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InvisibleCosmicJokeM
happy mutant
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Registered: 04/06/00
Posts: 10,848
Loc: Portland, OR
Re: I am so sick and tired of Christianity (moved) [Re: CherryBom]
    #22899962 - 02/13/16 04:15 PM (5 years, 9 months ago)

This thread was moved from Spirituality & Mysticism.

Reason:
Better suited for PS&P.


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InvisibleKurt
Thinker, blinker, writer, typer.

Registered: 11/26/14
Posts: 1,688
Re: I am so sick and tired of Christianity (moved) [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #22900112 - 02/13/16 04:59 PM (5 years, 9 months ago)

Writings on the wall.


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InvisibleCosmicJokeM
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Re: I am so sick and tired of Christianity [Re: Icelander]
    #22900147 - 02/13/16 05:07 PM (5 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
What's interesting to me and a little suspicious is with things like the Ouija board only a select few get anything out of it.  We all played with it as kids and then when tripping etc.  and nothing much came of it.





"Early in 1942, my mother made friends with a new neighbor, who wasn't Irish. She was named Olge Liebertoff and she was a Jew. . . . Olga was a big fan of the ouija board, which she soon persuaded my mother to try. They both liked the results so much that they sat, night after night, with the planchette moving between them, while I listened to the radio. A nun at school had warned us that ouija boards were tools of the devil, but when I told my mother that she said, 'Nuns don't know everything.'

I knew that disagreeing with anything the nuns said was the Sin of Pride, but she was my mother, so I didn't dare tell her that. . . .

One night, while they were sitting at the boards, I had an inspiration. I was lying on the floor, doing homework, and I suggested tentatively, 'Ask it when the war will end.'

They asked, and the planchette moved. Olga spoke out the letters and numbers of the answer as it emerged: AUGUST 14, 1945.

I was shocked again. The answer seemed incredible. Hypnotized by the professional optimists on the newscasts, I had the impression the war would be over much quicker than that. Nonetheless, I copied the answer inside the back cover of my notebook.

AUGUST 14, 1945. There it stood in the notebook for over three years, as the war dragged on and on. When the peace treaty was signed on August 14, 1945, I was discombobulated. It seemed to me that either the ouija board really was a tool of the devil, as the nuns claimed, or something happened that I just could not understand.

I spent a lot of time wondering about that." [Robert Anton Wilson: COSMIC TRIGGER II, pp. 115 -116]

"Brooklyn Tech certainly succeeded in getting me out of the Catholic reality-tunnel. . . .

Brooklyn Tech taught me a lot. I learned that the Earth wasn't hollow, after all, so there wasn't any Hell inside it. I encountered science teachers who encouraged us to think, instead of discouraging that activity as the nuns had. I even had one teacher, for calculus, who liked to drag philosophical problems into his exposition of math, and especially delighted in ending a class with a logical problem that none of us could figure out.

One day I went to this teacher, Mr. White, and told him the story of my mother and Olga and the ouija board. I wanted him to explain it. Naturally, being the man he was, he made ME explain it.

'How many ouija boards do you think there are in the world?' he asked me.

I said I couldn't guess, but it must be millions.

'Hundreds of thousands, at least,' he said. 'How many people do you suppose ever asked their ouija board when the war would end?'

I decided that everybody with a ouija board eventually thought of asking that question.

'Let's assume only half of them asked,' he said. 'That's still a lot of people. By sheer chance, how many answers would they get?'

'Uh,' I calculated, 'if there's say four hundred thousand and half of them asked, that would be two hundred thousand, and uh by sheer chance alone they'd get two hundred thousand answers."

'But there haven't been that many days between the beginning and end of the war,' Mr. White said. 'How many days have there been?'

I had to multiply 365 by 3 for the years 1942-1943-1944, which gave me 995, add on 24 days for 1941 and 225 for 1945 and arrived at 1244.

'So,' Mr. White said, 'how many would get the right answer by sheer chance?'

I came up with 152.

'So,' Mr. White said, 'That gives us 152 families telling the same story as you, and 199,848 who can only report that they got the wrong answer. Do you think the second group talks A GREAT DEAL about asking a ouija board and getting the wrong answer?'

'No,' I said.

'So where do we get our stories about people who got the right answer from ouija boards?'

'From the people who got the right answer by sheer chance.'

'I knew you could figure it out,' he said." [Robert Anton Wilson: COSMIC TRIGGER II, pp. 118-119]


--------------------
Everything is better than it was the last time.  I'm good.

If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care.

It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence.

I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too.  If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.


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InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
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Re: I am so sick and tired of Christianity [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #22900631 - 02/13/16 07:03 PM (5 years, 9 months ago)

Everybody's got a story to tell. :lol:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: I am so sick and tired of Christianity [Re: Icelander]
    #22900810 - 02/13/16 07:44 PM (5 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
What do you set your ego up in place of?:smirk:;)

Besides I thought this forum was about letting each person have their say without interference or challenge?

The past is, well, the past. Guess I'm capable of change even at this advanced age. :shrug:





I don't set my ego up in place of anything. I recognize that  Being needs to take the place of my ego. Jung called it the "Self," with a capital 'S,' but Eckhart Tolle calls it "Being" which I prefer.

It's the Spirituality & Mysticism forum that you are referring to. This forum can expect challenges and debates. The other is a softer rule. You don't wanna go insult someone because they disclose that they worship the image of a rooster on a box of Kellogg's Corn Flakes. That would be gauche and unkind. I've encountered individuals with the all-too-common Christ delusion, and I am in no wise obliged to recognize their egocentric delusion. Ram Dass had a brother-in-law who was repeatedly hospitalized for the Christ delusion. Ram Dass told him that everyone is Christ, and the relative said "No, you don't understand." Ram Dass said "That's why they keep locking you up."

Experiencing God as within oneself as well as without oneself can be problematical when the Presence isn't associated with Compassion or Love, but with one's thoughts and desires, thereby identifying their egoic-mind with God. Ram Dass' relative stole cars because 'God' needed a car. :rolleyes:


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


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InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
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Re: I am so sick and tired of Christianity [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #22901139 - 02/13/16 09:04 PM (5 years, 9 months ago)

whatever :laugh:  Have fun with all that. 


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Edited by Icelander (02/13/16 09:06 PM)


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InvisibleCherryBomM
Yoga Gypsy
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Registered: 12/27/98
Posts: 11,176
Loc: Ontario
Re: I am so sick and tired of Christianity [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #22902850 - 02/14/16 08:44 AM (5 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

CosmicJoke said:
The whole thread is inappropriate imho, the reality is some of the audience here in S&M is Christian, and this thread discredits their religion.  It baits Christians into defending their religion and reacting negatively to those who disrespect it.  I will fix that by tossing it into PS&P.




I feel like the face that this thread got moved further proves my point.  This isn't about the Christians FOR ONCE.  That wasn't the original intent.  I'm craving SPIRITUALITY AND MYSTICISM.  Fucking Christianity wins AGAIN. 

:facepalm:


--------------------


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InvisibleCherryBomM
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Re: I am so sick and tired of Christianity [Re: CherryBom]
    #22902868 - 02/14/16 08:56 AM (5 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

CosmicJoke said:
The whole thread is inappropriate imho, the reality is some of the audience here in S&M is Christian, and this thread discredits their religion.  It baits Christians into defending their religion and reacting negatively to those who disrespect it.  I will fix that by tossing it into PS&P.




I feel like the face that this thread got moved further proves my point.  This isn't about the Christians sensitive feelings FOR ONCE.  That wasn't the original intent.  I'm craving SPIRITUALITY AND MYSTICISM.  Fucking Christianity wins AGAIN. 

:facepalm:


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InvisibleCosmicJokeM
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Re: I am so sick and tired of Christianity [Re: CherryBom]
    #22902871 - 02/14/16 08:57 AM (5 years, 9 months ago)

Timothy Leary coined the expression in the 60s "Turn on, Tune in, Drop out".  Drop out - get rid of the Christians in your life, it's just that easy.  IMHO, you failed in your rant, by creating it it in S&M, it naturally drew all the Christian spiritualists and mystics right to it, you magnetized the exact people you were sick and tired of to your thread.  All the spirituality and mysticism you could ever want is readily available to you, look inwards, it has nothing to with the Christians, once you let them go they'll leave you be.

I'll make it clear to you right now that I am not Christian, nor do I favor Christianity to any other world religion, but I do know that disrespecting any religious tradition in S&M goes against the spirit of the forum and causes unnecessary tension.

In PS&P I'll happily tell you I think monotheism is worst disaster to ever befall humanity.  If you want to meet a cool tribe of people into S&M, I'd recommend you check out the Starwood Festival,  it's a week long neo-pagan festival, all of my psychedelic heroes from Timothy Leary, Terence McKenna, Robert Anton Wilson, Stephen & Ina May Gaskin,  & Rev. Ivan Stang of the Church of Subgenius have lectured there.


--------------------
Everything is better than it was the last time.  I'm good.

If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care.

It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence.

I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too.  If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.


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InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: I am so sick and tired of Christianity [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #22902898 - 02/14/16 09:22 AM (5 years, 9 months ago)

You are correct!  Not easy to do if you were programmed with christianity from birth but still, correct!

Spot on:thumbup:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisibleCherryBomM
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Registered: 12/27/98
Posts: 11,176
Loc: Ontario
Re: I am so sick and tired of Christianity [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #22902901 - 02/14/16 09:24 AM (5 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

CosmicJoke said:
Timothy Leary coined the expression in the 60s "Turn on, Tune in, Drop out".  Drop out - get rid of the Christians in your life, it's just that easy.  IMHO, you failed in your rant, by creating it it in S&M, it naturally drew all the Christian spiritualists and mystics right to it, you magnetized the exact people you were sick and tired of to your thread.  All the spirituality and mysticism you could ever want is readily available to you, look inwards, it has nothing to with the Christians, once you let them go they'll leave you be.




I know it.
All in good fun.  Happy Vday.


--------------------


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InvisibleCosmicJokeM
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Re: I am so sick and tired of Christianity [Re: CherryBom]
    #22903086 - 02/14/16 10:49 AM (5 years, 9 months ago)

S'okay, and I'll definitely message you before moving a thread of yours again, it's just a lot of people come out of the woodworks who aren't even necessarily interested in S&M to do some Christian bashing....  The S&M community is pretty sensitive, it's why there was a schism from Philosophy & Spirituality to two forums to begin with.  Happy Vday to you too!


--------------------
Everything is better than it was the last time.  I'm good.

If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care.

It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence.

I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too.  If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.


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Offlineanangaranga maiden
Stranger
Registered: 08/10/15
Posts: 178
Last seen: 4 years, 7 months
Re: I am so sick and tired of Christianity [Re: CherryBom]
    #22907238 - 02/15/16 02:15 PM (5 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

CherryBom said:
I was brought up pretty agnostic.  I am baptized.  I went to church for about a year when I was a child because I chose to, not because I had to.  I got bored and stopped going.  I have always generally been taught that there are all kinds of different ideas and religions and they all generally teach the same basic concept:  don't be a dick.

I am just so sick and tired of hearing about 'God' and Jesus and listening to judgmental Christian bullshit that rears up every summer when the pride parades start up.  And why gay folks can't get married, and why blacks are trouble makers and drugs are bad, mmmmmmkay?  I am so sick and tired of stuffy old white men telling me that abortions are wrong and why aren't I married yet?

I want to learn about healing herbs from crones in the forest, and crystal therapy from wiccans who aren't afraid to wear a pentagram for fear of being judged or persecuted.  I want western yoga to include chakra studies and Ayurveda, not just power vinyasa.  I want to learn what the mudras are in a pagan circle.

I wonder what the world would be like today if the Christian revolution never happened?  What if the pagans kept on doing their thing?  What if the Norse never converted?  Would Odin and Thor be legit?  Not just stories or comic book characters?

Would my boss stop mansplaining my own ideas to me like they were his own?  Fuck, maybe I wouldn't be the only woman in a 6 person management team. I guess a lot of things would be weirdly different.  I'm just so sick and tired of my entire life having this undertone of the church, the patriarchy, the glass ceiling, stuffy weddings, stuffy funerals.

Don't even get me started on weddings and funerals.  Under the eyes of god, honor and obey, till death do us part, OMG, shoot me in the face.  What do we even think we are doing?  Does anyone even believe this horseshit anymore?  What's the point?  People are just doing what has always been done with their eyes and hearts closed.  They don't even ask why.

I'm just so sick of it all.  Aren't we supposed to be evolving?  That is happening, right? I'm just a white girl trapped in a christian nation looking for my own tribe.




whats stopping you from meeting/being/reading pagan?


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Registered: 02/11/04
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Re: I am so sick and tired of Christianity [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #22907497 - 02/15/16 03:31 PM (5 years, 9 months ago)

For some reason I think S & M means something different to me.


--------------------


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InvisibleCosmicJokeM
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Registered: 04/06/00
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Re: I am so sick and tired of Christianity [Re: zappaisgod]
    #22907593 - 02/15/16 04:00 PM (5 years, 9 months ago)

Don't worry, you're probably thinking of BDSM.


--------------------
Everything is better than it was the last time.  I'm good.

If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care.

It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence.

I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too.  If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.


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InvisibleCherryBomM
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Registered: 12/27/98
Posts: 11,176
Loc: Ontario
Re: I am so sick and tired of Christianity [Re: anangaranga maiden]
    #22908843 - 02/15/16 08:47 PM (5 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

anangaranga maiden said:


whats stopping you from meeting/being/reading pagan?




Nothing.  But it's kind of like this. 

"I want to eat fruit"

"why don't you try vegetables?"

"No thank you, I would like fruit."

"Just try one vegetable, it won't hurt you"

"Ummmm, I don't really want to, I just want to eat fruit please"

"You're really missing out,  vegetables are so nutritious!"

"Fruit is nutritious too."

"But vegetables are better.  Here, let me recite some passages from the book of vegetables.  It will definitely change your mind."

:rolleyes:


--------------------


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InvisibleLeviticus969
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Re: I am so sick and tired of Christianity [Re: CherryBom]
    #22909083 - 02/15/16 09:28 PM (5 years, 9 months ago)

What that sounds like to me is the classic Angel and Demon on your shoulders. You have the free will to decide so choose wisely, the light or dark side. Although your metaphor of fruits and vegetables is not really valid imo since fruits and vegetables, both, are supposed to be good for you. But I hate both so...





I suggest you watch the 1973 version of the Wicker Man. It's an unbiased film on Paganism vs Christianity imo. Pretty good movie for an old school flick.


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InvisibleCosmicJokeM
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Re: I am so sick and tired of Christianity [Re: CherryBom]
    #22909146 - 02/15/16 09:40 PM (5 years, 9 months ago)

i'd just tell them i'm homo and like to eat....  oh nevermind
i can turn two missionaries into a sandwich real quick :lol:


--------------------
Everything is better than it was the last time.  I'm good.

If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care.

It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence.

I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too.  If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.


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OfflineEywa_devotee
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Re: I am so sick and tired of Christianity [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #22910348 - 02/16/16 02:11 AM (5 years, 9 months ago)

I hate to be blunt, but it is in my opinion a 2000 year old and counting personality cult no different then those of some of the Hindu "god-men". A few questions made me leave Christianity for good. They are:

If Jesus was the true messiah, why did the BS continue even after he died?

Why would any loving god allow killing in their name?

For what reason would an all mighty being create a SATAN figure only to feed it's own ego like it did with Job?

It is the fear of death and dying that ultimately sells christianity to most people- Why would a being use fear of death to make people believe they are god almight, yet at the same time bait with everlasting life if they are a perfect being?

If this god is a perfect being, then what is the point of salvation and everlasting punishment?

What is your soul, is it really yours anyway?

What is the point of trying to avoid death if it is inevitable and necessary in a temporary world?

Why is belief taken out of context so badly that most so called Christians don't even try to live the example set by Jesus Christ?

Why would a god so love the world (as it is) that he would send his own child to die?

Why would a god wish to keep our species both IGNORANT and AFRAID?

Jesus did a lot of miracle healing, I myself have witnessed the same powers, they are legit. Why would a god wish to destroy someone with gifts like that who could help many, solely to have the net effect of protection the established Earthly authority structure?

Why should we separate our selves from nature instead of integrating with it?

Why would any loving god give disclosure of a horrific potential future event knowing that doing so would risk subconsciously tricking us into manifesting it?

The only point of it seems to be an ego cult engineered by a lesser god like being based on a derivative fear based system of subconscious manipulation, used only to feed it's Ego and delusions of pride and power.


--------------------
"Love one another." "To Love is to know me." "Love is the Law, Love under Will." "In Compassion, all sorrows end." Regardless of the Master, the message is the same- Choose love and you shall live, Choose Fear and you shall die. Help bring peace to this Earth: Love one another, and serve others before yourself.


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OfflineTitus_Pullo


Registered: 01/24/10
Posts: 461
Last seen: 5 years, 9 months
Re: I am so sick and tired of Christianity [Re: Eywa_devotee]
    #22910387 - 02/16/16 02:33 AM (5 years, 9 months ago)

Seems like you guys don't know very much about Christianity at all


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