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Mateo
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Registered: 06/24/11
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Re: Coca growers [Re: Mateo]
#24893899 - 01/06/18 10:55 AM (6 years, 24 days ago) |
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Regarding Coca cuttings, this can be read in chapter 6 of Coca Cultivator's Handbook by Manuel Coquero It´s found online at a quite known site about coca.
Chapter 6, Other Methods of Propagation
If you have grown a bush from seedlings or have access to a mature bush, probably the easiest method of propagation is by inducing adventitious roots to grow on plant cuttings. The cutting method also gives more control over what type of plant will be produced, because the cutting will grow into a bush with all the characteristics of the parent bush, whereas reproducing by seed germination can yield widely varied results.
Cuttings should be taken from the parent plant's growing tip or from the side shoots. Erythroxylon coca cuttings will be most successful if they are 5-6 inches long. The base should be cut very cleanly with a sharp knife. Tearing the base of the cutting will injure the plant and its ability to form roots. In choosing a shoot to use for a cutting, the stem must be neither too hard nor too soft. If it is very soft and pliable, it is of no use and the same applies if it has gone quite woody. It is difficult to indicate the precise optimum state for cuttings, but a general rule of thumb is to take cuttings at that point where growth is firm enough to snap when the twig is bent sharply. If the wood bends, the cutting is too old (or too young) for satisfactory rooting. (If the shoot is snapped off, care should be taken to trim it to make the cut clean). Avoid taking abnormal growth or weak shoots from the center of the plant.
Once the shoot has been removed from the plant, remove all leaves that will be under the soil when it is inserted and remove some which will be above the soil level. The cuttings should be inserted into the soil about half their length, the soil replaced and firmed around them. The soil we are speaking of may be sand, perlite, vermiculite or kitty litter mixed with a small amount of potting soil.
The more foliage the cutting has the more it will transpire and lose moisture, causing it to wilt. If it loses too much moisture from the leaves, it is likely that it will die before it has a chance to take root. One method of circumventing this is to cut the leaves in half, allowing less leaf surface for transpiration. A more effective method is to place an empty gallon container over the shoot, thereby creating a miniature greenhouse that will retain the humidity the shoot needs to take root.
Rooting can be greatly speeded by treating the base of the cutting with a rooting hormone. Speed is important, because the quicker the cutting takes up water the less chance it will have to wilt. The brand names of two of these are Rootone and Hormodin. Again, this hormone can be purchased in nearly any store that sells plant or gardening supplies. Dip the moistened end of the stem into one of these powders, shake the excess powder off and insert the stem in the rooting medium. Be sure to read the instructions on the label and don’t expect the hormone to make up for any mistakes you make in watering, shading or sanitation. Too much of these hormones is worse than none at all.
Ground layering is another simple method of propagation in which branches are notched and brought into contact with the soil to make them take root while still attached to the parent plant. Once they have formed roots, they can be detached and planted, thus becoming new plants.
Select a low growing branch that can be bent to the soil of a new pot. Take a point a few inches from the end of the branch and just below a joint. On the underside of the branch at a selected point, make a slanting cut halfway through the branch and wedge it open with a people. Bend the branch into a hole in a pot placed nearby, placing the cut at the center and well toward the bottom. Anchor it with a heavy wire loop, fill the hole with soil, firm the soil and mulch the pot to conserve moisture. After several weeks, dig down carefully to see if the branch has taken root. If it has, sever it from the parent branch. If rooting has not taken place, put back the soil and wait. Sometimes this process will take several months.
Air layering is another ancient and well-proved technique for propagation. Select a pencil-sized branch. Below a joint either make a slanting cut 1/3 through the stem, inserting a piece of matchstick to keep it spread apart, or remove a ring of bark about 3/4 wide, scraping it down to the heartwood. Dust the cut lightly with rooting hormone powder, wrap the area with a generous handful of damp sphagnum moss, and enclose it in polyethylene. Bind it securely above and below the cut with string or wire ties.
I tried normal cuttings but it seems quite hard for them to form roots. Maybe im doing something wrong.
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Mateo
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Re: Coca growers [Re: Mateo]
#24893942 - 01/06/18 11:20 AM (6 years, 24 days ago) |
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I found where i got the info that south american coca growers starting to use cloning instead of seeds.
Original source is Medicinal & Poisonous Plants" - PROSEA Handbook No. 12, but i found the info on a website.
"Another interesting point is the South American coca farmers when collecting their seeds, pour them into a container of water and the seeds that float are discarded as they are non viable, another fact is that seeds collected from a plant grown by cutting, ie clonal propagation are not viable as they possess no embryo. Most South American coca farmers use this method as it results in earlier harvesting, and as a consequence the chance of obtaining viable seeds from Peru etc is becoming very difficult."
If this is correct they are using cuttings to cut the time for the cocabush to become leaf producing.
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StickyIcky Fingers
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Quote:
Solipsis said:
How toxic is nicotine to what stages of growth? And what about a datura extract (the plant itself kills insects on the spot)? Although I have no idea about yields, it would actually be kinda nice to grow something like the Nicotiana Rustica I have seeds of for the purpose of pest control.
I would think it would be good at larval stage (if they have one) and adult stage seeing as there is a whole class of synthetic insecticides based on it. But I did not have much success spraying tobacco tea at spider mites... didn't slow em much at all.
Datura extract might do it my last battle with spider mites did not go/end well. Be careful making/mixing/applying that stuff. Might make a good companion plant.
Tobacco tea is good for killing fungus gnats. As are neem oil and water traps.
Rosemary oil did not slow the mites and Monterry insecticide did work ok for a week or ten days. The neem oil spray did the best out of everything I tried and the mites still won until I cut and burned the plants (and wiped the tent down with iso)
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mrmazdarx9
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Registered: 05/15/16
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Full on terminator on them. Mines full of little bugs i gave up trying to kill them a long time ago, everytime i sprayed with food safe stuff all my leaves went yellow seemed trying to kill them caused more damage than the bugs ever did. Diatomaceous earth is said to be good and safe but ive never got round to getting some, thatll be my next stuff i try as and when i can be bothered.
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ferrel_human
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Registered: 06/26/09
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I guess you were right mrmazdarx9. Notice these tiny protusions? Almost looks like its gonna start making new sprouts.

And on closer inspection the trunk is quite green so its definitly alive. Im so happy. 
Had to take thwm outside cause its nice out. 73fahrenheit/22.78 celius
-------------------- Nature is my church and walking through it is gospel. It tells no lies and reveals all to those who look, and listen, closely. -Karode
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MoonFarmer
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mrmazdarx9
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Fingers crossed man like i said i was certain both times mine was dead but i gave it a chance i had nothing to lose kept watering when needed and it came back
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mrmazdarx9
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The first new shoot is growing like crazy and the other 3 are coming along well
 Im gonna have to remove the ephedra before it gets tangled in the new growth The first of the new leaves on the Lazarus coca as im now calling it are perfect colour and as big as my middle fInger
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Edited by mrmazdarx9 (01/07/18 12:48 PM)
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ferrel_human
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Registered: 06/26/09
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They look excellent bro. Good stuff. 
Lazarus coca is a term you coined? I like the leag structure.
-------------------- Nature is my church and walking through it is gospel. It tells no lies and reveals all to those who look, and listen, closely. -Karode
 Looking for Mimosa tenuiflora seeds. Buttons for trade
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Mateo
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Registered: 06/24/11
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Some nice looking new growth, looks like it really grows fast. That is a lot of old flowers, im suprised you dont get more berries. My berry is still alive but probably falls off any day now.
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Feroxx
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i have never ever grew coca or anything, but on other plants tobacco tea didnt do much for fungus gnats 4 me, but diatomite killed them all in a week or so last summer, i have had many dead insects on tobacco plants but there were some small green insects that seemed to not be affected and live on it, i also have had very small red insects in datura leaves, maybe i will consider growing chrysanthemum someday again
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mrmazdarx9
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Re: Coca growers [Re: Feroxx]
#24896732 - 01/07/18 03:39 PM (6 years, 23 days ago) |
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Quote:
ferrel_human said: They look excellent bro. Good stuff. 
Lazarus coca is a term you coined? I like the leag structure.
Yeah coz it came back from the dead lol twice like the story of Lazarus think its biblical dunno not into religion none conformist here.
Quote:
Mateo said: Some nice looking new growth, looks like it really grows fast. That is a lot of old flowers, im suprised you dont get more berries. My berry is still alive but probably falls off any day now.
Mate it goes through that many flowers a week no berries occassionally ill get a couple but they drop off every time while still green
Quote:
Feroxx said: i have never ever grew coca or anything, but on other plants tobacco tea didnt do much for fungus gnats 4 me, but diatomite killed them all in a week or so last summer, i have had many dead insects on tobacco plants but there were some small green insects that seemed to not be affected and live on it, i also have had very small red insects in datura leaves, maybe i will consider growing chrysanthemum someday again
I really need to buy some D.E. sound like the fucking golden ticket.
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Mateo
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I have read much good things about DE but doesn´t it only get things in the soil?
Someone said in another thread that the only thing that worked on spider mites was something called Safer soap or Safer spray. But i cant get this where i live unfortunatley.
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DBCOOPERCE
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Re: Coca growers [Re: Mateo]
#24898158 - 01/08/18 08:58 AM (6 years, 22 days ago) |
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Quote:
Mateo said: another fact is that seeds collected from a plant grown by cutting, ie clonal propagation are not viable as they possess no embryo.
Do you have any information about in which one of the Erythroxylum species this is the case ? To me it makes no sense that a plant, propagated by cuttings wouldn't produce viable seeds if self-fertile.
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Mateo
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I have no idea what type of coca it refered to, at least one type used for production and that will be E.Coca or E.Novo, probably E.Coca. Im no expert on plant sex, embryos, cromosomes and stuff, not in any plant type. Can it be so that ANY plant grown from a cutting, possesses no embryo in the seed and therfore has no viable seed? Just a guess, someone must know this stuff.
Some good news, i have got another berry forming on the same plant that already has one. So now there are 2 berries developing on one of my Novo´s    I cant help feeling little hopeful that they make it, even though i know chanses are slim. The first berry has grown but not turned orange/red yet.
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DualWieldRake
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Re: Coca growers [Re: Mateo]
#24898335 - 01/08/18 11:16 AM (6 years, 22 days ago) |
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The plant is not aware it is beeing a cutting and it's genetically identical to the original, so highly unlikely this would change things.
There are different types of flowers though (in atleast some of the coca species), and i believe not all type of flowers will be compatible with their own type. Possible it's just a mechanical thing where pollen won't reach receptacles, in that case you might be able to assist. You'd have to read up on it for all the details
https://filehost.net/1f99b69d6e8d6456
Heterostyly in Erythroxylum coca (Erythroxylaceae)
Edited by DualWieldRake (01/08/18 01:07 PM)
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Mateo
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I get a "File not yet uploaded" error on the file. Anyone able to dl it?
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DualWieldRake
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Re: Coca growers [Re: Mateo]
#24898496 - 01/08/18 01:06 PM (6 years, 22 days ago) |
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Link was not working, i changed it
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mrmazdarx9
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Ive read that cuttings do not produce seeds also
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Mateo
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Thanx for the scientific paper about Erythroxylum flowers. Intresting to read even though i sometimes cant understand all scientific wording.
I got some of the plant hormones and medium i ordered today. I just wait for a few more items then i going to experiment with micrpropagation and hormone boosted cutting attempts. Also going to try hormone aided germination of some seeds that didnt work.
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