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 Dark_Star
train driver pervading a desktop
 
Registered: 08/20/04
Posts: 31,859
Loc: Uranus
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 Re: Stoned Drivers Are Killing More and More Innocent Victims  [Re: Konyap]  1
#23223978 - 05/13/16 09:36 PM (7 years, 10 months ago) |
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Bullshit. Marijuana most certainly slows my reaction time, and decreases my attention span. If I'm stoned, I should not be behind the wheel of an automobile.
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trampis
mad hatter
Registered: 01/01/06
Posts: 3,545
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I never once insisted that impaired driving of any kind is okay. In fact I find it completely reckless for anyone to get behind the wheel under the influence.
I was pointing out that the author clearly has bias which is evident to anyone who read the article or went one step further and looked into previous articles written by the same author.
The news should be objective.
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 Capt. Stern
Stranger
Registered: 04/23/13
Posts: 168
Last seen: 6 years, 16 days
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Re: Stoned Drivers Are Killing More and More Innocent Victims [Re: trampis] 1
#23224815 - 05/14/16 04:21 AM (7 years, 10 months ago) |
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It's just that traffic confuses me while high. Otherwise I drive slower and more careful. I am one of those people that have higher sensitivity to grass, though, so I have trust in other people to drive me safely while they're high.
BTW Something Super Extreme, what do you find illegitimate about that study? I forgot much of it, but it seemed legit, while this article has a few points and loads of bull.
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trampis
mad hatter
Registered: 01/01/06
Posts: 3,545
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Re: Stoned Drivers Are Killing More and More Innocent Victims [Re: Capt. Stern] 1
#23224830 - 05/14/16 04:33 AM (7 years, 10 months ago) |
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I was just aggravated by how slanted the article was written.
News articles should present the facts, not the authors opinion.
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Psychogenic
Tripped out jungle monkey
Registered: 05/26/14
Posts: 631
Last seen: 7 years, 9 months
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Re: Stoned Drivers Are Killing More and More Innocent Victims [Re: trampis]
#23225638 - 05/14/16 11:20 AM (7 years, 10 months ago) |
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You cant blame pot for peoples personal judgment either even though I can still drive after smoking pot.
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Bozko
Thread Ruining Autist
Registered: 06/01/14
Posts: 596
Loc: USA PNW
Last seen: 3 years, 30 days
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Re: Stoned Drivers Are Killing More and More Innocent Victims [Re: Psychogenic]
#23225734 - 05/14/16 11:46 AM (7 years, 10 months ago) |
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This is from NORML, but the document sites US DoT and US Department of Health and Human services statistics. Here is the link for followup.
http://norml.org/library/item/cannabis-and-driving-a-scientific-and-rational-review#5
"Survey data indicates that approximately 112 million Americans (46 percent of the US population) have experimented with the use of illicit substances. Of these, more than 20 million (8.3 percent of the population) self-identify as "current" or "monthly" users of illicit drugs, and more than 10 million Americans say that they've operated a motor vehicle while under the influence of an illicit substance in the past year. These totals, while far from negligible, suggest that the prevalence of illicit drug use among US drivers is far less than the prevalence of alcohol among this same population.
To date, "[The] role of [illicit] drugs as a causal factor in traffic crashes involving drug-positive drivers is still not well understood." While some studies have indicated that illicit drug use is associated with an increased risk of accident, a relationship has not yet been clearly established regarding the use of psychoactive substances and crash severity. Some reviews of traffic fatality data indicate that, in general, drivers with the presence of illicit drugs in their system possess an enhanced fatality risk compared to sober drivers. However, this risk is far lower than the fatality risk associated with drivers who operate a vehicle with the presence of alcohol in their system above or near the legal limit for intoxication. According to one review of the literature: "The risk of all drug-positive drivers compared to drug-free drivers is similar to drivers with a blood alcohol concentration of 0.05%. The risk is also similar to drivers above age 60 compared to younger drivers [around age 35]."
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ShadeOfDeepPurple said: I guess you don't get shamanism yet by the very fact that you describe a psychedelic as Mexican.
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Bozko
Thread Ruining Autist
Registered: 06/01/14
Posts: 596
Loc: USA PNW
Last seen: 3 years, 30 days
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Re: Stoned Drivers Are Killing More and More Innocent Victims [Re: 404]
#23225764 - 05/14/16 11:53 AM (7 years, 10 months ago) |
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And these are examples of illogical arguments for making driving while stoned illegal for everybody.
Quote:
Dark_Star said:
Bullshit. Marijuana most certainly slows my reaction time, and decreases my attention span. If I'm stoned, I should not be behind the wheel of an automobile.
Quote:
404 said:
marijuana slows reaction time. My reading comprehension skills are failing me here i think?  thinks weed does or doesnt affect driving
Drugs affect people in different ways. Show numbers to back up what you have to say, not personal experience or opinion.
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ShadeOfDeepPurple said: I guess you don't get shamanism yet by the very fact that you describe a psychedelic as Mexican.
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something super extreme
NIGGA YOU A FUCK NIGGA!
Registered: 10/29/12
Posts: 17,397
Loc: TURNT UP!
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Re: Stoned Drivers Are Killing More and More Innocent Victims [Re: Bozko] 1
#23225852 - 05/14/16 12:22 PM (7 years, 10 months ago) |
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uhhhh okay. I assure you that the subject has been more exhaustively studied by actual researchers than you seem to believe.
Your idiot pro-advocacy sources have cherry-picked results specifically for... what? Proposing that it be acceptable for people to drive impaired?
Ridiculous. They should be rounded up and shot just for suggesting it.
Everything you people are saying about it being acceptable to drive while high is based solely on anecdote; asking us to introduce empirical sources to the conversation really isn't going to help you very much.
http://www.ukcia.org/research/driving/01.php
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2722956/
http://ntl.bts.gov/lib/25000/25800/25867/DOT-HS-808-078.pdf
There's three. You're welcome to post some garbage from an alternative news outlet that totally disproves this horrible propaganda.
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Camwritesgonzo
The Unflushable Stool
Registered: 06/09/12
Posts: 2,333
Loc: On Uranus 
Last seen: 8 months, 8 days
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By all means, continue locking up drivers who have smoked a joint. I'm going to be over here butt-bombing oxycontins before drinking a fifth of Jack while making my laps around town in my pickup.
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"I've always maintained that reality is for those who can't face drugs."-Tom Waits
"I feel the same way about disco as I feel about herpes."-Hunter S. Thompson
A squid eating dough in a polyethylene bag is fast and bulbous, got me?
  
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404
error
Registered: 08/20/10
Posts: 14,539
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Re: Stoned Drivers Are Killing More and More Innocent Victims [Re: Camwritesgonzo] 1
#23226504 - 05/14/16 03:29 PM (7 years, 10 months ago) |
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I'm not sure which logical fallacy that is, but it's definitely one. you are using an extreme example of one form of intoxicated driving to justify another form of intoxicated driving, your point is moot as fuck
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PinPornProducer
Buy the ticket, take the ride
Registered: 08/23/14
Posts: 9,981
Loc: Rocky Point R.I
Last seen: 6 years, 3 months
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Re: Stoned Drivers Are Killing More and More Innocent Victims [Re: trampis]
#23226522 - 05/14/16 03:36 PM (7 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
trampis said:
This is the author, Cully Stimson.
Just look at all the garbage articles the guy has written.
Quote:
Charles "Cully" D. Stimson is a leading expert in criminal law, military law, military commissions and detention policy at The Heritage Foundation's Center for Legal and Judicial Studies.
From his Wikipedia page: Charles Douglas "Cully" Stimson (born June 13, 1963) is a former American career appointee at the Pentagon. Stimson was the Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense for Detainee Affairs. He resigned February 2, 2007,[1][2][3][4] following a controversy about his statements on legal representation for prisoners at Guantánamo Bay.
Dude just looks like a douche bag...
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musiclover420
psychonaut
Registered: 11/06/12
Posts: 19,563
Loc: PNW
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
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Re: Stoned Drivers Are Killing More and More Innocent Victims [Re: Dark_Star]
#23226607 - 05/14/16 04:08 PM (7 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Dark_Star said:
Bullshit. Marijuana most certainly slows my reaction time, and decreases my attention span. If I'm stoned, I should not be behind the wheel of an automobile.
The "I" is the key word there... I personally get distracted when I am really baked so I don't intend to drive stoned much but I will probably just smoke less when I have to drive to compensate for that. I know plenty of people who drive great stoned but clearly that will not be the case for everyone  if people really are worried it wouldn't be hard to do something about it that actually makes sense.
Like making it necessary for recreational and medical users to take a special driving exam while stoned to gauge how it will effect them.
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Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky
You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by
I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me
I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free
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404
error
Registered: 08/20/10
Posts: 14,539
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Re: Stoned Drivers Are Killing More and More Innocent Victims [Re: musiclover420] 1
#23226626 - 05/14/16 04:13 PM (7 years, 10 months ago) |
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except that's hard to do because there's no magic number for that... How about we just not get stoned before getting behind the wheel of a car?
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Konyap
Registered: 06/30/07
Posts: 33,945
Loc: Planet Piss
Last seen: 4 years, 5 months
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Re: Stoned Drivers Are Killing More and More Innocent Victims [Re: 404]
#23226652 - 05/14/16 04:20 PM (7 years, 10 months ago) |
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it said right in his source it was equivalent to 0.05% BAC
that's less then a beer
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musiclover420
psychonaut
Registered: 11/06/12
Posts: 19,563
Loc: PNW
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
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Re: Stoned Drivers Are Killing More and More Innocent Victims [Re: 404]
#23226674 - 05/14/16 04:26 PM (7 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
404 said:
except that's hard to do because there's no magic number for that... How about we just not get stoned before getting behind the wheel of a car?
So people who smoke medicinally shouldn't drive high even if they have no issues just becouse some people do?
Meanwhile we just have all the drunk drivers, people on pharmaceuticals, stimulants, cell phones, or people just being downright stupid...
That not only is unfair but does not make any sense if you ask me...
--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky
You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by
I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me
I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free
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something super extreme
NIGGA YOU A FUCK NIGGA!
Registered: 10/29/12
Posts: 17,397
Loc: TURNT UP!
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Re: Stoned Drivers Are Killing More and More Innocent Victims [Re: musiclover420] 1
#23226695 - 05/14/16 04:33 PM (7 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
musiclover420 said:
Like making it necessary for recreational and medical users to take a special driving exam while stoned to gauge how it will effect them.
That's stupid. Almost as stupid as:
Quote:
musiclover420 said:
Quote:
404 said:
except that's hard to do because there's no magic number for that... How about we just not get stoned before getting behind the wheel of a car?
So people who smoke medicinally shouldn't drive high even if they have no issues just becouse some people do?
Meanwhile we just have all the drunk drivers, people on pharmaceuticals, stimulants, cell phones, or people just being downright stupid...
That not only is unfair but does not make any sense if you ask me...
You understand that all of those things are illegal too, right? Why do some of you seem to think that it suddenly became permissible to drive drunk?
Beat the straw man a bit harder.
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musiclover420
psychonaut
Registered: 11/06/12
Posts: 19,563
Loc: PNW
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
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The point is that they are illegal...
It is not "permissible" but people do it all the time anyways and the majority of accidents involve something like that.
Meanwhile plenty of people use cannabis medicinally and drive fine all the time...
--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky
You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by
I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me
I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free
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something super extreme
NIGGA YOU A FUCK NIGGA!
Registered: 10/29/12
Posts: 17,397
Loc: TURNT UP!
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Re: Stoned Drivers Are Killing More and More Innocent Victims [Re: musiclover420] 1
#23226825 - 05/14/16 05:08 PM (7 years, 10 months ago) |
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So your point is that you have no point.
Is your argument seriously "well this impairment isn't quite as dangerous as other impairments so it should be completely ignored and unpunished"?
I hope you understand that's both unconvincing and retarded, if that's the case. Thing is, I'm not entirely convinced that you know what you're trying to say.
I did link three legitimate studies conducted by reputable sources demonstrating that it is, actually, not "just fine" to drive around high.
Maybe if these people have such shit lives that they need to be perpetually high to perform even the most basic tasks like driving, they should just save some time and kill themselves (ideally without a car crash being involved).
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musiclover420
psychonaut
Registered: 11/06/12
Posts: 19,563
Loc: PNW
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
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Quote:
something super extreme said:
I did link three legitimate studies conducted by reputable sources demonstrating that it is, actually, not "just fine" to drive around high.
So I should take 3 random studies over years of tons of people driving stoned daily with 0 problems?
Quote:
I hope you understand that's both unconvincing and retarded
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Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky
You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by
I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me
I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free
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404
error
Registered: 08/20/10
Posts: 14,539
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Re: Stoned Drivers Are Killing More and More Innocent Victims [Re: musiclover420]
#23227170 - 05/14/16 06:40 PM (7 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
musiclover420 said:
Quote:
404 said:
except that's hard to do because there's no magic number for that... How about we just not get stoned before getting behind the wheel of a car?
So people who smoke medicinally shouldn't drive high even if they have no issues just because* some people do?
Meanwhile we just have all the drunk drivers, people on pharmaceuticals, stimulants, cell phones, or people just being downright stupid...
That not only is unfair but does not make any sense if you ask me...
What are you saying dude? I'm gonna go with no, just like if you're fucked up on other types of prescribed pain meds you can get ticketed. Another logical fallacy i see.
Stimulants on the other hand aren't that much of a problem, when used as directed. they decrease reaction time and increase levels of focus and fight fatigue. if you're on mdma though, that's another story... stuff like prescription amphetamines and caffeine are obviously fine... completely besides the point though.
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