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idiotek


Registered: 02/06/04
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Re: Why don't we have a "libtard" smiley? [Re: Dr.Wongburger] 1
#23403993 - 07/02/16 12:25 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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I think you're either a simpleton with a child's grasp on these concepts, or you're a troll intentionally stirring shit up in here with multiple incendiary topic threads.
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Dr.Wongburger
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Re: Why don't we have a "libtard" smiley? [Re: Pastywhyte]
#23403994 - 07/02/16 12:25 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Pastywhyte said:
Quote:
Dr.Wongburger said: I'm all for buying homeless people homes, helping people stay off the streets, loving the shit at of people and giving. My thing is tho I do not believe Government is meant to do it.
If not the government then who? The people responsible for the mess in the first place? Don't look at them, they are busy trying to figure out how to wring a little more out of the hyper-stressed populace and finite planet. The church(s)? Don't hold your breath, they are just as culpable as all the other guilty parties.
It is up to the government. But the problem with most governments is that they no longer see themselves as public servants. Instead they are "leaders". They went ahead and created their own class, unaccountable to most.
Libertarianism is retarded. It might have been a viable thought 200 years ago, but today it's completely out of touch. Unless you want to go off into the woods and live with pre industrial technology, there is no way you can extricate yourself from society. If you live in society or benefit from it, then you need to give back. Otherwise you are a leech on the rest of us who do give back.
This is where me and you disagree. I think no one has to do it. I see it as a "tough world" and if things go south then it's tough luck from there and that's just "to bad".
Regardless if it must continue the money should come from else where- some other form of taxation and not from my paycheck- income tax. There have been strives for tax reform this year. Idk which would work best but I have heard of the "consumption tax" also called the "fair tax". I can't comment on these things I just like how it would abolish the IRS.
I have to work to live. I don't like my living being taxed. I have to eat food. They do not tax my food thankfully (not that this justify's anything). No one forces me to buy items that may have higher taxs due to a tax reform. Luxury things or items like tv's or what not everyday things.. I'm just saying.. get the money from else where. not my paycheck. That's it haha. It really is. If it must continue.. okay, even tho I don't agree with it but don't steal from me.
However I'm very happy to share with you these words, it's a pleasure to converse. You guy's here on the shroomery provide hour's of fun for me.
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Dr.Wongburger
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Re: Why don't we have a "libtard" smiley? [Re: twighead]
#23404000 - 07/02/16 12:28 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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twighead said: Literally the only thing the free market is interested in is profits. Thinking that they'll pick up social work is some sort of libertarians delusion 
I can't speak for all libertarians (I actually had these views before knowing I was a libertarian and used the name because that's what i am apparently, many things match up)
but if you look at history and study you will find that we did not always have these social services. I suggest you do some research and discover how things used to work before big brother took over.
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twighead
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Re: Why don't we have a "libtard" smiley? [Re: Dr.Wongburger]
#23404012 - 07/02/16 12:31 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Yes I'm aware of what things were like in the 1890s...
Unrestrained industrial scale businesses and monopolistic control over sources of income, housing, and food do not a healthy society make.
Thank god for Teddy Roosevelt. Bringing the tyranny of workers rights
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Why don't we have a "libtard" smiley? [Re: idiotek]
#23404030 - 07/02/16 12:38 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Geoff Peterson said: I think you're either a simpleton with a child's grasp on these concepts, or you're a troll intentionally stirring shit up in here with multiple incendiary topic threads.
QFT
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Dr.Wongburger
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Re: Why don't we have a "libtard" smiley? [Re: idiotek]
#23404055 - 07/02/16 12:50 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Geoff Peterson said: I think you're either a simpleton with a child's grasp on these concepts, or you're a troll intentionally stirring shit up in here with multiple incendiary topic threads.
I have been a member of this community for 9 years. Even tho my profile say's otherwise my original account has been lost in the sands of time - My password was saved in gmail account along with my security code, one day I was messed up on drugs and paranoid, with all the incriminating things that I used to do back then associated with that email address I deleted the account and a few day's later the account was un accessible.
I'm not sure if that's breaking the rules but there is absolutely nothing I can do about it and it's gone forever. Can you imagine having a account made 9 year's ago then ( a few years back ) you don't get to have it any more? Every one see's me as a newb now I'm sure but i don't fucking care I moved on.
If you check out my thread on homosexuality there are very kind heart'd words and it's for the greater good. My recent thread on gun's and China is very informative and it was a shock today to me when I discovered how China cover's up all their mass killings.
I have 2 close mortal friends in this world, in this small town I live in. We hang out all the time and these are the type of things we talk about all the time. I'm not sure if that makes us nerds. My friend is a Libertarian and the other is a liberal. We talk about these subjects for hours on out every time we see each other. It's what I'm filled with,
"The worms crawl in, the worms crawl out In your stomach and out your mouth" - Tech N9ne
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hostileuniverse
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Re: Why don't we have a "libtard" smiley? [Re: twighead]
#23404088 - 07/02/16 01:06 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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twighead said: Literally the only thing the free market is interested in is profits. Thinking that they'll pick up social work is some sort of libertarians delusion 
Exactly, that's also why bill and Melinda gates have decided to give half their fortune to govt so it can be doled out for the "good of society"
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Supachopped719
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They did that for tax reasons, bruh. Some amount does get given to charity, but when billionaires 'pledge' vast portions of their fortune, 9 times out of ten it's to cheat taxes and help cronies.
-------------------- Real Eyes Realize Real Lies.
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hostileuniverse
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Re: Why don't we have a "libtard" smiley? [Re: Supachopped719]
#23404104 - 07/02/16 01:13 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Supachopped719 said: They did that for tax reasons, bruh. Some amount does get given to charity, but when billionaires 'pledge' vast portions of their fortune, 9 times out of ten it's to cheat taxes and help cronies.
Wrong, they still don't get to keep that money, they just don't have to pay tax on it. The real reason they give it to charity rather than govt is because they know charity won't waste the majority of it and govt will.
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Dr.Wongburger
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Re: Why don't we have a "libtard" smiley? [Re: twighead]
#23404167 - 07/02/16 01:41 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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twighead said: Yes I'm aware of what things were like in the 1890s...
Unrestrained industrial scale businesses and monopolistic control over sources of income, housing, and food do not a healthy society make.
Thank god for Teddy Roosevelt. Bringing the tyranny of workers rights 
"Roosevelt emerged spectacularly as a "trust buster" by forcing the dissolution of a great railroad combination in the Northwest. Other antitrust suits under the Sherman Act followed."
"Roosevelt thought it was particularly important for the government to supervise the workings of the railway to avoid corruption in interstate commerce related to the shipment of coal and other commodities and goods. The result was enactment of the Hepburn Act in 1906, that established Federal control over railroad rates.[104]"
Great guy.. controlling the free market. Allowing government to stick their noses into things. I'm not the most knowledgeable on old teddy so please quote me otherwise if he was not about controlling the free market.
Income taxes evolved, but in 1894 the Supreme Court declared the Income Tax of 1894 unconstitutional in Pollock v. Farmers' Loan & Trust Co.. The federal government scrambled to raise money.[5]
In 1906, with the election of President Theodore Roosevelt, and later his successor William Howard Taft, the United States saw a populist movement for tax reform. This movement culminated during then candidate Woodrow Wilson's election of 1912 and in February 1913, the ratification of the Sixteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution:
"The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration."
So some time after Teddy was out of office after spending all that cash on those big projects (this statement is not based solely on what I posted above) uncle sam decides he's running low on cash and here comes in the Income Tax. hmmmm...
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twighead
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Re: Why don't we have a "libtard" smiley? [Re: Dr.Wongburger]
#23404193 - 07/02/16 01:57 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Breaking up monopolies is/was an extremely good thing - and most libertarian's that know about economics support the anti-trust laws because the free market doesn't function when there's no competition, and high barriers to entry. That puts companies in a favorable position to focus mostly on sitting on their fat money making machine instead of innovating and competitively pricing.
For better or worse - the whole world has income taxing now, in the realm of good - it's allowed worldwide govt's to fund a military powerful enough to ensure the nations survival - particularly from 1912-1945... as well as facilitating massive infrastructure projects which were the backbone of the US' rapid economic rise. Obviously in the negatives, spending can be frivolous, inefficient, rerouted, corrupt, heavily lobbied by corporate interests... etc.
Though as I see it, it isn't having the taxation/government system that is the problem - technically public pay systems have the potential to be much more efficient for the tasks they seek to cover. Corruption and a political games seem to form the root of the problems with said system. And still - countries that have communal health care systems save significant money. The US spends approx 2x per capita on health care. So it would seem that the potential bureaucratic follies and corruption of government are still preferable to the absurd profiteering in this country.
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Dr.Wongburger
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Re: Why don't we have a "libtard" smiley? [Re: twighead]
#23404286 - 07/02/16 02:38 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
twighead said:
For better or worse - the whole world has income taxing now, in the realm of good - it's allowed worldwide govt's to fund a military powerful enough to ensure the nations survival - particularly from 1912-1945... as well as facilitating massive infrastructure projects which were the backbone of the US' rapid economic rise. Obviously in the negatives, spending can be frivolous, inefficient, rerouted, corrupt, heavily lobbied by corporate interests... etc.
Though as I see it, it isn't having the taxation/government system that is the problem - technically public pay systems have the potential to be much more efficient for the tasks they seek to cover. Corruption and a political games seem to form the root of the problems with said system. And still - countries that have communal health care systems save significant money. The US spends approx 2x per capita on health care. So it would seem that the potential bureaucratic follies and corruption of government are still preferable to the absurd profiteering in this country.
To bad it's that way. I would rather have no economic ride than allow a nation (the US) to commit theft towards it's people. As a emergency tax such as during the Civil war or when ever that's one thing. I can't really state how I feel about it because I'm not sure.
With no emergency I see it as just being un American. I think it's bullshit that we are now forced into health care. I hope that changes.
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twighead
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Re: Why don't we have a "libtard" smiley? [Re: Dr.Wongburger]
#23404298 - 07/02/16 02:43 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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What's specifically bullshit imo is being forced into private insurance, I wouldn't have a problem with a system that was similar to Canada's or Germany's.
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Dr.Wongburger
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Re: Why don't we have a "libtard" smiley? [Re: twighead]
#23404320 - 07/02/16 02:50 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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twighead said: What's specifically bullshit imo is being forced into private insurance, I wouldn't have a problem with a system that was similar to Canada's or Germany's.
I can understand how you feel. Since I have the same feeling but in the opposite direction. What nation are you apart of? If it's from other than the U.S. and the nation is set up that way- supposed to be that way your views are completely valid 100%.
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hostileuniverse
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Re: Why don't we have a "libtard" smiley? [Re: Dr.Wongburger]
#23404378 - 07/02/16 03:15 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Taxes aren't the problem, Over taxation is, there is simply no reason for people to be paying upwards of half their income to the govt in some form of taxation
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Dr.Wongburger
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Registered: 08/23/15
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Quote:
hostileuniverse said: Taxes aren't the problem, Over taxation is, there is simply no reason for people to be paying upwards of half their income to the govt in some form of taxation
BUT what about the children?!? They have to go to college one day! Surely even tho college a choice they have to go! We have to take the money and use it for young people so when they get old enough they can go to college!
What would we do if they did not get to go on our dime...
Iv'e actually considered making a "hitler" video over this income tax thing. You know... the scene that every one uses to edit in their own sub titles...
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Why don't we have a "libtard" smiley? [Re: Dr.Wongburger]
#23404451 - 07/02/16 03:43 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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So when nearly all the power and money collects to the top (it's almost complete) and is firmly held what's your plan? If the whole world is uneducated, there is no water treatment, no sanitation, zero waste disposal, and all the money and resources are controlled by a tiny elite, you just gonna take off into the woods and sleep on a mattress of money that you kept from the big bad tax man?
Like I said before, you are being robbed. You're just blind to what is actually being taken. Like a sheep worried about the other sheep getting a bigger share of the food, you stampede right into the shearing station. You then feel justified in having more food cause you "earned it". But you still get fleeced in the end. No better than liberals. Worse actually because at least liberals want something more in return. You just want to collect fiat fairy tales.
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Dr.Wongburger
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Re: Why don't we have a "libtard" smiley? [Re: Pastywhyte]
#23404529 - 07/02/16 04:28 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Pastywhyte said: So when nearly all the power and money collects to the top (it's almost complete) and is firmly held what's your plan? If the whole world is uneducated, there is no water treatment, no sanitation, zero waste disposal, and all the money and resources are controlled by a tiny elite, you just gonna take off into the woods and sleep on a mattress of money that you kept from the big bad tax man?
Like I said before, you are being robbed. You're just blind to what is actually being taken. Like a sheep worried about the other sheep getting your share of the food, you stampede right into the shearing station. No better than liberals. Worse actually because at least liberals want something in return. You just want to collect fiat fairy tales.
Theft is theft. Committing a wrong simply does not make a right. Which post did you reply to?
What money are speaking of? Money that's already mine in the first place? The States have 105 years under it's belt of no income tax. I am not against local educational systems. I am against federal education. College should not be funded by tax dollars. Why would the entire world be uneducated? The world does no revolve around the United States. I speak for/about my nation when it comes to the income tax. There are other options btw.
If for some reason my area of the United States lost water treatment I would leave the city and move to the county where I'm legally allowed to have a well. My buddy has a well, it's the cleanest water I have ever drank. There's plenty of un inhabited land here. People do what they have to do to survive well's have been dug threw out human history- all the way to biblical times.
What do you mean sanitation? In older times they had out houses. They would dig a hole in the ground so you could use your bath room there. But United states did not cease to exist. Although that is terrible. If you mean food wise- lack of regulation of food, China is a pretty good example of that, they don't give two shit's if your food is contaminated it's pretty terrible but the nation is still alive. I'm not saying that's a good thing. If you were just also meaning waste management (trash disposal) why would there ever be none? If Government ditched it which I'm not implying they would but also I'm not sure if any income tax dollars go to this area of life (I don't believe it does) so I don't see why it would be of a concern but if they did ditch it, it would be a big opening for the free market, it would more than likely take over since there would be plenty of money to be made.
Since this hypothetical situation was made up(maybe i'm lost's in posts, I don't recall which this was a reply to), let's say it actually happen. Freedom, pure clean freedom allowed it to happen. The elite have it all.
Then the rest of us die and become dry bones. I guess that's tough luck there and the way the cookie crumbles. This free society is not mean to be perfect. A free society is not a perfect society. It's a total messed up place when viewed by people from the outside but those are consequences of freedom.
Thank you for the scenario tho I enjoyed it .
Also I see the little blue numbers, does that indicate the post you replied to? I went threw the page and did not see it.
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Why don't we have a "libtard" smiley? [Re: Dr.Wongburger]
#23404536 - 07/02/16 04:32 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Dude you are hilarious. You sound like a temporarily embarrassed billionaire if I ever heard one. Good luck, I wish you well on you quest to hold on to what's yours. . .whatever that is.
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Dr.Wongburger
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Re: Why don't we have a "libtard" smiley? [Re: Pastywhyte]
#23404549 - 07/02/16 04:37 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Thank you. I wish the fact's said I was a billionaire! I understand what you are implying tho (the moving). I would really tho move into my friends house. He's a nice guy.
My whole thing is I just want what's mine (my entire pay check- the rights to the fruit of my own labor). haha that's it.
Thank you tho it was fun talking to you.
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