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topdog82
Death Spirit



Registered: 07/16/10
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Re: Why do we still eat meat? [Re: Achillita]
#22385811 - 10/15/15 09:34 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Shroomslip said: That goes back to me saying the best we can really do is base it on similar animals. And you've still got to factor in the fact that the wild boar and wild turkeys are, well, wild. Our domesticated animals have quite different mindsets, instincts etc. Like dogs, they've been selectively bred to fit our needs, and our needs are for them to depend on us and not behave like wild animals.
I don't know for sure, but I'm going to guess it would take more than one generation to breed that wild back into them. Whether they went extinct before the wild they'd need to thrive could be bred into them is the question.
Some animals that have been bred into captivity (which is even a step lower than domestication) can survive being released into the wild at a later date, and survive. For others, it's a death sentence.
Thats true. I guess I will admit where I am wrong on this one. It is hard to say
In india (my home country) I notice that dogs in the streets often act like wolves. The government does so little about stray animals that they herd into packs and fight each other, often to the death
So I assume that cows would just roam and chill out and fuck around. But like I said, I guess niether of us can say 
You bring up an interesting points and I guess it depends on the species
Quote:
Achillita said: Grass is free man... If you have land and rain falls from the sky, most places grass will grow. I've been around a dozen ranches all across Texas and Oklahoma. Some were extremely big, others only a hundred cattle or so. They'd only really give them feed as a supplement when there was no grass or just not enough.
All these places let their cattle roam through out the day. And most rounded them up into a smaller field at night.
From my personal experience, most ranches just don't do the things some people claim they do. Slaughterhouses are going to look brutal. They walk the cattle through, kill them(there's various methods), and then hook them to butcher.
As with this. I cant say forsure. After all, you are the rancher. But IMO/looking at the evidence, MOST beef on the market tastes corn fed. If I compare the taste of ANY kind of beef I buy in safeway to the grass fed beef, I can taste a noticable difference. There have been quite a few studies to show that what is being sold as grass fed versus average beef has a significantly different flavor and fatty acid profile
Like I said, I guess its silly for me to speak. I haven't seen how it all goes down. But this is where the evidence points. I will remain open minded and skeptical until someone provides me with evidence to sway me either way
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topdog82
Death Spirit



Registered: 07/16/10
Posts: 7,992
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Re: Why do we still eat meat? [Re: Achillita]
#22385817 - 10/15/15 09:35 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Achillita said: Wild boars(at least in the US) are just domestic pigs that escaped.
Almost all domesticated animals can survive on their own. Wild turkeys are a thing. As are wild chickens.
I actually didn't know that. Incredibly interesting
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Shroomslip
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Re: Why do we still eat meat? [Re: Achillita]
#22385848 - 10/15/15 09:44 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Achillita said: Wild boars(at least in the US) are just domestic pigs that escaped.
Almost all domesticated animals can survive on their own. Wild turkeys are a thing. As are wild chickens.
Unless the boar population stems from only a very recent escape, my point still stands. I will admit I don't really know a boars lineage. It's not impossible for a captive bred or domesticated animal to survive in the wild, they just aren't as adapted to such things.
For instance, and for sake of argument let's say boars are just first or second generation escaped domesticated pigs. Take 20 of them, release them into the wild and do not influence them in any way, and compare them to a pool of 20 that has always existed outside captivity under the same criteria. See how many die at an earlier than expected age from each group. Run the experiment a dozen times, and you're probably going to start to see a pattern that favors the ones that were never captive at all.
I've also already pointed out that some animals are just better suited to going from captivity to total freedom. Even fully domesticated and captive bred.
--------------------
With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way. I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today. Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear. I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear. You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline
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Malcolm_Xtasy
Oh baby what Is you doin??



Registered: 04/04/12
Posts: 13,851
Loc:
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Re: Why do we still eat meat? [Re: topdog82]
#22385859 - 10/15/15 09:46 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
In india (my home country) I notice that dogs in the streets often act like wolves.
Never would've guessed you were Indian
-------------------- I'm stupid, Enlil is smart. I'm ugly, Enlil is beautiful. I'm a loser, Enlil is a winner. Someday, I hope to be like Enlil but secretly know I never will.
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topdog82
Death Spirit



Registered: 07/16/10
Posts: 7,992
Loc: California
Last seen: 5 months, 2 days
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Re: Why do we still eat meat? [Re: Shroomslip]
#22385881 - 10/15/15 09:52 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Malcolm_Xtasy said:
Quote:
In india (my home country) I notice that dogs in the streets often act like wolves.
Never would've guessed you were Indian 
Lmao I am not fobby indian. I grew up here. Brown by skin color and white in most ways
Quote:
Shroomslip said:
Quote:
Achillita said: Wild boars(at least in the US) are just domestic pigs that escaped.
Almost all domesticated animals can survive on their own. Wild turkeys are a thing. As are wild chickens.
Unless the boar population stems from only a very recent escape, my point still stands. I will admit I don't really know a boars lineage. It's not impossible for a captive bred or domesticated animal to survive in the wild, they just aren't as adapted to such things.
For instance, and for sake of argument let's say boars are just first or second generation escaped domesticated pigs. Take 20 of them, release them into the wild and do not influence them in any way, and compare them to a pool of 20 that has always existed outside captivity under the same criteria. See how many die at an earlier than expected age from each group. Run the experiment a dozen times, and you're probably going to start to see a pattern that favors the ones that were never captive at all.
I've also already pointed out that some animals are just better suited to going from captivity to total freedom. Even fully domesticated and captive bred.
It kinda depends generation to generation and species to species. Hard to say
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Bodhi of Ankou
*alternate opinion blocks path*


Registered: 06/02/09
Posts: 24,778
Loc: Soviet Canukistan
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Re: Why do we still eat meat? [Re: topdog82] 1
#22385905 - 10/15/15 09:56 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Now im forever gonna read everything you say in a stereotypical indian accent
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topdog82
Death Spirit



Registered: 07/16/10
Posts: 7,992
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Last seen: 5 months, 2 days
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haha godamn. I always withhold personal info on this forum to keep anonymity. I just fucked up hahahQuote:
Bodhi of Ankou said: Now im forever gonna read everything you say in a stereotypical indian accent 
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Malcolm_Xtasy
Oh baby what Is you doin??



Registered: 04/04/12
Posts: 13,851
Loc:
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Quote:
Bodhi of Ankou said: Now im forever gonna read everything you say in a stereotypical indian accent 
I was thinking the exact same thing
-------------------- I'm stupid, Enlil is smart. I'm ugly, Enlil is beautiful. I'm a loser, Enlil is a winner. Someday, I hope to be like Enlil but secretly know I never will.
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topdog82
Death Spirit



Registered: 07/16/10
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Lol you guys are complete bastards
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404
error


Registered: 08/20/10
Posts: 14,539
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Re: Why do we still eat meat? [Re: Kukaracha]
#22386290 - 10/15/15 11:13 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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video was hard to watch. kinda feel nauseous.
think it's time i cut down on meat all together. fish is another story... but red meat and fowl, i can probably do without it.
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404
error


Registered: 08/20/10
Posts: 14,539
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Re: Why do we still eat meat? [Re: 404]
#22386303 - 10/15/15 11:15 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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and shroomslip, i only kinda glossed over your response up there, but trying to say its OK because they couldnt survive in the wild is kind of a BS argument for the advocation of that kind of suffering, if that's where you were going with it. no living being should have to suffer through that.
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Shroomslip
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Re: Why do we still eat meat? [Re: 404]
#22386318 - 10/15/15 11:18 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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It's not, read my responses, all of them, before you pass judgement. Thanks.
--------------------
With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way. I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today. Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear. I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear. You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline
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zZZz
jesus


Registered: 12/28/07
Posts: 33,478
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Quote:
Bodhi of Ankou said: Now im forever gonna read everything you say in a stereotypical indian accent 
maybe we should read urs in stereotypical canadian accent?, how bout it ey?
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404
error


Registered: 08/20/10
Posts: 14,539
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Re: Why do we still eat meat? [Re: Shroomslip]
#22386367 - 10/15/15 11:27 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Shroomslip said: It's not, read my responses, all of them, before you pass judgement. Thanks.
don't get your panties in a twist. thanks
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Shroomslip
Architekt



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Re: Why do we still eat meat? [Re: 404]
#22386385 - 10/15/15 11:30 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Don't have them twisted. I've just already been prematurely judged in this thread once based on assumption and lack of clarity.
--------------------
With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way. I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today. Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear. I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear. You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline
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Bodhi of Ankou
*alternate opinion blocks path*


Registered: 06/02/09
Posts: 24,778
Loc: Soviet Canukistan
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Re: Why do we still eat meat? [Re: 404]
#22386427 - 10/15/15 11:37 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
404 said: video was hard to watch. kinda feel nauseous.
think it's time i cut down on meat all together. fish is another story... but red meat and fowl, i can probably do without it.
Its nothing compared to nature, and if its any consolation most places are a lot more effective at hitting the main arteries. Most of that video featured halal style killings. Which is basically slitting their throats ear to ear for no other reason then orthodoxy.
This is how it should be done everywhere
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404
error


Registered: 08/20/10
Posts: 14,539
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Re: Why do we still eat meat? [Re: Shroomslip]
#22386434 - 10/15/15 11:38 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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i glossed over your initial arguments and i think Twighead said a lot of what i would have said already.
anyway, considering that a great portion of carbon emissions come from the meat industry, i would say that maybe it really is time to start cutting back on meat. we don't need as much as we eat today anyway. some 51% of the total emissions allegedly come from the meat industry
http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/climate-change/study-claims-meat-creates-half-of-all-greenhouse-gases-1812909.html
http://www.worldwatch.org/node/6294
http://www.animalfeedscience.com/article/S0377-8401%2811%2900517-7/abstract
feel free to debunk these to the best of your abilities, because that is definitely not my strong suit.
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Kukaracha
Cat wannabe


Registered: 12/18/08
Posts: 1,682
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Re: Why do we still eat meat? [Re: 404]
#22397062 - 10/18/15 10:50 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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In the end, whatever your point of view is, the reasons to cut back on your meat consumption are just too numerous.
Don't care about animals? Fine, do you care about ecology? Don't care about ecology? Fine, do you care about your kids' future? Don't care about your kids? Fine, do you care about yourself?
In the end, the only way to enjoy meat daily is to not care at all about anything, including your health.
Massive meat consumption : - is industrial torture and slaughter to ensure that you get the cheapest product, - is a wasteful production extremely demanding in terms of water, - has a huge impact on carbon emissions, - is equal to massive antibiotic intake, since raised animals are in such poor health they take vertiginous amounts of complements and medicine, - is expensive, - is bad for your health as it is a high-fat diet leading to cancer, liver and heart problems.
To each his own but at some point you have to call out people on this sort of behaviour.
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Beanhead
IS IRONIC PARADOX


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Re: Why do we still eat meat? [Re: Kukaracha]
#22397076 - 10/18/15 10:55 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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-feeds everyone ^ How do we replace this?
Yes, it is a wasteful expenditure with water, so are potatofarms, every day a farmer must clean his equipment, that's tons of water this is just how it is when cleanliness is such a strong factor in food sector. The whole animal is used though, there nothing goes to waste.
Carbon emissions can be countered with green energy sources.
Edited by Beanhead (10/18/15 10:59 AM)
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ThatKidWithTheFace
R.I.P. ZIG R.I.P. Sloth


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Re: Why do we still eat meat? [Re: Herbologist]
#22397084 - 10/18/15 10:56 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Herbologist said: This is why I try to only eat meat that has been humanely raised.
Grass fed, free range, no antibiotics, no hormones. purely natural.
No antibiotics? That sounds like an irresponsible farmer!
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[quote]Sheekle said: [quote]ThatKidWithTheFace said: Is this the same aunt that fucks dogs?[/quote] u bet ur ass it is.[/quote]
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