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InvisibleSupalemonhaze
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Re: Blenderless Liquid Inoculate [Re: Munchauzen]
    #23426223 - 07/09/16 11:03 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

I'm thinking that he would be re-filling the syringe over and over, just like you would do with LC.

But I agree, pouring is easier and safer once you get the hang of it. Syringes are not as dependable as good sterile tek.

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InvisibleMunchauzen
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Re: Blenderless Liquid Inoculate [Re: Supalemonhaze]
    #23426232 - 07/09/16 11:07 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Supalemonhaze said:
I'm thinking that he would be re-filling the syringe over and over, just like you would do with LC.

But I agree, pouring is easier and safer once you get the hang of it. Syringes are not as dependable as good sterile tek.



still, you'd have to refill it 3-5 times just for one jar. that would ruin your ship pretty quickly. even if you had a 60cc syringe, that could do at most 2 jars. so for 10 jars you'd have to refill 5 times. thats not exactly ideal, and in fact pretty bad. the integrity of the ship would be seriously comprised after a single batch of jars.

this tek uses considerably more liquids than a LC tek, or even other LI teks at that.

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Invisiblemupetmower
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Re: Blenderless Liquid Inoculate [Re: Supalemonhaze]
    #23426236 - 07/09/16 11:07 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Yeah i was quickly able to eye out to have "close enough" of the amount of LI I was trying to use per jar. It actually was way easier than i thought it would be, and I ended up with the exact amount left that I should've had left after my calculations for mL/jar I was going for.

And good call, Munch. I saw those at Walmart I think, also. So I'll grab some to try it out with. I'm just thinking it may be better to PC the lid in a separately wrapped piece of foil, and leave it in the foil wrapped up until you after you have shaken the jar with its regular lid, you know? That way you can keep it as sterile as possible before use. Because I would imagine it would be kinda difficult to keep it sterile enough of you just had it on from the beginning. Idk, though, since in not sure exactly what the lid is like.


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InvisibleMunchauzen
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Re: Blenderless Liquid Inoculate [Re: mupetmower]
    #23426244 - 07/09/16 11:09 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

mupetmower said:
Yeah i was quickly able to eye out to have "close enough" of the amount of LI I was trying to use per jar. It actually was way easier than i thought it would be, and I ended up with the exact amount left that I should've had left after my calculations for mL/jar I was going for.

And good call, Munch. I saw those at Walmart I think, also. So I'll grab some to try it out with. I'm just thinking it may be better to PC the lid in a separately wrapped piece of foil, and leave it in the foil wrapped up until you after you have shaken the jar with its regular lid, you know? That way you can keep it as sterile as possible before use. Because I would imagine it would be kinda difficult to keep it sterile enough of you just had it on from the beginning. Idk, though, since in not sure exactly what the lid is like.



for ease of use, try just putting the lid on an empty jar along with a band and pc'ing it. you'll find it makes for an easy and convenient transfer from one jar to the other.

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Invisiblemupetmower
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Re: Blenderless Liquid Inoculate [Re: Munchauzen]
    #23426344 - 07/09/16 11:42 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Oh yeah, that is a good idea. Thanks man. I'll try to get some of those lids today, and see what I can do with them. I think I should have a couple plates that can be used. As well as some I started a couple weeks ago with softer agar.

We will see :grin:


--------------------
-The wise man never stops seeking knowledge.


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InvisibleSupalemonhaze
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Re: Blenderless Liquid Inoculate [Re: mupetmower]
    #23427134 - 07/09/16 04:41 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

I reckon you could get away with less than 30cc. All you need is 1 fragment of mycelium anyway. Not at all saying that it's superior to pouring, ships and syringes are not my thing yet there are others who swear by them and have a pretty bad phobia of opening jars. Pieces of agar would also be problematic with a syringe I gather.

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Invisiblethe_r3dz
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Re: Blenderless Liquid Inoculate [Re: Supalemonhaze]
    #23427208 - 07/09/16 05:17 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Colonization speeds up pretty dramatically the more you use
I just like to have an excuse to use the equipment I paid for

Edited by the_r3dz (07/09/16 06:47 PM)

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InvisibleSupalemonhaze
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Re: Blenderless Liquid Inoculate [Re: the_r3dz]
    #23427295 - 07/09/16 05:53 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Ships are a disaster waiting to happen IME. I always end up tearing them and the rubber ends up in the damn jar, contaminating it.

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InvisibleLocN9ne
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Re: Blenderless Liquid Inoculate [Re: Supalemonhaze]
    #23427300 - 07/09/16 05:58 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Supalemonhaze said:
Ships are a disaster waiting to happen IME. I always end up tearing them and the rubber ends up in the damn jar, contaminating it.



Agreed, ships as well as syringes are kinda uneccesary extra steps.


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InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
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Re: Blenderless Liquid Inoculate [Re: Supalemonhaze]
    #23427308 - 07/09/16 06:01 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Ya gotta be careful with SHIPs. Need to push the syringe in with pressure down, away from the hole, otherwise you will tear the fuck outta the SHIP. Silicon SHIPs also suck balls IMO compared to the actual rubber ones from vendors. I only use a SHIP on the lid for the LC. Otherwise it's lid off and squirt.

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Invisibleweetsie
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Re: Blenderless Liquid Inoculate [Re: the_r3dz]
    #23427318 - 07/09/16 06:07 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

One advantage to a syringe might be controlling the quantity that goes into each jar more accurately, both in liquid volume and quantity of agar fragments. Despite my best efforts I struggled to get even quantities across the 7 jars I did so there is a fair bit of variation in colonizing speed.

Next time I do LI I will use 1% agar instead of 2% so it breaks up smaller/easier.
Fill the plates up much deeper, twice as deep is twice as much inoculum per plate.
Use a 50ml syringe so the distribution is more equal between grain jars, no ships or anything, just take the lid off and squirt.

As of 7 days the 7 jars I inoculated are all between 60-100% colonised, all healthy no contams. They soaked up the excess water and lost the wet look within a couple of days.


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InvisibleSupalemonhaze
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Re: Blenderless Liquid Inoculate [Re: weetsie]
    #23427337 - 07/09/16 06:12 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

You get used to pouring evenly. It might be uncomfortable if you never poured agar but I do so approximately twice a week so it was pretty easy to pour the LI. It was my first and only attempt at LI as well, haven't used it since then so far. With a syringe, you can't really suck up the big agar pieces which is a shame because those are the first that recover. I reckon colonization is even faster via pouring.

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Invisibleweetsie
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Re: Blenderless Liquid Inoculate [Re: Supalemonhaze]
    #23427457 - 07/09/16 07:04 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

I'm half way through my 2nd box of plates so 750~ pours. I think personally I'm just too clumsy to pour evenly from a jar.

On second thought I might try using a bottle, that would be much easier to pour. Would just have to slice the agar plate into 4 strips so they fit through the smaller mouth.


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InvisibleSupalemonhaze
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Re: Blenderless Liquid Inoculate [Re: weetsie]
    #23427462 - 07/09/16 07:07 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Possibly clumsy.. Probably just out of practice. I mean, my 7 year old nephew can pour a glass of coke all on his own. I find it hard to believe that someone can't get used to pouring from a jar. It's more a matter of not wanting rather than not able.

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InvisibleLocN9ne
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Re: Blenderless Liquid Inoculate [Re: Supalemonhaze]
    #23427494 - 07/09/16 07:17 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Yeah man, you just need to get around the right amount... Slightly less is actually excellent, slightly more is also not that bad... Practice with a jar of water, it won't take long to get it down man... You got this...:seriousthumbsup:


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InvisibleLocN9ne
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Re: Blenderless Liquid Inoculate [Re: LocN9ne]
    #23427527 - 07/09/16 07:27 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Sorry bout the double post, but... 5 days from inoculation, no shake... You da man munch!!!



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InvisibleMunchauzen
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Re: Blenderless Liquid Inoculate [Re: LocN9ne]
    #23427578 - 07/09/16 07:46 PM (7 years, 8 months ago)

ya man. take the same amount of LI you were going to use on 10 jars, and use it on 5. cuts colonization time in half. at some point i'll probably add that to the op... maybe...

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OfflineMMG
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Re: Blenderless Liquid Inoculate [Re: weetsie]
    #23428371 - 07/10/16 03:52 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

you'll wanna do 1.5% ish for soft yet solid agar, that's what I've found works for me. If I go lower than that I might get a some solidity but will have a layer of moisture/liquid sitting on the top face of the agar which automatically makes it inhospitable to any transfer.
This happens even when I cook solid agar but it's worse if you make it too soft (atleast for transfers, spores generally do ok or better with the extra moisture).
For me, the best way to counter-act the condensation or moisture problem is turning the agar container upside down so that it occurs at the lid and not on the surface of the agar. I turn it upside after it's done solidifying and it's got a level surface -  then when I want to use it for a transfer, after I clean the container up with alcohol, I open it up a do a slight swish motion with the lid to knock out most of the moisture that's built up on it. Then I re-lid and proceed to transfer.
I'd be interested to hear how other mycologists go about dealing with this natural moisture build up that occurs when doing agar, specially the removing part of it.
In regards to LI, I feel like with a lot of things in life, there's a point of diminishing returns when it comes to the amount used. But it's definitely wiser to underdo it a bit than to go over and have it get bacterial or mushy IMO.
Also...I've found millet to be a messier grain than say whole oats when doing liquids, specially if it's slightly over-hydrated.
Millet tends to get bacterial more easily if overdone or if the moisture content get's tweaked out of the ideal zone, while in the other hand, whole oats IME soak up liquids much more easily. I think this might have to do with the outer husk layer allowing it the grain to better deal with the extra moisture by acting as a wicking agent/sponge.
But yeah, in general, oats I think are one of more forgiving grains for LI or anything really.
just my 2cents... I'm looking forward to employing this technique again soon


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InvisibleMunchauzen
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Re: Blenderless Liquid Inoculate [Re: MMG]
    #23428533 - 07/10/16 07:12 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

I'd be interested to hear how other mycologists go about dealing with this natural moisture build up that occurs when doing agar, specially the removing part of it.





I ignore it and pretend its not there.

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InvisibleSupalemonhaze
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Re: Blenderless Liquid Inoculate [Re: Munchauzen]
    #23428563 - 07/10/16 07:36 AM (7 years, 8 months ago)

If you cool your agar before pouring, condensation will not be a problem. You have to wait until you can handle the bottle without burning your hand. I never get pooling with this method, I only get minimal condensation in the first 2-3 plates at the top of the stack, the rest are totally clear of condensation.

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