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InvisibleliloldmeFacebook
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Registered: 05/15/04
Posts: 5,087
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Re: Why have a gun? [Re: Bodhi of Ankou]
    #23374706 - 06/23/16 06:25 PM (7 years, 7 months ago)

they had more than enough red flags to stop this guy from buying a firearm legally. he had the FBI called on him just weeks before the shooting and it still happened somehow..


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Why have a gun? [Re: Bodhi of Ankou]
    #23374729 - 06/23/16 06:31 PM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Bodhi of Ankou said:
But your suggesting people should be arrested for thought crimes. Thats a dangerous precedent to set man.




The guy threatened to kill his coworkers praising ISIS, how the fuck do you NOT want to arrest this guy???


--------------------
http://www.countdowntotrump.com





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Offlinetwighead
mͯó
I'm a teapot


Registered: 08/27/08
Posts: 29,560
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Re: Why have a gun? [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #23374738 - 06/23/16 06:33 PM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
Quote:

twighead said:
What kind of sport is that good for?




none of your damn business is the sport it's best suited for



Your adjective not mine, I just call them guns.


--------------------
¿Check out some art m8?



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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: Why have a gun? [Re: Bodhi of Ankou] * 1
    #23374974 - 06/23/16 07:35 PM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Bodhi of Ankou said:
But your suggesting people should be arrested for thought crimes. Thats a dangerous precedent to set man.





I'm suggesting that potential terrorists not be ignored simply because the FBIs
boss said "cut them loose or I'll fire you and call you a racist", that's what
this divisionist president the US has no does



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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: Why have a gun? [Re: twighead] * 4
    #23374981 - 06/23/16 07:37 PM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

twighead said:
Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
Quote:

twighead said:
What kind of sport is that good for?




none of your damn business is the sport it's best suited for



Your adjective not mine, I just call them guns.





that was the "a right doesnt have to have a need" spiel



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Offlinetwighead
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Re: Why have a gun? [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #23375123 - 06/23/16 08:21 PM (7 years, 7 months ago)

just curious about the nomenclature :lol:


--------------------
¿Check out some art m8?



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Invisiblefalsereality


Registered: 04/01/13
Posts: 4,112
Re: Why have a gun? [Re: twighead] * 1
    #23375129 - 06/23/16 08:22 PM (7 years, 7 months ago)

I need a gun to shoot the OP of this thread.


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Invisiblefalsereality


Registered: 04/01/13
Posts: 4,112
Re: Why have a gun? [Re: Prisoner#1] * 1
    #23375134 - 06/23/16 08:25 PM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:





Is that a real lower? I want one...

Love my college campus, no safe spaces, concealed carry allowed and there's a bar -- and not just some bitch ass bar that serves juice.


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InvisibleBodhi of Ankou
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Registered: 06/02/09
Posts: 24,778
Loc: Soviet Canukistan Flag
Re: Why have a gun? [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #23375168 - 06/23/16 08:38 PM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Quote:

Bodhi of Ankou said:
But your suggesting people should be arrested for thought crimes. Thats a dangerous precedent to set man.




The guy threatened to kill his coworkers praising ISIS, how the fuck do you NOT want to arrest this guy???




Even if the arrested him for uttering threats, he goes to jail for a few months and then he's out again. What then? You think him being a felons gonna make it difficult for him to get a gun? You cant stop this shit from happening by force. If someone wants to go rouge and kill a ton of people theres literally nothing stopping them from doing so.


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OfflineShroomslip
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Re: Why have a gun? [Re: Bodhi of Ankou] * 2
    #23375179 - 06/23/16 08:42 PM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Wait what side are you on? I coulda swore you were one of the anti-gun nuts but you're saying what every pro-gun person has been saying since day 1. That gun laws aren't going to keep guns out of the hands of people who are hell bent on getting them and using them to shoot people.


--------------------
With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way.
I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today.
Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear.
I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear.


You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being
With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline


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InvisibleBodhi of Ankou
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Re: Why have a gun? [Re: Shroomslip]
    #23375193 - 06/23/16 08:47 PM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Ive never said we gotta get rid of guns. I suggested something needs to be done about it. Ya'll gun fetishists instantly projected your pc bullshit on that and assumed I meant a ban. In this case the only real fix would be to pull out of the middle east. It is a war, dont get all up in arms when blood spills on your soil. Fuck you thinks gonna happen.

Funny thing is for all that pride about being the biggest toughest country to ever grace the earth Americans sure as fuck pussy out with their tails between their legs as soon as shit gets real. A single incident and your snapping up all the ammo you can buy and cowering in your homes with your rifles clutched to your chests. Fucking laughable.


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Offlinetopdog82
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Re: Why have a gun? [Re: Shroomslip]
    #23375202 - 06/23/16 08:50 PM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Shroomslip said:
Quote:

topdog82 said:
Quote:

Shroomslip said:
You can't really expect anti-gun people to be educated or use logic when it comes to which guns need to be banned. As has been proven ad nauseam is that they don't understand the first thing about ballistics. To them: Most widely used gun in mass shootings = most dangerous. Larger bullet always = more dangerous and lethal. Higher round count per magazine = greatly increases lethality. Armor piercing rounds = super deadly bullets no one needs. I mean you could keep going with all the stupid ideas they have in their head that are dead fucking wrong. They don't know shit about them and don't care to get to know them or understand what it is they're even talking about.



What's wrong with any of these theories? I assumed all these to be true

All the experience I have had is shotguns, .22 rifle, black powder and a .22 pistol I think. Maybe an at-15 I think

Please let me know. I'm
Curious



1. There are a lot of reasons why the most widely used gun is used that is not because it's the most dangerous. Price, availability, ease of use, public image just to name a few. Here's one scenario. Johnny decides fuck it, he's gonna go shoot up a place so he goes to a gun store to buy a gun. He's not quite sure what he wants so he's shopping around. Gun shop owner does his job and starts trying to help him out making suggestions and talking, gun shop owner talks him into buy a more expensive rifle than the cheap ass .45 he was originally eyeing. Because that's what gun shops do, they try to upsell. Johnny doesn't give a shit about price, he's going to be dead or in jail come tomorrow anyways. The AR-15 could disappear all together tomorrow and another gun would just take it's place. This is one of the main reasons banning the gun used is a stupid idea. It doesn't solve a damn thing.

2. There's more to the lethality of a round than just caliber. If bigger bullet always = more deadly, there wouldn't be (probably) billions of dollars spent on designing and improving on them. There wouldn't be all kinds of different configurations. Why waste the time making hollow points when you can just make simple full metal jacket? Same caliber so they must be just as deadly as each other. Caliber is only a small part of what determines how effective or deadly a round is.

3. Amount of rounds a magazine holds really has little to do with how lethal a shooter is. In an actual shootout it might make a difference, but these shootings aren't usually a shootout. It's some guy walking around shooting people over a (relatively compared to a shootout) long period of time while they cower and cry and try to get away. He has plenty of time to drop an empty mag and load another one with no real risk. Not to mention even the dumbest mother fucker knows better than stand in the middle of a crowd and drop his mag out letting everyone know he can no longer fire. As long as he can put just a bit of distance between him and all his victims he can reload with no real issue. The size of the magazine has jack shit to do with how lethal he is. Honestly, I'd rather be being shot at by someone with a 100 round drum than a 10 round magazine. Bullets are heavy. The weight of 100 vs 10 makes a huge difference to accuracy of the shooter.

4. What makes bullets more or less deadly, is the damage they do to a person when they hit. Rounds that shatter or compress/mushroom after entering a body cause a lot more damage than rounds that stay intact. This has to do with the transfer of energy mostly. More of the energy of the bullet is transferred to the body. Armor piercing rounds are meant to go through "armor". Human flesh is a lot softer than "armor". As a result they tend to just go straight through and cause less damage than a round designed for soft targets. Less of their energy is transferred to the target and is instead used to keep going.



Just saw this. Well w
Quote:

Shroomslip said:
Quote:

topdog82 said:
Quote:

Shroomslip said:
You can't really expect anti-gun people to be educated or use logic when it comes to which guns need to be banned. As has been proven ad nauseam is that they don't understand the first thing about ballistics. To them: Most widely used gun in mass shootings = most dangerous. Larger bullet always = more dangerous and lethal. Higher round count per magazine = greatly increases lethality. Armor piercing rounds = super deadly bullets no one needs. I mean you could keep going with all the stupid ideas they have in their head that are dead fucking wrong. They don't know shit about them and don't care to get to know them or understand what it is they're even talking about.



What's wrong with any of these theories? I assumed all these to be true

All the experience I have had is shotguns, .22 rifle, black powder and a .22 pistol I think. Maybe an at-15 I think

Please let me know. I'm
Curious



1. There are a lot of reasons why the most widely used gun is used that is not because it's the most dangerous. Price, availability, ease of use, public image just to name a few. Here's one scenario. Johnny decides fuck it, he's gonna go shoot up a place so he goes to a gun store to buy a gun. He's not quite sure what he wants so he's shopping around. Gun shop owner does his job and starts trying to help him out making suggestions and talking, gun shop owner talks him into buy a more expensive rifle than the cheap ass .45 he was originally eyeing. Because that's what gun shops do, they try to upsell. Johnny doesn't give a shit about price, he's going to be dead or in jail come tomorrow anyways. The AR-15 could disappear all together tomorrow and another gun would just take it's place. This is one of the main reasons banning the gun used is a stupid idea. It doesn't solve a damn thing.

2. There's more to the lethality of a round than just caliber. If bigger bullet always = more deadly, there wouldn't be (probably) billions of dollars spent on designing and improving on them. There wouldn't be all kinds of different configurations. Why waste the time making hollow points when you can just make simple full metal jacket? Same caliber so they must be just as deadly as each other. Caliber is only a small part of what determines how effective or deadly a round is.

3. Amount of rounds a magazine holds really has little to do with how lethal a shooter is. In an actual shootout it might make a difference, but these shootings aren't usually a shootout. It's some guy walking around shooting people over a (relatively compared to a shootout) long period of time while they cower and cry and try to get away. He has plenty of time to drop an empty mag and load another one with no real risk. Not to mention even the dumbest mother fucker knows better than stand in the middle of a crowd and drop his mag out letting everyone know he can no longer fire. As long as he can put just a bit of distance between him and all his victims he can reload with no real issue. The size of the magazine has jack shit to do with how lethal he is. Honestly, I'd rather be being shot at by someone with a 100 round drum than a 10 round magazine. Bullets are heavy. The weight of 100 vs 10 makes a huge difference to accuracy of the shooter.

4. What makes bullets more or less deadly, is the damage they do to a person when they hit. Rounds that shatter or compress/mushroom after entering a body cause a lot more damage than rounds that stay intact. This has to do with the transfer of energy mostly. More of the energy of the bullet is transferred to the body. Armor piercing rounds are meant to go through "armor". Human flesh is a lot softer than "armor". As a result they tend to just go straight through and cause less damage than a round designed for soft targets. Less of their energy is transferred to the target and is instead used to keep going.




Just saw this. Well put together post. I actually didn't know any of this at all. Further proof that I need to take a gun cclass or something if I get a gun


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OfflineShroomslip
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Re: Why have a gun? [Re: Bodhi of Ankou]
    #23375218 - 06/23/16 08:54 PM (7 years, 7 months ago)

You can't lump me in with so called gun fetishist that instantly projected my pc bullshit on you, because I didn't do that. I just seemed to recall you being with the anti-gun crowd. Threw me for a loop for a second and was curious.

I will freely admit we have a problem and I don't know how to address it or what to do about it. I just know banning guns or turning the entire country into California standards when it comes to guns is NOT the answer. My problem with the anti-gun crowd is that they can't do the same. They can't admit they don't really have a strong solution either, they're just tossing out ridiculous ideas which at best is just the appearance of doing something. Stripping the rights away from millions of people because of what a very small percentage of psychopaths do with them, is absurd. I don't know how it can be see as anything but absurd.


--------------------
With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way.
I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today.
Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear.
I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear.


You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being
With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline


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OfflineShroomslip
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Registered: 11/25/12
Posts: 23,651
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Re: Why have a gun? [Re: topdog82] * 1
    #23375227 - 06/23/16 08:57 PM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Happy to help where I can. I strongly believe in people actually be educated on the matter. Not even just people who may want to have one in the future. Really everyone should know the basics.It would be rare but you never really know when you may have to pick up a gun to save your own life or someone else's. You should at least know what you're doing. If everyone were really educated, we might actually get somewhere beyond just spinning our tires in the mud. Throwing it in drive and reverse isn't getting us out of the hole and we're only digging it deeper the more we do it.


--------------------
With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way.
I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today.
Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear.
I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear.


You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being
With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline


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InvisibleBodhi of Ankou
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Other

Registered: 06/02/09
Posts: 24,778
Loc: Soviet Canukistan Flag
Re: Why have a gun? [Re: Shroomslip]
    #23375236 - 06/23/16 08:59 PM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Ok my bad. I was suggesting something had to be done earlier and I was slammed with a ton of gun nut memes from 4 or 5 posters. I didnt even hint at what thing needed to be done either. Both sides are kind of ridiculous in the matter. If everyone could settle down instead of getting all riled up and trying to force something to happen a sensible solution might actually be reached, but like most sensitive issues people already dug there trenchs and started lobbing shots at eachother. The idea of compromise and cooperation seems to be lost on most people.


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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: Why have a gun? [Re: Bodhi of Ankou] * 2
    #23375268 - 06/23/16 09:14 PM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Bodhi of Ankou said:
Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Quote:

Bodhi of Ankou said:
But your suggesting people should be arrested for thought crimes. Thats a dangerous precedent to set man.




The guy threatened to kill his coworkers praising ISIS, how the fuck do you NOT want to arrest this guy???




Even if the arrested him for uttering threats, he goes to jail for a few months and then he's out again. What then? You think him being a felons gonna make it difficult for him to get a gun? You cant stop this shit from happening by force. If someone wants to go rouge and kill a ton of people theres literally nothing stopping them from doing so.





so wait. you're telling us that criminals can get guns when it's made illegal
for them to get guns? that's preposterous, it's illegal, just like shooting 100
people in a gay bar is illegal. but if these things are illegal and the
criminals are already doing these things then would they even care that guns
were banned to begin with? I would assume the answer is not which means only one
thing.... gun control is not about guns, it's about control


so I issue a well meaning FUCK YOU to anyone that want to ban guns but wants
people with guns to enforce a gun ban on people that have broken no laws


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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: Why have a gun? [Re: Bodhi of Ankou] * 1
    #23375277 - 06/23/16 09:19 PM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Bodhi of Ankou said:
Funny thing is for all that pride about being the biggest toughest country to ever grace the earth Americans sure as fuck pussy out with their tails between their legs as soon as shit gets real.





afraid? me? what do i have to be afraid of, I have a gun


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InvisibleBodhi of Ankou
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Re: Why have a gun? [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #23375330 - 06/23/16 09:45 PM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Which is why you have the gun. Youre scared.


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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: Why have a gun? [Re: Bodhi of Ankou] * 1
    #23375340 - 06/23/16 09:47 PM (7 years, 7 months ago)

if i were scared I'd have a cop, not a gun

a gun is because I'm not willing to break a sweat defending myself


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Invisiblefalsereality


Registered: 04/01/13
Posts: 4,112
Re: Why have a gun? [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #23375348 - 06/23/16 09:49 PM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
if i were scared I'd have a cop, not a gun

a gun is because I'm not willing to break a sweat defending myself




Hypothetically, would you need a mobility scooter to reach the phone?


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