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Shroomism
Space Travellin


Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
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yeah, the universe is insane. 
there's thought to be 6 to the 10th power number of galaxies in the absolutum. That's a lot of stars and stuff.
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infidelGOD
illusion

Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 3,040
Loc: there
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order doesn't necessarily mean that something is alive, or intelligent

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Phluck
Carpal Tunnel


Registered: 04/10/99
Posts: 11,394
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 4 months, 8 days
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Re: Bullshit! [Re: ]
#2252592 - 01/19/04 11:45 AM (20 years, 1 month ago) |
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Sorry, I missed this post earlier:
"1. The universe is a unified closed physical system (physicalism) 2. Matter gives rise to mind in the course of biological evolution (emergentism, materialism) 3. Brains give rise to consciousness (epiphenomenalism or mind-brain identity), therefore: 4. The death of the brain is the death of the person (nihilism) "
None of these things are assumed by science. Many scientists may take these viewpoints, but any decent one will be able to tell you that none of these ideas have been tested (nor, at this point, can they be tested), so there is no solid conclusion to be made. You will also find scientists and skeptics who are quite open to the possiblity of an afterlife, or a soul.
"5. Purpose and meaning (why) are excluded from scientific analysis any evidence contravening this view is unthinkable and can be summarily dismissed. "
Purpose and meaning must be assigned to things by a conciousness, and do not necessarily have roots in the origin. To assume that there is purpose and meaning, assumes there is a higher power.
The final list is composed of assumptions (ie. "The evolving and self-organising universe reflects intelligence, order, creativity, meaning and purpose"), and ideas that cannot be tested ("Human consciousness may in some form survive the death of the brain").
While they are interesting to ponder, there is no way to incorporate them into science.
"Explanations need not be restricted to the physical realm "
Perhaps, but they need to have some sort of basis to be taken seriously. When you delve into ideas brought about by visions, dreams, and intuitions, there is no way to separate the fiction from reality. Even if there are concrete answers being given to us, they're mixed with fiction, and there is no way to determine their accuracy.
"I merely am pointing out that the skepdicks do not even entertain postulates such as these. My opinion is that they are too ensconced in "science" to do so. I think I have made my point."
I don't think that's the case at all. When a skeptic discusses truth and reality, this is certainly true, but this does not mean he can't explore his creativity, or ponder the questions we cannot answer, it simply means he won't claim he is finding truth in doing so.
-------------------- "I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson http://phluck.is-after.us
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Anno
Experimenter



Registered: 06/17/99
Posts: 24,166
Loc: my room
Last seen: 6 days, 22 hours
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Re: Bullshit! [Re: Phluck]
#2261888 - 01/22/04 01:49 AM (20 years, 1 month ago) |
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So did anyone download some of the series?
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Phluck
Carpal Tunnel


Registered: 04/10/99
Posts: 11,394
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 4 months, 8 days
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Re: Bullshit! [Re: Anno]
#2261959 - 01/22/04 02:28 AM (20 years, 1 month ago) |
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I grabbed the episodes I hadn't seen yet, Thanks!
-------------------- "I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson http://phluck.is-after.us
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Anonymous
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Re: Bullshit! [Re: Phluck]
#2265115 - 01/23/04 07:42 AM (20 years, 1 month ago) |
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- Post History Deleted Upon User's Request -
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Phluck
Carpal Tunnel


Registered: 04/10/99
Posts: 11,394
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 4 months, 8 days
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Re: Bullshit! [Re: ]
#2265507 - 01/23/04 11:16 AM (20 years, 1 month ago) |
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"Some links or quotes or anything that says these postulates aren't philosophical presuppositions of science would be fine."
Uh... I don't think there are any. I think the burden of proof is on you for this one.
Science in itself does not have any presuppositions, science is not a belief system, it is a method for testing theories and ideas.
-------------------- "I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson http://phluck.is-after.us
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Phluck
Carpal Tunnel


Registered: 04/10/99
Posts: 11,394
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 4 months, 8 days
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Re: Bullshit! [Re: Phluck]
#2265522 - 01/23/04 11:20 AM (20 years, 1 month ago) |
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Also,
Science hasn't explored the idea of an afterlife, or a soul, because there simply isn't any way to test that. The closest thing we have to evidence of these ideas is that a bunch of people believe in them. This does not mean that science has discarded these ideas, it just means that there is no way to gather information on them.
Philosophy cannot offer any further information on these ideas either, it can only be used to ponder and speculate.
-------------------- "I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson http://phluck.is-after.us
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Anonymous
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Re: Bullshit! [Re: Phluck]
#2266508 - 01/23/04 04:58 PM (20 years, 1 month ago) |
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- Post History Deleted Upon User's Request -
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