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Parafaragaramus
Conquistador



Registered: 01/21/13
Posts: 446
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Re: First Timer did lots of reading. Popcorn TeK. [Re: GreenHornThumb]
#22360039 - 10/10/15 05:35 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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oh yea after the first shake things get fun and they just grow extra fast.
what made you decide to do popcorn instead of like wbs? I've only ever read mixed to negative things about it so I never tried it
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GreenHornThumb
Whisperer Of The Myc



Registered: 10/08/15
Posts: 367
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Re: First Timer did lots of reading. Popcorn TeK. [Re: Parafaragaramus]
#22360063 - 10/10/15 05:41 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Archenemy_6 said: oh yea after the first shake things get fun and they just grow extra fast.
what made you decide to do popcorn instead of like wbs? I've only ever read mixed to negative things about it so I never tried it
Well honestly I like choosing the underdog. Also the prep time with the popcorn was such a breeze.
I used http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/17007040/fpart/all/vc/1
And I have nothing but success.
I didn't like the prep time of wbs a lot of washing and rinsing and boiling.
For what I'm doing i believe popcorn is good enough. It helps me save on verm also.
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GreenHornThumb
Whisperer Of The Myc



Registered: 10/08/15
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Re: First Timer did lots of reading. Popcorn TeK. [Re: GreenHornThumb]
#22363490 - 10/11/15 02:06 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Updated post shake. So far so good. The white is back and spreading. Just inoculated another jar of corn with some pes Hawaiian for an experiment.
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LazyMonkey
Stranger

Registered: 08/16/15
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Last seen: 7 years, 10 months
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Re: First Timer did lots of reading. Popcorn TeK. [Re: GreenHornThumb]
#22368042 - 10/12/15 12:34 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Putting my reply here, instead of in the oat prep thread since this is more specific towards you than the overall oat tek.
Disclaimer. I have not personally done a g2g transfer yet. I will be dropping agar to grains (pastyplate tiger dropped in a SAB) soon, when clean plates are fully colonized.
From what I've read, it's simple enough to do if you have either a still air box or a laminar flow hood. Look up g2g transfers, but basically you shake up your spawn and carefuly dump a portion of your colonized spawn into sterilized grain. I believe about 1/10 of a jar is standard, but popcorn being a bigger grain will have fewer inoculation points than WBS or others. Give it a shake to distribute the popcorn throughout the oats and then wait. Treat the oats then, as you did your popcorn. Wait for 30/50% colonization and then shake, wait for full colonization and then spawn to bulk.
I'm not an expert. Others may have much better advice than I, but that is the way I would approach it with my current level of (non-existent) skill. Keep your sterile tek good, and you should be relatively safe in doing it this way.
You could also dump a bit of popcorn into the oat jar, then the remainder of popcorn put to bulk to fruit as you would normally. Saving the oat jar to make a new 'master' so that when it is fully colonized, you can then do another round of transfers to fresh jars and start the whole cycle over again.
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GreenHornThumb
Whisperer Of The Myc



Registered: 10/08/15
Posts: 367
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Re: First Timer did lots of reading. Popcorn TeK. [Re: LazyMonkey]
#22368081 - 10/12/15 12:46 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
LazyMonkey said: Putting my reply here, instead of in the oat prep thread since this is more specific towards you than the overall oat tek.
Disclaimer. I have not personally done a g2g transfer yet. I will be dropping agar to grains (pastyplate tiger dropped in a SAB) soon, when clean plates are fully colonized.
From what I've read, it's simple enough to do if you have either a still air box or a laminar flow hood. Look up g2g transfers, but basically you shake up your spawn and carefuly dump a portion of your colonized spawn into sterilized grain. I believe about 1/10 of a jar is standard, but popcorn being a bigger grain will have fewer inoculation points than WBS or others. Give it a shake to distribute the popcorn throughout the oats and then wait. Treat the oats then, as you did your popcorn. Wait for 30/50% colonization and then shake, wait for full colonization and then spawn to bulk.
I'm not an expert. Others may have much better advice than I, but that is the way I would approach it with my current level of (non-existent) skill. Keep your sterile tek good, and you should be relatively safe in doing it this way.
You could also dump a bit of popcorn into the oat jar, then the remainder of popcorn put to bulk to fruit as you would normally. Saving the oat jar to make a new 'master' so that when it is fully colonized, you can then do another round of transfers to fresh jars and start the whole cycle over again.
Thanks for the reply kind sir. I actually have a small kids tent+SAB. Its kind of like a personal sterile room. I make sure i have gloves / mask, clean clothes etc. Spray the inside of the tent etc wipe it all down. Now I dont enter it just my hands enough to see what im doing through a clear section of the tent and the SAB. I havnt seen any contam or wierd things yet so I think this is working.
I was looking into agar but I dont understand the benefit of it? Could i have an agar plate with good myc on it and do a transfer to grains? So i wont have to keep doing jar to jar ? Is the risk higher but worth because the myc is so developed that it colonizes the jar faster?
found my answer
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/20436992/fpart/1/vc/1
I will probably do this
Quote:
Hotnuts said: Sounds good. You can simply take a fat rhizo strand out of the jar with a pair of sterile tweezers or knife to use for applying to the agar. Like a strand that's crawling up toward the top of the jar on the surface of the grains.
I will look up agar teks to see what I can find that I like / has good success.
Edited by GreenHornThumb (10/12/15 12:55 PM)
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LazyMonkey
Stranger

Registered: 08/16/15
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Re: First Timer did lots of reading. Popcorn TeK. [Re: GreenHornThumb]
#22368178 - 10/12/15 01:10 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Exactly. Reading has saved me a lot of headaches so far. I've got my second round of agar plates almost fully colonized and they all look to be clean. The first plates (inoculated from multispore syringe from vendor) still look clean as well, so that encourages me to think that I have minimal risk of hidden contams on the 2nd set of plates. I want my first attempt at growing mushrooms to be successful, so I am trying to eliminate as many contamination variables as possible and using methods that suit my mindset and approach to this project.
For going from agar to grains, I intend to use the 'tiger drop' method with 'pastyplates'.
Pastywhytes easy agar tek
The Tiger Drop.
Also you may want to look at grain to grain in a still air box.
But overall, grain to grain is faster than agar to grain. With grain to grain, you will have many different places in the receiving jar spread out through the grain for the myc to grow out from. With agar, there will be fewer inoculation points so full coverage will take longer. I'm using agar to make sure that my myc is clean, because obviously there's no practical way to tell if a vendors syringe is clean until you grow it out and see if contaminants form. I'd rather toss a little bit of agar in the trash, than whole jars of grains that I have gone through the trouble of preparing. If your agar or your grain spawn is clean, then risk of additional contamination is minimized.
I plan on doing the 'Tiger Drop' method, since to me it seems less risky than cutting wedges out of agar and transferring those. It suits my mindset better at least, but many people have success with both methods. Using smaller grains, like WBS, millet, grass seed, means that in a given volume from a jar, the number of inoculation points (Colonized grains) will be higher than from something like oats or popcorn, which will make the colonization faster. At least to my understanding, which is based off of reading and research and not practical experience at this point. So of course take anything I say with a grain of salt and do your own research to verify or disprove my suggestions.
The tent with a SAB inside of it seems like overkill to me personally, but I will not fault your effort to ensure sterility. If it works for you, and obviously it has been so far, then go with it.
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GreenHornThumb
Whisperer Of The Myc



Registered: 10/08/15
Posts: 367
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Re: First Timer did lots of reading. Popcorn TeK. [Re: LazyMonkey]
#22368215 - 10/12/15 01:18 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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So essentially if my sterilization tek is on point and my myc is clean there's really no need for agar if I can just g2g multiple jars to keep the good myc flowing?
updated OP with today's pic fluffy nice myc everywhere nice full shake recovery
Edited by GreenHornThumb (10/12/15 01:26 PM)
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LazyMonkey
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Re: First Timer did lots of reading. Popcorn TeK. [Re: GreenHornThumb]
#22368260 - 10/12/15 01:29 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
GreenHornThumb said: So essentially if my sterilization tek is on point and my myc is clean there's really no need for agar if I can just g2g multiple jars to keep the good myc flowing?
That's how I understand it for the most part. Senescence is something that could be an issue if you keep myc from the same original sample going long enough, but I don't really know how long that takes to set in. It's one aspect I don't have a good understanding of myself yet.
If you want to try cloning from pins, or isolating higher performing cultures out of what you have already? That is another application of agar, so it still has a use. It just depends on whether or not that is something you will be trying out later.
Is agar necessary? If you can get clean spawn, then I'd say it's not entirely necessary. If you start having problems, it's a good way to help get past that. I believe agar is a useful tool to have in your toolbox of tricks for success, but it's not absolutely necessary.
g2g is awesome for multiplying your spawn. My plan is to go from agar to grains, but then use g2g after that. With agar as a starting point for new myc cultures and experimenting with cloning and isolation.
Edit: Looking good to me!
Edited by LazyMonkey (10/12/15 01:32 PM)
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GreenHornThumb
Whisperer Of The Myc



Registered: 10/08/15
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Re: First Timer did lots of reading. Popcorn TeK. [Re: LazyMonkey]
#22368269 - 10/12/15 01:32 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
LazyMonkey said:
Quote:
GreenHornThumb said: So essentially if my sterilization tek is on point and my myc is clean there's really no need for agar if I can just g2g multiple jars to keep the good myc flowing?
That's how I understand it for the most part. Senescence is something that could be an issue if you keep myc from the same original sample going long enough, but I don't really know how long that takes to set in. It's one aspect I don't have a good understanding of myself yet.
If you want to try cloning from pins, or isolating higher performing cultures out of what you have already? That is another application of agar, so it still has a use. It just depends on whether or not that is something you will be trying out later.
Is agar necessary? If you can get clean spawn, then I'd say it's not entirely necessary. If you start having problems, it's a good way to help get past that. I believe agar is a useful tool to have in your toolbox of tricks for success, but it's not absolutely necessary.
g2g is awesome for multiplying your spawn. My plan is to go from agar to grains, but then use g2g after that. With agar as a starting point for new myc cultures and experimenting with cloning and isolation.
Ah I understand less room for wasted time when trying to get a healthy culture started to transfer to a spawn. Instead of waiting weeks to see if your jar is going to be good do an agar plate and go from there. I'll probably do an agar after fruiting from a stem of a good shroom like RR videos.
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LazyMonkey
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Re: First Timer did lots of reading. Popcorn TeK. [Re: LazyMonkey]
#22368309 - 10/12/15 01:42 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Right. I'm lazy, in many ways. Thus my name. I'd rather do it once, and get it right the first time, than do it twice 'cause I screwed up along the way.
Now that I know my first syringe is pretty clean though, that gives me more confidence. It still takes time on agar, but it suits me to take this approach.
I've read plenty of accounts of people having contamination due to the syringes or prints they started from, not just from contams in their work space. So I wanted to to be able to work around that. I went with a reputable vendor that was recommended as providing good clean spores and so far I'd say that the reputation is well earned.
I could have gone straight to grains, but I'm a little paranoid.
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GreenHornThumb
Whisperer Of The Myc



Registered: 10/08/15
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Re: First Timer did lots of reading. Popcorn TeK. [Re: LazyMonkey]
#22368403 - 10/12/15 02:05 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
LazyMonkey said: Right. I'm lazy, in many ways. Thus my name. I'd rather do it once, and get it right the first time, than do it twice 'cause I screwed up along the way.
Now that I know my first syringe is pretty clean though, that gives me more confidence. It still takes time on agar, but it suits me to take this approach.
I've read plenty of accounts of people having contamination due to the syringes or prints they started from, not just from contams in their work space. So I wanted to to be able to work around that. I went with a reputable vendor that was recommended as providing good clean spores and so far I'd say that the reputation is well earned.
I could have gone straight to grains, but I'm a little paranoid.
Ah now I completely understand. I'm looking forward to the oats. Been seeing some good stuff. I got my coir ready and ordered gypsum for the oats. I might try to do an experiment and add gypsum to the bulk sub for a few jars of popcorn and some without.
http://www.amazon.com/Espoma-Organic-Traditions-Garden-Gypsum/dp/B000KL5HVQ
Only thing I don't understand much is the lime stone. So you can add gypsum to the soak and to the substrate but for a casing lime is recommended?
Edited by GreenHornThumb (10/12/15 03:56 PM)
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NDStepp84
Stellar nuclear waste


Registered: 04/23/15
Posts: 4,956
Last seen: 1 month, 3 days
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Re: First Timer did lots of reading. Popcorn TeK. [Re: GreenHornThumb] 1
#22369080 - 10/12/15 04:24 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Pasty's no pour is a great easy method, once you start doing agar and see how easy and beneficial it is, you will wish you started with it from the get go, everyone probably wishes they started sooner. Read Agar what why and how it explains the basics and benefits
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"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do. -Robert A. Heinlein
Links and teks ND's grow log and discussion Plant thread
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GreenHornThumb
Whisperer Of The Myc



Registered: 10/08/15
Posts: 367
Last seen: 6 months, 17 days
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Re: First Timer did lots of reading. Popcorn TeK. [Re: NDStepp84]
#22369238 - 10/12/15 04:49 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
NDStepp84 said: Pasty's no pour is a great easy method, once you start doing agar and see how easy and beneficial it is, you will wish you started with it from the get go, everyone probably wishes they started sooner. Read Agar what why and how it explains the basics and benefits
I book marked that thank you. I will look into this after my first flush to see if I yield some nice ones. I would probably do stem to agar.
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GreenHornThumb
Whisperer Of The Myc



Registered: 10/08/15
Posts: 367
Last seen: 6 months, 17 days
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Re: First Timer did lots of reading. Popcorn TeK. [Re: GreenHornThumb]
#22374053 - 10/13/15 03:46 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Can't wait

Updated OP with strongest myc jar
Edited by GreenHornThumb (10/13/15 04:11 PM)
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Psilosoulful

Registered: 09/05/14
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Re: First Timer did lots of reading. Popcorn TeK. [Re: GreenHornThumb]
#22374503 - 10/13/15 05:17 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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LazyMonkey
Stranger

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Re: First Timer did lots of reading. Popcorn TeK. [Re: Psilosoulful]
#22375571 - 10/13/15 08:27 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Now that looks familiar. Rock on.
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GreenHornThumb
Whisperer Of The Myc



Registered: 10/08/15
Posts: 367
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Re: First Timer did lots of reading. Popcorn TeK. [Re: LazyMonkey]
#22375621 - 10/13/15 08:38 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Should I start prepping / trying agar and practice with some syringes ?
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LazyMonkey
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Re: First Timer did lots of reading. Popcorn TeK. [Re: GreenHornThumb]
#22375658 - 10/13/15 08:44 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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How about this for an answer. Why not?
Especially since you only need a single drop of spore solution on an agar plate, a syringe goes a long, long way.
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Psilosoulful

Registered: 09/05/14
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Re: First Timer did lots of reading. Popcorn TeK. [Re: GreenHornThumb]
#22375691 - 10/13/15 08:49 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
GreenHornThumb said: Should I start prepping / trying agar and practice with some syringes ?
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GreenHornThumb
Whisperer Of The Myc



Registered: 10/08/15
Posts: 367
Last seen: 6 months, 17 days
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Re: First Timer did lots of reading. Popcorn TeK. [Re: LazyMonkey]
#22375704 - 10/13/15 08:50 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
LazyMonkey said: How about this for an answer. Why not?
Especially since you only need a single drop of spore solution on an agar plate, a syringe goes a long, long way.
Gotcha yea I got nothing much else to do. I was even checking up on some baddy brf jars I buried. They are actually eating the small casing I had on top hmm. I'll keep an eye on there.
Quote:
Psilosoulful said:
Quote:
GreenHornThumb said: Should I start prepping / trying agar and practice with some syringes ?


I'll agar research tomorrow to see how I want to do it.
Edited by GreenHornThumb (10/13/15 08:53 PM)
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