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Offlinejimbob989
Psilocybernaut
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Registered: 10/12/15
Posts: 79
Last seen: 6 years, 8 months
Any Biologists in the house? Amateur or not.
    #22433991 - 10/25/15 10:11 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

I am studying biology at university, and already completed a diploma in horticulture, and my specialty at college and then in the workplace was symbiotic organisms.

I was thinking that we could investigate what sorts of organisms would actually be beneficial or even neutral-exclusive (where it doesn't harm the mushroom mycelia but it would compete with "contams")

My gut feeling is that it would be easy as pie to figure out a way to do this for casings and probably even for the bulk sub, but I suspect that there will be very few things which are beneficial during the inital spore germination and early growth, and sadly that is the area where we most worry about contams.

So I may ask a professor about doing a project on this, though I imagine I will have to use a non Psilocybe species for the tests if it's for school.

Anyway, anyone have any candidates? I'm thinking that phages would be too expensive to produce, and besides they tend to be very specific. Bacteria probably fit the bill better than another fungi, since the other fungus would presumably both compete more directly, and anyway suffer from the same weaknesses as our crop species. So a bacteria, which would rapidly infiltrate the substrate faster than a fungus, exclude trich, b.sub, and other common bacterial contams, and then hopefully be consumed by the crop species.


--------------------
First Cyan (indeed first wild Psilocybe of any kind) that I ever did find! Oddly enough, she was alone, in a fairly dark coloured mix of compost and soil, where as every other cluster since was in light/alder type chips!





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Invisiblemicro
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Re: Any Biologists in the house? Amateur or not. [Re: jimbob989] * 1
    #22434027 - 10/25/15 10:25 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Sure!

I *was* in molbio (infectious disease research) but that was over ten years ago.

Not sure if that counts XD

I was actually reading about Indole-3-Acetic-Acid earlier today and got a good one for ya:

Quote:

From: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indole-3-acetic_acid#Fungal_symbiosis
Fungal symbiosis

Fungi can form a fungal mantle around roots of perennial plants called ectomycorrhiza. a fungus specific to spruce called Tricholoma vaccinum was shown to produce IAA from tryptophan and excrete it from its hyphae. This induced branching in cultures, and enhanced Hartig net formation. The fungus uses a multidrug and toxic extrusion (MATE) transporter Mte1.[14] Research into IAA-producing fungi to promote plant growth and protection in sustainable agriculture is underway.[15]







Good luck!


-- micro


--------------------
Any research paper or book for free
(Avatar is Maxxy, a character by Mizzyam, RIP)


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Offlinefalcon
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Re: Any Biologists in the house? Amateur or not. [Re: jimbob989]
    #22436712 - 10/26/15 04:28 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

I love this kind of stuff, there's been some people on this site that have done some of this.

In the commercial mushroom industry there's a lot or research that's already been done on this and a lot of history, but it's mostly with Phase II Composting. The people who grow Agaricus bisporus use a technique that creates a selective media that creates a substrate that inhibits the growth of organisms that competes with contaminates Phase II Composting and Actinomycetes .

There's some people who've done some playing around on this site with lactic acid fermentation with grains on this site,http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/8729280

Tangential, Pseudomonas putida helps  primordia formation of Agaricus bisporus


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Offlinejimbob989
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Registered: 10/12/15
Posts: 79
Last seen: 6 years, 8 months
Re: Any Biologists in the house? Amateur or not. [Re: falcon]
    #22441172 - 10/27/15 05:36 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Yeah, I worked extensively with ecto and endo mycorrhizae. In fact, I saved my organic vegetable greenhouse company TRUCKLOADS of money by innoc our plants during seeding (I was head of propagation). They had tried everything in the book to fight contam (because as organic producers they can't use almost any fungicides/pesticides/herbicides), and I (taking my knowledge from my years of breeding and growing cannabis (with license) for myself (nerve damage) and my dad (multiple sclerosis), knowing that a good innoc (I used a blend of many different bacterial and fungal symbiotes) would help, but it reduced our damp-off rate, increased growth rate, and reduced fertilizer costs.

As far as the Phase II, yes I have been to large scale A.Bisporus grows (there are a lot near me it's a big industry), and first of all, for a cube grower it was amazing to see endless rows of shroom beds! Secondly, sadly where I live now the idea of doing any composting (I don't even have a garden :frown: ) is out of the question.

I'm still gunna think on it, and maybe even expand my thoughts beyond biological symbiotes to novel materials and chemistry.


--------------------
First Cyan (indeed first wild Psilocybe of any kind) that I ever did find! Oddly enough, she was alone, in a fairly dark coloured mix of compost and soil, where as every other cluster since was in light/alder type chips!





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Offlinefalcon
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Re: Any Biologists in the house? Amateur or not. [Re: jimbob989]
    #22441454 - 10/27/15 06:38 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

I've been thinking about it some, and a change of conditions might let one fungus take aothers place in a substrate.


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Invisiblemicro
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Re: Any Biologists in the house? Amateur or not. [Re: falcon]
    #22441486 - 10/27/15 06:43 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

I've had something similar in the back of my mind.

I wonder if laccases and other proteins/hormones from one species can induce pinning in another.

IIRC, they weren't all that much different, looking at a BLAST query.


--------------------
Any research paper or book for free
(Avatar is Maxxy, a character by Mizzyam, RIP)


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Invisiblewoodrow
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Registered: 03/17/03
Posts: 142
Re: Any Biologists in the house? Amateur or not. [Re: jimbob989]
    #22443330 - 10/28/15 03:58 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

The red yeasts, Rhodotorula sp. have been observed to stimulate spore germination in mushies but I forget where read that. I suspect there are a lot of other organisms that can do the same.


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Invisiblemicro
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Re: Any Biologists in the house? Amateur or not. [Re: woodrow]
    #22443387 - 10/28/15 05:18 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Hmm, you're right! That *does* sound familiar.

Stamets, perhaps?

This could be something to try in harder-to-fruit species, being careful to separate them enough they won't compete in each other's space. It is possible when one fruits the laccases, etc. will help trigger the fruiting response in the other. That is just a guess, of course.


--------------------
Any research paper or book for free
(Avatar is Maxxy, a character by Mizzyam, RIP)


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