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OfflineIlift
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How to find solace after the death of a loved one as an Atheist
    #22412248 - 10/21/15 04:09 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

My grandmother died a few months ago and whilst I was profoundly upset at the time, the sinking weight of reality that she is gone is only really setting in and its very unpleasant. Obviously it is a part of life that I will get over but when the religious die, there is heaven and the belief about being in a better place etc, as hard as I'd like to believe this I just can't. I was very close with my Grandmother and both my grandparents were like second parents to me and treated me as their own. I wonder what comfort I can find, although she died, she died after a long battle with cancer to this I am relieved however it is still the undeniable void that is left. I would like to know some advice/things that helped you guys get through a similar  situation.





Edited by CosmicJoke (10/21/15 10:31 PM)


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Offlinethebitterbuffalo26
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Re: How to find solace after the death of a loved one as an Atheist [Re: Ilift]
    #22412271 - 10/21/15 04:50 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

I'm sorry for your loss.  Maybe all you can do is proudly take on the charge of one day doing the same thing for your grandchildren. She will always live on through you.


--------------------


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InvisibleShiithead
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Re: How to find solace after the death of a loved one as an Atheist [Re: Ilift]
    #22412280 - 10/21/15 04:57 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

1 Thess 4:17

Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.


--------------------

Ephesians 6:12
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
Psalm 12:6
The words of the Lord are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times.
Hebrews 11:3
Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.
Revelation 3:11
Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.


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InvisibleWhite Beard

Registered: 08/13/11
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Re: How to find solace after the death of a loved one as an Atheist [Re: Ilift]
    #22412498 - 10/21/15 07:47 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

she's free from pain now.


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Offlinelovelaughlibs
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Re: How to find solace after the death of a loved one as an Atheist [Re: White Beard]
    #22413327 - 10/21/15 11:23 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Consider that her physical body is gone but the memories and wisdom and experience you had together are absolutely not gone. Hard as it may be, consider yourself lucky to have had nice experiences with her and try use the experience as a chance to grow as a person.

I too lost a Grandmother last November and some things can be hard to accept (such as lack of being able to ask her stuff anymore).

Try focus on the positives and don't try mentally fight one of life's inevitabilities.


--------------------
Ask and ye shall receive; Seek and ye shall find.


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InvisibleJokeshopbeard
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Re: How to find solace after the death of a loved one as an Atheist [Re: White Beard]
    #22413676 - 10/21/15 01:12 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

White Beard said:
she's free from pain now.



I tend to think of death as a blessing, rather than a curse, mostly for this reason.


--------------------
Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not.
--Jac O'keeffe


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InvisibleMiddlemanM

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
Re: How to find solace after the death of a loved one as an Atheist [Re: Ilift]
    #22413795 - 10/21/15 01:49 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Ilift said:

Obviously it is a part of life that I will get over but when the religious die, there is heaven and the belief about being in a better place etc, as hard as I'd like to believe this I just can't.




Religious people don't really believe it either.


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InvisibleCosmicJokeM
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Re: How to find solace after the death of a loved one as an Atheist [Re: Ilift]
    #22416031 - 10/21/15 10:33 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Grieve, baby, grieve!  Whatever you're holding in, let it out!

That's my best advice, and I'm sorry if it falls short.

:heart: CJ


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Everything is better than it was the last time.  I'm good.

If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care.

It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence.

I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too.  If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.


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InvisibleJokeshopbeard
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Re: How to find solace after the death of a loved one as an Atheist [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #22418184 - 10/22/15 12:52 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

It's good advice CJ. I'm a huge advocate of not holding anything in. I think it's really bad for us.


--------------------
Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not.
--Jac O'keeffe


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Invisiblelaughingdog
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Re: How to find solace after the death of a loved one as an Atheist [Re: Ilift]
    #22419664 - 10/22/15 06:56 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

it is ok to cry
it is ok not to cry
it is all ok
it comes and goes in waves
the conscious/ego self is not in charge
when it hurts it fucking hurts

intellectually we know our sadness/grieving does the dead no good

so grief is partly about unfinished business,
or if you don't like the jargon:
shit that didn't get sorted out with the person in question

on a feeling level
allow tears
make both time and space in life for tears

it's a process:
it cycles back and forth between:
mind and body
child and adult
gratefulness for what was given vs. anger for hurt that happened

mind may want to short circut the process
and be in control

but like digestion, in anit about thinking
it's on a more subterranian level
go with it, allow it, it keeps changing


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Invisiblelaughingdog
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Re: How to find solace after the death of a loved one as an Atheist [Re: laughingdog]
    #22419741 - 10/22/15 07:12 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

unlike digestion
it may be a very intense process at times
the 'deceased' may appear in dreams ...

and one can even feel like one actually is the deceased person.
It is beyond reason. It has it's own way.

go with the flow ...


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OfflineTameMe
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Re: How to find solace after the death of a loved one as an Atheist [Re: laughingdog]
    #22425716 - 10/24/15 03:11 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

As an athjest i was so disturbed by the subject that i skipped reading body of post to say....your views on metaphysical beliefs arent necessarily connected to her death and in Some way your coping with loss based on your belief takes away from the life and death she traversed and encapsulates it into a struggle for you that denies the personality that was lived and focuses on your own feelings in her wake..dont make sense of it...feel...just feel...and appreciate the memories....appreciate her life...and what rubed off on you and accept the inevitable


Edited by TameMe (10/24/15 03:12 AM)


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: How to find solace after the death of a loved one as an Atheist [Re: Ilift]
    #22428477 - 10/24/15 05:50 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

I never conceptualize that someone 'has gone,' or 'is in,' a better place. Or a worse place for that matter. What I will not entertain is the eternalization of any of our finitude. Firstly, Eternity does not mean endless duration of time. Eternity is timeless, and form of any kind must exist in space and time. Form can only exist as extension and duration. Eternity is not temporal or spatial in any referential way, not analogous to any sensory experience.

It makes more sense to conceptualize the intricacies and complexities of each person's life like the intricacies and exquisite complexities of a Tibetan Buddhist sand painting which is eventually swept together into an amorphous pile of sand. Or again, imagine a fabulously detailed ice sculpture that is removed from freezing temperatures to melt into an amorphous puddle of clear water. Likewise for us, sinking back into the formless Clear Light whence our individual minds arose in the first place. I always dislike the dismantling of a sand painting. It's an abstract but poignant example of the dissolution of form and beauty which symbolizes the reality that ALL form is temporary, but that the Eternal is Eternal.

Even in Christianity, MOST people FAIL to grok that Eternal Life is NOT personal immortality. Eternal Life is the life of Eternal God. If "God is love," as 1 John 4:8 posits (metaphysically considered, regardless of your atheistic stance) then only love is eternal. Hence, to the extent that we identify with being love, we "have eternal life." Experiencially, as we die, as the cosmic elements leave us (Fire element leaves, we become cold, Water element leaves, we become thirsty, Air element leaves, breathing becomes labored, etc.), we are left with the element of Space or Consciousness. I suspect it will be a supremely familiar experience, recognizing our True Nature "face-to-face" and having a momentous realization that THIS was the real 'I' behind our mistaken references to our body every time we casually used to word 'I' to refer to ourselves. The final Realization will be of the nature of Ultimate Reality as yet another illusion dies into Eternity. I hope it's at least as blissful as sinking into a hot bath on a cold night. What remains of all of us is the Eternal aspect that we always were and failed to Realize in our sensory lives.

We are only temporary animations of the Eternal Life. Greater understanding of what we are changes the whole way we grieve the loss of others. Our attachment to form is the source of our suffering, and it takes many forms: the  loss of our youth, our appearances, our health, our strength, our flexibility, our memory, our abilities in general. At a certain point, we realize that we are all dying in bits and pieces as we slide inevitably into total dissolution of our egoic mind-body in death. Coming full circle, we have never been what we thought we were - individual waves. We have always been the entire Ocean, and we've been deceived by Maya, the illusion, to think we were only temporary individuals. One of the remedies is to take the love for your grandmother, and simply love. Be love, which is to say, Be Compassionate. Instead of regarding love as an action, consider love as a state of being. You loved her in form, now love without form. Do not identify grief with your grandmother, identify your grandmother with love. I have clients who think letting go of their grief is a betrayal, and so cling to grief instead of allowing love and joy to emerge, as if being joyful again will betray the loved one who has died. Nothing could be further from the truth. First grieve, then allow yourself to rejoice again in your lost one's True Nature - love.


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


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InvisibleCosmicJokeM
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Re: How to find solace after the death of a loved one as an Atheist [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #22429401 - 10/24/15 08:52 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Instead of regarding love as an action, consider love as a state of being.




Damn I just said that nearly verbatim in the last thread I replied to, what a synchronicity.


--------------------
Everything is better than it was the last time.  I'm good.

If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care.

It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence.

I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too.  If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: How to find solace after the death of a loved one as an Atheist [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #22430267 - 10/25/15 01:05 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

We're kindred souls CJ. I hope you'll be visiting us soon.


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


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OfflineIlift
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Re: How to find solace after the death of a loved one as an Atheist [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #22430431 - 10/25/15 03:34 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Thank you all for your replies <3 even though I am not a fan of religious scripture, they can provide meaning in some instances. It would take me a great length of time to reply individually to every comment however they were all worthwhile and benefited greatly.
:heart::heart::heart:


Edited by Ilift (10/25/15 03:35 AM)


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InvisiblehTx
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Re: How to find solace after the death of a loved one as an Atheist [Re: Ilift]
    #22440786 - 10/27/15 03:51 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

There is no solace, only a scar.


--------------------
zen by age ten times six hundred lifetimes
Light up the darkness.


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Invisiblesudly
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Re: How to find solace after the death of a loved one as an Atheist [Re: Ilift]
    #22462793 - 11/01/15 03:10 PM (8 years, 2 months ago)

I know it's a difficult thing but in life we have to swallow the bitter pill of reality and use time to come to acceptance of what is and what is not.

Solace for me comes in knowing how lucky we all are to even be alive in the first place, that we had a chance to live and used it. If you look into the stars and know of the physics that take place, you'll know that you are looking into an inhospitable hell hole and may appreciate the life you have on Earth a little more. I do.


--------------------
I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.



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Offlinezzripz
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Re: How to find solace after the death of a loved one as an Atheist [Re: Ilift]
    #22465978 - 11/02/15 09:50 AM (8 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Ilift said:
My grandmother died a few months ago and whilst I was profoundly upset at the time, the sinking weight of reality that she is gone is only really setting in and its very unpleasant. Obviously it is a part of life that I will get over but when the religious die, there is heaven and the belief about being in a better place etc, as hard as I'd like to believe this I just can't. I was very close with my Grandmother and both my grandparents were like second parents to me and treated me as their own. I wonder what comfort I can find, although she died, she died after a long battle with cancer to this I am relieved however it is still the undeniable void that is left. I would like to know some advice/things that helped you guys get through a similar  situation.








I just think like the Christian who thinks in black or white terms, eg 'heaven or hell' 'good or evil', so does the atheist 'all is matter there is no spirit' . It is the same black or white thinking but from a different perspective.
Rather understand Mystery. Mystery is that which is beyond reason/logic/rationality/measure. Mystery cannot be contained by the measuring mind, though that mind arrogantly presumes one-day-it-will. there is no respect for mystery as in it will always be beyond measuring. Can you measure love? I have heard the 'wanna know everything persona' actually tell me that it is just chemicals--reducing even that feeling of love to chemicals
Know that you, and your gran are not just who you think you are/were. Like the particle and the wave in physics. We are this mysterious process that can be in 'one place' but also are spread out, depending on perspective. it is impossible as said to try and box this understanding in. But trying to is when you feel that void. Is when you feel there is no meaning, no mystery. The curse for the Christian is that s/he has contained it in their dualistic black and white universe


Edited by zzripz (11/02/15 11:27 AM)


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