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Invisiblemaddchef
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I have an issue with my lids
    #23402432 - 07/01/16 09:30 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

So I started to run my 941 and got maybe 1/4 through the cycle and ran our of propane and propane accessories. The meat of it is this: When I finally opened it up to get the jars for use on the stovetop it of course had a vacuum, apparently so did my jars and I hear hissing sounds from about half of them around the lid meaning the metal to glass seal of having the lids upside down has failed me.


Some of my lids are pretty old and rusty but some of the ones that were leaking are like new.

What this means to you/me: In a presto or mirro you won't be able to pull a vacuum in your pc at the end of cycle simply because of the way the pc is designed (shoddy) but..............your jars will still try to pull one.

This means as soon as the inside of your pc cools beyond a certain point it begins to draw outside air in and with it, contams.

Should those get sucked in your pc because of thermal dynamics and then get sucked into your jar that doesn't make a perfect seal well there goes your grow, sabotaged from the very beginning.


I've seen some people remedy this by yanking the weight off and wrapping the vent stem with an ISO soaked paper towel but we both know ISO evaporates very quickly. Maybe they use bleach and I read it wrong, ionno. But if this is or should be common practice we need to preach it more. Anyone ever seen their metal to glass lids fail this way?


--------------------
In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is king.

All mushrooms are edible, but some only once.....                     

                                        Easier than cakes

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InvisibleInocuole
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Re: I have an issue with my lids [Re: maddchef] * 1
    #23402473 - 07/01/16 09:45 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Um, there shouldn't be any such vacuum if you unscrew the lids well enough to be able to wiggle them around, then wait for the PC to cool before opening it and tightening them.


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OfflineLogicaL ChaosM
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Re: I have an issue with my lids [Re: maddchef]
    #23402485 - 07/01/16 09:48 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Im so confused. Why would there be a vaccum at all?

And what kind of jars are these? Grain jars? PF jars? Shouldnt there be holes in the jar lids for GE, hence no vacuum?

so confused :wtfsonic:


--------------------
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InvisibleInocuole
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Re: I have an issue with my lids [Re: LogicaL Chaos]
    #23402497 - 07/01/16 09:51 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

He's talking about unmodded lids, upside down.  If you unscrew them just enough, it works.  I know this because I just did some agar this way.  And we know full well that would show contams if there were any.


--------------------
                            :rainbowdrink: Tea doesn't work?                            AMU  (Q & A)                  Grain prep for Intergalactic Space Oats :pes:     

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Invisiblemaddchef
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Re: I have an issue with my lids [Re: Inocuole]
    #23402506 - 07/01/16 09:54 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

I have my lids on pretty tight but not tight enough I need a strap wrench to get them broken loose lol.

Didn't think having them barely sitting on the threads was common practice either?



Actually they are modded lids with a cellulose sfd which proves the size of the air leak since it would take the path of least resistance.


--------------------
In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is king.

All mushrooms are edible, but some only once.....                     

                                        Easier than cakes

I do science and shit.

:havesomescience:


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InvisibleCosmoKramer
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Re: I have an issue with my lids [Re: Inocuole]
    #23402507 - 07/01/16 09:54 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Can't say that I've seen this.. But I always get them immediately at cool down. Like an hour at most after removing the rocker on prestos. It's still warm enough that warmer air is still pushing out of the pressure valve.


--------------------
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InvisibleInocuole
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Re: I have an issue with my lids [Re: CosmoKramer]
    #23402511 - 07/01/16 09:56 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

I do that with filtered lids because that's the point of the filters.  The unmodded lids take a couple extra precautions to go smoothly but, meh.  I'll probably keep a mix of them going.


--------------------
                            :rainbowdrink: Tea doesn't work?                            AMU  (Q & A)                  Grain prep for Intergalactic Space Oats :pes:     

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Invisiblemaddchef
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Re: I have an issue with my lids [Re: CosmoKramer]
    #23402512 - 07/01/16 09:57 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Well you have the group "Leave your jars in your pc overnight to cool" and the other half who takes their jars out hot


--------------------
In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is king.

All mushrooms are edible, but some only once.....                     

                                        Easier than cakes

I do science and shit.

:havesomescience:


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InvisibleInocuole
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Re: I have an issue with my lids [Re: maddchef]
    #23402516 - 07/01/16 09:58 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

I just explained the difference..  Taking filtered jars out hot is not an issue.  But if you have a filter you want a halfway decent seal.  How big are these GE holes?


--------------------
                            :rainbowdrink: Tea doesn't work?                            AMU  (Q & A)                  Grain prep for Intergalactic Space Oats :pes:     

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Invisiblenatedawgnow
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Re: I have an issue with my lids [Re: Inocuole]
    #23402781 - 07/02/16 12:06 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

I usually watch my pc and as soon as pressure equalizes, i open it. No
vacuum gets pulled and i just set the lid back on but not enough to seal it and let the jars cool.
I run an AA.

I also do my agar unfiltered. Just unscew the cap a bit, put foil over it
and when you open the pc first thing to do is tighten the lid. I can't think
of a single time i had a bad pour doing it this way:shrug:


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OfflineLogicaL ChaosM
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Re: I have an issue with my lids [Re: Inocuole]
    #23402935 - 07/02/16 02:21 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Inocuole said:
He's talking about unmodded lids, upside down.  If you unscrew them just enough, it works.  I know this because I just did some agar this way.  And we know full well that would show contams if there were any.





I see. Whats the major advantage of unmodified lids besides being super simple to "make"?


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Invisiblemaddchef
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Re: I have an issue with my lids [Re: LogicaL Chaos]
    #23403309 - 07/02/16 07:31 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

I think that's the only upside but I'm not sure,



So most of you are babysitting your pc until the pressure drops and not just turning it off and walking away?


--------------------
In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is king.

All mushrooms are edible, but some only once.....                     

                                        Easier than cakes

I do science and shit.

:havesomescience:


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InvisibleSupalemonhaze
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Re: I have an issue with my lids [Re: LogicaL Chaos]
    #23403315 - 07/02/16 07:36 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

LogicaL Chaos said:
Quote:

Inocuole said:
He's talking about unmodded lids, upside down.  If you unscrew them just enough, it works.  I know this because I just did some agar this way.  And we know full well that would show contams if there were any.





I see. Whats the major advantage of unmodified lids besides being super simple to "make"?




Nothing? It's cool to not have to drill and silicone SFDs but you only do that once really so I'm not bothered by it much. I still do hate making holes and siliconing though, I try to make do without making new lids most of the time :lol:

I can't use the unmodded anyway, my jars only come with metal lids.


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InvisibleSupalemonhaze
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Re: I have an issue with my lids [Re: maddchef]
    #23403322 - 07/02/16 07:39 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

maddchef said:
I think that's the only upside but I'm not sure,



So most of you are babysitting your pc until the pressure drops and not just turning it off and walking away?




Babysit?

:nohellno:

I don't even babysit it during the cycle, I got used to setting the gas so I only go in there once, when the pressure reaches 15PSI and I put it on a smaller burner.

When it's done I put it in from of my hood and I either go there 10-20 minutes later to take the jars out to cool fast or I leave the PC there if I don't need to work soon.  I've left my presto full with grain jars on my stove on a few occasions and I never got a contam in my jars.


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OfflineMycoLoopology
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Re: I have an issue with my lids [Re: Supalemonhaze]
    #23403326 - 07/02/16 07:42 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

personally i just push the PC off the burner onto a cooler spot when my 120 minute cycle is up. then i let it sit over night, or all day, until its cool to the touch. this can take a while sometimes... but i wait till its completely cool, and then try to noc those jars ASAP!


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OfflineNDStepp84
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Re: I have an issue with my lids [Re: Supalemonhaze]
    #23403331 - 07/02/16 07:42 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

If the jars are still hot I'd imagine if any contam was sucked into the jar it would be killed by the heat.


--------------------

"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do.
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InvisibleSupalemonhaze
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Re: I have an issue with my lids [Re: NDStepp84]
    #23403332 - 07/02/16 07:44 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

:onfire: <<<< Spores.


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Invisibleblindingleaf
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Re: I have an issue with my lids [Re: Supalemonhaze]
    #23403420 - 07/02/16 08:21 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

i cook jars with the regular circular weight PC (so it has no vacuum) and I turn it off and walk away.  i use metal lids. sometimes they area little loose when im unloading them the next day, but I never had an issue i could back track to that

edit: throw a half cup of agar in one and use the grain lid on it and see what happens after a week if ur worried.


--------------------
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MICROBIAL HUSBANDRY!!!!

The whole is greater than the sum of its parts


Edited by blindingleaf (07/02/16 08:23 AM)


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Invisiblemaddchef
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Re: I have an issue with my lids [Re: blindingleaf]
    #23403429 - 07/02/16 08:27 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

I like the agar idea. My 941 has the regular weight but still pulls a vacuum.


--------------------
In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is king.

All mushrooms are edible, but some only once.....                     

                                        Easier than cakes

I do science and shit.

:havesomescience:


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InvisibleJuiceh
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Re: I have an issue with my lids [Re: maddchef]
    #23403525 - 07/02/16 09:17 AM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

LogicaL Chaos said:
Im so confused. Why would there be a vaccum at all?

And what kind of jars are these? Grain jars? PF jars? Shouldnt there be holes in the jar lids for GE, hence no vacuum?

so confused :wtfsonic:



So, if you run your PC properly you purge all air out at the beginning of the cycle. At the end of the cycle, when the steam condenses back to water it creates a vacuum where the air was previously. If your PC doesn't form a seal on cooldown or automatically drops a pressure valve to break the seal at 0psi that is where it will start pulling in air. Make sense?

Quote:

maddchef said:
I like the agar idea. My 941 has the regular weight but still pulls a vacuum.



My 921 did that when new too. The vent pipe to regulator weight seal isn't perfect tho. It will lose vacuum faster and it won't pull vacuum as deep as an AA with a sterilizer valve.


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