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hTx
(:



Registered: 03/27/13
Posts: 5,724
Loc: Space-time
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Lets Get Practical
#22504740 - 11/10/15 11:50 AM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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I am interested to hear yous guys thoughts on a practical matter..
What would be the single most effective way to reduce mass violence?
-------------------- zen by age ten times six hundred lifetimes Light up the darkness.
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LunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story


Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
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Re: Lets Get Practical [Re: hTx]
#22504799 - 11/10/15 12:05 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
hTx said: I am interested to hear yous guys thoughts on a practical matter..
What would be the single most effective way to reduce mass violence?
Kill all central bankers.
Kill 'em all.
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
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DividedQuantum
Outer Head


Registered: 12/06/13
Posts: 9,819
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Re: Lets Get Practical [Re: hTx]
#22504850 - 11/10/15 12:20 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Go back in time and wipe out Homo erectus.
-------------------- Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici
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White Beard

Registered: 08/13/11
Posts: 6,325
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Re: Lets Get Practical *DELETED* [Re: hTx]
#22504907 - 11/10/15 12:39 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Post deleted by White BeardReason for deletion: .
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LunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story


Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
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With nuclear war we won't get far. How about that missile launched right over LA? "Just a test, folks". Go back to sleep.
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
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DisoRDeR
motional



Registered: 08/29/02
Posts: 1,158
Loc: nonsensistan
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Re: Lets Get Practical [Re: hTx] 1
#22505060 - 11/10/15 01:19 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
What would be the single most effective way to reduce mass violence?
Accept greater risk
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Tropism
ChasingTail


Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 2,039
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Re: Lets Get Practical [Re: hTx]
#22505316 - 11/10/15 02:15 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
hTx said: I am interested to hear yous guys thoughts on a practical matter..
What would be the single most effective way to reduce mass violence?
Constant global sedation.
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: Lets Get Practical [Re: Tropism]
#22505512 - 11/10/15 02:54 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Tropism said: Constant global sedation.
I like it. Dose the worlds drinking water with heroin. Who's gonna care about anything enough to cause violence then?
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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White Beard

Registered: 08/13/11
Posts: 6,325
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yeah, but then nothing would get accomplished and eventually the economy would collapse. The dope would run out and all our infrastructure would be in disrepair. People would have no means of a living besides looting and robbing from one another. Things would become much more violent.
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eehoo
Stranger


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Increase local domestic violence, and return honor to fighting (I.e 1v1 , equal weapons or both fists, better man wins)
--------------------
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Tropism
ChasingTail


Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 2,039
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Quote:
Jokeshopbeard said:
Quote:
Tropism said: Constant global sedation.
I like it. Dose the worlds drinking water with heroin. Who's gonna care about anything enough to cause violence then?
Anyone gets outta line you just double-up their dose. Problem solved.
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Hippocampus



Registered: 04/01/15
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Last seen: 6 years, 10 months
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Re: Lets Get Practical [Re: hTx]
#22505690 - 11/10/15 03:41 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Extinction of Homo sapiens sapiens
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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What about that movie (and the Rick & Morty episode) with the plot that allows a single night of violence per year. Could it really work practically?
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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Hippocampus



Registered: 04/01/15
Posts: 753
Last seen: 6 years, 10 months
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idk, but The Purge movies were terrible compared to what a great concept it is.
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Kurt
Thinker, blinker, writer, typer.

Registered: 11/26/14
Posts: 1,688
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Re: Lets Get Practical [Re: DisoRDeR]
#22507543 - 11/10/15 11:21 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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I agree with the suggestion "Accept Greater Risk". Also I think being aware is important.
I have been thinking and reading a bit about non-violence, as a distinct possitive idea. I know there are a lot of suggestions that this ideal does not fit our world. My response, is in acknowledgement that conflict is part of life. But I don't think this means non-violence is an impossible ideal.
Maybe it is suggested or asked for the wrong way. For example, peace could not to my mind be asked for outwardly in "meekness" or "turning the other cheek" by some ease in example. That is too much to ask of somebody. It is possibly unjust, and also finally just impractical, because if everybody did this, or was really "like Christ" I think that force of violence would go unchecked.
I mention this first, because while we are supposed to be beyond the suggestions of judeochristian religion today, I think this mythology holds fast, in a western people's broader ethic. A modern genesis is to say we are more objective, and so we have a basic idea of standing on one side of things. Someone would maybe say "the way the world is" is not as something created, yet that form of statement is indeed still quite held to. I think Nietzsche was right, in his impression that westerners killed their creator God, and now stand on one side of things. Genesis for modern people.
From the Greek/ Athenian enlightenment, down to the modern enlightenment era, we suggest the outward openness of a forum, established by democratic ideals, of liberal institutions, in which we find our ideas of truth foundm As truth does not come without contingency of argument, truth does not come without its forum properly. This forum has been considered such a virtue, that I even think I agree, that maybe the whole world could benefit from these western ideals of truth and representation.
But then, I don't think the venturesome exportation of western values, is such a benefit to the world, and this I would observe has in its way become violence under the same aegis of "Democracy". And come to it I think there is room for inherent criticism. Western ideals of truth themselves are not only hand in hand, but entangled with representation. It is not some thing about Platos forms, but pehaps indeed it was Socrates' opposition to the polis, which gave him forum to speak, then had him killed, and memorialized all in unison.
So eventually, as I have sometimes expressed in this forum at the shroomery, I have seen this as conditional, even a form of violence. Why indeed is western enlightenment, the burgeoning of knowledge and pursuit of truth, always needing in a way its forum, and polis? Why is it needing outwardly project its truth, or claim its truth, and what does this imply everything needs to be justified? Isn't nature okay the way it is? Are people over there so evil? The Western human being, I conclude, is simply extraverted in his notion of truth. It is both a virtue and a fault. And what about the simple form of suffering which can't be justified, that is grossly "of nature"? Through some cynicism to these outward forums, and through some suffering, I have become more open to recognizing the possibility and path to individual or personal realization. When indic people, for instance, Buddhists, say all is arising of suffering, I take it they mean that the world may, to an individual's personal or "psychological" discretion, be recognized as undifferentiated. And as I have observed, first of all is tbat this is a much larger idea than some notion held by Buddhists, or even all yogas and tantras of the Indian cultural landscape. What has been mentioned is the palpableness of a certain psychological experience that suggests a notion of unity which many have interpreted as metaphysical and cosmological. Could it be reasonable to say that nature, and nature itself is suffering, even if it relies on a certain "psychological" impression to be described? When it is said that all that arises is this same feeling this is a view to nature:
“Quote:
This world, Kaccana, is for the most part shackled by engagement, clinging, and adherence. But this one [with right view] does not become engaged and cling through that engagement and clinging, mental standpoint, adherence, underlying tendency; he does not take a stand about ‘my self.’ He has no perplexity or doubt that what arises is only suffering arising, what ceases is only suffering ceasing. His knowledge about this is independent of others. It is in this way, Kacca¯na, that there is right view.
Being the same thing, I hold that the differentiable phenomena of nature are interconnected in this way, if in a passive way, nonetheless seen in these developing threads. If there is of course the points of mitigation, where "something" arises, seemingly out of nothing (again though I would contrast my own position with the creation of ex nihilo views) it still is possible to see this all as one interconnected stream. If it is burden of argument, that would be asked of me, I would say that the priority of awareness is something which seems to come hand in hand, and entangled with the psychological experience of suffering.
One example of interconnectedness I first observe, in studying this is Karma. It does not so much a metaphysical or cosmological truth. In the Bhagavad Gita, of course, Krishna encourages Arjuna that death is okay, due to the reality of reincarnation. Krishna suggested that Arjuna should fight even his own brothers and cousins, in a battle which is right, for instance, when Arjuna felt that the violence of battle was wrong. However it becomes clear that what Karma, as a principle of arising consequences, means, is actually work, or action.
Hence I observe of an ethic, it is the same with a metaphysical idea of the nature. For example, just as modern westerners have a concept of force, that is mechanical, standing behind whatever levers and pullies or mathematical calculations, indic people have Karma, or work, which, if one point of difference could be made, it would be that it is not removed from reality in precisely this sense.
For example, I was watching a discussion by the Anglo American philosopher John Searle, where John raised his hand in the air and said, my consciousness did that. I would not doubt he is right, and unifying something there, but his precise point is not saying that those threads flow all from a stream of consequences, all the same interconnected stream to be observed. Rather, he is saying I personally, have power over a causal determinancy of physical events, or apparently I (the cartesian ego as consciousness) pop up in this. That is an important "thing" I wouldn't deny.
I think people can see things the way they want to, but I am bringing this up, as a point of contrast though. I do not think it necessarily has to be some mystical thing to pull the filter off which says you stand on one side of things, or "stand in" for the myths of creator like beings. I think that is a distinct notion that is in contradiction to coming up in and through things in actual involvement.
A better comparison in terms would be in the Greek notion physis, (Greek: φύσις), the organic and undifferentiated, "growth" or "becoming" of nature in itself, prior to dualism. I think the Greek people, in an unmediated way, contemplated nature, as well as what they created. They kept a sight of this, and indeed understood one in contradistinction to the other, but in clarity.
Physis or nature, is also the basis of the idea of modern physics, and hence, of a linear, or mechanical reality, which is calculated by abstract and removed principles and mathematical language. It is hard to suggest that this is an assumption, when determinism (what was once logical, or the practical part of our knowledge base that could be "determined") has been superimposed on physical nature as much as the human mind as though it were something inherent. Clearly this is projected by the way we attempt to know things in the modern world, but we take this as absolute. It is difficult to argue with absolutes.
If it seems quaint or strange to talk about an unmitigated organic stream of becoming, in relation to this, whether as the lucid and colorful greek way, or as the indic way, I am not sure what could be said. I would argue, not so much that this is a difference in cosmology or metaphysics. This is modern people stepping away from nature, and dwelling in nullity of the principles they came from.
My own argument here however, is not to a revival of Greek philosophy. Here it is of what Indian philosophers have suggested, that I would put in relative terms again, as how individual realization of the undifferentiated arising of suffering, potentially suggests observation of nature which is not ideally removed.
It is not a gurus trick or hoax to think of this, I observe. I think this is a practice, prior to being any claim, or idea to be justified in any form of expression. I think it makes enough sense for my own sake, and worth sharing that from the most palpable reality of arising suffering, epistemology, ontology, and perhaps even cosmological notions, come out of an archetypal way of being. No one needs to believe me. In terms it is what we would call the passive and quite subordinate, subjective domain of psychology which here speaks. That is reasonable too. It is acceptable to find a relative term for what is talked about. Perhaps it is ultimately something passive or quiescent that is sought?
I find these following words reconcile these relative issues quite well:
Quote:
The Dhamma is understood to be a path of practice in conduct, meditation, and understanding leading to the cessation of the fundamental suffering (dukkha) that underlies the human condition as lived in the round of rebirth (sam· sa¯ra). The texts repeatedly state that the Buddha taught only what is conducive to achieving that goal of cessation, or nirvana (Pali nibba¯na), and there are strong suggestions, as captured by the renowned undetermined questions, that purely theoretical speculations, especially those to do with certain metaphysical concerns about the ultimate nature of the world and one’s destiny, are both pointless and potentially misleading in the quest for nirvana.
Nevertheless, while it is true that the Buddha suspends all views regarding certain metaphysical questions, he is not an antimetaphysician: nothing in the texts suggests that metaphysical questions are completely meaningless, or that the Buddha denies the soundness of metaphysics per se. Instead, Buddhism teaches that to understand suffering, its rise, its cessation, and the path leading to its cessation is to see reality as it truly is.
Noa Ronkin
So, this is my contribution, to the prospect of non-violence. I think awareness is important. An ideal of non-doing, non-imposing, and non-resisting may be ideal, but it has to be practiced and worked for; or I believe, even as the Bhagavad Gita suggests, it has to be fought for. My thought is someone who wants peace has to find things all together to ride the crest down. The notion could be considered psychological, so the main thing to do for peace, I say is find personal psychological equilibrium.
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laughingdog
Stranger

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Re: Lets Get Practical [Re: hTx]
#22507835 - 11/11/15 01:56 AM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
hTx said: I am interested to hear yous guys thoughts on a practical matter..
What would be the single most effective way to reduce mass violence?
question is of course obviously self contradictory -- hence the funny replies it is NOT a "practical matter"
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zzripz
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Re: Lets Get Practical [Re: hTx]
#22508009 - 11/11/15 05:01 AM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
hTx said: I am interested to hear yous guys thoughts on a practical matter..
What would be the single most effective way to reduce mass violence?
Study how they do propaganda. Learn the tricks, see through them, keep doing it, go as deep as you can and share with others as you do
Think of the First World War, and how many young men were seduced into the whole propaganda of it, and this was before TV and radio!! They used art, posters, the music hall and of course extremely violent coercion and shaming
Make it your business to study propaganda/mind-control, and the actual doing of it will undermine it!
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nuentoter
conduit



Registered: 09/17/08
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Re: Lets Get Practical [Re: zzripz] 2
#22508018 - 11/11/15 05:20 AM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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World wide vegetarianism. Then the world wide acceptance and positive reinforcement of half an hour if quiet meditation/reflection time every morning. This would be encouraged by every employer and parent to help create mindfulness towards and from the general public.
--------------------
The geometry of us is no chance. We are antennae, we are tuning forks, we are receiver and transmitters of all energy. We are more than we know. - @entheolove "I found I could say things with color and shapes that I couldn't say any other way - things I had no words for" - Georgia O'Keefe I think the word is vagina
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: Lets Get Practical [Re: nuentoter] 1
#22508230 - 11/11/15 07:45 AM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
nuentoter said: Then the world wide acceptance and positive reinforcement of half an hour if quiet meditation/reflection time every morning. This would be encouraged by every employer and parent to help create mindfulness towards and from the general public.
Following on from this, how about dedicating 50% of school learning to academia, and then 50% to learning about being a creature with consciousness and emotions? Things like how to deal with your emotions, how to deal with hardships, how to learn your mind, how to support your fellow human, the nature of love, etc, etc?
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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CosmicJoke
happy mutant


Registered: 04/05/00
Posts: 10,848
Loc: Portland, OR
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Re: Lets Get Practical [Re: hTx]
#22508673 - 11/11/15 10:10 AM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
hTx said: I am interested to hear yous guys thoughts on a practical matter..
What would be the single most effective way to reduce mass violence?
I've said it before, massively reduce our military budget and invest it into education.
-------------------- Everything is better than it was the last time. I'm good. If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care. It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence. I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too. If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.
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