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Shroomslip
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Registered: 11/25/12
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Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible?
#22494653 - 11/08/15 08:18 AM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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I'm a very good cook, I can do a lot of things people can't, but fried chicken has always been the bane of my existence. I know how to cheat and make it seem right, but I don't want to have to. Plenty of people can pull it off in frying alone. They don't need to pre-boil or bake after getting the skin golden brown. They can throw it in oil and cook it all the way through, and not burn the coating.
How? I've spent a while on perfecting getting the consistency in coating that you'd find in restaurants, and have it down. It only works on foods that cook quickly though. Basically the ones that don't really have to cook, or the ones who cook so fast it can't possibly be raw in the center once the outside is done.
Anyone have tips? I have a thermometer and I've cooked at lower than advertised temps, and I always get the same result. Outside is done before the inside. Throwing it in the oven to finish has only ever made it soggy and less than spectacular. Boiling it first and finishing in oil destroys the flavor. I finally have the ability to give it a Popeye's style coating (crunchy, flakey) but I cannot figure out how to get it fully cooked in the oil alone.
To be honest I don't even know why I'm asking. This is something I've been trying to get right for years and every single thing people have suggested does not work short of the cheating methods, and they all have their downsides that detract from the intended product. Guess I'm just hoping someone has some miracle piece of advice I'd never found on my own.
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With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way. I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today. Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear. I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear. You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline
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Fell
Wanderer



Registered: 04/11/15
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Re: Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible? [Re: Shroomslip]
#22494669 - 11/08/15 08:24 AM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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I do just fine with a nicely seasoned cast iron skillet and a low flame. It definitely takes some practice my friend but don't give up. It is so worth it when you finally get it down pat.
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Fell
Wanderer



Registered: 04/11/15
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Re: Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible? [Re: Fell]
#22494675 - 11/08/15 08:27 AM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Also depending on what mixture you are using to bread it will greatly affect wether the outside burns before it's ready. I generally use a nice light buttermilk batter and try not to season the batter too heavily that will make it burn much faster.
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Lumiz



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Re: Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible? [Re: Fell]
#22495539 - 11/08/15 12:44 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Check your oil temp a good temp is 350 but stay below 375, and use a light coating on the chicken I use seasoned flour and egg wash to coat mine. Also a seasoned cast iron skillet as Fell said is the best imo for frying chicken in.
practice makes perfect
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  Lurk
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ballsalsa
Universally Loathed and Reviled



Registered: 03/11/15
Posts: 20,867
Loc: Foreign Lands
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Re: Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible? [Re: Lumiz]
#22495553 - 11/08/15 12:48 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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drop the chicken in thwe oil for a bit, remove, pat down the excess oil, then batter and reintroduce to the fryer. done deal
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Like cannabis topics? Read my cannabis blog here
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Shroomism
Space Travellin



Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
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Re: Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible? [Re: Shroomslip] 1
#22497090 - 11/08/15 06:03 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Try Karaage with the double or triple fry It's probably my favorite fried chicken. Up there with a REALLY perfect southern style fried chicken.
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TheMaster
PATIENCE


Registered: 07/13/13
Posts: 705
Loc: Earth
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Re: Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible? [Re: Shroomism]
#22498735 - 11/09/15 12:22 AM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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I'm sure the copious amounts of beer helped, but karaage in Japan was probably the best fried chicken I've ever had.
Alton Brown has some good info for pan fried chicken.
 >
-------------------- "Live as if you were to die tomorrow. Learn as if you were to live forever." Mahatma Gandhi
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Shroomism
Space Travellin



Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
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Re: Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible? [Re: TheMaster]
#22498771 - 11/09/15 12:43 AM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Pretty much all the food I had in Japan was probably the best X I've ever had. Their food quality is just so much higher over there.. both in the raw ingredients and the preparation. The karaage I had in Japan was also the best fried chicken I've tasted in my life. This was one of them
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TheMaster
PATIENCE


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Re: Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible? [Re: Shroomism]
#22498802 - 11/09/15 01:06 AM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Nice, I was taking pictures of just about every meal. One place near my hotel had this sweet Japanese style tartar all over it. I think I prefer it with just lemon and maybe some ponzu for dipping, but it was still really good.
From left to right: cheese and fish roe sticks, karaage with tartar, and tonkatsu.
-------------------- "Live as if you were to die tomorrow. Learn as if you were to live forever." Mahatma Gandhi
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SillyPsy
Strangest

Registered: 08/18/15
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Re: Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible? [Re: TheMaster]
#22520115 - 11/13/15 09:28 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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A proper deep frying setup, with good temp management should work. A large enough mass of oil so that the temp doesn't drop too much when the food is placed in. Like a Dutch oven or a very thick walled pot. I use a Dutch oven, with an induction cooktop to adjust my temp to the 350--375f range. I've used propane burners on campouts too though, just takes more babysitting. Too low a temp, and the breading is soggy with oil, too high and it'll never cook inside without drying out/burning. The other posters were correct about breading as well. What is great for fried mushrooms might not work so well for chicken. I'm also a fan of the buttermilk. Lightly seasoned flour dredge, buttermilk, back into the flour then fry.
Do you let it rest after the fryer?
Is your oven a convection oven? Cooking in resturants, those pieces that were a little on the large side, after they've reached max brownage in the fryer,would finish in a 450-500f convy oven. If your oven isn't convection maybe try placing them on the bottom oven rack with the broiler on. The moisture is what makes them soggy. Keeping the oven door cracked with the broiler on would prob help too if using a standard conduction oven.
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Shroomslip
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Re: Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible? [Re: SillyPsy]
#22520228 - 11/13/15 09:48 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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The coating I use on almost all fried foods (minus fish) is basically the same. Dredge, then into some liquid (buttermilk, egg+milk or water depending on what I have and feel like doing at the time) and then into flour again. Let them rest a bit to set and then into oil. I almost never cook above 350 degrees, in the event I know I'm going to get an instant and significant temperature drop, I may start at 365 or so.
The only thing I really have problem with is whole chicken pieces, breasts, thighs, legs etc.. Boneless is no problem at all. I have a gas stove. I've seen people cook perfectly fried chicken with the set up I have and using my same methods plenty of times. I just want classic southern style fried chicken without having to pre or post cook it in the oven, I know it's possible, like I said I've seen it done enough times, it bugs me that I can't do this. Anything I've put my mind towards cooking and getting right, I have. Fried chicken is something I have never been able to pull off and I'm not sure why. I have tried many variables and I just can't seem to get it to work 
It's taken me quite a while to get the restaurant style coating of fried foods down (something else I've spent a lot of time and experimentation on but only over the past few months) and now that I have, I want to revisit fried chicken. It's not really about the end product for me, which is why I don't want to "cheat". It's about being able to do it. Cooking is a life long hobby of mine and like any hobby, it's not really about the finished product, it's about mastering the skill that took to create it in the first place.
I'm obviously doing something wrong, I just don't know what. I've played with coating, rest times, temp control, cookware, oil type, oil amount among others I can't think of off the top of my head. At this point the only thing I can even think of to do is somehow find significantly smaller chicken pieces, but then that goes back to me knowing it's possible and having seen it done already. That would just be another cheat method.
I dunno what else to do.
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With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way. I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today. Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear. I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear. You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline
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Cherub
Stranger


Registered: 11/03/15
Posts: 72
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Re: Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible? [Re: Shroomslip]
#22520547 - 11/13/15 10:39 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Don't know if you've tried this, but I use a mason jar to pound the chicken breasts so they are all the same thickness and a little broken down. If they are too thick, it ends up having a texture like boots after I'm through with it, because it takes so long to cook the middle.
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SillyPsy
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Re: Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible? [Re: Cherub]
#22525982 - 11/15/15 01:08 AM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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I was going to suggest a brine. After playing around on Google I stumbled on this site. The science sounds good, might give it a look. I know vodka makes a killer tempura batter....
http://www.seriouseats.com/2015/07/four-secrets-for-better-fried-chicken.html
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Shroomslip
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Re: Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible? [Re: SillyPsy]
#22526012 - 11/15/15 01:24 AM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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I already add liquid to my dredging mixture, that was actually the breakthrough I had on replicating the type of coating you find in restaurants. I've even experimented with a few different processes to see which produces the best end product. I've added liquid, mixed it around a bit and turned it out on a counter and used a rolling pin to get all the wet stuff flat, then "chopped" it up a good bit. I've tried just spraying tiny droplets and mixing and a very light stream straight from the faucet while moving the bowl in a circular pattern. The last one works best, it's easier than the rolling pin method. Once enough water is added you just work it with your hands like you're crushing dried herbs or something and causing flat shreds to fall back in.
I haven't brined it, even though I do regularly brine turkeys and whole chickens that will get roasted. I'm not really having a problem with dry meat, because it's not getting cooked all the way through. I don't know how brining could help my situation, but if anyone knows it could, I'll give it a shot..
The double frying might work, I'm really not sure. The outside will cool a lot quicker than the inside and it will absorb some moisture giving more time for the outside to cook before burning. Would probably rely on a very narrow time table though. I imagine that if the entire thing cools, you're back to square 1. At least that's how it would relate to my issue and why I would be trying it.
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With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way. I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today. Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear. I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear. You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline
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Shroomism
Space Travellin



Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
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Re: Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible? [Re: Shroomslip]
#22534038 - 11/16/15 06:26 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Seriously though, you should try the potato flour coating like karaage.. and the double fry. I mean just like... try different stuff.
You say you've been using basically the same coating on all fried foods.. but you aren't satisfied with how it always turns out. Well you know how they say the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.
Or try southern stylez
I mean there's like a billion ways to season & fry chicken But seriously, try karaage.
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Shroomslip
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Re: Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible? [Re: Shroomism]
#22534107 - 11/16/15 06:36 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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I'm satisfied with the coating, the only problem is chicken being undone. When I use it to make chicken strips or popcorn chicken, it's fine. I mean I'm going to try what you posted, but not as a solution to fried chicken, just because I like to try new things and had never heard of it before.
I just wanted to try and figure out why I have such an issue with traditional southern fried chicken that goes into the oil and only cooks in oil, when plenty of people seem to be able to do it. Was hoping maybe there was some variable I was missing or someone had struggled forever and found out some tip that let them do it.
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With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way. I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today. Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear. I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear. You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline
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Shroomism
Space Travellin



Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
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Re: Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible? [Re: Shroomslip]
#22538994 - 11/17/15 07:39 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Fry for a couple minutes, remove, let it chill and dry a bit.. fry again. It's ok if you let it cool. When done right the double/triple fry usually produces the crispest chicken in my experience. You shouldn't have to worry about undone chicken that way. I'd be more concerned with overcooking, but it's easily avoided
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allreadyused
The Liquor



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Re: Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible? [Re: Shroomism]
#22547154 - 11/19/15 02:46 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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If you're having problems with burning it could be the oil used. If it's been used a few times it can loose it's viscosity and burn the food. I always deep fry in peanut oil because it has a pretty high smoke point and you can get a few fry's out of it before it's bad. If I pan fry sometimes I'll use shortening. Bone in chicken breasts can cook unevenly; I'll debone them or quarter them before before frying. The other trick too is to make sure whatever you drop in the oil has been out of the cold long enough to come up to room temperature. I like to soak chicken in butter milk overnight and just use a simple dredge of ap flour and corn meal. Adding spices to the dredge can also cause it to burn. If you want to season put it on under the dredge. Another cheat you can use it to parcook the chicken in the oven and just put it in the oil towards the end. The reason restaurant fried chicken always tastes so good and is cooked perfectly is because most fried chicken places use pressure fryers.
-------------------- Everything I say is for entertainment. Fuck the ASPCA
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HelpHub
I'm not THAT strange!

Registered: 07/18/15
Posts: 60
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Re: Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible? [Re: allreadyused]
#22555354 - 11/21/15 12:36 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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If I was having the problems you describe I would replace my thermometer or see if I can calibrate the one I'm using. Never a bad idea to have two thermometers though...
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Shroomslip
Architekt



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Re: Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible? [Re: HelpHub]
#22556606 - 11/21/15 05:41 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Yeah I know I need a new one, it's never been perfect but for most purposes it's done reasonably well. I just can't afford a decent one right now (it's digital). I got this specific one because it's wired and the probe can put in the oven, so for like roasting a turkey or whatever I don't have to keep opening the oven to check if I'm in the right range.
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With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way. I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today. Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear. I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear. You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline
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HelpHub
I'm not THAT strange!

Registered: 07/18/15
Posts: 60
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Re: Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible? [Re: Shroomslip]
#22560095 - 11/22/15 03:16 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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I just got a Thermapen. I've wanted one for years but they're $100. They just put out their newest version so the older one I was able to score on for $70.
Super accurate and super quick reading. Glad I finally got one...
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Shroomslip
Architekt



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Re: Fried chicken.. Why do I find it impossible? [Re: HelpHub]
#22560405 - 11/22/15 04:20 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Well, I just gone done coating up all my chicken and letting it rest, after making sure to leave it out for a good hour. I'm going to attempt fried chicken again, don't remember the last time I tried. I got a whole chicken and cut it up, tried to find the smallest one I could. The thighs and legs seem small enough to get done, kinda worried about the breasts, they're huge.
Instead of worrying about keeping the temp at the usual range I aim for, I'm going to go a bit lower so I can cook it for longer periods. Start with the smallest pieces first and see how done they get, if all of it gets done right, I'll try one breast traditional way and see how done it gets, if it's not done, I'll try the double/triple fry thing and then can compare the results. If the smallest pieces don't get done right, I'll start the multiple frying on those.
I don't have anything but a very small cast iron skillet. I've wanted a good sized dutch oven for a while, but they're expensive. First thing I'm doing differently this time is using a much larger pot and more oil. It's not quite cast iron heavy, but it's not thin Walmart stuff either. Either way wish me luck.
Well I was able to do the smaller pieces and the medium sized ones with multiple frying. The breasts were simply just too big, should've deboned them, but I wanted that authenticity. Having to finish them in the oven. At least I know I can do thighs, legs and wings (never really had a problem with wings though).
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With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way. I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today. Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear. I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear. You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline
Edited by Shroomslip (11/22/15 05:49 PM)
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