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Debacle
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Would this work?
#23421143 - 07/07/16 06:56 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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I am trying to grow bulk I just sterilized some rye grow bags but am unsure of how to inoculate in my Sab. Can I just flame the needle and inject threw the plastic and then immediately cover the hole with hot glue, I didn't put and tape on the bags like the tek said to do but would it still work?
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Inocuole
Scalpel of Evil's Bane



Registered: 11/21/11
Posts: 24,863
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Re: Would this work? [Re: Debacle]
#23421158 - 07/07/16 07:01 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Uhm.... Maybe. Is there even a filter on the bag? You could dab the glue, or silicone or something, on the bag first and then use that spot as an injection port once it dries.. I wouldn't even be putting spores syringes to rye bags in the first place though. Syringe to bag is even less reliable than syringe to grain jars, which is still pretty unreliable.
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Debacle
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Re: Would this work? [Re: Inocuole]
#23421172 - 07/07/16 07:05 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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If that's the case I have some partiality colonize Pf jars that I made to big on Accident so should I just do a transfer with a sterile knife?
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Inocuole
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Re: Would this work? [Re: Debacle]
#23421176 - 07/07/16 07:07 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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How much is too big exactly..? I wouldn't transfer anything partially colonized with a knife unless it was an agar plate.
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Debacle
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Re: Would this work? [Re: Debacle]
#23421186 - 07/07/16 07:09 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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That's a good idea with silicone since its self healing what if I used a lot of the syringe would it still be not worth it?
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Debacle
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Re: Would this work? [Re: Debacle]
#23421190 - 07/07/16 07:10 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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I made them quart sized I can already tell they are going to stall
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Inocuole
Scalpel of Evil's Bane



Registered: 11/21/11
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Re: Would this work? [Re: Debacle]
#23421206 - 07/07/16 07:14 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Using more of the syringe would decrease your chances of success. You have the highest chances of success using the smallest amount of spores, because each ml of spores could potentially have contams, and you don't know which ML has the contams in them. So, say the probability of contam for the whole syringe is some arbitrary value. Let's just say 15. 15 contams. So 1ml= about 1.5 "contams" (more likely bacterium or mold spores, whatever)
Therefore .5 ml has a chance of being totally clean (1.5/2=0.75). That leaves a 25% chance of success. If you use .25ml that increases to a 50% chance of success, and so on. Likewise 2cc pretty much guarantees contamination beyond a doubt in this given syringe. That's assuming a certain number of contaminant particles and that'll never be something you can guess easily, but, just to explain the math/science of it.
Basically, if you're playing russian roulette, you don't want to have to take more than one turn.
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Debacle
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Re: Would this work? [Re: Inocuole]
#23421217 - 07/07/16 07:16 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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So you think I should use the syringe?
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Inocuole
Scalpel of Evil's Bane



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Re: Would this work? [Re: Debacle]
#23421233 - 07/07/16 07:22 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Well... You can do whatever you want, I'm not in a position to be able to calculate your real chances of success here. I just know that in bags of grain, inoculated with spores, you have an extremely high chance of running into bacteria. The only thing I'd say "Yeah go ahead and inoculate with spores" is PF tek. BRF/verm is really forgiving to small amounts of bacteria. Grain, not so much.
So, you know, honestly, you could even potentially have a better chance transferring a piece of said uncolonized PF cake into one of the bags in a SAB, but that's just not something I can recommend in good conscience if you aren't familiar with transferring techniques. That one is a little tricky especially, but it would work if it were done correctly, I know that much. The trick is getting ALL of the top dry verm layer out of there before digging into it because that shit is covered in contaminants. I'd go for something like, out of the middle of it. And you'd need to be very slow and careful doing all of this in a SAB.
If anything hits open air it's game over though for both projects. So avoid many eggs, one basket scenario if possible.
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Debacle
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Re: Would this work? [Re: Inocuole]
#23421257 - 07/07/16 07:29 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Well my Pf jars for some reason the very layer is pretty colonized so would it be bad if I even knocked that into the grow bags
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Debacle
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Re: Would this work? [Re: Debacle]
#23421260 - 07/07/16 07:30 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Verm*
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mupetmower
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Re: Would this work? [Re: Debacle]
#23421276 - 07/07/16 07:38 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Yeah that would likely just fuck everything up honestly.
-------------------- -The wise man never stops seeking knowledge.
-I wanna feel the change consume me, feel the outside turning in. I wanna feel the metamorphosis and cleansing I've endured within.
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Inocuole
Scalpel of Evil's Bane



Registered: 11/21/11
Posts: 24,863
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Re: Would this work? [Re: Debacle]
#23421277 - 07/07/16 07:38 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Yes. When something that is colonized, but dirty, is mixed with something that is sterile, you're inoculating a little bit of cubes, and a little bit of whatever else landed on it. Sure the cube mycelium is all you see on the verm, that's because mold and bacteria don't like to germinate on just verm, but the second it hits nutritious grain, those contaminants will take off no problem. The dry verm layer has to come off. If you have to decimate a cake for this, then what you have to do is slide it out of the jar, in the prepped SAB, tear the whole cake in half with your hands, and use a sterile tool to take a piece of colonized mycelium from inside of it, just any tiny little piece will do, and drop that in the bag.
I'd really just recommend getting into agar as quickly as possible and creating clean inoculate that way, and then you won't have to worry about buying spores anymore while you figure everything else out.
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/19208976 https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22721954
I realize the thought of doing this the way I described above would give me doubts if I were the one doing it, so recommending it to you seems reckless. The info's there if you're feeling wild though.
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