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InvisibleDoctorJ
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How do you "be yourself" ?
    #2285226 - 01/29/04 10:02 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I was having a conversation with a buddy about how humans express their selves to others. He was saying that more people should "be themselves".

my immeadiate thought was, "how do you 'be yourslef'" I mean, how can you represent yourself honestly to others? I think the limits of human perception make this impossible.

Most humans' "selves" consist of vast arrays of random shit, much of which is self-contradictory. How can you truly represent something as complex as yourself in one singular expression?

When i communicate with others, I am never truly honest. I am never truly representing myself. I am always coloring and shading for the situation. Playing up and playing down certain aspects of myself for the benefit of communication. Although I generally try to express myself honestly, sometimes it comes out in a form which I have crafted for specific ears. This is partialy a drive to control and influence others, and partialy an admission that I could never truly represent myself even if I wanted to.


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peace, pot, and microdot!


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OfflineNiamhNyx
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Re: How do you "be yourself" ? [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2285273 - 01/29/04 10:18 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

That is a really good point DoctorJ. I, as well try to express myself honestly but I think it's only so easy to exaggerate and diminish certain pieces of ourself for the sake of appealing to or even manipulating the people we encounter. At this point in my life I am conciously working on being straightforward and blatantly honest. I've spent years being diplomatic to my own detriment. How does one truly express themselves? I don't know. This is especially difficult to answer when we consider that we are constantly changing. I suppose te best way to "be ones self" is to react honestly and directly to each experience one has rather than putting on an act.


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InvisibleArmFromTheAbyss
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Re: How do you "be yourself" ? [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2285315 - 01/29/04 10:33 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

It's quite easy to be yourself, if you don't have a mask on.

The human experience is so complex, intangible, beautiful yet terrible at the same time. Humans naturally have a tendency towards the pleasure side, but it's not always peaches and cream. I think living life tends to make many people repress the negative, it makes them put a mask over themselves, or at least the negative part.  We all are jaded, we have no choice.

But if you can walk around unmasked, vunerable, true, you are the light. It's not easy, in fact it has probably brought many people to suicide. I still haven't figured this shit out for myself, it doesn't feel right for me to mask myself in any form, but it's also not good to let the shit on your feet stink up your entire life; if you truely express yourself, you will speak in YingYangs.  Life is a contridiction.  :confused: :laugh: <--- see like that.


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InvisibleZero7a1
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Re: How do you "be yourself" ? [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2285370 - 01/29/04 10:55 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

The hard part is percieving yourself. can you really boil yourself down to a couple of adjectives?  A clever phrase? I think people think that it may be so easy sometimes, to think that they can fit so easily. But once one sees the complexity of a human being, it is not so easy to try and "be oneself", which i must agree with you on.

When you try to think about yourself, and your life, for me personally, im just like "what the fuck?"  :wtf: .

You fool yourself into thinking you know who you are, maybe that if you knew, maybe you could make yourself "better" or fix "your problems". This raises so many questions that it just becomes shitty to try and think about.

If we didnt want to limit ourselves, i dont think their would be a point in trying to be "who we are", that would assume that we had something solid, and limiting, something to give us definition.


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What?


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InvisibleDoctorJ
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Re: How do you "be yourself" ? [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #2285454 - 01/29/04 11:20 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

At this point in my life I am conciously working on being straightforward and blatantly honest. I've spent years being diplomatic to my own detriment.




Ah, but dont fall into the trap of being honest to your own detriment!  I mean, come on- are you gonna walk into a job interview smoking a joint and wearing ratty-assed clothes?  Are you going to let every foible and neurosis come out on a first date?  Are you going to express your displeasure to every person that annoys you?  :lol:

I dont think any of us could last very long, living like that.  I'm not saying its the way things should be, I'm just saying, its the way they are :smile:

I think the only honesty that can truly exist is the honesty between I and I :rasta:


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peace, pot, and microdot!


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InvisibleDoctorJ
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Re: How do you "be yourself" ? [Re: Zero7a1]
    #2285463 - 01/29/04 11:23 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

The hard part is percieving yourself.




actually, I find that percieving myself is pretty easy when I abandon words, symbols, abstractions, and binary logic. I guess its all about meditation.


--------------------
peace, pot, and microdot!


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InvisibleZero7a1
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Re: How do you "be yourself" ? [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2285464 - 01/29/04 11:23 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

I dont think any of us could last very long, living like that. I'm not saying its the way things should be, I'm just saying, its the way they are 





ha, i cant seem to hide any of it, only unless ive had a really good day. The hardest part is getting a job, thinking about trying to keep myself up around a girl... fuck that. If she is turned off at how crazy i act, o well, i did the best i could.

Its too hard to try and press yourself to show other people, especially when the majority of people dont even care about who you are, they are just trying to experience the best, without trying to look too much into things. But they will definately see when you fuck up :wink: .


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What?


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OfflineFrog
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Re: How do you "be yourself" ? [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2285491 - 01/29/04 11:32 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I see it as "layers".

There are layers as to who we are. The outside layer for the world, in general, to see. Then a deeper layer, for our acquaintances. And then an even deeper layer for those to whom we are closest, who accept us in spite of our crazy, joint-smoking, depressed, disheveled selves.


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The day will come when, after harnessing the ether, the winds, the tides, gravitation, we shall harness for God the energies of love. And, on that day, for the second time in the history of the world, man will have discovered fire.  -Teilard


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OfflineNiamhNyx
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Re: How do you "be yourself" ? [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2285492 - 01/29/04 11:32 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

hahah, ok so you have a point. Although, it really depends on what job we're talking about. I did drop off a resume at a shop that sells psychedelics, if I came in puffin a joint it would probably IMPROVE my chances :smirk:


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OfflineSpecialEd
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Re: How do you "be yourself" ? [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2285499 - 01/29/04 11:36 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

The problem with adjusting yourself to an audience is that you have to consider yourself superior. You assume that you have summed up the other person well enough to personalize your response. Of course, there are some instances where that isn't true (like avoiding the word nigger in front of a black person).

The other thing to consider is "What if the other person is adjusting to you?" What if they adjust themselves to their perception of you, and this affects your read of them which therefore affects your behavior towards them. Much like nobody's memory is good enough to be a good liar, nobodies people skills are adequate enough for such adjustments.

A truly honest society would have many benefits.

Quote:

I mean, come on- are you gonna walk into a job interview smoking a joint and wearing ratty-assed clothes?




If everyone was totally honest, nice looking clothes would not be necessary. You would not have to hide your drug use nor hide behind a suit.

Quote:

Are you going to let every foible and neurosis come out on a first date?




Everybody has irritating idiosynchrosies (sp?), so why act as though they do not exist. Why be on your best behavior, why not give an honest presentation with a take it or leave it attitude?

Quote:

Are you going to express your displeasure to every person that annoys you?




Why not? Let them know, if it is a problem, they deserve to know.


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"Plus one upvote +1..."
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-- :meff:
  /l_l\/
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InvisibleDoctorJ
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Re: How do you "be yourself" ? [Re: SpecialEd]
    #2285591 - 01/29/04 11:58 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I totally agree with you, but I doubt that if one person put those principles into practice, it would put them in a very good situation in life.

but my greater point is that the self is an indefinable thing that cannot be directly express via abstract communication which relies upon exclusive definition .


--------------------
peace, pot, and microdot!


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InvisibleinfidelGOD
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Re: How do you "be yourself" ? [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2285615 - 01/30/04 12:04 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

that?s a good question
my theory is that you can never completely BE yourself.
and it?s not because we "put on" a mask.. we are constantly being created from the inside out, and as our personality rises to the surface, it hardens into a mask.
underneath that mask is another one and another one ad infinitum.
the way to "be yourself" is to prevent too much buildup of crusty old layers
like a molting snake, we must shed our outer layers regularly, it?s how we grow, it?s how the outside world stays up to date on who you are.
ok, that?s enough mixing metaphors for today



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OfflineSpecialEd
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Re: How do you "be yourself" ? [Re: infidelGOD]
    #2285626 - 01/30/04 12:06 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

good analogy.


Quote:

   





^^^ That?s what my ears look like. :lol:


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: How do you "be yourself" ? [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2285735 - 01/30/04 12:42 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

The most exalted states that I have experienced were simultaneously experienced as being the most Real, or genuine 'me.' Those states, or, more accurately, those occasions when I rose to that self-same state of consciousness are most simply described by a phrase from the book BE HERE NOW as "Unbearable Compassion." That is to say, "Unbearable" in the sense of an expanding ecstasy that entirely annihilated my personal center, and in its place there existed only an Infinite Ocean of Compassion. Thought had vanished - not even my name remained. 'Ahamkara' or 'I-sense' had vanished - absolutely no awareness of body as well as thinking mind remained. When the state subsided, all I can describe is the sense of this Infinite Ocean of Compassion (there was a sense of pale, pale, sky blue almost white light attending), contracting in an instant to a point of intense feeling in the Center of my Heart. The feeling, an Infinitude a moment ago, was now a locus - a point that radiated an intense feeling of Compassion.

In that return to 'me,' I understood the meaning of the Tibetan Buddhist Great Mantra 'OM MANI PADMA HUM' - The Absolute is a Jewel in the Lotus of the Heart. I understood the meaning of the Crown of Thorns that descends to encircle the radiant Sacred Heart of Jesus.

Compassion is of the nature of Ultimate Reality. "Allah the Compassionate, the Merciful." 'Chesed' - Mercy - the first emanation from the Supernal Triangle of the Kabbalistic Tree. Sat Chit Ananda - Being-Knowledge-Bliss - the Ultimate Condition of classical Hinduism. Agape - selfless Love in Christianity. These are some of the formulations of what Hindus call 'Atman' - our True Self - the Transpersonal Center, above the personal center of one's ego with all of its psychophysical constituents: thoughts, feelings, memories, intuitions, dreams, etc. The nature of one's true Self, as born out by every Wisdom tradition and world religion is Compassion. It is 'the seashell of Buddha' - it is 'the rose and the lamb' which is Christ. Compassion is the fount of human beinghood which emerges from the Ground of Being which is GOD. Seeking to BE Compassionate is The Way, it is essential and genuine humanity. +++ Peace. Pax. Shalom. Shanti. +++


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: How do you "be yourself" ? [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2285858 - 01/30/04 01:35 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

When i communicate with others, I am never truly honest. I am never truly representing myself. I am always coloring and shading for the situation.

It is only partially about subtle manipulations and "acting". ALL human interactions include present feedback, past relations (memory) and expectations. No matter how "honest" a person, they will act differently alone than they would with their lover or than they would with their mother. We are "who we are" in response to external stimuli. We are not separate from our social environment.


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The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineFrog
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Re: How do you "be yourself" ? [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2285976 - 01/30/04 02:29 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Renegade was saying to me that I'm lucky that I don't have to worry about being myself, because I am "myself" everywhere I go.

I don't think that that is always such a good thing. I say exactly what I think, I pretty much do what I want (running around law offices bare footed), I state my opinions even when they are directly in conflict with someone else's.

The problem with being yourself is that then there is always someone to tell you what is "wrong" with you, and I think we all try to avoid that, which is why some people have a difficult time just being themselves.

So there is always someone around telling me what is wrong with what I say, think or do. Of course, I understand it is usually their own insecurities or preconceived ideas about how things should be, but it doesn't hurt any less to be criticized.


--------------------
The day will come when, after harnessing the ether, the winds, the tides, gravitation, we shall harness for God the energies of love. And, on that day, for the second time in the history of the world, man will have discovered fire.  -Teilard


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OfflineRenegade8
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Re: How do you "be yourself" ? [Re: Frog]
    #2286001 - 01/30/04 02:43 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Which is worse - having other people not like you or not liking yourself? I personally say fuck 'em, but I know that comes with consequences.

"The price of conformity is that everyone likes you but yourself." Henry Rollins


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I'm just see-through faded, super jaded, and out of my mind. - R.I.P. Layne


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OfflineStrumpling
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Re: How do you "be yourself" ? [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2286007 - 01/30/04 02:47 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I think being one's self implies not trying to be somebody else


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Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE


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InvisibleSkorpivoMusterion
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Re: How do you "be yourself" ? [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2286346 - 01/30/04 06:40 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

"Most people are other people. Their thoughts are someone else's opinions, their lives a mimicry, their passions a quotation."
-- Oscar Wilde




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Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.


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Anonymous

Re: How do you "be yourself" ? [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2286464 - 01/30/04 09:18 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Markos: beautiful. :heart:

Ah, not to be cut off,
not through the slightest partition
shut out from the law of the stars.
The inner -- what is it?
if not intensified sky,
hurled through with birds and deep
with the winds of homecoming.


~ Rilke
(trans. by Mitchell)


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