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MajickMuffin
Edible Cult


Registered: 05/28/14
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Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks?
#22651663 - 12/13/15 08:12 PM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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Anyone have experience with Popcorn grain?
I have 30 pounds of it. Just made 5 bags of Popcorn grain boiled with Gypsum.
Pros and Cons? Any insight or experiences to give me?
I also made 15 bags of Popcorn grain 25%, Oak 75% and Gypsum.
5/5/5 bags of Popcorn/Oak are; Golden Oyster, King Oyster, Shitakke.
5 bags of Popcorn Grain/Gypsum are; Pearl Oyster.
I'm going to be using Popcorn Grain all the fucking time because I have a ton of it.
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Mycologist217
Frank's Disciple



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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: MajickMuffin]
#22651745 - 12/13/15 08:31 PM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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If I was just guessing, it would be that corn offers virtually no nutrition. I know low nutrition is the aim during the initial germination phase but I hypothesize the corn is so low nutrition that the fruits produced by colonized corn are generally lower in mass.
-------------------- My LC Manual (With custom LC lid Tek) ~~ Required Mycology Supplies ~~ Agar Work Videos ~~ L G M AMU Q&A-NO SYMPATHY FOR THE DEVIL! KEEP THAT IN MIND! BUY THE TICKET: TAKE THE RIDE Check out my Retail Gourmet Mushroom Farm! Mycologist217 is a fictitious entity that uses images supplied by Google to mask his/her inability to develop normal social habits.
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tetherface
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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: MajickMuffin] 1
#22651754 - 12/13/15 08:33 PM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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I wouldn't say it sucks i really like the look and prep of popcorn the price for me sux although I didn't try very hard to source it the biggest downfall i see is being a very large grain you get fewer innoc points
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MajickMuffin
Edible Cult


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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: Mycologist217]
#22651773 - 12/13/15 08:36 PM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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Nutrition is probably a factor.
Which is why when I boiled the Corn to prepare it I added a shit ton of Gypsum.
And I plan to Spawn it to other things.
I just figured it would colonize quickly.
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MajickMuffin
Edible Cult


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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: tetherface]
#22651777 - 12/13/15 08:37 PM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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Honestly I don't see any difference in inoculation points.
When you inoculate, it falls down onto whatever it touches either way.
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cronicr



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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: MajickMuffin]
#22651882 - 12/13/15 08:56 PM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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large endospore counts huge grains less inoc points, you will have probably 3 x the amount of mycelium in a qt of rye then a qt of popcorn
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MajickMuffin
Edible Cult


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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: cronicr]
#22651910 - 12/13/15 09:03 PM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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Endospore count doesn't matter when you PC at 15psi for 120 minutes does it? Lol.
Thanks for input cronicr
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cronicr



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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: MajickMuffin]
#22651914 - 12/13/15 09:03 PM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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yes and no
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MajickMuffin
Edible Cult


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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: cronicr]
#22651931 - 12/13/15 09:07 PM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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Is there still a survival chance of Endospores through PC ?
I mean you hard boil Popcorn grains for like 30mins before PC anyways...
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Machiavelliavore
Vermiculite Hater



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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: cronicr]
#22651953 - 12/13/15 09:12 PM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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At least with cracked corn, I've read a few posts from users that could not get the endospore count down enough from a single PC run.
In the future, try adding some bran. I think the cellulose fiber is most likely what the corn lacks nutritionally, and it adds lots of noc points.
The mycellial volume is also quite low.
Might check out that blackout method of microwaving then dumping into boiling water in the PC with no jars. Then you put it in containers for one quick final sterilization on the outside.
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I spawned some popcorn casings and had double-overlay cause I didn't put enough hydrogen peroxide in my automated aquarium mister. I only got one mushroom so I cut off the head part where the seeds fall from and put it in a jar of LC and sprayed it all over a tin of PF cakes I made with gravel, cardboard, and bisquick in my microwave. I think it will be good cause B+ is so potent. Triggered yet? Only a square would say "a cube is a cube."
No, this does not look right...
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wtfcrazymofo
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The smaller the grain the more surface are for the fungus. It might take longer to (chew) so longer isolation time maybe.
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insanemike
Registered: 02/23/14
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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: wtfcrazymofo]
#22652089 - 12/13/15 09:39 PM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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Popcorn gets a bad rep because of its size but I've spawned plenty of popcorn to bulk with lots of success. As far as endospores go, it cannot possibly have a load anywhere near what animal feed grade grain carries. As far as nutrition goes, it is higher in carbs and particularly high in starch which gives a slightly lower protein content but I doubt that is a make or break aspect of grain spawn. Last, when using popcorn, make sure that the hull splits on at least 15-20% percent of the kernels before taking it off the heat. The rest will split in the pc cycle.
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MajickMuffin
Edible Cult


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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: insanemike]
#22652111 - 12/13/15 09:44 PM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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That's how I cook it 
Thanks for your experience friend, that gives me a bit more hope
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insanemike
Registered: 02/23/14
Posts: 4,272
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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: MajickMuffin]
#22652125 - 12/13/15 09:46 PM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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Director



Registered: 09/18/11
Posts: 79
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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: insanemike]
#22652416 - 12/13/15 11:28 PM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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I've always had great success with popcorn. It was my first bulk substrate, spawned to coir. I was able to get a very good yield that would be about 10 wet grams less than I get with rye berries.
Like insanemike, I PC after soaking to allow approx 15%-20% of the hulls to crack so the PC would do it's job. I soaked for 24 hours to allow endospores to grow and then PC it for 120 min + @15psi.
So I find the price of popcorn makes it worth it for me when I want a fast colonization to spread over to other grains, or as a starting point for an LC.
I find it really easy to do an LC with popcorn due to the large surface area per individual grain.
So in the end, to each their own. YMMV.
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wildernessjunkie
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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: Director]
#22652510 - 12/14/15 12:16 AM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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I used to use popcorn for GLC. It does really well in that area. But that's about it.
I would bet that if you do a side by side grow using popcorn in one sub, and WBS in the other you would see the difference first hand.
When someone is dead set on an idea , its hard to sway them otherwise. I encourage you to discover the difference on your own.
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insanemike
Registered: 02/23/14
Posts: 4,272
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It's not always about BE. Sometimes it's about availability, ease of use and cost.
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cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: insanemike]
#22652662 - 12/14/15 02:10 AM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
insanemike said: It's not always about BE. Sometimes it's about availability, ease of use and cost.
popcorn here for me is not cheap at all...rye is though
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MajickMuffin
Edible Cult


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A new pet store opened in town , and they have a shit ton variety of WBS , I'm going to use it and experiment with it.
But I have 30 pounds of corn sitting in a box. Lol. It was cheap and avaliable.
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insanemike
Registered: 02/23/14
Posts: 4,272
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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: MajickMuffin]
#22653105 - 12/14/15 08:25 AM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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Might as well use up the popcorn first.
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Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: insanemike]
#22653212 - 12/14/15 09:15 AM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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Popcorn pros. Smells great. Grains change color allowing to see how well dispersed it is upon shaking or G2G.
Popcorn cons. Expensive (for me at least). Harder for heat to penetrate. Low knock points. Less nutrition per quart.
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MajickMuffin
Edible Cult


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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: Pastywhyte]
#22653300 - 12/14/15 09:39 AM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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Less nutrition means potentially less colonization time does it not?
I'm documenting all my grows by the way
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Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: MajickMuffin]
#22653369 - 12/14/15 10:01 AM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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Popcorn does colonize pretty fast. That's not really a good way to speed colonization times tho as yield suffers at the end.
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MudaFuka
Poppin bottles


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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: Pastywhyte]
#22655864 - 12/14/15 08:44 PM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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I like popcorn. I used a lot if it when I first started growing. It works best when mixed with other grains like WBS. The large grain size helps keep your grain jars nice and loos for easy shaking. Popcorn will also absorb some excess moisture during the PC cycle. It give you some room for error with your grain prep. I've saved a few batches of badly burst WBS by mixing in some popcorn.
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Machiavelliavore
Vermiculite Hater



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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: MudaFuka]
#22656819 - 12/14/15 11:55 PM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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Damn Muda, that's a cool trick. I like it.
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I spawned some popcorn casings and had double-overlay cause I didn't put enough hydrogen peroxide in my automated aquarium mister. I only got one mushroom so I cut off the head part where the seeds fall from and put it in a jar of LC and sprayed it all over a tin of PF cakes I made with gravel, cardboard, and bisquick in my microwave. I think it will be good cause B+ is so potent. Triggered yet? Only a square would say "a cube is a cube."
No, this does not look right...
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Director



Registered: 09/18/11
Posts: 79
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What is really nice is when you live right next to a popcorn farm (no kidding, a farm growing popcorn corn) and can get a 25kilo bag for the price of a brick of coir, or if you want to harvest it yourself: as much as you want free. Even once in a blue moon, you can find a popped kernel on a cob.
I too noticed that popcorn tends to soak up that little extra. It also gives some space for the sclerotia to work their "magic" more easily, and (At least I) have noticed the sclerotia tend to form their first knots fastest on pcorn.
The magic of growing mushrooms is they will try to grow with whatever you have, and you can keep experimenting without smelling up the entire neighborhood.
In the end I agree with both Muda and Pasty, but I still love me some popcorn. Just save some off to the side and some butter for your movie night while you PC those jars!
MajickMuffin: keep us updated (at least me please)
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Machiavelliavore
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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: Director]
#22660165 - 12/15/15 08:01 PM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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Damn director, you should really check out the blackout method. You could potentially prepare SOOOOO much in one round, then bag it and PC it for like ~60 mins to sterilize the outside of the kernels.
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I spawned some popcorn casings and had double-overlay cause I didn't put enough hydrogen peroxide in my automated aquarium mister. I only got one mushroom so I cut off the head part where the seeds fall from and put it in a jar of LC and sprayed it all over a tin of PF cakes I made with gravel, cardboard, and bisquick in my microwave. I think it will be good cause B+ is so potent. Triggered yet? Only a square would say "a cube is a cube."
No, this does not look right...
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Director



Registered: 09/18/11
Posts: 79
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Quote:
Machiavelliavore said: Damn director, you should really check out the blackout method. You could potentially prepare SOOOOO much in one round, then bag it and PC it for like ~60 mins to sterilize the outside of the kernels.
I'm looking up that method now, however I don't really have the urge to do a big grow. It is fun to grow these on your own for your personal use at most. HOWEVER, non-psychoactives would be a good thing to try on a large scale for a farm grow.
thanks for the suggestion, i'll keep looking.
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eatyualive
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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: Director]
#22684042 - 12/21/15 06:10 PM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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mycelia loves pcorn grain. its a little slower to colonize due to large kernal size. but i must say, oysters love it. and cubes as well. its a bit more work to prepare than normal grain like wbs or oats. also, its starchy. that is where most people fail. if you boil it an hour then lay it all flat out on a towel to soak up the extra starches. its real easy to work with. i had some issues with bad grain so i had to switch to the popcorn for a while. i will say at the time it was cost effective, but it can be expensive. depends on your location.
     
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Director



Registered: 09/18/11
Posts: 79
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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: eatyualive]
#22685551 - 12/22/15 02:28 AM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
eatyualive said: mycelia loves pcorn grain. its a little slower to colonize due to large kernal size. but i must say, oysters love it. and cubes as well. its a bit more work to prepare than normal grain like wbs or oats. also, its starchy. that is where most people fail. if you boil it an hour then lay it all flat out on a towel to soak up the extra starches. its real easy to work with. i had some issues with bad grain so i had to switch to the popcorn for a while. i will say at the time it was cost effective, but it can be expensive. depends on your location.
      
Not to resurrect an 8 hour old thread, but this is the reasoning why I went wih popcorn, just soak out that starch and it goes to town on your edibles.
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Sockadin



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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: Director]
#22685612 - 12/22/15 03:42 AM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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OP:
Popcorn has worked well for me in the past. The most important thing is to soak for at least 24hrs before you boil. Popcorn has produced nice flushes for me in the past. I am not sure were it stand against grain on a nutritional level. But the more kernel per volume of a rye or oat jar is higher than popcorn. This is what everyone means by more inoculation points. The grains are larger so they take up more room meaning less individual kernels and more space between the grains=less overall mycelium.
If you have a 30lb bag! Hells Yar PC the shit out of it and keep us posted.
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mushpunx
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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: Sockadin]
#22685757 - 12/22/15 06:10 AM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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Im a rye guy. I get about 100lbs every other month.
50lb bags of popcorn are actually quite cheaper than rye for me, but if I wanted cheap spawn Id go with bird seed.
I think that's the main reason popcorn fell out of favor around here, WBS is cheaper and probably better to work with
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MajickMuffin
Edible Cult


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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: Sockadin]
#22686037 - 12/22/15 08:52 AM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Sockadin said: OP:
Popcorn has worked well for me in the past. The most important thing is to soak for at least 24hrs before you boil. Popcorn has produced nice flushes for me in the past. I am not sure were it stand against grain on a nutritional level. But the more kernel per volume of a rye or oat jar is higher than popcorn. This is what everyone means by more inoculation points. The grains are larger so they take up more room meaning less individual kernels and more space between the grains=less overall mycelium.
If you have a 30lb bag! Hells Yar PC the shit out of it and keep us posted.
I definitely understand what people are saying about 'less mycelium'. But the 1 successful grow that I have done with popcorn grain has proven the opposite. The space in between grains were Filled with mycelium, (cubensis), as if there was no empty space at all. No less mycelium. But I don't know how often that happens
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Pastywhyte
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Registered: 09/15/12
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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: MajickMuffin]
#22686089 - 12/22/15 09:15 AM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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It has less to do with the myc in the "spaces" as that will all contract. It's about grain surface area. Popcorn has the least.
Popcorn can work, I did a few grows with it myself. You can get good results with it. But for me and most people, it's far more expensive and harder to hydrate and sterilize properly than grains like rye wbs or oats.
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MajickMuffin
Edible Cult


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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: Pastywhyte]
#22686311 - 12/22/15 10:58 AM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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I heard a couple people mention soaking in water prior to boiling because of a lot of starches. What is any negative impact of starch? Because I did not soak before boiling
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Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: MajickMuffin]
#22686354 - 12/22/15 11:13 AM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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People soak to soften the endospores and hydrate the grains. Popcorns large grain size has an insular effect which means you want softer endospores and longer PC times in general to achive an effective cycle.
Personally I had good results with just PCing the popcorn to hydrate. Then pull out hot, strain and jar and back into the PC.
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MudaFuka
Poppin bottles


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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: Pastywhyte]
#22686478 - 12/22/15 12:09 PM (8 years, 1 month ago) |
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I actually find popcorn to be one of the easiest grain to prep. Just boil the shit out of it until the outer skin splits open, strain and load. If it was cheaper id probably use it more often.
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woofwoof
such mushrooms!



Registered: 01/04/19
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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: MajickMuffin]
#25743799 - 01/14/19 02:48 PM (5 years, 14 days ago) |
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I wanted to use a fairly small amount, enough to do one G2G transfer, then spread it out in normal quarts after. Is this advised??
Using a tiny amount in order to just colonize fast? I'll be using MS spore syringe to noc up the corn jar with about enough grain to G2G one singe jar, then ramp up after that.
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Failboat
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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: woofwoof]
#25743803 - 01/14/19 02:53 PM (5 years, 14 days ago) |
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Eat your popcorn and buy a sack of oats, come over to the oat side...
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woofwoof
such mushrooms!



Registered: 01/04/19
Posts: 1,127
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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: woofwoof]
#25743805 - 01/14/19 02:54 PM (5 years, 14 days ago) |
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I will also be pressure cooking the grain
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woofwoof
such mushrooms!



Registered: 01/04/19
Posts: 1,127
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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: Failboat]
#25743807 - 01/14/19 02:55 PM (5 years, 14 days ago) |
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Quote:
Quirkmeister92 said: Eat your popcorn and buy a sack of oats, come over to the oat side...
I do not plan on using popcorn mainly, just wanted to use it to kick off a tiny amount for grain to grain transfers since I hear it colonizes fast
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bodhisatta 
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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: woofwoof]
#25743952 - 01/14/19 03:59 PM (5 years, 14 days ago) |
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Old thread,
Fast colonization doesn't have too much to do with grain. Much more to do with how much inoculum you use, temperatures, culture genetics(vigor), grain moisture (proper prep).
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Buelligan
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Re: Why do people say Popcorn Grain sucks? [Re: Pastywhyte]
#25744100 - 01/14/19 05:15 PM (5 years, 14 days ago) |
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Quote:
Pastywhyte said:
Personally I had good results with just PCing the popcorn to hydrate. Then pull out hot, strain and jar and back into the PC.
This was the method I used as well when I first started bulk methods in 2011. Dump the popcorn straight into the PC. Add water and whatever supplements, seal it up and cook at pressure for 45 minutes.
Once the pressure bleed off, strain and rinse with hot water, allow to dry for a hour or so, then jar it up and run through the PC for another 2 hours.
I thought it kind of stunk for the hydration run though.
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