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InvisibleYonatin
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Loc: Flag
Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: Typerwritermonky]
    #26380720 - 12/14/19 06:40 AM (4 years, 1 month ago)

Is it just me or is it normal to think of heroin EVERY single day MULTIPLE times a day after getting clean? I hate the fact it's on my mind all the time. I don't feel like I want to use it, but it's more like a feeling of missing it. I don't miss the problems it created for me, but I think of it ALL the time. Especially in the morning because that was my favorite time to use, I just want to see if that ever goes away or if I'm stuck with this forever.


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OfflinemndfreezeMDiscordReddit
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: Yonatin]
    #26380832 - 12/14/19 07:56 AM (4 years, 1 month ago)

It gets easier.  Find new hobbies and interests to get that natural dopamine flowing.


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Nothing says love like grannies prolapsed anus!

quote]Urb said:
I know... Its fucked up... Ill fix it minyana..[/quote]


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Invisibledbreeze
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: mndfreeze]
    #26381376 - 12/14/19 01:53 PM (4 years, 1 month ago)

Well since i talked so much about being done with the clinic here figured i would fill ya guys in....i had goten down to 20 then had to go back to 25! My end of the year goal doesnt seem possible still hoping by the end of feb tho. 2 month push back. The reason being i completely broke my brain! LOL but seriously ended up with panic attacks and well something a bit worse than that not from the methadone from one of our helpers and well still recovering i am not sure if i will ever completely recover from this! I think going down on the methadone created anxiety and then breaking my brain in the process those anxiety's started forming thoughts and well lets say i dont feel alone but not sure if its good or bad. God i hope things go back to the way they were a couple weeks ago and i can continue so upset i wont be able to make the end of the year goal!


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InvisibleCosmicGiggle
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: dbreeze]
    #26382035 - 12/14/19 08:07 PM (4 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Yonatin said:
Is it just me or is it normal to think of heroin EVERY single day MULTIPLE times a day after getting clean? I hate the fact it's on my mind all the time. I don't feel like I want to use it, but it's more like a feeling of missing it. I don't miss the problems it created for me, but I think of it ALL the time. Especially in the morning because that was my favorite time to use, I just want to see if that ever goes away or if I'm stuck with this forever.




How long have you been clean? I’ll have 3 years in April and it still crosses my mind quite a bit. I’m still on buprenorphine (down to 2mg a day now) And I still get bad cravings once in awhile. Almost always when I’m alone and bored, or when the weather gets a certain way or when the outside air smells a certain way after raining. Or when me or my lady uses vinegar in the kitchen.. I don’t think of it all the time anymore, but I think it’s because I started slowly obtaining meaningful things in life. Better job than I’ve ever had,  better partner than I’ve ever had, and therefore brighter future, or the makings of. But it still at least crosses my mind daily, like you, not in a craving way, just present. Maybe someone with more clean time will have a better answer (I sure hope so). I spent over a third of my life on heroin/opiates and I haven’t reached 30 yet. Still learning how to be an adult. What I still haven’t been able to give up is the fucking needle. I still IV a little bupe every morning even though I don’t feel anything from it, the pill that is. I just can’t get through the day without craving sticking a needle in my arm, drawing blood, and slowly pushing until it’s inside me. My brain holds that in higher regard than the heroin itself. and while it’s all well and good I’ve tapered from 12mg to 2mg in the past 9 months, I know heroin will never leave my mind completely until I stop sticking myself every morning.
Anyways. I doubt you’ll ever forget about it completely, but it will definitely go from “ALL the time” to just “sometimes” and part of that will depend on length of time, part of it will be on you to avoid triggers and to fill your life with things you deem more important than using heroin. Finding those things is another story and has been a major challenge for me. I’m hoping starting this fungi hobby will be one of those things.


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Invisibledbreeze
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: CosmicGiggle]
    #26382664 - 12/15/19 05:13 AM (4 years, 1 month ago)

It does get better! Takes a while tho. i got almost 10 years away now and VERY RARELY does it cross my mind! Sometimes if i look down at my arm and a vein is popping out i think "hmm remember that?" but really thats about it! The bottom line is everyone is different brain chem is different also experience is different. For me when i quit it was easier than expected but its cause at one point the supply was almost unlimited when that went away i had such a big habbit to feed things got really bad really quick. Honestly it destroyed 99% of my life so when the time came it wasnt a hard decision to see whats right. I grabbed on to the clinic 10 years ago and still trying to let that go. There is deffinitly a "adjustment phase" But after a while it absolutely gets better! Like i said its very rare i think about it now. It got easier for me the longer i got clean cause when my head cleared up enough to see the destruction i caused lets just say i shouldn't be alive or free many many times over. The methadone gave me enough time away for my head to clear up. but then using that for 10 years for ME well it needs to end.

And i get the needle thing i really do. But honestly by doing that your holding on to a piece of it and really your giving yourself the rope to hang yourself with. One time i relapsed by sniffing suboxone for a few days decide this aint what i want ....fuck it! Thats no good. It will be hard to let go of that but same as dope itself after that adjustment period (wich is different for everyone) it will get easier! Holding on to ANY piece of that addiction is just no good! been there made that mistake MANY times


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InvisibleYonatin
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: CosmicGiggle]
    #26386466 - 12/17/19 05:31 AM (4 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

CosmicGiggle said:
Quote:

Yonatin said:
Is it just me or is it normal to think of heroin EVERY single day MULTIPLE times a day after getting clean? I hate the fact it's on my mind all the time. I don't feel like I want to use it, but it's more like a feeling of missing it. I don't miss the problems it created for me, but I think of it ALL the time. Especially in the morning because that was my favorite time to use, I just want to see if that ever goes away or if I'm stuck with this forever.




How long have you been clean? I’ll have 3 years in April and it still crosses my mind quite a bit. I’m still on buprenorphine (down to 2mg a day now) And I still get bad cravings once in awhile. Almost always when I’m alone and bored, or when the weather gets a certain way or when the outside air smells a certain way after raining. Or when me or my lady uses vinegar in the kitchen.. I don’t think of it all the time anymore, but I think it’s because I started slowly obtaining meaningful things in life. Better job than I’ve ever had,  better partner than I’ve ever had, and therefore brighter future, or the makings of. But it still at least crosses my mind daily, like you, not in a craving way, just present. Maybe someone with more clean time will have a better answer (I sure hope so). I spent over a third of my life on heroin/opiates and I haven’t reached 30 yet. Still learning how to be an adult. What I still haven’t been able to give up is the fucking needle. I still IV a little bupe every morning even though I don’t feel anything from it, the pill that is. I just can’t get through the day without craving sticking a needle in my arm, drawing blood, and slowly pushing until it’s inside me. My brain holds that in higher regard than the heroin itself. and while it’s all well and good I’ve tapered from 12mg to 2mg in the past 9 months, I know heroin will never leave my mind completely until I stop sticking myself every morning.
Anyways. I doubt you’ll ever forget about it completely, but it will definitely go from “ALL the time” to just “sometimes” and part of that will depend on length of time, part of it will be on you to avoid triggers and to fill your life with things you deem more important than using heroin. Finding those things is another story and has been a major challenge for me. I’m hoping starting this fungi hobby will be one of those things.



I've been off of heroin for 3 1/2 years now and off subs for almost 3 years. I like to think of it as knowing there is this really blissful place on earth and I've been there but I got kicked out and I can't go back. I take a low dose of kratom everyday, nothing too much and it helps me accept the dull feeling I get every day. My life is on the upswing for sure though, I've started working 5 months ago. I've excelled in my job and have gotten almost $3 in raises in only 5 months, I am now the assistant store manager of the joint and the people at work love me. I have my own car, I get to buy goodies like a sound system, but I still can't shake the thought of heroin multiple times a day. I find it irritating more than anything, it's like a constant reminder of how dull life feels once you get clean. I'm the happiest I've been in 6 years though and I am extremely grateful for that and everything I have.


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InvisibleThayendanegea
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: Yonatin]
    #26386621 - 12/17/19 08:14 AM (4 years, 1 month ago)

Great story! One thing that I always remember about my addiction, especially when I was in early sobriety is that when any urge hit me "It is much easier to stay away from the first one than it is the second." Also, "as soon as you have 24 hrs.  sober, you are closer to your next drink/ drug than you are from your last".

Some of these pearls of wisdom passed on to me along with the Serenity Prayer have helped me immensely in sobriety.:sunny::peace:


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Look Deep Into Nature,and Then You Will Understand Everything Better.

Albert Einstein


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OfflineWildmana
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: Thayendanegea]
    #26386727 - 12/17/19 09:36 AM (4 years, 1 month ago)

It's a journey man, took me a long time to get to normal never done h just had an unlimited amounts of oxy and the likes I just never could get enough in those days there were pill Mills a plenty in my area so it was easy as hell , and then there were none and a whole lot of sick folks  it was horrible not to say I couldn't find a few a day there was no way I could afford 25 30 mg pills a day at 30 a piece so I had to quit the decision was easy but recovery wasn't it's been 8 years now and even when I have to see a doctor I refuse pain meds cause that was a miserable life , life now isn't grand or lavish but I'm  a better me ,and as long as were alive there's always opportunity to improve. Hang in there peeps.


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New guy


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OfflineEnjoywho
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: RJ Tubs 202]
    #26388033 - 12/18/19 02:57 AM (4 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

RJ Tubs 202 said:
The term "relapse" is one of the most harmful ideas created by the recovery industry. If you decide to use, own it. You made a choice to use. Instead of telling people you "relapsed" last night, be honest and tell folks you made a decision to use. Honesty is important.




That's what I think as well. If someone uses 1 day in 7 years your not throwing away all that time. Your literally 99.99% clean in that time frame. No reason to go on a bender and throw your life away. Which is what they make it seem like. Whoops had a beer might as well go bang some heroin.


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"I don't give nothin' to nobody, I just pay the cost to do business." - Riley "Young Reezy"-Boondocks

"The road to hell is paved with good intentions."

"In the days of kings and queens I was a jester."

"And then the great lord created bears... too many bears... shoulda really dialed back on the bears." Squidbillies

"Can you start speaking words instead of your damn filthy lies!"- Louise "Bobs Burgers"


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OfflineDoc9151M
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: Enjoywho]
    #26388505 - 12/18/19 10:43 AM (4 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Enjoywho said:
Quote:

RJ Tubs 202 said:
The term "relapse" is one of the most harmful ideas created by the recovery industry. If you decide to use, own it. You made a choice to use. Instead of telling people you "relapsed" last night, be honest and tell folks you made a decision to use. Honesty is important.




That's what I think as well. If someone uses 1 day in 7 years your not throwing away all that time. Your literally 99.99% clean in that time frame. No reason to go on a bender and throw your life away. Which is what they make it seem like. Whoops had a beer might as well go bang some heroin.



I think you're missing the point, it's not that someone is throwing away years of sobriety that is a problem with relapse, it's that it only takes 1 beer, shot, pill or whatever to set someone back on the path of active addiction. I have seen and experienced this 1st hand, there have always been years of use again after each relapse for me and my drinker friends would always seem to binge for a few months, but not one of us ever used just once. Relapse is life threatening,  most people don't get back into recovery immediately and that is why it is stressed. Telling someone that you relapsed is owning your decision, not understanding yourself and why you do what you do is more harmful to one's self, because not everyone is using because they like getting high and carrying out self destructive behavior.

No two addicts are alike, we may have similarities but definitely not the same and so treatment should be individualized and not generalized  because what works for me may not work for someone else. It is the generalization of treatment in rehabilitation facilities and outpatient services that sets people up for failure.


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Psilocybe cubensis data collection thread. please help with this project if you hunt wild cubensis.
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=26513593&page=0&vc=1#26513593


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Anonymous #10

Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: Doc9151]
    #26389170 - 12/18/19 05:06 PM (4 years, 1 month ago)

I think about opiates all the time. I had a stint when I was younger, never had much of a problem moving away from that behaviour. But as I get older I'm more attracted to what it has to offer. I've needed it, but always shied away. Lately though, I've not been shy about it. It feels good. It feels normal. I don't know why I'm even saying this. It feels destructive. But it feels good. Relieving. I want to not. But I wish I could forever. Here's to hoping it all stays together I suppose


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OfflineDoc9151M
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: Anonymous #10]
    #26391002 - 12/19/19 04:39 PM (4 years, 1 month ago)

@anonymous#10 Take it from someone who has lived with severe pain for 2 decades now, taking opiates to feel good is a kin to putting a gun to your head after spinning  the cylinder and pulling the trigger. I have good friends rotting in the ground over it and it never goes well in the end.

Something that I never thought about was major surgery and the opiates not working. An elder woman I know that had a hefty habit recently had emergency open heart surgery and nothing they gave her helped, she literally screamed for 2 days before they finally put in a coma and on a ventilator for 12 days.

Those of us with debilitating pain have to learn to live with a certain amount and not try to medicate so much that we feel nothing,  it's suicidal when we try to take so much.  If I want to get high now I smoke good weed instead of taking more opioids, it's just not worth it to go through that hell.


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Psilocybe cubensis data collection thread. please help with this project if you hunt wild cubensis.
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=26513593&page=0&vc=1#26513593


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Invisibletrvptamine
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: Enjoywho]
    #26391610 - 12/19/19 09:54 PM (4 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Enjoywho said:
Quote:

RJ Tubs 202 said:
The term "relapse" is one of the most harmful ideas created by the recovery industry. If you decide to use, own it. You made a choice to use. Instead of telling people you "relapsed" last night, be honest and tell folks you made a decision to use. Honesty is important.




That's what I think as well. If someone uses 1 day in 7 years your not throwing away all that time. Your literally 99.99% clean in that time frame. No reason to go on a bender and throw your life away. Which is what they make it seem like. Whoops had a beer might as well go bang some heroin.



I agree. If you have the will power then every once in a while isnt a bad thing. But I think If you are fresh off the junk then maybe give a year or two at least.

EDIT: I need to add that what I said above is exactly what ive been doing. It keeps me from having any withdrawals, but I still am I polydrug addict in the in my mental. I always want to have something. I dont get sick, but I dont like being sober.


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Edited by trvptamine (12/19/19 09:56 PM)


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OfflineRJ Tubs 202
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: Doc9151]
    #26391730 - 12/20/19 12:19 AM (4 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Doc9151 said:

I think you're missing the point, it's not that someone is throwing away years of sobriety that is a problem with relapse, it's that it only takes 1 beer, shot, pill or whatever to set someone back on the path of active addiction.




Yes, sometime people choose to return to the behavior. Sometime people change their relationship to using - especially when they realize they're in control of their behavior and the choices they make.

Drew Barrymore was a full blown drunkard by the time she reached the age of 11. Now she drinks and owns a winery. We must dismantle the fear based falsehoods that teach people they are powerless. These ideas are crippling and keep people battling an imaginary disease that doesn't exist.   



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OfflineDoc9151M
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: RJ Tubs 202]
    #26392441 - 12/20/19 01:10 PM (4 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

RJ Tubs 202 said:
Quote:

Doc9151 said:

I think you're missing the point, it's not that someone is throwing away years of sobriety that is a problem with relapse, it's that it only takes 1 beer, shot, pill or whatever to set someone back on the path of active addiction.




Yes, sometime people choose to return to the behavior. Sometime people change their relationship to using - especially when they realize they're in control of their behavior and the choices they make.

Drew Barrymore was a full blown drunkard by the time she reached the age of 11. Now she drinks and owns a winery. We must dismantle the fear based falsehoods that teach people they are powerless. These ideas are crippling and keep people battling an imaginary disease that doesn't exist.   





I believe that telling people that they are powerless is harmful, but I also know that if you are anything like myself, taking the 1st pill, drink ect. is playing Russian roulette. For some people it's not such an obvious choice, they think that they are in control until they are not.

Edit: I disagree strongly that addiction is an imaginary disease,  addiction is chronic, insidious, progressive and terminal for some.  Addiction causes changes in the body at the cellular level just as cancer other diseases cause measurable changes. Yes, addiction can be arrested and recovery possible,  but it will always be just below the surface and many things can bring it back out.


Edited by Doc9151 (12/20/19 01:16 PM)


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InvisibleCognitive_Shift
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: Doc9151] * 1
    #26436548 - 01/16/20 10:32 AM (4 years, 13 days ago)

Update:

MMT has given me my life back.  It's been 11 months since I last used heroin or any other drug/alcohol.  I now have a week of take home doses.  So far so good!  I rarely if ever have any cravings.  There is a lot of red tape involved with the methadone clinic but it allows me to function normally.


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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs


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OfflineDoc9151M
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #26439299 - 01/17/20 09:27 PM (4 years, 11 days ago)

Quote:

Cognitive_Shift said:
Update:

MMT has given me my life back.  It's been 11 months since I last used heroin or any other drug/alcohol.  I now have a week of take home doses.  So far so good!  I rarely if ever have any cravings.  There is a lot of red tape involved with the methadone clinic but it allows me to function normally.



Word, there are 2 MAT treatment facilities in my area and one is better than the other. The one I go to allows me to have a medical marijuana card and the other one will not.  The other clinic also bans the use of all over the counter medications.

Having normalcy back in my life is just one of the positive things about MMT. I to  could have a weeks worth of take out doses but I choose to get 2 for the weekend only at moment. Cravings are still pretty strong in the evening time I'm afraid that I will start dipping into my bottles if I had anymore on hand than I do.

Not really sure if my dose is where it should be, maybe I need to go up and see if it takes away my cravings because they are the biggest problem now.

Edit: My chronic pain issues are why I like having access to the medical marijuana,  the cravings are my only real concern right now.


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Psilocybe cubensis data collection thread. please help with this project if you hunt wild cubensis.
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=26513593&page=0&vc=1#26513593


Edited by Doc9151 (01/17/20 09:28 PM)


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Invisiblemoonrockmushy
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: Doc9151]
    #26439497 - 01/18/20 01:55 AM (4 years, 11 days ago)

Just an alternate opinion:  I was able to make it work with kratom.  You don't want to be chained to a facility, if you haven't given it a real go you should.  Methadone and suboxone are extremely addictive like heroin or oxy, easily comparable in terms of addiction.  Kratom is the best step down that I have found.  Sure it's hard, but it's a bit of relief when you are trying to get off. 

If you're not trying to get off I understand turning to methadone or suboxone if you're struggling right now.  If you are trying to get off I encourage getting some kratom.  It will definitely help, especially if you're not fully hooked.  I know it makes some people sick, but definitely give it a try and just stay to a reasonable dose because it will make you sick if you take too much.

For me the hardest thing was never going through those first few hellish sleepless nights, it was dealing with the month after that, and kratom will help with that.  If you've been through opiate withdrawal you won't break a sweat stopping kratom a month or two later, or whenever you're ready.


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OfflineDoc9151M
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: moonrockmushy]
    #26440037 - 01/18/20 11:09 AM (4 years, 11 days ago)

Thing is, if you are trying to use kratom to get off prescription opiates,  it doesn't work for synthetic opiates like methadone, buprenorphine, demerol, etc. But it does help if you are coming off of natural opioids like morphine or heroin. I tried several ounces of both red and green mang da kratom to no effect.

If you are trying to quit, I say do whatever it takes to obtain your goal, be it methadone or something else. Addicts will do nearly anything to get a fix so why not use the same for getting clean.


--------------------


Psilocybe cubensis data collection thread. please help with this project if you hunt wild cubensis.
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=26513593&page=0&vc=1#26513593


Edited by Doc9151 (01/18/20 11:10 AM)


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Invisibledbreeze
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: Doc9151]
    #26441086 - 01/19/20 02:18 AM (4 years, 10 days ago)

Methadone is strong as i said i am on my way off i went to fast tho hoping to be done by jan1st looks like it will take some time tho but still going to get off it. Kratom will work for methadone w/d i tried it when i missed a day or 2 it helped. However if i had tried that in the begining it would have been just like subs i wouldnt have taken it everyday. when i first got clean from heroin i NEEDED someone to make sure i took it everyday!


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