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OfflineGIjoe420
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B+ Fruiting Log - grain -> coir - Multispore Monotub
    #23354486 - 06/17/16 11:32 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

  • Wild Bird Seed (Kroger Brand) was prepped using Doc34`s Wild Bird Seed Tek

  • Knocked up a jar with MS syringe from vendor (B +, 2 cc). Then a G2G transfer in to 5 more jars.

  • Spawned to coir at a 1:3 ish ratio using Damion5050's My Elementary Coir Tek

  • Substrate is about 3 1/2 inches deep. I used leftover coir prep for casing layer


DAY 01 - introducing to fruiting conditions



Edited by GIjoe420 (06/19/16 09:32 AM)

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OfflineClintMassey
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Re: B+ Fruiting Log - grain -> coir - Multispore Monotub [Re: GIjoe420]
    #23354495 - 06/17/16 11:34 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

I love the b+ strain,one of my favourite strains...Its gonna be a bunch of them over there


--------------------
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Cause the crowd get shot down, and I don't get shot down

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Invisibleopenmindedcanvas
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Re: B+ Fruiting Log - grain -> coir - Multispore Monotub [Re: GIjoe420]
    #23354530 - 06/17/16 11:46 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

looking awesome!
:thumb:

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OfflineGIjoe420
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Re: B+ Fruiting Log - grain -> coir - Multispore Monotub [Re: GIjoe420]
    #23360248 - 06/19/16 09:19 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

YESTERDAY (6-18-16) DAY 02

Woke up and checked on the tub and once again my gut dropped straight out of my ass and hit the floor  :facepalm3:  That oh-too-familiar smell of contamination. I'm not really sure what's going on. My last tub I ran contaminated as well but I was way too hasty and it wasn't nearly 100% colonized on the surface before I went in to fruiting so I chalked it up to that. I'm guessing I'll still get one flush in before I take her on out to the mushie cemetery out back.

  • I have had at least 3 successful grows in this same tub
  • Same bird seed and same bird seed prep
  • Same Eco Earth coir and prep
  • Same materials used all around


The only thing that I can think is different is this:

instead of using my normal knocker lids I just used a straight filter. I read a post by RR that said he does his G2G jars filter only. I noticed that the top layer of the grain doesn't colonize completely. My last shake is between 90%-100% so I didn't think this was THAT big of a deal but IDK. Still learning here. And my tub is not as dialed in as I would like. I don't have the same condensation happening in the tub. The walls are about dry as a bone but the ceiling is wet per the usual. We are having higher-than-normal temps in the house lately so there is more airflow than I normally have.
                                         

TODAY (6-19-16) DAY 03

The contamination smell has decreased ?!?  :shrug: ?!? The beautiful mushroom smell is coming back. I didn't notice much of a change in the surface of the substrate other than there  is a little more pre-knotting or whatever (I'm not sure how to explain it) and the fluffy myc on the edges is starting to condense more. Was I not 100% yet on Day 01? I mean there was a tiny bit of casing layer still showing and today it is covered more but that has been normal for me in the past. I let it colonize for 8 days after I mixed the sub.


Edited by GIjoe420 (06/19/16 09:27 AM)

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OfflinecronicrFacebook
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Re: B+ Fruiting Log - grain -> coir - Multispore Monotub [Re: GIjoe420]
    #23360303 - 06/19/16 09:39 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

:cool:


--------------------

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OfflineRosen_Rot
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Re: B+ Fruiting Log - grain -> coir - Multispore Monotub [Re: cronicr]
    #23360386 - 06/19/16 10:11 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

:brilliant:


--------------------
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InvisibleTheChief
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Re: B+ Fruiting Log - grain -> coir - Multispore Monotub [Re: GIjoe420]
    #23360395 - 06/19/16 10:14 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

You were 100% on day 1, yes.  The substrate won't just colonize and stop there though, they like to continue to colonise even deeper (consolidating the substrate) before fruiting usually, that is what you are seeing.  The mycellium may become much whiter and thicker in the first few days of fruiting conditions as this happens.  Once the substrate has got hold of sufficient nutrients locked within, that is when it will begin to produce fruits.

Edit:  About the smell, I know what your talking about, sometimes I get odd smells too. It can mean contamination or just some odd smell is being produced as the nutrients are eatin by the mushrooms. Different substrate materials will also produce different smells. Bacterial infection can also cause it, sometimes it isn't a big issue and you can fruit along side it with no problems. Ideally when you bust up your grain jars before spawning you should give them a wif to see if they smell like fresh mush, after spawning the smell can varie a lot and is not so much of a concern.

Is it a sweet smell?

:chief:

Edited by TheChief (06/19/16 10:27 AM)

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InvisibleTheChief
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Re: B+ Fruiting Log - grain -> coir - Multispore Monotub [Re: GIjoe420]
    #23360432 - 06/19/16 10:33 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

The top layer not colonising in your jars could be due to too much GE and the surface grains dried out, they don't like to colonise dry stuff. Uncolonised grains are also contamination hazard when spawning. I would suggest tighten up your gas exchange holes some how.


--------------------


jcbowling1985 said:
"Additionally I did one Armageddon jar with all of the types together."

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OfflineGIjoe420
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Re: B+ Fruiting Log - grain -> coir - Multispore Monotub [Re: TheChief]
    #23360437 - 06/19/16 10:35 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Thanks for the info CHIEF. The smell is sweet-ish (?), but not overwhelming and there is a hint of mustiness or dampness? I can only get one whiff when I pop the lid and then it fades and all I smell is shroom. When I spawned the jars they smelled absolutely wonderful! I just know from my last tub experience that with that particular smell of DAY 02, it got stronger and the green stuff followed. I've lost one mono and 3 cakes and they all had this smell. I'm hoping you're spot on about the output from consumption being the culprit because I'm not 100% positive that the cakes smelled exactly like this. It was a while ago when I was still fucking around with the BRF BS 
:toast: Here's to hoping! Keep sending those positive vibes Chief!



I had the same thought about the uncolonized grain. I am switching back to the old G2G jars I used. I was just tight on time this run and my old lids are in use with some Ecuadors.

Lids that I normally run:

Edited by GIjoe420 (06/19/16 10:50 AM)

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InvisibleTheChief
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Re: B+ Fruiting Log - grain -> coir - Multispore Monotub [Re: GIjoe420]
    #23360530 - 06/19/16 11:11 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Yes, I know that sweet musty smell all too well.

Just make sure your grain prep and cultures are done right.

I have had many tubs smell that way and fruit just fine, but it all comes down to your spawn. If your spawn is clean you got nothing to worry about. Substrate prep plays a small factor but not much if you have a clean, strong culture.

If you use CVG, for example, you don't even have to pasteurize it. When you add stuff like poo and or peat moss proper pasturization becomes a factor because contams naturally thrive in those additives, they are usually already present.

Don't worry so much about casing layers with cubes if your not too keen on proper pasturization and pH adjustments. Cubes don't really need a casing, although it can inprove results. The problem is they are not worth the extra contam risk unless you know exactly what you are doing. 

I suggest sticking to CVG and no casing until you get contaminations under control, then move on to the more advance techniques, to improve results.


--------------------


jcbowling1985 said:
"Additionally I did one Armageddon jar with all of the types together."

Edited by TheChief (06/19/16 11:22 AM)

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InvisibleMoabfighter
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Re: B+ Fruiting Log - grain -> coir - Multispore Monotub [Re: TheChief]
    #23360577 - 06/19/16 11:21 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

I really think the sweet smell is the Coir. I've noticed it often. Not really had much contam issues before either.


--------------------
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InvisibleTheChief
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Re: B+ Fruiting Log - grain -> coir - Multispore Monotub [Re: Moabfighter]
    #23361785 - 06/19/16 07:42 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Moabfighter said:
I really think the sweet smell is the Coir. I've noticed it often. Not really had much contam issues before either.



I agree with you, seems like it may be the coir, which produces a sweet smell as the mushrooms eat it.  It makes sense because it is just in the built up co2 they give off opening the tub when we smell it, after it subsides like OP said, it smells just like fresh mushrooms again.

It is the main ingredient we all used in our substrates, smelled like mushrooms on the grains before, I say it is a very good chance this is the case...

:chief:


--------------------


jcbowling1985 said:
"Additionally I did one Armageddon jar with all of the types together."

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OfflineGIjoe420
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Re: B+ Fruiting Log - grain -> coir - Multispore Monotub [Re: GIjoe420]
    #23364143 - 06/20/16 03:31 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

DAY 04

Motha Fuckin' Dick Suck! Saw that little green piece of shit, closed the lid, and took it outside of the house.



Trich right? So what's next? Toss the bitch and make sure I limit my GE on the next run? I couldn't think of any other culprit and I have 5 more grain jars exactly like this ready to go. I taped up the tops to limit the GE as per CHIEFS suggestion


next run on last shake and new tape:

Edited by GIjoe420 (06/20/16 04:00 PM)

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OfflineKenetic
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Re: B+ Fruiting Log - grain -> coir - Multispore Monotub [Re: GIjoe420]
    #23364233 - 06/20/16 04:02 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Looks like bruising.  Plus the yellow tint is what I get occasionally if the surface is too dry. 
Too much fae and not enough moisture turns shit yellow, with bruising soon to follow


--------------------
Todo Cambia
   

               
                                                :cookiemonster::elmo:



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OfflineKenetic
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Re: B+ Fruiting Log - grain -> coir - Multispore Monotub [Re: Kenetic]
    #23364238 - 06/20/16 04:04 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

See how the yellow tint is only on the edge of the tub?  Polyfil in bottom holes is too loose


--------------------
Todo Cambia
   

               
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OfflineKenetic
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Re: B+ Fruiting Log - grain -> coir - Multispore Monotub [Re: Kenetic]
    #23364239 - 06/20/16 04:05 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Oh shit just saw the close up of the green.  Nvm


--------------------
Todo Cambia
   

               
                                                :cookiemonster::elmo:



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OfflineGIjoe420
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Re: B+ Fruiting Log - grain -> coir - Multispore Monotub [Re: Kenetic]
    #23364687 - 06/20/16 06:47 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Trichoderma
Sources: Soil, Dust, Clothing
Odors: Coconut, Musty

Although the spores are far less common indoors than the previous molds Trichoderma's aggressive nature makes it one of the most common contaminants in mushroom cultivation. It's mycelium is a tranparent to light grey color and can be very difficult to see depending on the substrate. The first visible sign is often a thick bright white aerial mycelium that grows over the surface of the substrate. Spore are produced on this mycelium turning it a yellow to green color often with a noticeable bright white 'apron' still surrounding the colony. The wet spores it produces are too heavy to become airborne on their own but are able adhere to airborne dust particles and become airborne that way. The sticky nature of the spores make them a common contaminant in still air box work as they easily stick to gloves and jars. Sporulation occurs from various triggers including light, nutrients in the substrate, full colonization, and damage to colonies. Often times sporulation will not be triggered until after spawning, leaving unsuspecting cultivators unaware their healthy appearing spawn is actually contaminated. Smell testing jars before use is essential for catching this mold before spawning although not all species produce a distinct odor.

Contamination is also common after spawning, Freshly spawned grains are quite vulnerable when Trichoderma spores are present in large amounts and cross contamination can occur after handling sources of the spores such as dust and soil. The spores are killed very easily by pasteurization however sterilizing many bulk substrate will actually leave them more vulnerable. Generally Trichoderma does not grow aggressively until it has reached the grain spawn so contamination related to improper pasteurization tends to occur in later flushes.

Casing layers are also vulnerable to Trichoderma. Casing material should always be pasteurized. Although very few species can actually grow on living mushrooms, the enzymes produced can degrade the quality of the mushrooms causing brown spotting and aborts. In case where mold is present on a mushroom will be obvious dark brown damage to the mushroom. In the case of Cubensis it will generally be on old aborted mushrooms. Trichoderma is generally harmless aside allergic reaction to airborne spores so no need to get overly worried about if a mushroom may have hidden mold in it or anything like that. If the mushroom looks healthy keep it. It should be noted however that Trichoderma infected mushrooms may produce the appearance of mold after harvest if not promptly dried and is most likely the case when Trich appears on any harvested mushroom.




from recognizing and dealing with contamination thanks Kizzle!



So after reading this I have more confirmation on Chiefs suspicion that the top layer of grain not being completely colonized is the most likely reason for the contamination. I am going to test that on the next run by limiting the GE on my jars and following the same process. The part that is highlighted and underlined struck me. I didn't think it was a good idea to keep the tub going if the trich is present. Can someone with some experience in this area enlighten me?

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Re: B+ Fruiting Log - grain -> coir - Multispore Monotub [Re: GIjoe420]
    #23364778 - 06/20/16 07:18 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

I don't recommend keeping a mean green tub around for long, I would just toss it as quick as possible.  That is the bummer about tubs, they are pretty big substrates and once you got something else in there with it, you usually lose it all.

I have bisected out trich before with some success, but most times, it usually did not end well.  If you leave it for too long you'll have a real nasty mess to clean up, that green stuff is not a nice thing to overload your grow area with spores of either.

Running smaller grows in tiny containers or trays may save a lot of materials when you are just starting out, until you get the contaminations under control. You can fill up a mono tub with a bunch of smaller subs and it will still work just like if you had a big one in there. This way if one or more gets contamination, you won't lose your whole grow, you can just get rid of the smaller subs in question and keep the others.

Once you get to the point where you feel you've eliminated your contamination issues, you can go back to full size subs being confident they won't trich out.  Just a suggestion though.

Toss it. Start over. Make sure your sterile procedures and grain prep are solid before moving on.

Sorry for your loss.  It happens to the best of us.

:chief:


--------------------


jcbowling1985 said:
"Additionally I did one Armageddon jar with all of the types together."

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OfflineSloppyJoseph
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Re: B+ Fruiting Log - grain -> coir - Multispore Monotub [Re: TheChief]
    #23364812 - 06/20/16 07:33 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Yeah seeing as you don't have any pins, that tub will probably be over run with trich before you even see a mushroom. I went to look at this dub tub that I left too long, spores everywhere. I was gonna dunk just to see what was up. I hadn't looked at in for 3 days... popped it open this morning to this.



Just to give you an idea of how fast this stuff moves.


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AMU Q&A

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OfflineKenetic
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Re: B+ Fruiting Log - grain -> coir - Multispore Monotub [Re: SloppyJoseph]
    #23364990 - 06/20/16 08:36 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

SloppyJoseph said:
Yeah seeing as you don't have any pins, that tub will probably be over run with trich before you even see a mushroom. I went to look at this dub tub that I left too long, spores everywhere. I was gonna dunk just to see what was up. I hadn't looked at in for 3 days... popped it open this morning to this.



Just to give you an idea of how fast this stuff moves.




Ouch man that's terrible.  R.I.P.


--------------------
Todo Cambia
   

               
                                                :cookiemonster::elmo:



DMT said: Everyone know's me, they just don't know it yet

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