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OfflineP.Zappatecorum
Lophophilus
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Registered: 10/15/12
Posts: 2,094
Loc: Cactaceae
Last seen: 3 years, 5 months
Re: lamps and lighting [Re: Spanishfly]
    #22505730 - 11/10/15 03:52 PM (8 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Spanishfly said:
Quote:

DaveyJones6911 said:
for weed i was planning a windowsil grow with some autoflowering lowryder or something like that.
but i am considering setting up something with cfl lights or maybe LED lights.
but i think i will take that question to the weed forums.






Of course people use artificial lights for weed - there is only ONE reason for this - weed is ILLEGAL and you have to keep it out of sight.  The stuff grows far better under God´s sun.




You just don't know what you're talking about, Spanish.  Weed is legal in my state and people use grow lights in winter because the sun is not sufficient, even if you had a heated greenhouse. Did you grow plants when you were in the UK, or did you just start gardening when you moved south? 

I've lived in a mediterranean climate like you have and everything you say is true, for people living in tropical, subtropical and mediterranean climates in the lowest, near tropical temperate zones.  In cooler, northern temperate climates and polar regions, the sun is only better than lights for a couple months a year in summer.  The rest of the year you have to supplement or just grow straight under lights.

Winter sun here is not as strong as good grow lights, period, my plants etiolating in the window and not under lights is proof enough of that.


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Offlineinvitro

Registered: 05/03/13
Posts: 2,529
Last seen: 1 month, 21 days
Re: lamps and lighting [Re: invitro]
    #22505741 - 11/10/15 03:54 PM (8 years, 2 months ago)

Here is the deal, full sunlight will get you between 5000 and 15000 FC.  It's a wide range and there exceptions to the rule because of everyone has their own latitude which changes things a lot, that's why I was not giving number initially...  Cloudy light cuts that down by 50-70% (rough estimate- depends on how thick the clouds are).

Spanish fly I know all that about room lighting and seedling lighting, what you don't seem to understand is that 600 and 1000 MH or HPS are very much stronger and are the standard for flowering. 


Here's what probably happened, you tried flowering under t5s or t8s and compared that to outdoor, and your outdoor was better.  You need better lights to finish indoor, t8s just can't throw off enough light, not even close not even with a bank of them.  Depending on the sun especially in Scotland will land you sub-par results compared to a proper indoor grow.  In Scotland you might be giving the plants what the need in full sunlight in the peak of summer, maybe maybe.  The rest of the year your crippling your potential.

Even in the tropics, cloudy light below what you want, seriously.


Edited by invitro (11/10/15 03:57 PM)


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Offlineinvitro

Registered: 05/03/13
Posts: 2,529
Last seen: 1 month, 21 days
Re: lamps and lighting [Re: invitro]
    #22506224 - 11/10/15 05:33 PM (8 years, 2 months ago)

Even in the tropics you're still struggling with an outdoor grow because the daylight hours are limited.  At the equator you have about 12 hours of sunlight, well the first few hours and the last few hours the sun is low on the horizon so your only getting 7-8 hours of strong sunlight.  You pretty much need to supplement with lights wherever you are if you want to achieve your potential.  You can do OK outdoors, you can't beat supplemented light for the true potential of your plant.


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OfflineSpanishfly
$$$Rich€€€Bich£££
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Registered: 03/19/12
Posts: 1,851
Loc: Spain
Last seen: 6 years, 26 days
Re: lamps and lighting [Re: invitro]
    #22508004 - 11/11/15 04:55 AM (8 years, 2 months ago)

Let´s not get sidetracked into weed - there are lots of economic and other reasons people use lights for that all year.

All I can say to the OP as far as his cacti are concerned is do what the professionals do - the nurseries all over Europe who grow cacti for profit.

Put them in a greenhouse  or frame (doesn´t have to be expensive)and give them as much natural light as possible - a Google will show you that even a cloudy day is as good as any artificial light - it appears that those who want to shout loudest cannot back their comments up with any real data.  Keep them frost free with a small paraffin heater.  Keep them dry and let them rest and mature the soft growth of last summer.

That is the advice I have from all of the many renowned growers and expert authors of publications on cactus cultivation that I have acquired over the years - the Lambs, the Maces, Pilbeam, Anderson et al, dating from 1961. All UK based as it happens, and people who DEFINITELY know what they are talking about.  That is what I did when I grew in Scotland - and I NEVER suffered from any etiolation.

I have nothing further to add to this thread.


Edited by Spanishfly (11/11/15 05:29 AM)


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OfflineSpanishfly
$$$Rich€€€Bich£££
Male


Registered: 03/19/12
Posts: 1,851
Loc: Spain
Last seen: 6 years, 26 days
Re: lamps and lighting [Re: P.Zappatecorum]
    #22508007 - 11/11/15 04:58 AM (8 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

P.Zappatecorum said:

You just don't know what you're talking about, Spanish.  Did you grow plants when you were in the UK, or did you just start gardening when you moved south? 






Apparently you are so keen to insult me that you can´t actually be bothered to fully read my responses.


--------------------
I am currently BANNED from using Private Messages - so can anyone who wants to contact me do it via my Journal thread.  Link is https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/23831115

Maybe some mod or whatever might think this has now been long enough.


Edited by Spanishfly (11/11/15 05:30 AM)


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Offlineinvitro

Registered: 05/03/13
Posts: 2,529
Last seen: 1 month, 21 days
Re: lamps and lighting [Re: Spanishfly]
    #22508917 - 11/11/15 11:23 AM (8 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Spanishfly said:
Let´s not get sidetracked into weed - there are lots of economic and other reasons people use lights for that all year.

All I can say to the OP as far as his cacti are concerned is do what the professionals do - the nurseries all over Europe who grow cacti for profit.

Put them in a greenhouse  or frame (doesn´t have to be expensive)and give them as much natural light as possible - a Google will show you that even a cloudy day is as good as any artificial light - it appears that those who want to shout loudest cannot back their comments up with any real data.  Keep them frost free with a small paraffin heater.  Keep them dry and let them rest and mature the soft growth of last summer.

That is the advice I have from all of the many renowned growers and expert authors of publications on cactus cultivation that I have acquired over the years - the Lambs, the Maces, Pilbeam, Anderson et al, dating from 1961. All UK based as it happens, and people who DEFINITELY know what they are talking about.  That is what I did when I grew in Scotland - and I NEVER suffered from any etiolation.

I have nothing further to add to this thread.




You've got a tiger by the tail Spanishfly :lol:


I have actually tested out all kinds of conditions with a light meter and grown a fair number of plants, but since my first hand experience doesn't count for anything and some guy's book from 1961 does, lets ask google.

Metal halide maps developed in the 60s, HPS did not come onto the marker until 1964(wiki).  Technology has advanced greatly since then. 

Wiki: 1,000 - 2,000 lux Typical overcast day, midday

http://www.weedfarmer.com/cannabis/lighting_guide.php: 400W MH covering 1 square meter: 40000lux
Light intensity needed for optimal cannabis growth 25,000-50,000 lux.

So even a 400w MH is 20-40 times as strong as light on a cloudy day, at mid-day.


Conclusion: modern lamps (post 1961) are without a doubt much stronger than outdoor light

Thanks google.


Edited by invitro (11/13/15 05:59 AM)


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