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OfflineDoc9151M
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: RJ Tubs 202]
    #26052125 - 06/14/19 10:42 AM (4 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

RJ Tubs 202 said:
It's helpful you uncovered the benefits you view for using ("Getting high for me was like bonding with boredom, it allowed me to do nothing and be fine with it.") Of course it's not possible to do nothing. Maybe you felt more at ease with yourself when you were high. I'm usually wanting to get away from myself when I notice the desire to get loaded. 

You say Heroin Anonymous meetings helps you "center". Is it possible to create some social support with friends that would provide that? Many people find 12 step programs helpful because they are welcomed and accepted and kinda part of a supportive family. It takes some real effort to create a such a social circle, but it can be done.



I agree,  an NA or religion based 12 step program could be beneficial by allowing you to build relationships with people that have a good bit of clean time, having people that understand what you're going through can really make a difference.

I can totally relate to boredom and getting high, it's what got me through many a day, but now, I try to occupy that time with something constructive, instead of something destructive.


--------------------


Psilocybe cubensis data collection thread. please help with this project if you hunt wild cubensis.
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=26513593&page=0&vc=1#26513593


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OfflineRJ Tubs 202
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: Doc9151]
    #26053078 - 06/14/19 09:10 PM (4 years, 7 months ago)

In the long run, building relationships with people who have a love affair with intoxication may be counter productive and keep the flame of desire alive. People who have not used for 10 or 20 or 30 years but still label themselves an "addict" are still in love and obsessed.


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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: RJ Tubs 202]
    #26057273 - 06/17/19 09:52 AM (4 years, 7 months ago)

I'm finally moving up phases at my methadone clinic after 90 days of clean drug screens.  Now I don't have to go there 6 days a week.


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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs


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OfflineDoc9151M
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #26059310 - 06/18/19 09:36 AM (4 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Cognitive_Shift said:
I'm finally moving up phases at my methadone clinic after 90 days of clean drug screens.  Now I don't have to go there 6 days a week.



I'm right behind you, but I'm not sure if I'm doing it right. I don't have any issues with dope sickness, my dose is holding up in that regard, it's 10 hours after dosing when I get the urge to get high.

Hopefully, some of you whom are working a legit program can give me some advice. When I first started the clinic, I had the impression that my dose is "holding" as long as I am not getting dope sick.

Now, I'm wondering if I should be looking for a dose that keeps me from craving. In your honest opinion, is that something I should be expecting from my dose or should I address it in another way?

Don't get me wrong, I do NOT want to get high, I want the urge to get high to go away, but when my pain kicks up in the afternoon, that's when I start craving something that will make it stop or become more bearable.


--------------------


Psilocybe cubensis data collection thread. please help with this project if you hunt wild cubensis.
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=26513593&page=0&vc=1#26513593


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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: Doc9151]
    #26059729 - 06/18/19 02:42 PM (4 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Cognitive_Shift said:
I'm finally moving up phases at my methadone clinic after 90 days of clean drug screens.  Now I don't have to go there 6 days a week.




This is a major step.  Not having to go to your clinic every damn day is huge on the path to fixing yourself.  Stability and responsibility are key to sticking with it.  I fucked up once during my 5ish years at my clinic because I took some valium to calm my anxiety and had forgotten just how long it stays in your body....I lost all of my privileges and it took me about 8 months to get them back.  Sent me in a lovely spiral of depression and feeling like a failure. 

Keep it up man.  The longer you do it, the easier it gets to stay off the other shit and fix your other abusive issues and habits. 


Quote:

Doc9151 said:
Quote:

Cognitive_Shift said:
I'm finally moving up phases at my methadone clinic after 90 days of clean drug screens.  Now I don't have to go there 6 days a week.



I'm right behind you, but I'm not sure if I'm doing it right. I don't have any issues with dope sickness, my dose is holding up in that regard, it's 10 hours after dosing when I get the urge to get high.

Hopefully, some of you whom are working a legit program can give me some advice. When I first started the clinic, I had the impression that my dose is "holding" as long as I am not getting dope sick.

Now, I'm wondering if I should be looking for a dose that keeps me from craving. In your honest opinion, is that something I should be expecting from my dose or should I address it in another way?

Don't get me wrong, I do NOT want to get high, I want the urge to get high to go away, but when my pain kicks up in the afternoon, that's when I start craving something that will make it stop or become more bearable.





Chronic pain is the main reason why doctors think opiates are not a good long term solution. There is no final dose that will ever fix you.  You will just continue to build tolerance no matter how high you go but the rest of your body won't be able to keep up, and eventually side effects will fuck you up more than the pain does.  Methadone has a long as fuck half life but my pain generally started up about hour 14 if it was going to happen.  There are not a ton of options for you other than to raise your dose up until your clinic says you've hit the max allowed, or look into alternative treatments like different medications, surgery, etc.

For my nerve issues I found that rotating meds worked.  When my gabapentin stopped working I could switch to lyrica for a while until it stopped working as well, then back to gabapentin. There may be some specific pain medication that works for you like that as well.

Regardless, long term, opiates won't ever work 100% for you.


--------------------
Nothing says love like grannies prolapsed anus!

quote]Urb said:
I know... Its fucked up... Ill fix it minyana..[/quote]


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Invisiblemoonrockmushy
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: RJ Tubs 202]
    #26071716 - 06/24/19 06:56 PM (4 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

RJ Tubs 202 said:
In the long run, building relationships with people who have a love affair with intoxication may be counter productive and keep the flame of desire alive. People who have not used for 10 or 20 or 30 years but still label themselves an "addict" are still in love and obsessed.




People with an internal struggle are always going to be like this.  If someone can find something that doesn't make them quite so miserable then I hope some higher power will bless them, because god must know it ain't easy.

The pain isn't easy, but subverting your subconscious mind is not going to fix your existential anxiety.  Again I can't speak for people with chronic pain though.  It's a bad time to be them right now.


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OfflineRJ Tubs 202
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: moonrockmushy]
    #26072174 - 06/25/19 12:44 AM (4 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

moonrockmushy said:
Quote:

RJ Tubs 202 said:
In the long run, building relationships with people who have a love affair with intoxication may be counter productive and keep the flame of desire alive. People who have not used for 10 or 20 or 30 years but still label themselves an "addict" are still in love and obsessed.




People with an internal struggle are always going to be like this.  If someone can find something that doesn't make them quite so miserable then I hope some higher power will bless them, because god must know it ain't easy.




Are you implying internal conflicts and struggles are permanent life-long conditions? Many people move on from self destructive behaviors without a "higher-power". Of course we all are bombarded with the message that you "need help to change". If I had a dollar for every time I was told I needed "help". What a bunch  of bullshit. Nobody once told me I was in full control of my behavior. Never! We are being sold a box of lies.


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OfflineFert Nitty
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: RJ Tubs 202]
    #26074173 - 06/26/19 12:14 AM (4 years, 7 months ago)

Hey y'all,I've been pretty inactive this last year or 2 on there threads. Addiction usually keeps me shut off from any normal socialization. I'm planning on transitioning from heroin to Suboxone and I am having a hard time starting. I work mon-fri and don't have any sick time left after taking a week off of work due to a back injury from a car wreck.

I guess I am looking for advice from anyone currently on Suboxone - how rough is the initial transfer from h to subs? I've utilized buprenorphine on many occasions over the yearsbl, but only to maintain, and with no plans of lifestyle changes. Is this something I would be able to do during a weekend supposing I have plenty of subs? In the past I was miserable while on Suboxone but I believe it was mostly just because I was fiending for dope and unhappy with the situation I was in.

If I begin my transition on a Saturday morning waking up sick, should I be okay enough on Monday to work? If there is anyone here with recent experience getting on subs, whats the first couple days going to be like? I understand everyone is different and I also understand that my plan is not an ideal method for recovery but I am in a specific situation and have no room to do things any other way. I am desperate to begin changing my lifestyle even a little at a time, firstly is dropping the needle and stopping the chase. I have had multiple clean uperiods ranging months to years, but always following a medical detox, and I have always avoided subs for long term use, because I'm aware of the withdrawals experienced coming off of them.

Any advice or answers to my few scattered questions is greatly appreciated. Keep up the good work yall, and stay strong.


--------------------



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OfflineDoc9151M
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: Fert Nitty]
    #26074890 - 06/26/19 10:59 AM (4 years, 7 months ago)

Welcome back to the shroomery

I am not currently on suboxone, but I tried it for 2yrs, it wasn't for me and the methadone clinic is cheaper. Being on the clinic has given me stability for the most part, but I suffer from severe chronic pain and it's my demon. At least I'm not getting dope sick anymore, dope sick + chronic pain = suicidal ideation

Do something, whether it's suboxone or methadone or cold fucking Turkey, do something other than smack or junk, to many unscrupulous folks killing people with their garbage.

At the methadone clinic, suboxone is way more expensive than methadone, but either one is better than what you are doing. Hang in there, I really hope that you get something that works for you. I don't wanna to see another post about one of my shroomery brothers and sisters passing on to the other side because of bullshit dope.


--------------------


Psilocybe cubensis data collection thread. please help with this project if you hunt wild cubensis.
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=26513593&page=0&vc=1#26513593


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InvisibleYonatin
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: Fert Nitty]
    #26075220 - 06/26/19 02:43 PM (4 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Fert Nitty said:
Hey y'all,I've been pretty inactive this last year or 2 on there threads. Addiction usually keeps me shut off from any normal socialization. I'm planning on transitioning from heroin to Suboxone and I am having a hard time starting. I work mon-fri and don't have any sick time left after taking a week off of work due to a back injury from a car wreck.

I guess I am looking for advice from anyone currently on Suboxone - how rough is the initial transfer from h to subs? I've utilized buprenorphine on many occasions over the yearsbl, but only to maintain, and with no plans of lifestyle changes. Is this something I would be able to do during a weekend supposing I have plenty of subs? In the past I was miserable while on Suboxone but I believe it was mostly just because I was fiending for dope and unhappy with the situation I was in.

If I begin my transition on a Saturday morning waking up sick, should I be okay enough on Monday to work? If there is anyone here with recent experience getting on subs, whats the first couple days going to be like? I understand everyone is different and I also understand that my plan is not an ideal method for recovery but I am in a specific situation and have no room to do things any other way. I am desperate to begin changing my lifestyle even a little at a time, firstly is dropping the needle and stopping the chase. I have had multiple clean uperiods ranging months to years, but always following a medical detox, and I have always avoided subs for long term use, because I'm aware of the withdrawals experienced coming off of them.

Any advice or answers to my few scattered questions is greatly appreciated. Keep up the good work yall, and stay strong.



If you don't use for 24 hours before taking Suboxone it shouldn't be too hard. I switched to Subs a while ago and they helped me get off of H but I then got stuck on subs for longer than I was using H. The longer you go without using the better the first dose of Subs work. I used to get a little bit of euphoria when taking Subs for the first while. If you use a lot then try and wait longer before dosing with Subs because Subs could make you feel sick if you still have H in your system.


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OfflineRJ Tubs 202
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: Fert Nitty]
    #26076053 - 06/26/19 10:43 PM (4 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Fert Nitty said:

Addiction usually keeps me shut off from any normal socialization.




Would you agree the term "addiction" is a word that describes an intimate passionate relationship?


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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: RJ Tubs 202]
    #26076359 - 06/27/19 04:19 AM (4 years, 6 months ago)

Its important for people looking into treatment to remember that you shouldn't look at the time it takes. If you need to be on subs for years then you need years and it's still a million times better than being on heroin.  Stability long term is what saves you, not the drug itself.  In theory in a clinic setting ANY opiate would work, but are just not ideal. Methadone works well because it's powerful and long lasting so you can dose once a day.  Subs are actually better for quickly getting off but then shit gets rough for a bit. 

Its the stability, counseling, and helping you get on a normal life routine that isn't chasing a high that gets you clean. 

Much love everyone. Keep up the fight.


--------------------
Nothing says love like grannies prolapsed anus!

quote]Urb said:
I know... Its fucked up... Ill fix it minyana..[/quote]


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OfflineDoc9151M
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: mndfreeze]
    #26076797 - 06/27/19 10:32 AM (4 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

mndfreeze said:
Its important for people looking into treatment to remember that you shouldn't look at the time it takes. If you need to be on subs for years then you need years and it's still a million times better than being on heroin.  Stability long term is what saves you, not the drug itself.  In theory in a clinic setting ANY opiate would work, but are just not ideal. Methadone works well because it's powerful and long lasting so you can dose once a day.  Subs are actually better for quickly getting off but then shit gets rough for a bit. 

Its the stability, counseling, and helping you get on a normal life routine that isn't chasing a high that gets you clean. 

Much love everyone. Keep up the fight.



I agree wholeheartedly, time isn't what is important not using H is very important.


--------------------


Psilocybe cubensis data collection thread. please help with this project if you hunt wild cubensis.
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=26513593&page=0&vc=1#26513593


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Invisiblemoonrockmushy
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: RJ Tubs 202]
    #26077697 - 06/27/19 04:28 PM (4 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

RJ Tubs 202 said:
Quote:

moonrockmushy said:
Quote:

RJ Tubs 202 said:
In the long run, building relationships with people who have a love affair with intoxication may be counter productive and keep the flame of desire alive. People who have not used for 10 or 20 or 30 years but still label themselves an "addict" are still in love and obsessed.




People with an internal struggle are always going to be like this.  If someone can find something that doesn't make them quite so miserable then I hope some higher power will bless them, because god must know it ain't easy.




Are you implying internal conflicts and struggles are permanent life-long conditions? Many people move on from self destructive behaviors without a "higher-power". Of course we all are bombarded with the message that you "need help to change". If I had a dollar for every time I was told I needed "help". What a bunch  of bullshit. Nobody once told me I was in full control of my behavior. Never! We are being sold a box of lies.




You're not in full control of your behavior, that's a ridiculous notion. 

It's about harm reduction, not being in total control of your behavior.  We're not talking about some nefarious organization trying to deceive and take over the world.  These are people who struggle with addiction and attempt to find some stability in their lives through a community focused on a major problem that they have.

And to answer your question: yes, addiction has the potential to be a chronic condition and often is.  If some people find that whatever program works for them, great.  There are definitely people who have achieved things that they want in life through these programs, and I fully support that if it's what works for them.


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OfflineEnjoywho
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: moonrockmushy]
    #26078421 - 06/28/19 12:15 AM (4 years, 6 months ago)

Started using heroin again after about 5-6 years clean. It's crazy here for what i'd pay 50 dollars for up in Alaska. (.1) I get .2 for 20$. twice as much for half the cost.

Plan on tapering off again though. Got a hook up on subs for less then 5 dollars a 8 mg strip. Really just not digging the money I'm spending even at 20 bucks a day your still spending 140 a week. Weekends or days when I dont have work and nothing to do i'll use 40 or so.

It's really annoying how incredibly short acting dope seems to be. Sometimes it seems like 10 minutes later after the initial rush your already down again like :wtf: ???


--------------------
"I don't give nothin' to nobody, I just pay the cost to do business." - Riley "Young Reezy"-Boondocks

"The road to hell is paved with good intentions."

"In the days of kings and queens I was a jester."

"And then the great lord created bears... too many bears... shoulda really dialed back on the bears." Squidbillies

"Can you start speaking words instead of your damn filthy lies!"- Louise "Bobs Burgers"


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Invisiblemoonrockmushy
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: Enjoywho]
    #26078491 - 06/28/19 01:56 AM (4 years, 6 months ago)

Yeah the rush is really the only good part.  Other than that opiates just seem to make me itchy, bloated, and irritable.  The high is gone real quick but the side effects last all day. 

Good luck with the taper man.  I'd recommend kratom over suboxone any day.  I've never had an easy time coming off of subs, in lots of ways it's harder than dope.  Coming off of kratom was a piece of cake by comparison, and you don't have to worry about precipitated withdrawals.


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OfflineRJ Tubs 202
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: moonrockmushy]
    #26078502 - 06/28/19 02:15 AM (4 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

moonrockmushy said:

You're not in full control of your behavior, that's a ridiculous notion.




That sounds like 12 Step powerless dogma. As if driving to the liquor store or your drug dealer is not a choice. This type of thinking allows us to blame our choices on an imaginary "disease" that controls our behavior and forces us to ingest chemicals. Let's be honest and just admit that it's an exciting passionate love affair. Labeling oneself an "addict" gives us an excuse. Nobody wants to admit they are a drug user or a drunkard. Call yourself an "addict" and you adopt the victim role. There are many benefits to believing you are powerless over your behavior. It's a free pass with lots of perks. I can post a long list if you like.


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Invisiblemoonrockmushy
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: RJ Tubs 202]
    #26078526 - 06/28/19 03:08 AM (4 years, 6 months ago)

I didn't say that people are powerless, just that total control over your own behavior is not reality.  We're all subject to internal and external circumstances that are out of our control, it's just part of being human. 

I think you're projecting here.  Not every addiction is an exciting passionate love affair, especially in the later stages.  If believing in your fully self-actualized choices works for you, great.  I don't see why you would resent someone else for seeking help through some sort of program. 

Nobody I've met in recovery denies being a drug user or a drunk, it's sort of a prerequisite for being a drug addict.  Your narrative that people who identify as addicts are all emotionally manipulative and doing it for the "perks" is not accurate in my experience.  Sure some addicts suck, but that's going to be true anywhere you go in life.


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OfflineEnjoywho
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: moonrockmushy]
    #26078541 - 06/28/19 04:05 AM (4 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

moonrockmushy said:
Yeah the rush is really the only good part.  Other than that opiates just seem to make me itchy, bloated, and irritable.  The high is gone real quick but the side effects last all day. 

Good luck with the taper man.  I'd recommend kratom over suboxone any day.  I've never had an easy time coming off of subs, in lots of ways it's harder than dope.  Coming off of kratom was a piece of cake by comparison, and you don't have to worry about precipitated withdrawals.




I only got 4 of them just for the first 4 days. After that i'll pretty much be fine. I could get kratom to the little asian store sells it. Maybe i'll grab some of that too for after the 4 days of that. We'll see how things are going.

It's weird to think about when your only buying .2 at a time but if you buy that 7 days a week your pretty much doing a gram and a half a week. Which I dunno seems like a lot but probably really isn't. I only buy it like that as I know i'll be too lazy to go get more. I could save money buying a teener but I'd just end up doing more.


--------------------
"I don't give nothin' to nobody, I just pay the cost to do business." - Riley "Young Reezy"-Boondocks

"The road to hell is paved with good intentions."

"In the days of kings and queens I was a jester."

"And then the great lord created bears... too many bears... shoulda really dialed back on the bears." Squidbillies

"Can you start speaking words instead of your damn filthy lies!"- Louise "Bobs Burgers"


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OfflineDoc9151M
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Re: Opiate addicts support group (moved) [Re: Enjoywho]
    #26079030 - 06/28/19 10:43 AM (4 years, 6 months ago)

How about we keep the thread about recovery and not the price of dope or how good it feels.

This thread is about getting off dope, talking about the good times only makes others think about it and that could trigger a relapse, we don't want that.


--------------------


Psilocybe cubensis data collection thread. please help with this project if you hunt wild cubensis.
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=26513593&page=0&vc=1#26513593


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