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Offlinecoirlover
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A lot of questions needing answers ASAP
    #22387107 - 10/16/15 05:52 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

1.)When doing G2G transfer from small bags to large in a SAB what is the best method?  Is there a tek for this?  I was thinking of cutting a hole in the bottom corner of the colonized bag and dumping the grain into the larger bags through these holes.  Anyone have success doing this
?

2.)After pasteurizing large bags for G2G do I just open them in the SAB and dump colonized grain in?  Seems really risky!  Is there a best practice when doing this without a HEPA.

3.)I see some people boiling there rye before PC and some people who do not.  Is there a definitive answer as to which method is best yet?  I have bags, rye and tyvek sleeves and am making my first bags tomorrow.

Thanks in advance!


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OfflineDrCrumbs
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Re: A lot of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: coirlover]
    #22387128 - 10/16/15 06:09 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

1. I wouldnt just because the outside of the bag isn't sterile anymore like the inside. I cut the top of the bag and fold the bag down so only the inside is exposed and use a sterile spoon/fork to transfer with.
(kind of like if you folded a sock you were wearing down, if this makes sense).

2. I assume you mean sterilize. Yeah basically, but pay attention to what surfaces you are touching with what tools. You dont want to touch non sterile surfaces with your sterilized stuff.

3. I've tried a whole bunch of different things, lots of stuff works. You just want plump, non busted, and minimal moister in the jars when your done.


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InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
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Re: A lot of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: DrCrumbs]
    #22387232 - 10/16/15 07:07 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Follow directions and don't rely on your assumptions and hunches.

If the TEK leaves you with too many questions you're probably reading a shit TEK wrote by a kid 15 years ago


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Offlinemushpunx
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Re: A lot of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: bodhisatta]
    #22387556 - 10/16/15 09:22 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

1.G2G from bag to bag is actually pretty tricky, especially in a still air box. Bags are tricky enough in SAB as it is. Definitely do-able, I don't think I would be able to pull that off though :lol:

Do not cut a hole in the bag. You want to pour from one bag into the receiving bag.

2. I think you are confused about what G2G is. Grain to grain transfer colonized (jar, bag) grain from one sterile container into another sterile container of sterilized grain, to colonize the receiving container of grain. G2G is simply a way of expanding your grain spawn.

You would never pasturize grain, only sterilize it. You pasturize bulk substrates (coir, poo, straw etc).
You mix colonized grain spawn with pasteurized substrate. This is usually done in open air.

If you use good sterile technique G2G is perfectly do able in still air box, although trickier with spawn bags than jars.

3. Almost all rye preps require a simmer. I rinse my grains, soak overnight, then hard boil for 10 min. I then strain and shake every once in a while to steam dry the grains.



Most people don't G2G spawn bag to spawn bag. Id s ugguest you inoculate jars first as masters and use those colonized jars to inoculate your spawn bags.

I go agar to quart jar, to 4 quart spawn bag for a total of 5quarts spawn.


Do you use agar? You will want to clean up your culture first before putting to grain dude

Send me a message if you would like some guidance


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Offlinecoirlover
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Re: A lot of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: mushpunx]
    #22387622 - 10/16/15 09:42 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

I meant to say sterilized bags... I have 12 colonized 1# bags GT, I am transferring to 24 4.5 qt bags. Just really concerned with opening bags inside SAB.  Should you really use a spoon? I thought I read this was a really bad idea


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Offlinemushpunx
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Re: A lot of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: coirlover]
    #22387787 - 10/16/15 10:27 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

coirlover said:
I meant to say sterilized bags... I have 12 colonized 1# bags GT, I am transfegoing  to 24 4.5 qt bags. Just really concerned with opening bags inside SAB.  Should you really use a spoon? I thought I read this was a really bad idea





Absolutely no spoon man!  You shouldn't be concerned opening the bags in SAB. The air inside is not sterile, the idea is to keep it as still as possible to not let contams land in your work.

For G2G you have to be very smooth, quick but decisive and careful. Like I said its MUCH easier to go jar to bag than bag to bag.

You need to prep your SAB with spritzing the walls with soapy water. Wipe down the bags with ISO very well before going into SAB.

Gloves, clean tyvek sleeves, clean clothes face mask all that good stuff. Wipe gloves down with ISO frequently.

The idea is simple, pour from one bag into the next. But unless you have a very tall SAB this is easier said than done in still air box. You don't want to stir the air up, don't ever move anything over top an open bag, don't let your fingers slip into the top of the bag. Open the reciving bag, open the master bag, pour the master into receiver without letting the bags touch or moving any fingers or bag over top of the open bags. Try to keep the air still. 
Like I said very tricky in small SAB

In a still air box you have the disadvantage of not being able to give a proper plenum in spawn bags like you would w a flow hood. But once the receiving bag is set twist the top up and zip tie or seal.


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Re: A lot of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: mushpunx]
    #22387906 - 10/16/15 11:04 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

I'm all about still air boxes but if you're doing bag2bag you need a hood. Good luck even in an awesome SAB


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Offlinemushpunx
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Re: A lot of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: bodhisatta]
    #22389071 - 10/16/15 03:59 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

bodhisatta said
I'm all about still air boxes but if you're doing bag2bag yo. need a hood. Good luck even in an awesome SAB




That's what Im saying man. I dont think I could pull it off yet

G2G takes practice, bags take a lot of practice. I kinda think if OP already has a bunch of smaller bags knocked up maybe should spawn a bunch of trays or mino monos with those.

Use quarts or pints (even easier to work with) as masters. Use the large spawn bags as receivers if you wanna learn on those but expect some goof ups at first

Check out RR letsgrowmushrooms. Has a Great visual on G2G, he explains sterile tek very well too.

Also has a great section on spawn bag prep, and section on innoculating spawn bags via G2G, I think its the sawdust chapters.


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Offlinecoirlover
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Re: A lot of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: coirlover]
    #22605114 - 12/02/15 05:02 PM (8 years, 1 month ago)

G2G bag to bag... results are in.....








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InvisibleAdden
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Re: A lot of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: coirlover]
    #22605126 - 12/02/15 05:03 PM (8 years, 1 month ago)

I'd toss em.

...in gel caps and give to friends for Christmas. :lol:

Nice work.


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Offlinecoirlover
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Re: A lot of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: Adden]
    #22605145 - 12/02/15 05:12 PM (8 years, 1 month ago)

yeah, bachelor party is a few months away... Going to be a party!!!  How do you dry this many?I am a little worried about them going bad. I only have 2 dehydrators.  Right now I just have fans blowing on them until the rest are dry, will they be okay?


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Re: A lot of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: coirlover]
    #22605166 - 12/02/15 05:17 PM (8 years, 1 month ago)

I would 24h fan dry and wait for them to shrink, then throw them in the dehydrator.

You can split big caps from the center of the cap to one side. They tend to dry faster this way. I've seen some that have had to been quartered to have any shot at drying before they rot.

I've found that a 50/50 split in the trays works better. Bigger caps towards the center separated by stems then going down in size as they move toward the outside had always cracker-dried mine at 100F in 6-10 hours after fan drying.

They will shrink more than you think, as some say.

..you can't buy more racks for the dehydrator?


Edited by Adden (12/02/15 05:20 PM)


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Offlinemushpunx
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Re: A lot of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: Adden]
    #22605178 - 12/02/15 05:20 PM (8 years, 1 month ago)

Nice tub man!!


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OfflineSarah Tonin
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Re: A lot of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: mushpunx]
    #22605200 - 12/02/15 05:25 PM (8 years, 1 month ago)

:congrats: 

You got them out of that tub and spread them out?


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Offlinecoirlover
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Re: A lot of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: Sarah Tonin]
    #22605244 - 12/02/15 05:32 PM (8 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Sarah Tonin said:
:congrats: 

You got them out of that tub and spread them out?




Yes, I got them on every shelf I can find with fans blowing on the ones that are not in the dehydrator.

Guess on dry weight?


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Offlinecoirlover
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Re: A lot of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: Adden]
    #22605256 - 12/02/15 05:34 PM (8 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Dys said:
I would 24h fan dry and wait for them to shrink, then throw them in the dehydrator.

You can split big caps from the center of the cap to one side. They tend to dry faster this way. I've seen some that have had to been quartered to have any shot at drying before they rot.

I've found that a 50/50 split in the trays works better. Bigger caps towards the center separated by stems then going down in size as they move toward the outside had always cracker-dried mine at 100F in 6-10 hours after fan drying.

They will shrink more than you think, as some say.

..you can't buy more racks for the dehydrator?




Im sure I can online but that doesn't help much now....


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OfflineSarah Tonin
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Re: A of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: coirlover]
    #22605299 - 12/02/15 05:41 PM (8 years, 1 month ago)

:thumbup:  approximately 1/10th of the wet weight is the standard rule...  nice work.  I like Dys's method of fan drying and finishing in the dehydrator.  Much better use of the limited dehydrator space too but they turn out prettier as well.


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Re: A of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: Sarah Tonin]
    #22605329 - 12/02/15 05:48 PM (8 years, 1 month ago)

I've been traveling and collecting specimens. Managed to lay a thick paper bag over a chair in the hotel room I was staying in. Carefully used a lighter to see where the hot air would fall, turn back on itself and take off. Dried faster than anything I've ever seen in my life.

Here in the PNW you see a lot of ceiling fans in closets or laundry rooms with a heat light/fan assembly that sucks everything up and out. Great kind of deal if you can manage that, and they usually have shelves in those little rooms.

I've had specimens dry to near cracker incredibly quickly and only needing 2 hours in the dehydrator.


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OfflineSarah Tonin
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Re: A of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: Adden]
    #22605379 - 12/02/15 05:58 PM (8 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Dys said:
Carefully used a lighter to see where the hot air would fall, turn back on itself and take off.





:shocked:  how do you do that?


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Re: A of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: Sarah Tonin]
    #22605421 - 12/02/15 06:06 PM (8 years, 1 month ago)

Just move a light flame around and watch the way it blows. Start where you'd place your fruits, move it horizontally and vertically. When you find the right distance you have a convective heat transfer diffusing water molecules away from the fruit bodies and kicking it away. Sort of kinda like oven drying, just jerry rigged.


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OfflineSarah Tonin
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Re: A of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: Adden]
    #22605506 - 12/02/15 06:23 PM (8 years, 1 month ago)

I need a video  :lol: 

So this is without a fan, right?  And you're looking for the flame to dive downward?  Is this generally around table/counter height in a room?  Are there general parameters where this elusive air flow happens? 

Hopefully OP can use the info too and I'm not thread-jacking.


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Re: A of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: Sarah Tonin]
    #22605550 - 12/02/15 06:32 PM (8 years, 1 month ago)

Hotel rooms have those nice big old bastards.

Take a chair or table whichever and lay your fruits down on thick paper.

Position in front of the heater/AC.

You're looking to trace the flame and see which way it blows to get a circle. You want it coming from the heater but also a little going back to the heater. A high-backed chair with a deep seat works great; it will kick some back at you and cause a back and forth flame when held directly over the fruits.

Slightly but noticeable that it's trying to go down the air current but enough that it flicks the other way a little too.

Then move it down to the chair and make sure it blows back to the heater.

Last step is using it over the top of a table/chair and make sure air is still moving about. That means the moist air does in fact have a way to escape.

Wish I could explain it better, but that's really it.

Don't forget to put the chair or table back, or light the place on fire. You'll be do more rearranging than using your lighter. A Zippo won't work.

And make sure they don't blow anything around.. don't want tiny caps all over the place.


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OfflineSarah Tonin
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Re: A of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: Adden]
    #22605640 - 12/02/15 06:48 PM (8 years, 1 month ago)

Got it!  Thanks for explaining.  :super:


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Re: A of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: Sarah Tonin]
    #22605656 - 12/02/15 06:51 PM (8 years, 1 month ago)

Anytime! :thumbup:


Edit: Oh. You might want to make sure it's going full circle and lighter/space test before putting down a giant flammable sheet of paper. You can then just shut it off, lay your fruits down, and slowly turn the fan speed up. If you have to you can just weigh the bag down. Starbucks and REI bags work wonders. Much easier than a lunch bag making things fly everywhere.


Edited by Adden (12/02/15 06:54 PM)


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OfflineSarah Tonin
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Re: A of questions needing answers ASAP [Re: Adden]
    #22605694 - 12/02/15 06:58 PM (8 years, 1 month ago)

:asianofapproval:

Beautiful specimen in your avatar, btw.


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