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InvisibleMr.GuessWork
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Re: Head of House "Science" Committee Appointed Evolution Denier to Head Science Investigations [Re: Srirachi] * 1
    #22465767 - 11/02/15 08:23 AM (8 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Srirachi said:
Science is a modern religion that requires far more faith than any of the others, and is full of more deluded zealots than all the others combined.




That is a pretty big stretch. Are you really tying to compare a dude that works at NASA with the combination of a Muslim extremest suicide bomber, a christian scientist who lets his kid die from pneumonia, AND a guy who insists that there's not a rock on the planet that's older than a few thousand years? It's a lot harder to be deluded when you admit that you might be wrong.


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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: Head of House [Re: Turtletotem] * 1
    #22465866 - 11/02/15 09:05 AM (8 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Turtletotem said:
Take away all the politics, the grandstanding, the religious influences and the your-side-my-side mentality, and what it boils down to is that an incompetent has been put in a place he has no business being.

Or is that just me?





so it's like the IPCC and the global warming alarmists, reject the things you
choose not to believe in because it doesnt fit your personal views, how can you
condemn the same thing you support


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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: Head of House "Science" Committee Appointed Evolution Denier to Head Science Investigations [Re: Mr.GuessWork] * 2
    #22465871 - 11/02/15 09:08 AM (8 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Mr.GuessWork said:
Quote:

Srirachi said:
Science is a modern religion that requires far more faith than any of the others, and is full of more deluded zealots than all the others combined.




That is a pretty big stretch. Are you really tying to compare a dude that works at NASA with the combination of a Muslim extremest suicide bomber, a christian scientist who lets his kid die from pneumonia, AND a guy who insists that there's not a rock on the planet that's older than a few thousand years? It's a lot harder to be deluded when you admit that you might be wrong.





have you met the true believers of science, they're just like the religious
zealots, global warming is real, there's a scientific consensus but GMOs cause
cancer because one fraud published a paper claiming it does even though it goes
against this same scientific consensus


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Offlinemakaveli8x8
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Re: Head of House "Science" Committee Appointed Evolution Denier to Head Science Investigations [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #22466140 - 11/02/15 10:43 AM (8 years, 2 months ago)

sounds alot like religion, where alot of the followers choose to only conform to the rules they feel are important to them while ignoring alot of the other rules.

at the end of the day everything is flawed, science flat out is not better than religion and vice versa,  thats why everyone just needs to fuck off and everyone just mind their own business.  Problem is every 'cult following' has to try and make their 'group' sound better.  and its like i said, there's room for both, just because the guy has a religion doesn't mean he doesn't know what science is, doesn't mean he isn't fit for the job.  Until science proves beyond a shadow of a doubt how the universe was created, where all the shit came from, and where everything goes, its all a guess, and 'a god' which could just be a highly evolved being or whatever/ having something to do with it is just as possible as any other explanation.

but your examples of sarcasm or whatever, are good examples of science holding the world back, not that i agree with gmo's, or your sarcasm on global warming, but it works to prove the point when you believe in science so religiously nothing gets done because your constantly waiting for some piece of paper from the science community, for a politician to wipe his ass with


--------------------
We were sent to hell for eternity :hellfire: Ø:omgawesome:h®
We play on earth to pass the time :foreheadslap:

Over-population the root of all Evil-brings the Elites Closer to the gates.


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Invisiblemillzy
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Re: Head of House "Science" Committee Appointed Evolution Denier to Head Science Investigations [Re: makaveli8x8]
    #22466164 - 11/02/15 10:50 AM (8 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

makaveli8x8 said:
sounds alot like religion, where alot of the followers choose to only conform to the rules they feel are important to them while ignoring alot of the other rules.

at the end of the day everything is flawed, science flat out is not better than religion and vice versa,  thats why everyone just needs to fuck off and everyone just mind their own business.  Problem is every 'cult following' has to try and make their 'group' sound better.  and its like i said, there's room for both, just because the guy has a religion doesn't mean he doesn't know what science is, doesn't mean he isn't fit for the job.  Until science proves beyond a shadow of a doubt how the universe was created, where all the shit came from, and where everything goes, its all a guess, and 'a god' which could just be a highly evolved being or whatever/ having something to do with it is just as possible as any other explanation.

but your examples of sarcasm or whatever, are good examples of science holding the world back, not that i agree with gmo's, or your sarcasm on global warming, but it works to prove the point when you believe in science so religiously nothing gets done because your constantly waiting for some piece of paper from the science community, for a politician to wipe his ass with




both science and religion are mistaken in criticizing the other by the standards of their own side. but that doesn't invalidate either pursuit. different games with different goals.

broun's appointment is a travesty.


--------------------
I'm up to my ears in unwritten words. - J.D. Salinger


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OfflineTurtletotem
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Re: Head of House [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #22466178 - 11/02/15 10:53 AM (8 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
Quote:

Turtletotem said:
Take away all the politics, the grandstanding, the religious influences and the your-side-my-side mentality, and what it boils down to is that an incompetent has been put in a place he has no business being.

Or is that just me?





so it's like the IPCC and the global warming alarmists, reject the things you
choose not to believe in because it doesnt fit your personal views, how can you
condemn the same thing you support




I support what now?
You trying to pull my leg here, Pris?


--------------------


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Offlinemakaveli8x8
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Re: Head of House "Science" Committee Appointed Evolution Denier to Head Science Investigations [Re: millzy]
    #22466189 - 11/02/15 10:56 AM (8 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

millzy said:
Quote:

makaveli8x8 said:
sounds alot like religion, where alot of the followers choose to only conform to the rules they feel are important to them while ignoring alot of the other rules.

at the end of the day everything is flawed, science flat out is not better than religion and vice versa,  thats why everyone just needs to fuck off and everyone just mind their own business.  Problem is every 'cult following' has to try and make their 'group' sound better.  and its like i said, there's room for both, just because the guy has a religion doesn't mean he doesn't know what science is, doesn't mean he isn't fit for the job.  Until science proves beyond a shadow of a doubt how the universe was created, where all the shit came from, and where everything goes, its all a guess, and 'a god' which could just be a highly evolved being or whatever/ having something to do with it is just as possible as any other explanation.

but your examples of sarcasm or whatever, are good examples of science holding the world back, not that i agree with gmo's, or your sarcasm on global warming, but it works to prove the point when you believe in science so religiously nothing gets done because your constantly waiting for some piece of paper from the science community, for a politician to wipe his ass with




both science and religion are mistaken in criticizing the other by the standards of their own side. but that doesn't invalidate either pursuit. different games with different goals.

broun's appointment is a travesty.




so your saying a person can't believe in science and religion?  because thats pretty much what i do, i think both are wrong and both are right in certain ways, its almost like your saying science can't prove that a god exists one day?  which would be false, someone could have created the universe, one theory is simulation theory


--------------------
We were sent to hell for eternity :hellfire: Ø:omgawesome:h®
We play on earth to pass the time :foreheadslap:

Over-population the root of all Evil-brings the Elites Closer to the gates.


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OfflineTurtletotem
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Re: Head of House "Science" Committee Appointed Evolution Denier to Head Science Investigations [Re: makaveli8x8]
    #22466214 - 11/02/15 11:01 AM (8 years, 2 months ago)

Science and religion should feed eachother instead of this tribal bullshit but whatever.


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Invisiblemillzy
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Re: Head of House "Science" Committee Appointed Evolution Denier to Head Science Investigations [Re: makaveli8x8]
    #22466257 - 11/02/15 11:14 AM (8 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

makaveli8x8 said:

so your saying a person can't believe in science and religion?  because thats pretty much what i do, i think both are wrong and both are right in certain ways, its almost like your saying science can't prove that a god exists one day?  which would be false, someone could have created the universe, one theory is simulation theory




i'm saying that each field serves its own purpose and does not necessarily contradict the other, and that the assumption that the two are incompatible is founded on ignorance and ideological blindness.

some of our greatest scientists have been devoutly religious. some of our first scientists were priests, e.g. descartes. the cartesian view, in spite of, or perhaps especially because of its flaws laid the initial groundwork for the scientific method. this set the stage for locke, berkely, newton, kant etc. early modern philosophy is generally rooted in religion.

i don't really know how to respond to your comment about whether or not science can prove god exists. that really depends on how you define the term and what would count for evidence. and it's really all beside the point because you're taking a scientific approach to god, which is a mistaken point of view. see above.


--------------------
I'm up to my ears in unwritten words. - J.D. Salinger


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InvisibleMr.GuessWork
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Re: Head of House "Science" Committee Appointed Evolution Denier to Head Science Investigations [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #22466290 - 11/02/15 11:25 AM (8 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
Quote:

Mr.GuessWork said:
Quote:

Srirachi said:
Science is a modern religion that requires far more faith than any of the others, and is full of more deluded zealots than all the others combined.




That is a pretty big stretch. Are you really tying to compare a dude that works at NASA with the combination of a Muslim extremest suicide bomber, a christian scientist who lets his kid die from pneumonia, AND a guy who insists that there's not a rock on the planet that's older than a few thousand years? It's a lot harder to be deluded when you admit that you might be wrong.





have you met the true believers of science, they're just like the religious
zealots, global warming is real, there's a scientific consensus but GMOs cause
cancer because one fraud published a paper claiming it does even though it goes
against this same scientific consensus




Consensus is pretty rare in the new parts of science. The vast majority of people who study global warming stuff agree that the predictions have merit (I don't know much about it personally, but I trust them over the bible-thumping nay-sayers). On the other hand, one guy publishing a paper about GMOs and cancer doesn't count as science. Science requires a community so people can critically exam evidence and discuss it with other people who have informed opinions.

I have no idea what you mean by "true believers in science". Maybe you're talking about crazy people who believe in some sort of psuedoscientific religious thing, or maybe you're talking about people who make scientific claims like they're infallible? People like to use sciencey sounding concepts when they're pitching bullshit too because it has an air of credibility, and most people are too scared to risk admitting that they're wrong. It's a common propaganda technique too. None of that stuff is science though. Anybody who doesn't believe in science is going to have some serious trouble explaining the world around them since pretty much everything we've built is based in some sort of science.


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Offlinemakaveli8x8
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Re: Head of House "Science" Committee Appointed Evolution Denier to Head Science Investigations [Re: Mr.GuessWork]
    #22466323 - 11/02/15 11:38 AM (8 years, 2 months ago)

but wait, i thought science claimed every invention, including ones before science was created, which includes single people cracked out in their garages discovering shit very similar to the one guy publishing a paper that you claim isn't science now.  you science people always want the best of both worlds, you claim all the inventions, pretend religion is idiotic and those following it apparently are to stupid to know what science is.  Say religion didn't help create anything, and then claim all of sciences failures weren't really science to begin with:obama:  must be nice to claim everything and denie anything, all the while pretending science isn't as bad as religion


--------------------
We were sent to hell for eternity :hellfire: Ø:omgawesome:h®
We play on earth to pass the time :foreheadslap:

Over-population the root of all Evil-brings the Elites Closer to the gates.


Edited by makaveli8x8 (11/02/15 11:49 AM)


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OfflineTurtletotem
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Re: Head of House "Science" Committee Appointed Evolution Denier to Head Science Investigations [Re: makaveli8x8]
    #22466385 - 11/02/15 11:53 AM (8 years, 2 months ago)

You're mixing up science and scientism, tho.
One comes from natural philosophy and religious learning and has developed a certain set of rules and assumptions that make the whole thing work.

The other is some kind of new-age religion where every member denies it is.

Weird.


--------------------


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InvisibleMr.GuessWork
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Re: Head of House "Science" Committee Appointed Evolution Denier to Head Science Investigations [Re: makaveli8x8] * 1
    #22466479 - 11/02/15 12:19 PM (8 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

makaveli8x8 said:
but wait, i thought science claimed every invention, including ones before science was created, which includes single people cracked out in their garages discovering shit very similar to the one guy publishing a paper that you claim isn't science now.  you science people always want the best of both worlds, you claim all the inventions, pretend religion is idiotic and didn't help create anything, and then claim all of sciences failures weren't really science to begin with:obama:




Nobody said that all inventions were scientific, but most of what you see around you in everyday life has it's roots in some kind of scientific effort. Also, you're thinking biblically again. Science wasn't created; it gradually evolved from human attempts to explain the world. Lots of those early attempts were mystical explanations that relied on things like anthropomorphism and other nice human relatable explanations, but gradually we got better at telling stories that made sense, and eventually we decided it was important that we be able to test our stories to see if they were just bullshit or not. There was a lot of philosophical work that was put into our thinking to make it more useful than pointing the finger at the sky and blaming shit on an all-powerful all-knowing dude that made us. Religious myths don't have that same frame work.

As to you other point, my original point was that one person's claim doe not count as science. That claim has to undergo a critical review process before it's accepted. That's the whole point of publication: to figure out which claims are worth investigating and taking seriously, and to figure out which claims are going to be ignored. I highly doubt that anybody ever cracked out a paper in their garage linking something as complex and poorly understood as GMO foods to something else as complex and poorly understood as cancer. That kind of research is really hard to do with with large numbers of subjects, hundreds millions of dollars in funding, and with many groups of scientists studying the question from different angles. Sometimes people discover a new physics application or effect in their garages, but large scale medical research does not happen in a person's garage. And even when somebody does discover something in their garage, they introduce it to other scientists to check out before idiots start telling ghost stories about what happened. The point of doing science is to discover something useful (or something that leads to something useful), and ghost stories make that harder than it has to be. That's one of the reasons that there needs to be a separation between faith and reason. You can't have people running around yelling bullshit and crying wolf to people who depend on the well tested and well examined information.


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Offlinemakaveli8x8
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Re: Head of House "Science" Committee Appointed Evolution Denier to Head Science Investigations [Re: Mr.GuessWork] * 1
    #22466494 - 11/02/15 12:25 PM (8 years, 2 months ago)

actually they did say that which is why ive been saying it for 5 pages straight and only just now does someone try to say otherwise because again you want the best of both worlds, it was fine earlier because it suited peoples points in discrediting religion, now when it discredits science....best of both worlds.

w/e im done with this thread, had all the fun its gunna provide since koods knew better than to commit:cookiemonster:


--------------------
We were sent to hell for eternity :hellfire: Ø:omgawesome:h®
We play on earth to pass the time :foreheadslap:

Over-population the root of all Evil-brings the Elites Closer to the gates.


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InvisibleMr.GuessWork
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Re: Head of House "Science" Committee Appointed Evolution Denier to Head Science Investigations [Re: makaveli8x8] * 1
    #22466501 - 11/02/15 12:27 PM (8 years, 2 months ago)

They always get frustrated and leave before they learn anything.:sad:


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Offlinemakaveli8x8
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Re: Head of House "Science" Committee Appointed Evolution Denier to Head Science Investigations [Re: Mr.GuessWork] * 1
    #22466507 - 11/02/15 12:30 PM (8 years, 2 months ago)

sorry i meant to post this earlier, but forgot had it open in a seperate tab

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/10/29/pope-francis-may-believe-in-evolution-but-42-percent-of-americans-do-not/

ill leave with that


--------------------
We were sent to hell for eternity :hellfire: Ø:omgawesome:h®
We play on earth to pass the time :foreheadslap:

Over-population the root of all Evil-brings the Elites Closer to the gates.


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Offlineendogenous
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Re: Head of House "Science" Committee Appointed Evolution Denier to Head Science Investigations [Re: makaveli8x8] * 1
    #22467559 - 11/02/15 05:33 PM (8 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

makaveli8x8 said:
sounds alot like religion, where alot of the followers choose to only conform to the rules they feel are important to them while ignoring alot of the other rules.



Hey -- if you choose to disbelieve what science says - that's your business.

Personally, I don't want a baboon using naptha to extract Acacia in my house. If you have good fire insurance -- then go for it.


--------------------
The Day of the Lord has come like a thief in the night. -- It is there but no one knows it.


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Offlineendogenous
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Re: Head of House "Science" Committee Appointed Evolution Denier to Head Science Investigations [Re: endogenous]
    #22467645 - 11/02/15 05:50 PM (8 years, 2 months ago)

Ancient 'Cultic' Temple, 10,000-Year-Old Building Discovered Outside Jerusalem -- http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/11/26/ancient-cultic-temple-jerusalem_n_4344246.html

Ooops -- sorry archaeologists -- according to the US Investigations Committee on Science - this structure couldn't exist since it's older than 9000 years.

(From http://listverse.com/2013/11/15/10-oldest-artifacts-of-their-type-ever-found/)
The earliest example of people displaying decoration for its own sake is from 100,000 years ago. -- Nope.

the oldest evidence we have of humans using containers was not for carrying water or food, but for mixing paint around 100,000 years ago. -- wrong

Scientists in Spain, however, have found a map that dates back to 14,000 years ago. Too bad -- couldn't exist.

The oldest evidence of alcohol comes from central China and is 9,000 years old. -- Well that makes sense -- the earth was founded by a bunch of drunkards.

Archaeologists have discovered a row of 12 pits which appear to reflect the phases of the Moon over the course of lunar months. The calendar is 10,000 years old, twice the age of the earliest sophisticated calendars from the Near East. -- Well 2012 didn't happen either.


Sibudu Cave in South Africa is an archaeological treasure trove with the earliest examples of at least three different uses of technology. The remnants of civilization in the cave stretch back over 77,000 years, and include the oldest needle, the oldest bedding, and one of the earliest ever bone arrowheads
-- Must be from aliens who came to the earth right?


--------------------
The Day of the Lord has come like a thief in the night. -- It is there but no one knows it.


Edited by endogenous (11/02/15 06:14 PM)


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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: Head of House "Science" Committee Appointed Evolution Denier to Head Science Investigations [Re: Mr.GuessWork] * 1
    #22470068 - 11/03/15 08:51 AM (8 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Mr.GuessWork said:
Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
Quote:

Mr.GuessWork said:
Quote:

Srirachi said:
Science is a modern religion that requires far more faith than any of the others, and is full of more deluded zealots than all the others combined.




That is a pretty big stretch. Are you really tying to compare a dude that works at NASA with the combination of a Muslim extremest suicide bomber, a christian scientist who lets his kid die from pneumonia, AND a guy who insists that there's not a rock on the planet that's older than a few thousand years? It's a lot harder to be deluded when you admit that you might be wrong.





have you met the true believers of science, they're just like the religious
zealots, global warming is real, there's a scientific consensus but GMOs cause
cancer because one fraud published a paper claiming it does even though it goes
against this same scientific consensus




Consensus is pretty rare in the new parts of science. The vast majority of people who study global warming stuff agree that the predictions have merit (I don't know much about it personally, but I trust them over the bible-thumping nay-sayers). On the other hand, one guy publishing a paper about GMOs and cancer doesn't count as science. Science requires a community so people can critically exam evidence and discuss it with other people who have informed opinions.




there's no consensus on global warming either, the original sample size was
10,000 publishing climate scientists but somehow only 79 were used to make a
'consensus' that global warming is caused by man. a pretty small consensus

Quote:

I have no idea what you mean by "true believers in science".




because science has become a religion to many regardless of what you choose to believe


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