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Invisibleenlightened seed
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does hell exist?
    #22365398 - 10/11/15 08:40 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

does hell exist or is it merely used as a scare tactic to get people to believe certain things?  i do not believe anyone really asked to be here.  with that being said why would someone/something want to put people somewhere evil(if hell is an evil place)?  sounds like a bad idea, putting people in a place which is evil :imo:


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Invisiblechampinhom
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Re: does hell exist? [Re: enlightened seed]
    #22365417 - 10/11/15 08:46 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

enlightened seed said:
does hell exist or is it merely used as a scare tactic to get people to believe certain things?  i do not believe anyone really asked to be here.  with that being said why would someone/something want to put people somewhere evil(if hell is an evil place)?  sounds like a bad idea, putting people in a place which is evil :imo:





I used to know an old lady--a canny old girl--who once said to me: The older I get, the more I believe in the reality of evil and in the existence of the devil.

I think the older you get and the more you see, the more you hang fire on this question. I tend to think that, sure hell exists. But, it is certainly not what you or I or anybody else who hasn't been there thinks it is.

So, yeah, it exists. But it probably isn't eternal.


--------------------
My father used to say: I don't care what else you do in life, just don't be an asshole. People, forgive me when I forget what my daddy said.

Cut back the proliferating list of people whose opinions can hurt you. Unless they have done or want to do you some good, their views are just not worth tracking.
Saul Bellow

“People are just cannibals unless they leave each other alone.” Doris Lessing

Those whom the gods would save, they dower with compassion. Mr. P.  Silocybin


Edited by champinhom (10/11/15 08:47 PM)


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Invisibleenlightened seed
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Re: does hell exist? [Re: champinhom]
    #22365445 - 10/11/15 08:51 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

if it does exist, hell that is.  who decides who is invited?


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OfflinePeyote Road
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Re: does hell exist? [Re: enlightened seed] * 1
    #22365553 - 10/11/15 09:06 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Of course hell exists, but it is important to understand that in truth in might not be how you imagine it to be.

For instance, most people simply assume there is a physical world made of real physical objects and then they extrapolate their ideas of heaven and hell based on the first assumption.

However, what a lot of spiritual people have said recently (and many ancients concur with this) is that the first assumption is actually false. Its more true to say that everything is made out of consciousness. There isn't a physical world in the way most people imagine it to be. So then it naturally follows that heaven and hell aren't what most people imagine them to be either.

In the 1990s the then Pope released a statement saying something to this effect and explaining that heaven was a state of union with God and hell was a state of separation from God. So they are sort of like states of being. One may gravitate toward either one right now, while still on earth. THe people who gravitated toward hell during their earthly lives are going to get even more hell when they die, and the people who gravitated toward heaven in their lives are going to experience a greater heaven when they die.

Quote:


if it does exist, hell that is.  who decides who is invited?




In the words of C.S Lewis, the door to hell is always locked from the inside. He meant that people put themselves in hell by rejecting God, who represents the only good. Those who willfully choose evil and then refuse to repent or turn back even when confronted with their wickedness, are effectively sending themselves to hell.

I have even heard it stated that hell is a form of God's mercy, because for these people, being in heaven in the presence of God would be even more hellish for them than being in hell. Hell is effectively the furthest they can get from God and so God allows them to go there out of his great mercy.

A great book about heaven and hell is the Great Divorce by CS Lewis.


--------------------
The path of the herbalist is to open ourselves to nature in an innocent and pure way. SHe in turn will open her bounty and reward us with many valuable secrets. May the earth bless you. - Michael Tierra


Edited by Peyote Road (10/11/15 09:08 PM)


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OfflineLucisM
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Re: does hell exist? [Re: champinhom]
    #22365577 - 10/11/15 09:09 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

champinhom said:
The older I get, the more I believe in the reality of evil and in the existence of the devil.






I can get behind this.  When I study left handed paths such as Satanism I feel as if there is an evil with radiates from that, maybe it's from so many people putting so much energy into it that it becomes reality, I don't know.  I also know some Satanists that are not evil, but do well.

I don't know if my mind has been conditioned to think this though because of being raised in a Christian home.  I feel like whenever I am reading about left handed paths that I automatically associate it with evil, and then my mind is made up and I have a hard time seeing it any other way.

But there are some interesting near death experiences one can read about where people have experienced hell.  One scenario I think might play out when we die, is the having a choice of heaven and hell.  I think mankind is naturally selfish, and when we die we have a choice, but in order for us to choose eternal life (heaven) we must be humble and possibly admit faults before some great energy which judges us at the end our lives (God).  Mankind is such a selfish creature, this is where hell come into play, because some people will be bitter even in the after life and choose not to humble themselves and right their wrongs, this causes them to be sent to hell for a period of time to mull things over.  Maybe God is observing us in this hell to see if we learn our lesson, and if so then we are vanquished from "eternal damnation" but hey this is just one thought on the subject I have.


Oh yeah, I am not a Satanist in anyway, I just like researching why some people believe what they believe, I find that fascinating.


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Invisibleenlightened seed
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Re: does hell exist? [Re: Lucis]
    #22365624 - 10/11/15 09:17 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

i often wonder why people believe what they do.  i think it is kind of comical how no one actually knows the truth(whatever that means) but are so closed minded when it comes to certain topics.


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OfflineLucisM
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Re: does hell exist? [Re: enlightened seed]
    #22365686 - 10/11/15 09:26 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

I agree, which is why I find my God in nature where I don't see so many strings attached.:lol:

I want to understand why someone is a Muslim, Christian, Buddhist, Satanist, etc, so that I can better understand my fellow man and have more meaningful relationships with them.


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Invisibleenlightened seed
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Re: does hell exist? [Re: Lucis]
    #22365786 - 10/11/15 09:44 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Fennario said:
I agree, which is why I find my God in nature where I don't see so many strings attached.:lol:

I want to understand why someone is a Muslim, Christian, Buddhist, Satanist, etc, so that I can better understand my fellow man and have more meaningful relationships with them.





culture and/or upbringing maybe?  i am not sure what to think about religion as i believe that there is a higher power than religion.  i could go on for days on end so i am abruptly stopping when it comes to my opinion.


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Offlinemuckamuck
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Re: does hell exist? [Re: enlightened seed]
    #22365824 - 10/11/15 09:49 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

When consciousness goes underground at night we dream or we might have nightmares... I think it's likely that something similar happens when we die, but I don't believe anything is permanent. The afterlife could be a chaotic spectrum, the mind opens access to heaven and hell and we gravitate to whichever one we identify with more, or the one that is our karmic lot. Just speculatin,


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:hank:


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Invisibleenlightened seed
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Re: does hell exist? [Re: muckamuck]
    #22365846 - 10/11/15 09:53 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

death is inevitable.


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Offlinemuckamuck
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Re: does hell exist? [Re: enlightened seed]
    #22365911 - 10/11/15 10:03 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

So is life..
Actually the movie Jacobs Ladder is kind of what I see happening


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OfflinePeyote Road
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Re: does hell exist? [Re: Lucis]
    #22365931 - 10/11/15 10:08 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Fennario said:
I agree, which is why I find my God in nature where I don't see so many strings attached.:lol:

I want to understand why someone is a Muslim, Christian, Buddhist, Satanist, etc, so that I can better understand my fellow man and have more meaningful relationships with them.





I find God in nature as well, but I found studying religions valuable in helping me find God in the human realm, which is where I initially could not find Him.


--------------------
The path of the herbalist is to open ourselves to nature in an innocent and pure way. SHe in turn will open her bounty and reward us with many valuable secrets. May the earth bless you. - Michael Tierra


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Invisibleenlightened seed
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Re: does hell exist? [Re: Peyote Road]
    #22365960 - 10/11/15 10:15 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Peyote Road said:
Quote:

Fennario said:
I agree, which is why I find my God in nature where I don't see so many strings attached.:lol:

I want to understand why someone is a Muslim, Christian, Buddhist, Satanist, etc, so that I can better understand my fellow man and have more meaningful relationships with them.





I find God in nature as well, but I found studying religions valuable in helping me find God in the human realm, which is where I initially could not find Him.





i am still confused as to what "god" really is?  i sure hope that all the people that believe in god are not brainwashed into believing something besides what they think.  brainwashing has been very extensively used though out human history.


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InvisibleVitalux
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Re: does hell exist? [Re: enlightened seed] * 1
    #22365986 - 10/11/15 10:21 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

enlightened seed said:
does hell exist





You were born into it.
Welcome to hell

Spanish Inquisition



Armenian Genocide



Japanese War crimes



American War crimes



Famine




Yes there is Hell WE have someone running our world that must be the devil:shrug:


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Invisibleenlightened seed
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Re: does hell exist? [Re: Vitalux]
    #22365997 - 10/11/15 10:24 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Vitalux said:
Quote:

enlightened seed said:
does hell exist





You were born into it.
Welcome to hell

Spanish Inquisition



Armenian Genocide



Japanese War crimes



American War crimes



Famine




Yes there is Hell WE have someone running our world that must be the devil:shrug:





there is a good possibility you are correct that we are born into hell!


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OfflineLucisM
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Re: does hell exist? [Re: enlightened seed]
    #22366058 - 10/11/15 10:43 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

enlightened seed said:
i am still confused as to what "god" really is? 





I was confused about what God was for many years, but the more I just went about living my life and trying to do well in all avenues of my existence the happier I was, the more I tried to figure out exactly what God was the more depressed I became.


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Invisibleenlightened seed
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Re: does hell exist? [Re: Lucis]
    #22366107 - 10/11/15 10:58 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Fennario said:
Quote:

enlightened seed said:
i am still confused as to what "god" really is? 





I was confused about what God was for many years, but the more I just went about living my life and trying to do well in all avenues of my existence the happier I was, the more I tried to figure out exactly what God was the more depressed I became.




that is a good way of looking at things.  for the last four years i have had auditory hallucinations that the doctors think(as do i) were brought on by stress.  looking back at things i would say i was going crazy.  things are getting better with time though thankfully.  the things i have been going through just bring different thought to my mind.  it has just made me wonder more about what there is after what we refer to as life.


Edited by enlightened seed (10/11/15 11:18 PM)


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OfflineArctic W. Fox
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Re: does hell exist? [Re: enlightened seed]
    #22366135 - 10/11/15 11:05 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

enlightened seed said:
does hell exist






Quote:

Chris Kelvin:
Am I alive, or dead?



Quote:

Rheya Kelvin:
We don't have to think like that any more. We're together now. Everything we've done is forgiven. Everything...




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Re: does hell exist? [Re: Lucis]
    #22366184 - 10/11/15 11:20 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

I think hell or some form of it definitely exists. The reason I think this is that I have been experiencing a version of it since my last bad trip a little over a month ago.

I am reminded of a quote from the move Waking Life, when the main character or someone is flipping through the channels on TV, and one of them is a preacher and he says:

In heaven you rise to the level of your fullness of love, in Hell you sink to the level of your lack of love.

I have previously risen very high in my level of love. Currently I'm in a state of lack of love far fouler than anything I could have previously imagined.

I have erred significantly, not by being a bad person per se but by committing many sins of omission and not working on myself. In truth, I have been quite selfish the past few years and I have avoided self-reflection at all costs. On a recent trip and subsequent plunge into a type of psychosis this has only been confirmed for me.

The worst part is that I now see my laziness coming back to me as a serious punishment. Whether dealt from God or my own psyche I'm not sure if it truly matters, my experience is the same. Nothing is as good as it was prior to this. Everything is worse. I have no appetite, food tastes worse, I don't know when to shit, I can't sleep for more than a couple hours at a time, I have constant headaches, my memory is atrocious, I have zero sex drive, I am only experiencing negative synchronicities, and also having very bad luck. Of course, it could be much worse, right now it's bad luck in a trivial way, flat tire here, tangled fishing lines there, lack of preparedness really. Not sure if it's hell but it's felt like it.


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Invisibleenlightened seed
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Re: does hell exist? [Re: halo]
    #22366198 - 10/11/15 11:28 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

halo said:
I think hell or some form of it definitely exists. The reason I think this is that I have been experiencing a version of it since my last bad trip a little over a month ago.

I am reminded of a quote from the move Waking Life, when the main character or someone is flipping through the channels on TV, and one of them is a preacher and he says:

In heaven you rise to the level of your fullness of love, in Hell you sink to the level of your lack of love.

I have previously risen very high in my level of love. Currently I'm in a state of lack of love far fouler than anything I could have previously imagined.

I have erred significantly, not by being a bad person per se but by committing many sins of omission and not working on myself. In truth, I have been quite selfish the past few years and I have avoided self-reflection at all costs. On a recent trip and subsequent plunge into a type of psychosis this has only been confirmed for me.

The worst part is that I now see my laziness coming back to me as a serious punishment. Whether dealt from God or my own psyche I'm not sure if it truly matters, my experience is the same. Nothing is as good as it was prior to this. Everything is worse. I have no appetite, food tastes worse, I don't know when to shit, I can't sleep for more than a couple hours at a time, I have constant headaches, my memory is atrocious, I have zero sex drive, I am only experiencing negative synchronicities, and also having very bad luck. Of course, it could be much worse, right now it's bad luck in a trivial way, flat tire here, tangled fishing lines there, lack of preparedness really. Not sure if it's hell but it's felt like it.




i have been going through something similar.  stick in there brother, things will either get better or worse(depending on the choices you make for yourself).  i wish you the best of luck.


Edited by enlightened seed (10/11/15 11:33 PM)


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