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OfflineEggtimer
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Air dispersal LSD device?
    #23355956 - 06/17/16 08:22 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Is this possible? Like a LSD gas bomb?
If so would there be any way to control dosage like nanoparticles?
Would it be considered a war crime to use these in a war?


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Offlinechulutu
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Re: Air dispersal LSD device? [Re: Eggtimer]
    #23356057 - 06/17/16 08:56 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

i remember reading a book on the history of acid and the goverment expeiments with lsd like chemicals the military at one point had a chemical called BZ.

they had to follow a scientist around the lab for 5 days after testing it on him with a mattress because he would randomly pass out and fall asleep.

IIRC the BZ was in the same active ingredient measurement of LSD and could be delivered as a spray with water just like LSD as far as a i know (without any chlorine in the water if i remember right because it can cause LSD to decay rapidly. Hell if you could get/make enough LSD you could literally poision a water supply or simply spray people with a fucking supersoaker. no special equipment needed.

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OfflineEggtimer
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Re: Air dispersal LSD device? [Re: chulutu]
    #23356093 - 06/17/16 09:11 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

chulutu said:
i remember reading a book on the history of acid and the goverment expeiments with lsd like chemicals the military at one point had a chemical called BZ.

they had to follow a scientist around the lab for 5 days after testing it on him with a mattress because he would randomly pass out and fall asleep.

IIRC the BZ was in the same active ingredient measurement of LSD and could be delivered as a spray with water just like LSD as far as a i know (without any chlorine in the water if i remember right because it can cause LSD to decay rapidly. Hell if you could get/make enough LSD you could literally poision a water supply or simply spray people with a fucking supersoaker. no special equipment needed.




I always thought it would be cool if you were super rich and could crop dust the middle east, north korea, or DC with LSD or something lmao.

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OfflineLogicaL ChaosM
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Re: Air dispersal LSD device? [Re: Eggtimer]
    #23356291 - 06/17/16 11:09 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

It would be very very difficult to control dosage.

Also, LSD would likely be destroyed by the bombs explosion unless they used a pressure bomb or something not hot, to preserve the LSD.

I think having tiny homing needles laced with LSD would be the best bet for individually dosing people in the open. Then finish the people indoors with Acid gernades :lol:


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OfflineEggtimer
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Re: Air dispersal LSD device? [Re: LogicaL Chaos]
    #23356346 - 06/17/16 11:43 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

LogicaL Chaos said:
It would be very very difficult to control dosage.

Also, LSD would likely be destroyed by the bombs explosion unless they used a pressure bomb or something not hot, to preserve the LSD.

I think having tiny homing needles laced with LSD would be the best bet for individually dosing people in the open. Then finish the people indoors with Acid gernades :lol:




They have yeast that can potentially produce many organic chems right now. Right now it's very costly and impractical but the people working on it think within 5 years it may be something to look out for.
I forgot what my point was lmao might be time for bed.

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InvisibleEllisDSox
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Re: Air dispersal LSD device? [Re: Eggtimer]
    #23356367 - 06/17/16 11:53 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

According to Acid Dreams, which I assume is the book chulutu is talking about, serious attempts were made to make an airborne LSD delivery system and it just didn't work. It's unclear what happened with BZ. All the alleged uses of it (generally Vietnam and more modern conflicts in the Middle East) are massively uncertain, but I think it is confirmed that the US possessed literal tonnes of the shit until some time in the 80s. It's a totally unrelated drug, though. I also need to sleep. Fuck the world.


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InvisibleShroomopotamus
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Re: Air dispersal LSD device? [Re: EllisDSox]
    #23356372 - 06/17/16 11:58 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

air fresheners or spray bottles filled with lsd attached to like a drone or kite er plane er hot air balloon, or regular ole balloon probably wouldn't be too hard to make happen


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Edited by Shroomopotamus (06/17/16 11:59 PM)

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OfflineLogicaL ChaosM
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Re: Air dispersal LSD device? [Re: Shroomopotamus]
    #23356443 - 06/18/16 12:33 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Thats actually not a bad idea!

Wait till 404 hears about this!

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Invisible404
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Re: Air dispersal LSD device? [Re: chulutu]
    #23356445 - 06/18/16 12:35 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Dr. nichols explains that it can't really be absorbed through the skin and must be ingested, so super soaker is out.

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InvisibleliloldmeFacebook
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Re: Air dispersal LSD device? [Re: 404]
    #23356462 - 06/18/16 12:50 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

I would use pneumatic and a nozzle to keep the temp low. Would this be an impact device or something on a timer? Not that I would really make one of these for LSD, but have a similar design for a pneumatic powered FAE device I would like to patent that does not require primers, booster charges or any other HE for fuel dispersal so it's technically legal to possess as a civilian. Stoned and rambling :laugh:

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OfflineEggtimer
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Re: Air dispersal LSD device? [Re: 404]
    #23356472 - 06/18/16 12:56 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

404 said:
Dr. nichols explains that it can't really be absorbed through the skin and must be ingested, so super soaker is out.




Always thought this stuff was intresting appeatly as soon as it touches your skin you get a garalic like taste in your mouth. With some of the crazy drug dilvery systems they've been able to make with nano particles I think they could do it.


Dimethyl sulfoxide

Quote:

Use of DMSO in medicine dates from around 1963, when an Oregon Health & Science University Medical School team, headed by Stanley Jacob, discovered it could penetrate the skin and other membranes without damaging them and could carry other compounds into a biological system. In medicine, DMSO is predominantly used as a topical analgesic, a vehicle for topical application of pharmaceuticals, as an anti-inflammatory, and an antioxidant.[19] Because DMSO increases the rate of absorption of some compounds through organic tissues, including skin, it is used in some transdermal drug delivery systems. Its effect may be enhanced with the addition of EDTA. It is frequently compounded with antifungal medications, enabling them to penetrate not just skin but also toenails and fingernails.

DMSO has been examined for the treatment of numerous conditions and ailments, but the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) has approved its use only for the symptomatic relief of patients with interstitial cystitis.[citation needed] A 1978 study concluded that DMSO brought significant relief to the majority of the 213 patients with inflammatory genitourinary disorders that were studied.[20] The authors recommended DMSO for genitourinary inflammatory conditions not caused by infection or tumor in which symptoms were severe or patients failed to respond to conventional therapy.

Dolobene gel, containing DMSO, dexpanthenol, and heparin, is sold in Germany and eastern Europe for topical use in sprains, tendinitis, and local inflammation.[21]

In interventional radiology, DMSO is used as a solvent for ethylene vinyl alcohol in the Onyx liquid embolic agent, which is used in embolization, the therapeutic occlusion of blood vessels.

In medical research, DMSO is often used as a drug vehicle in in vivo and in vitro experiments. However, when a researcher is unaware of its pleiotropic effects, or when the control groups are not carefully planned, a bias can occur; an effect of DMSO can be falsely attributed to the drug.[22] For example, even a very low dose of DMSO has a powerful protective effect against paracetamol (acetaminophen)-induced liver injury in mice.[23]

In cryobiology DMSO has been used as a cryoprotectant and is still an important constituent of cryoprotectant vitrification mixtures used to preserve organs, tissues, and cell suspensions. Without it, up to 90% of frozen cells will become inactive. It is particularly important in the freezing and long-term storage of embryonic stem cells and hematopoietic stem cells, which are often frozen in a mixture of 10% DMSO, a freezing medium, and 30% fetal bovine serum. In the cryogenic freezing of heteroploid cell lines (MDCK, VERO, etc.) a mixture of 10% DMSO with 90% EMEM (70% EMEM + 30% fetal bovine serum + antibiotic mixture) is used. As part of an autologous bone marrow transplant the DMSO is re-infused along with the patient's own hematopoietic stem cells.

DMSO is metabolized by disproportionation to dimethyl sulfide and dimethyl sulfone. It is subject to renal and pulmonary excretion. A possible side effect of DMSO is therefore elevated blood dimethyl sulfide, which may cause a blood borne halitosis symptom.[citation needed]




Quote:

liloldme said:
I would use pneumatic and a nozzle to keep the temp low. Would this be an impact device or something on a timer? Not that I would really make one of these for LSD, but have a similar design for a pneumatic powered FAE device I would like to patent that does not require primers, booster charges or any other HE for fuel dispersal so it's technically legal to possess as a civilian. Stoned and rambling :laugh:



I was thinking like a gas grenade, timed canister, or something that could be sprayed out of a plane like an actual crop duster. You could do a carpet bombing with gas grenades I guess :lol:

Edited by Eggtimer (06/18/16 01:00 AM)

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Invisible404
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Re: Air dispersal LSD device? [Re: Eggtimer]
    #23356475 - 06/18/16 01:00 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

I think that's the one he used to make it absorb through the skin, and still nothing happened.

Quote:

"I've made LSD in my lab on many occasions for research purposes, possibly in not so meticulous a manner as Albert Hofmann. Nothing ever happened. I had several graduate students who made LSD as an intermediate for projects. No accidental ingestion of LSD ever occurred. A technician in my lab makes it routinely because we use it as a drug to train our rats. He's learned by experience that he never gets high, nothing ever happens. And yesterday I was talking to Nick Sand, and Nick said, "I made a solution of LSD in DMSO…" DMSO (dimethyl sulfoxide) is a chemical that greatly enhances absorption of other chemicals through the skin -- he says, "…I painted it on my skin. Nothing happened." A concentrated solution and nothing happened! How did this very meticulous Swiss chemist get the LSD into his body? I don't know. " The other point we need to think about is that when Albert was a child, he had what he called a spontaneous mystical experience. Now depending on whether you're a psychologist or a psychiatrist or whatever, we could say that Albert had a predisposition to altered states of consciousness.





I guess it was Nick Sand who did it, not Dr. Nichols. Still, looks as if LSD cannot be absorbed through the skin, even with DMSO

Edited by 404 (06/18/16 01:08 AM)

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Offlinedixienormous


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Re: Air dispersal LSD device? [Re: 404]
    #23356511 - 06/18/16 01:19 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

404 said:
Dr. nichols explains that it can't really be absorbed through the skin and must be ingested, so super soaker is out.



I know nichols says this but my own cousin has a beautiful story about how she was dosed during a hug on the neck as well as her male friend and they've been dating since. I guess the guy just saw something they didn't see yet. :smugjerry:

Also both Nick and Nichols did it in DMSO. There might be a difference in ethanol or H2O and alas there might be other variables not accounted for. Nichols lab can only produce 100mg a year while for example Pickard would do 1000 gram batches. It's more likely some would get in the air with such a high volume.

Edited by dixienormous (06/18/16 01:25 AM)

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Invisible404
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Re: Air dispersal LSD device? [Re: dixienormous]
    #23356527 - 06/18/16 01:27 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

I don't know, but i'm inclined to believe the experienced chemist[s] on this matter than an anecdotal story passed on by another person, no offense.

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Offlinedixienormous


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Re: Air dispersal LSD device? [Re: 404]
    #23356534 - 06/18/16 01:32 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

I guess we won't know until someone takes a vial and drops a drop on their neck.

Also if you put LSD in a spray bottle and get sprayed in the face you'll get dosed. I've heard numerous accounts from numerous people. My best friends mom got dosed that way when she was thirteen and didn't know what was happening. Put her off from it for life and now she's an alcoholic a little bit and it would help her.  :mad2:

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Re: Air dispersal LSD device? [Re: dixienormous] * 1
    #23356573 - 06/18/16 01:56 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

if you inhale lsd vapors you will trip balls:awesomenod:

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