannabis :lol: Harmalas are awesome though.


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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OfflineInebriaveritSaepe
Jack of all trades
Male

Registered: 05/19/15
Posts: 70
Loc: United States of America Flag
Last seen: 5 months, 20 days
Re: Cannabis Alternative... [Re: musiclover420]
    #23454231 - 07/18/16 08:55 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Salvia is a no-go in my area, and although I may not be able to MATCH THC, a somewhat comparable relaxant and euphoric agent would be alright with me.
I've ordered mugwort(thujone, I know it's not good to use often), Damiana, skullcap, and passionflower, I plan to try them alone and a few different ratios of these herbs together, probably smoked and in tea, I've got 4 Oz of each coming in the mail. I'm growing klip dagga, passionflower, and  wild lettuce.
With luck, I'll be able to find something somewhat similar to mids at least, though as y'all said I seriously doubt I'll find anything comparable to good bud.
I wonder if maybe some terpenes might help out. I believe I've heard some terpene containing foods like mango enhance a high, so I wonder if pine(a LOT  of bud smells piney) and mango extract combined with some of these other herbs might help match it. I've heard passionflower smells like bud and is sedating/euphoric; so maybe just the smell of mango/passionflower/pine plus the sedation of the other herbs might create a close enough scenario to emulate a cannabis buzz. Like an intentional placebo effect? I'm thinking I won't add the extracts to the herbs, but maybe rub a bit on the outside of the bong so I smell it. Smoking extracts of pine and mango seems unsafe :P

I'll have to research which of these herbs are safe with harmalas, harmala alkaloids are pretty strong MAOIs, and although passionflower and i believe Damiana have some MAOI properties, from my understanding it's fairly weak, so I'm not AS worried about it.

Anyway, my original thought on CB1 and CB2 agonists seems plausible, but I'd need to look into the concentrations of these chemicals in each plant, the other chemicals in these plants(and their safety) and how to extract them. Or maybe some of them are available pure online. Once I have the chemicals, I think dissolving the chemicals in alcohol and soaking passionflower or another carrier herb similar to what some people do with DMT and bud would be a good administration method.

I will let y'all know what I find/experience. Should be fun at the very least, observing the effects.


--------------------
Check out my garden!
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/24289947



PGP key: Profile or Journal @ shro omery .org/ forums/showflat.php/Number/24365166


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OfflineExceed19_2000
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Registered: 04/15/16
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Re: Cannabis Alternative... [Re: musiclover420]
    #23454236 - 07/18/16 08:58 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

musiclover420 said:
Interesting, out of all the occasions I smoked salvia I would only describe 1 as relaxing and that was with a lot of cannabis :lol: Harmalas are awesome though.





Thats exactly what I was going to say. Salvia isn't as much "fun", as it is an experience.


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OfflineEywa_devotee
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Re: Cannabis Alternative... [Re: Exceed19_2000]
    #23461229 - 07/20/16 11:44 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Hate to say it, if you'r after a nice sleepy stone, the closest is a light dose of good ole alcohol. But IMHO it's like cheap artificially flavored strawberry milk V.S a real thick home made strawberry milkshake. Ok i got the munchies...


--------------------
"Love one another." "To Love is to know me." "Love is the Law, Love under Will." "In Compassion, all sorrows end." Regardless of the Master, the message is the same- Choose love and you shall live, Choose Fear and you shall die. Help bring peace to this Earth: Love one another, and serve others before yourself.


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