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OfflineGroovy Hobbit
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First monotub - humidity looking right?
    #23406589 - 07/03/16 10:23 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

I started my monotub on 6/11 using rye grain spawn and following FrankHorrigan's 12 Steps with some help from Damion5050's Coir Tek. I put it into fruiting conditions on 6/27 w/ a 14W 6500 K light. It seems to be going alright, but I'm wondering whether my humidity looks okay. For instance, are these first shrooms' veils' separating too early?



Thanks!


Edited by Groovy Hobbit (07/04/16 06:54 AM)


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23406638 - 07/03/16 10:44 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

You can open the lid and take pictures man... They look fine, just genetics man.


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OfflineGroovy Hobbit
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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: LocN9ne]
    #23409455 - 07/04/16 06:59 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks for the reply. I should have mentioned this genetic is Golden Teacher.

Here are the caps now... They have not fully opened, but they're on the way.



I haven't opened the tub so as not to allow humidity to escape. But I will do so if I'll have to do a few rounds of harvest.

Does it look like I should "open and pick" a few times this first flush?

Thanks.


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OfflineGroovy Hobbit
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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23411123 - 07/04/16 05:19 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

The side of the tub closest to the light shows a pattern of less humidity. (See the pic.) I moved the tub 8 - 10 inches away from the light.



Advice on
  • the interaction of light and humidity?
  • the advisability of opening it up to pick the ones about to unfurl their caps?


If I open it, I'll spray a little to replenish lost humidity.

Thanks!

Happy INTERdependence Day!


Edited by Groovy Hobbit (07/04/16 05:37 PM)


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InvisibleLocN9ne
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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23411156 - 07/04/16 05:29 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Condensation is caused by temperature differences on either side of a surface... It is not an indicator of humidity... And you can most definitely open up your tub and pick away without any negative effects.


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OfflineGroovy Hobbit
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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: LocN9ne]
    #23411194 - 07/04/16 05:38 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Okay, thanks!


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OfflineGroovy Hobbit
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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23414152 - 07/05/16 03:42 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

I opened the tub to harvest the shrooms whose caps were opening (41.5g wet) - including the really small ones. I followed RR's advice to soak the substrate, adding ~5 cups of water to the tub. An hour later, I poured off about 4.4 cups.

Everyone looks happy, although I still have lots of little shrooms' caps opening. Should I be opening the monotub every day to harvest these little ones?

Thanks.


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23414199 - 07/05/16 03:55 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

only harvest the mature ones, let the small ones grow to full size before harvest.


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OfflineGroovy Hobbit
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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: spacechildo]
    #23414219 - 07/05/16 04:02 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

I've only been harvesting the ones whose caps are opening - whether large or small - on the understanding that waiting too long after the veil breaks risks a sporulation mess and a change for the worse in terms of taste.

Not so?

Even if so, are these then matters of preference?


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OfflineHugh Jorgan
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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23414292 - 07/05/16 04:26 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

I think you may be misunderstanding the process. You are absolutely correct regarding picking before sporulation but I think your timing is off. The opening of the caps isnt what you need to watch for its the breaking of the veils below them exposing the gills which is an indicator of pending sporulation. Those suckers may get quite a bit bigger before its time to harvest. Patience and sterile technique seem to be the hardest part for all of us to achieve. Welcome to a fun and very interesting hobby. Youre doing great so far!!

These are mature GT's


And if you get it right you can get some real monsters




Edited by Hugh Jorgan (07/05/16 04:42 PM)


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OfflineGroovy Hobbit
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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Hugh Jorgan]
    #23415186 - 07/05/16 09:23 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

I like the pics; and thanks!

But don't you think the veils on some of these small GTs have torn?:



The brims of their hats are turning up, and I can see tiny gills. (Unfortunately, I couldn't get the gills on the mushroom in the bottom-right of the first picture in focus.)


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23415210 - 07/05/16 09:33 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

They are broken but it's due to poor conditions and the fruit is aborting. You need to dial things in better.


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23415242 - 07/05/16 09:47 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

By the size of the others they will probably open in the next 12hrs or less. More FAE will enhance that flush at that stage, so loosen the poly  some. It's still best to wait and see before harvesting. Give it time for potential. You're not waiting on water to boil or anything, so just check every once in a while or when you're around. A few spores here and there isn't a problem. You have a small window after veil breaking and spores dropping. The gills will change to a darker color, but it happens at different rates.

Good job no matter what! Just enjoy.
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Edited by CosmoKramer (07/05/16 09:52 PM)


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OfflineGroovy Hobbit
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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: CosmoKramer]
    #23415315 - 07/05/16 10:17 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks!

I just loosened the top poly significantly, but left the lower holes on the tighter side (as per Frank's monotub dial-in). Perhaps I need to loosen the lower poly some too though...


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23416621 - 07/06/16 11:10 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Here's a better shot - from this morning - of these little ones opening.



So, PastyWhyte, these are aborts?

I just cut away a lot of the poly on the bottom holes (before and after):



Should I also loosen it? I note that, in his monotub tutorial, 

Quote:

large_dose said (here):
I then pack the holes loosely with polyfil and put a blanket over them for colonization.





Maybe I should add that the centers of my bottom holes are 9.5" apart...

Thanks, everyone!


Edited by Groovy Hobbit (07/06/16 11:25 AM)


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23416659 - 07/06/16 11:25 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

If they are still growing they are not aborts. But if they are popping veils early then that is often a sign that conditions are sub par. The caps look saturated in some of your pics. That means you are either misting too much or your FAE is poor or both.


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OfflineGroovy Hobbit
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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #23416668 - 07/06/16 11:27 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

I'm not misting, although I did a one-hour soak-and-drain - I think yesterday morning.

I believe CosmoKramer and you were right that it's FAE (thanks!); so I'm trying to dial that in...

I appreciate the help!


Edited by Groovy Hobbit (07/06/16 11:28 AM)


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OfflinePerception7
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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23417153 - 07/06/16 02:34 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Good job getting your first mono to fruit :super:

Yeah in my experience you will have some mushrooms in the first flush start to open up like your seeing at a very small, young age. In the 2nd flush though I never see any mushrooms doing this so for me so far its been genetics cause my tubs were dialed in properly. I use multispore syringes so I imagine this is why we have this happen to us more then the veterans here cause they are all using agar and superior genetics.

For instance, here is an image taken 4/06/2016 (first flush) you can see some of the mushrooms doing the same thing as your tub:



Same cluster on 4/09/2016:




Same cluster on 4/11/2016:



Same cluster on 4/13/2016:




As another member mentioned, when you go to harvest you can cut away the mature mushrooms and let the others continue to grow. This image is a plate of mushrooms that were cut at the base:



You will end up with stumps shown in this image, what I do is just let the others finish then you just remove the stump when all of the other mushrooms are mature and ready to pick. You only have to cut away when dealing with clusters though, I just twist and pull the mushrooms that are ready if I am not trying to prevent collateral damage:




It could be more then just genetics however, cause you do have a lot of mushrooms doing this. In the below image, you will see the little rings surrounding the polyfil, this is a good indicator that the tub is dialed in properly. For my first tub, it took me awhile to dial in the tub, for me it was EXTREMELY tight, tight as humanly possible on the bottom 4 holes, and very loose on the top two. The top two holes is where a lot of people do their tweaking to find the sweet spot for their unique environment:



--------------------
:1up: How I prepare my monotubs :1up:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/23066513



Edited by Perception7 (07/06/16 03:12 PM)


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OfflineGroovy Hobbit
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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Perception7]
    #23418267 - 07/06/16 08:19 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks for sharing your experience, Perception7. I've done some loosening of polyfil, and I'm watching to see how things unfold in the next day or so. In the meantime, I have a lot of those little caps open (maybe a third of the shrooms in the tub). Maybe I'll harvest tonight, or maybe I'll see what I can learn from a look in the morning.

Either way, thanks for the encouragement. I'm having a really good time!


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23418612 - 07/06/16 10:12 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

I harvested the opened caps... and DAMN, it's been so hot here that I dripped at last five drops of sweat into the monotub (not to mention my sticky arms hit the inside of the tub). I was as clean as I could be - cut the air, sprayed diluted bleach into he air before opening the tub, cleaned gloves and scalpel with alcohol, etc. But I couldn't stop those drips of sweat!?!)

Is sweat conducive to contams?

Anyway, this second cutting of the first flush was 157.6g:



Hopefully my FAE is getting more finely tuned... There are a lot more growing in there.

Woo hoo!


Edited by Groovy Hobbit (07/06/16 10:12 PM)


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23418656 - 07/06/16 10:24 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

I have sweated, sneezed, and coughed into monos while spawning. You have nothing to worry about as long as your spawn is clean.


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #23420531 - 07/07/16 03:24 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Check it out: The tub appears better dialed-in. Here's this afternoon's new wave of shrooms, growing larger and with far fewer premature veil breaks:



Thanks everyone!


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23420565 - 07/07/16 03:36 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

That pic looks great man. Yeah the only thing I do is wear sanitized surgical gloves when I harvest (70% alcohol rubbed on with paper towel). If I am going to be in there for a long time I wear a mask but its not necessary. I just feel more comfortable. I haven't had anything contam on me either so it may help a little.

I would do away with the bleach spray though. Congrats on the tub man!


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:1up: How I prepare my monotubs :1up:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/23066513



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OfflineGroovy Hobbit
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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Perception7]
    #23421951 - 07/07/16 11:45 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks, Perception7.

Here's how I'm using the bleach solution (based on something RR suggested elsewhere about using it as an alternative to the now-defunct Oust-brand air sanitizer). It doesn't touch the shrooms: I spray it into the air around the tub before I open it for harvest. I let the mist settle, then open the tub. I use gloves rubbed with alcohol, a bent scalpel, and tweezers. And on your suggestion I added a surgical mask this last cut...

This first flush has so far yielded almost 26oz (wet) - presumably around 2.6oz dry. FrankHorrigan gets 6 - 8 oz dry on the first flush. While I doubt mine will yield that much, I'm looking forward to seeing how it weighs out.


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23435744 - 07/12/16 06:38 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

The dry weight for the first flush was 74.4g (2.62oz).

I'm psyched. I imagine my next first will be more with my tub better dialed in.

Thanks, all.


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23437394 - 07/13/16 09:12 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Whoa... it looks like the second flush is coming in already.


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23437502 - 07/13/16 10:06 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

dont forget to post some pics! :thumbup:


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: spacechildo]
    #23440185 - 07/14/16 08:06 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Here's what it's looking like inside and outside:





Some caps opening early again - though not as bad as during the first flush. I just trimmed more of the lower polyfil in case it's a matter of an easier exit route for CO2...


Edited by Groovy Hobbit (07/14/16 10:38 AM)


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23443305 - 07/15/16 08:51 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Okay, here is the first monotub, second flush, first cutting (81.7g wet):



These look ready, don't they? (Veils broken, gills on most were visible for about a day. I don't see signs of sporulation.)

Here's what the tub looked like before this cut:



Here's what it looked like after:



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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23443309 - 07/15/16 08:52 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Veils look like they popped because of poor conditions. I have a hunch they could have gone for another day still. However fruits in hand is never a bad thing.


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #23443331 - 07/15/16 09:02 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

I suspect you're right!

In order to improve conditions, do you think I should
  • adjust the temperature? It's in the high 80s here today (no A/C; but I've got a little fan pointing toward the wall by the monotub).
  • adjust the polyfil? I've loosened the top and bottom.
  • move the light over the tub? It's next to it now (I believe I've read here that side-lighting beats top-lighting).
  • add moisture? I soaked and poured-off after the first flush.

Here's a look in situ:



Thanks for any ideas. I'm happy, and feel a wider grin coming on.


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23443347 - 07/15/16 09:07 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Once the pinset was in and the fruits about an inch tall I would slowly dial up the FAE. Your fruits look a bit saturated.


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #23443376 - 07/15/16 09:16 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Okay, man. Would you suggest I dial-in FAE by leaving the polyfil tighter till the pins come in, then loosening it? Or adding extra 1/4" holes? I've seen you do that, I think at the top of the tub.

Thanks!


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23443411 - 07/15/16 09:28 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Essentially yes. As the fruits develop they start to create their own microclimate. So less RH is needed as they mature. On the flip side as they get larger they start to need more fresh air. So for optimal results I like to adjust as they develop.

For the hybrid holes I like to tape up a row of holes and leave only a couple open as the pinset develops. Then once they are bigger I take off the tape completely to provide a fresh air boost.


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #23443482 - 07/15/16 10:01 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

I just found this post of yours on this topic - helpful!

  • So you're all taped up for colonization, then
  • you let the top holes breathe a little at knotting, and stuff the bottom holes with poly;
  • but you don't give the top holes a big breath till you've got a pinset?

Now, after the first flush, I went straight back into full fruiting conditions. Do you recommend instead closing the top a bit, and tightening the poly while new pins are coming in?


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23443521 - 07/15/16 10:14 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

No leave it with high FAE for the second flush. You ain't going for pinset second flush anyways and the pinsites seem a little more tolerant by that point anyways. Mist heavy or dunk and that usual kicks it off pretty good.

I should mention there are lots of ways to skin a cat. I have been playing with fruiting and casing at spawning time. It's doing great. Get familiar with your cultures and their needs and give em what they seem to like.

The big thing to know is when the sub is not happy. Learn how to spot that and then act accordingly. Mist if dry, extra FAE if wet. More light if the caps are small, etc.


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #23443555 - 07/15/16 10:29 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks!


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23466177 - 07/22/16 02:10 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

The dry weight for the second flush was 59.8g (2.11oz). The total dry weight yield from the tub so far is thus 134.2g (4.73oz).

Thanks for the help, all!

Here come some pins: perhaps the 3rd flush is immanent...


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23466692 - 07/22/16 04:44 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Nice grow man I'm having the same issues as you with dialing in when I get home I'll read more on this thread hopefully resurrect my two tubs that are performing poorly


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Boogieman47]
    #23489914 - 07/29/16 05:19 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Here's a harvest video of the 3rd flush. It's under 3 minutes.



I will post dry weight soon.


Edited by Groovy Hobbit (08/28/16 10:16 AM)


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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23492626 - 07/30/16 01:34 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

The dry weight of the third flush was 63.1g (=2.23oz). That brings the total for this monotub to 197.3g (=6.96oz).

As many of you predicted, these did grow much larger than those in the first and second flushes. Very nice.

If you watch the video, you'll see most of the mushrooms I harvested at least a few hours after veil-break (which was during the night). Several, though, I caught at what I hear may be the perfect moment, just as the veil is breaking.

I soaked the substrate for almost three hours, and put the tub back in fruiting conditions...

Thanks to everyone who helped with feedback. I appreciate it very much.


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OfflineHugh Jorgan
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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23502477 - 08/02/16 04:26 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Your first couple of flushes looked wet after you harvested them. Actually the third flush was what they all should have looked like. sometimes you might get a few mutant monsters in later flushes but once the tub is dialed in right they are all like that. Perhaps not as dense in later flushes. Heres a first flush of Texas orange cap



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OfflineGroovy Hobbit
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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Hugh Jorgan]
    #23502684 - 08/02/16 05:32 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Thanks, Mikehalb. Nice pics.

It looks like a fourth flush might be pushing through the ground over here...


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OfflineGroovy Hobbit
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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23544679 - 08/15/16 05:12 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

The fourth flush was smaller - 26 grams - bringing the total for the tub to 223.3 grams ( = 7.8 ounces).

Here's a little handful from the fifth flush, which is coming in now:



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OfflineWeavieWonder
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Re: First monotub - looking right? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #23555437 - 08/18/16 10:51 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Looking good in there.  Don't see any cracking or splitting your caps, so your humidity should be ok.  Might you consider investing in an analog hygrometer?  They are a great tool for making sure you are at least in the ball park (humidity wise) until you can develop an eye for such a thing.


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