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Invisiblepaperbackwriter
Edward Lear


Registered: 03/31/14
Posts: 1,888
Re: Poll: Economics [Re: Bigbadwooof] * 1
    #22431110 - 10/25/15 09:43 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Bigbadwooof said:
The best way for government to fix the problem is to play the role that business is not fulfilling, without trying to control business in 50 different ways. The government can create jobs, and businesses will be forced to face a tighter labor market, which will correct the problems organically.




:nodofunderstanding:


--------------------
Why should we strive with cynic frown
To knock their fairy castles down?  ~ Eliza Cook

It's rather embarrassing to have given one's entire life to pondering the human predicament and to find that in the end one has little more to say than, 'Try to be a little kinder.' ~Aldous Huxley


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: Poll: Economics [Re: Stonehenge]
    #22431177 - 10/25/15 10:04 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
If it works why don't all the poor countries do it and pull themselves up? Because it doesn't work, not there and not here.





For an interesting analysis of why poor countries (even ones rich with natural resources) have a hard time bootstrapping their way to prosperity, you should check out this book:


--------------------


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InvisibleStonehenge
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Re: Poll: Economics [Re: ballsalsa]
    #22431443 - 10/25/15 11:21 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

I don't have to read that book to know jacking up the min does nothing to promote prosperity, in fact it does the opposite. That's why none of the poor countries have tried it or tried it and gave up and went back to something reasonable.


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

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OfflinePatlal
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Re: Poll: Economics [Re: Stonehenge]
    #22431601 - 10/25/15 12:01 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Just copy and paste Canadian economic principles and you guys will pull through...


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OfflineBigbadwooof
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Re: Poll: Economics [Re: ballsalsa]
    #22431627 - 10/25/15 12:04 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
Quote:

Stonehenge said:
If it works why don't all the poor countries do it and pull themselves up? Because it doesn't work, not there and not here.





For an interesting analysis of why poor countries (even ones rich with natural resources) have a hard time bootstrapping their way to prosperity, you should check out this book:





Looks like a tabloid balls lol... but any book you suggest is excellent, I am sure. I will have to check it out.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
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OfflineBigbadwooof
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Re: Poll: Economics [Re: Stonehenge]
    #22431639 - 10/25/15 12:06 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
I don't have to read that book to know jacking up the min does nothing to promote prosperity, in fact it does the opposite. That's why none of the poor countries have tried it or tried it and gave up and went back to something reasonable.




Come on Stonehenge... that's just stupid. The only leverage 3rd world countries have for job growth is low wages. America has far more to offer than that, which is why our wages remain higher than 3rd world countries.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


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OfflineBigbadwooof
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Re: Poll: Economics [Re: Patlal]
    #22431648 - 10/25/15 12:07 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Patlal said:
Just copy and paste Canadian economic principles and you guys will pull through...




Are you Canadian?


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Poll: Economics [Re: Stonehenge]
    #22431796 - 10/25/15 12:40 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

Stonehenge said:
Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
I've been through minimum wage hikes, and it seems like the costs of goods and services go up right up with them



Of course they do, that's why it never works. If it worked, the whole world would have a high min wage and be prosperous. But it doesn't work except in the fantasies of liberals.



And we know exactly by how much.  The libertarian CATO Institute showed that "a 10 percent increase in the U.S. minimum wage raises food prices by up to 4 percent and overall prices by up to 0.4 percent."  That's a bargain for low paid workers.
.
.
.
empirical evidence shows it does work.  That's why I'm surprised conservatives keep fighting it.



Fal, how can you actually believe that loony stuff? Time to put down the liberal crack pipe for a moment and sober up. Some opinion piece or article with cherry picked statistics proves nothing.



I provided data from a libertarian think tank.  That data was based on averaging a number of different studies together.  The fact is, raising minimum wage does not raise prices anywhere near the amount of the minimum wage increase, and therefore puts more real money in people's pockets.  It's also been shown not to hurt jobs except for teenagers and only in the short term.  If you have contradicting evidence, please post it.

As wooof said above, this is just one of many things than can be done to improve the status of the working class.

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
If you believe your own post, you should be sending emails to the leaders of mexico, Pakistan, south America, etc informing them of how to improve the lives of their people. No doubt they never thought of just raising the min and will thank you for suggesting it.



Do you really think the leaders of 3rd world countries care about their poor, when the leaders of civilized countries don't even care?  It's all about helping the rich who helped them get into power.  Same shit everywhere.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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InvisibleStonehenge
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Re: Poll: Economics [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #22432393 - 10/25/15 03:27 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

So, you stand by your nonsense left wing article proclaiming raising the min is the path to prosperity and then tell us the reason poor countries dont' do it is because they don't care about the poor? Sounds like liberal logic. Oh, and don't forget to say it was shrubs fault.


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755


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OfflineBigbadwooof
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Re: Poll: Economics [Re: Stonehenge] * 1
    #22432416 - 10/25/15 03:36 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
So, you stand by your nonsense left wing article proclaiming raising the min is the path to prosperity and then tell us the reason poor countries dont' do it is because they don't care about the poor? Sounds like liberal logic. Oh, and don't forget to say it was shrubs fault.




... LEFT WING ARTICLE!?!?! HAHAHAHA!

You are fucking NUTS dude!

This was the CATO institute. Just because your know-nothing ill informed ass disagrees with the most right wing Libertarian institution in the fucking country, doesn't make it fucking Liberal!

Jesus Christ dude. Everything you disagree with is not inherently 'Liberal'.

You crack me up.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Poll: Economics [Re: Stonehenge]
    #22432446 - 10/25/15 03:43 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
I don't have to read that book to know jacking up the min does nothing to promote prosperity, in fact it does the opposite. That's why none of the poor countries have tried it or tried it and gave up and went back to something reasonable.




Actually Venezuela has been increasing their minimum wages by double and more, and it's working wonders for them


http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-10-16/venezuela-raises-minimum-wage-30-it-s-still-only-13-a-month

It's a socialist paradise down there I tell ya!


--------------------
http://www.countdowntotrump.com





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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Poll: Economics [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #22432543 - 10/25/15 04:13 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Where in your article does it show that raising the minimum wage was bad for them?

Venezuela is not a model socialist state.  They're not hurting because of a $13/month minimum wage.  :facepalm3:


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Poll: Economics [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #22432811 - 10/25/15 05:08 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Where in your article does it show that raising the minimum wage was bad for them?

Venezuela is not a model socialist state.  They're not hurting because of a $13/month minimum wage.  :facepalm3:




Socialism leads to price controls which leads to shortages, which leads to black markets, it's in black and white if you care to read it

Venezuela essentially did what BS is advocating, use the countries resources to treat everyone equally,


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: Poll: Economics [Re: Stonehenge]
    #22433017 - 10/25/15 05:54 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
I don't have to read that book to know jacking up the min does nothing to promote prosperity, in fact it does the opposite. That's why none of the poor countries have tried it or tried it and gave up and went back to something reasonable.




Read it or don't; it's no skin off my ass.  The topic at hand reminded me of that book, so i thought i would be nice and suggest it.


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InvisibleStonehenge
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Re: Poll: Economics [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #22433106 - 10/25/15 06:10 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Quote:

Stonehenge said:
I don't have to read that book to know jacking up the min does nothing to promote prosperity, in fact it does the opposite. That's why none of the poor countries have tried it or tried it and gave up and went back to something reasonable.




Actually Venezuela has been increasing their minimum wages by double and more, and it's working wonders for them


http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-10-16/venezuela-raises-minimum-wage-30-it-s-still-only-13-a-month

It's a socialist paradise down there I tell ya!




Well then, maybe we should try it after all? They want us to be successful just like Venezuela. Which is socialist btw.


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Poll: Economics [Re: Stonehenge]
    #22433425 - 10/25/15 07:30 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Who said we should be more like Venezuela???  Your dishonesty blows me away.  Bernie is suggesting something like the Northern European socialist model.

You and hostileuniverse keep making up straw man arguments, because it's the only way you can win (even though we call you on it so you don't win).


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OfflineBigbadwooof
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Re: Poll: Economics [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #22433651 - 10/25/15 08:32 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Who said we should be more like Venezuela???  Your dishonesty blows me away.  Bernie is suggesting something like the Northern European socialist model.

You and hostileuniverse keep making up straw man arguments, because it's the only way you can win (even though we call you on it so you don't win).




Stop ruining their fantasy that Europe doesn't exist asshole!


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Poll: Economics [Re: Bigbadwooof] * 1
    #22433685 - 10/25/15 08:43 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Bigbadwooof said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Who said we should be more like Venezuela???  Your dishonesty blows me away.  Bernie is suggesting something like the Northern European socialist model.

You and hostileuniverse keep making up straw man arguments, because it's the only way you can win (even though we call you on it so you don't win).




Stop ruining their fantasy that Europe doesn't exist asshole!




The fact you guys refuse to accept is that America could never be like Norway or denmarck, Venezuela is much closer to how it would turn out


--------------------
http://www.countdowntotrump.com





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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Poll: Economics [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #22433816 - 10/25/15 09:19 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

America is much closer to Europe than Venezuela.  Give me a break.  :shake:


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Poll: Economics [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #22434966 - 10/26/15 07:56 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
America is much closer to Europe than Venezuela.  Give me a break.  :shake:




Norway and Denmark have VERY strict immigration policies, we do not, quite the opposite in fact. The reason they do is because they know their welfare state would fall apart. That's one of the reasons it simply will not work here


--------------------
http://www.countdowntotrump.com





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