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Offlinefungulus
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Registered: 08/17/03
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dimethytryptamine containing grass as psilocybin pre-cursor?
    #2278545 - 01/27/04 07:46 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Just had an interesting thought while doing some leasurely reading in my new favorite book, "Psilocybin Mushrooms of the World", by Paul Staments, one of the stricture prints for mushie growers.

On page 24, while reading up on what the hell the sclerotia is I came across this passage: "By implication, tryptamine-producing grasses could have a potentiating effect on the production of psilocybin and/or psilocin (Gartz 1989). Canary (phalaris) grasses, known for their high dimethytryptamine content, might make excellent companions for the co-culture of Psilocybes." Staments goes on to elaborate by pointing out that many grassland species' sclerotia cling to dead grass and that might account for high indole content in species like P. semilanceata. The Gartz tryptamine experiments of course come to mind.

Does anyone know more on this subject? Could certain grasses serve to increase potency in simple cubensis cultures? I am very interested and hungry (stomach growling even) to know more. Any studies, thoughts, experience? Another reason to use straw?


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Invisibleutopianglory
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Re: dimethytryptamine containing grass as psilocybin pre-cur [Re: fungulus]
    #2279073 - 01/27/04 11:06 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Phalaris does not have a high dmt content though, high as in it has some but it is mostly impractical for extractions due to the sheer amounts required. Thats not to say it might not have its effect but it probably will be limited if the area being spawned is too small.

Certainly this is something that should be tried though.


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OfflineAnnoA
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Re: dimethytryptamine containing grass as psilocybin pre-cur [Re: utopianglory]
    #2279783 - 01/28/04 04:54 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)



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Invisibleutopianglory
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Re: dimethytryptamine containing grass as psilocybin pre-cur [Re: Anno]
    #2282523 - 01/29/04 02:21 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Wow, one of those threads that came up on the search had one of the weirdest reactions I have ever seen on these boards. Talk about angry.

I don't think that search yielded much in the way of information, essentially it suggested it could be done, but has not. Where is a mad scientist when you need one eh.


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OfflineBasidiocarp
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Re: dimethytryptamine containing grass as psilocybin pre-cur [Re: utopianglory]
    #2282619 - 01/29/04 02:46 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

utopianglory said:
Where is a mad scientist when you need one eh.




*Raises hand.*  If I could just find Beeker...  (Anyone who's seen the Muppet Show gets it.  Those who haven't seen it, should.)  :crazy2:


--------------------
"...if the mind is actually part of a continuum, a labyrinth that is connected not only to every other mind that exists or has existed, but to every atom, organism, and region in the vastness of space and time itself, the fact that it is able to occasionally make forays into the labyrinth and have transpersonal experiences no longer seems so strange."

Visit the Psychonautical Society


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Offlinellamaboy
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Re: dimethytryptamine containing grass as psilocybin pre-cur [Re: utopianglory]
    #2283289 - 01/29/04 10:54 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

the main reason it probably hasn't been tried is that DMT containing substrates are sorta expensive, or atleast, can be. the most typical way to do it, is to just add pure tryptamine HCl into your substrate. this has been tried, and it does work. you can get something like 10grams of tryptamine HCL for 50$ or something. you just have to know where to look.


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Invisibleutopianglory
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Re: dimethytryptamine containing grass as psilocybin pre-cur [Re: llamaboy]
    #2283298 - 01/29/04 11:03 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Phalaris can be found in the wild quite easily. Check DMT related information for instructions on how to locate it.

But just to help, phalaris is just merely a reed grass sometimes used for ornamental purposes. Two DMT containing types exist, arundinacea (sp?) and aquatica (sp?), aquatica has more "good stuff" but also contains another mode of the substance called buffetenine (sp?) which is fatal in too high doses, so is riskier to deal with. This is just from memory because i used to be a bit of a regular at dmtworld, though never smoked it.


Edited by utopianglory (01/29/04 11:04 AM)


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Offlinestara
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Re: dimethytryptamine containing grass as psilocybin pre-cur [Re: utopianglory]
    #2283362 - 01/29/04 11:34 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

some sort of 'acacia',too.


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Offlineiggy
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Re: dimethytryptamine containing grass as psilocybin pre-cur [Re: fungulus]
    #2291811 - 02/01/04 03:33 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

yes this has been tried and discussed many times. dmt in the substrate will increase psilocybin (or psilocin im not sure) content. On the dmt world boards there was an article about how someone added ground up mimosa hostilis(jurema) root bark to substrate to increase the alkaloid content in the mushrooms. mycelium takes any tryptamine that it encounters and basically adds a 4-hydroxy group onto it. if there was dipt in the substrate the mycelia would convert it into 4-ho-dipt so on and so forth, Im not sure exactly how this works like if you put in 5-meo-dmt would it change to 4-ho dmt still? or be some messed up shit like 4-ho-5-meo-dmt ( dont think this is even possible probably would be 4-ho-dmt) so in conclusion, yes the mushroom wil take the dmt Amd turn it to psilocin, this is a proven fact.


--------------------
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Mok-"Do you know what evil spelled backwards is? Live. And we all want to do that dont we?"




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OfflineBasidiocarp
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Re: dimethytryptamine containing grass as psilocybin pre-cur [Re: iggy]
    #2292062 - 02/01/04 05:56 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

iggy said:
mycelium takes any tryptamine that it encounters and basically adds a 4-hydroxy group onto it.




You don't think that the enzymes involved in this pathway are at least a tiny bit substrate-specific? I would be surprised if any and all substituted tryptamines would be converted. At some point stearic hindrance is going to keep the bigger/bulkier tryptamines out of some enzyme's active site, no?


--------------------
"...if the mind is actually part of a continuum, a labyrinth that is connected not only to every other mind that exists or has existed, but to every atom, organism, and region in the vastness of space and time itself, the fact that it is able to occasionally make forays into the labyrinth and have transpersonal experiences no longer seems so strange."

Visit the Psychonautical Society


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OfflineMycena
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Re: dimethytryptamine containing grass as psilocybin pre-cursor? [Re: fungulus]
    #2296518 - 02/03/04 07:56 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Rather than using a DMT rich substrate i think it would be more intereting to
a) find available rich sources of tryptamine (pref in something you can grow
b) write up on just how you can extract tryptamine easily (i dont know)
c) also do proper studies using tryptophan, Gramine and even plain old Indole to see what the mycelium can do with it
I do wonder if the indoles in manure act as precursors for the mycelium

and re Phalaris
P subaeruginosa in Western Australia grows along river banks mainly where it shares the habitat with P aquatica. I have personally seen them fruiting from arond their base and so who knows whats going on there.


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