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qman
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
#22422416 - 10/23/15 10:46 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
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burgerbrain said: I thought libs wanted to help the poor? Do libtards think that the poor own stock on the stock market? HAHAHAHAHAHAH Hilarious.
So tell us what conservatives will do for the poor. 
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burgerbrain said: Obama increased taxes on everyone-and in different ways. Obowmacare itself is a fucking tax, or does that not count in libtard land?
It's not a tax if you would buy health insurance anyway. And if you couldn't buy it before, now you can afford it. Ten million more people are now insured.
Insured in name only, is a $8000 deductible with a 60/40 hospital stay health "coverage"? No it's not.
"now you can afford it"
How come so many saw their premiums go up substantially for the same coverage? The insurance and health care companies aren't making record profits because they're the ones taking a hit on this new policy.
Edited by qman (10/23/15 10:46 AM)
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Stonehenge
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: qman]
#22422695 - 10/23/15 12:22 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Obumble helps the rich and steals from the poor, a reverse robin hood. Yet the deluded libs remember he is supposed to be on their side so they keep repeating the lies they were told.
The worst president ever.
-------------------- “A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835) Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: qman]
#22422942 - 10/23/15 01:19 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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qman said: Insured in name only, is a $8000 deductible with a 60/40 hospital stay health "coverage"?
An $8000 deductible beats a $100,000 bill does it not???
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qman said: How come so many saw their premiums go up substantially for the same coverage?
Please show me evidence of this. Premium growth slowed under Obamacare, and those whose went up substantially did so because their old coverage didn't meet the minimum requirements of Obamacare (in other words, their premiums went up because they got better coverage).
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qman said: The insurance and health care companies aren't making record profits because they're the ones taking a hit on this new policy. 
I agree, it was foolish to keep private insurance companies in the mix. But they had too much lobbying power to be removed from the equation. If we get rid of them and move to single payer, prices should drop substantially.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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hostileuniverse
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
#22423105 - 10/23/15 01:53 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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An $8000 deductible beats a $100,000 bill does it not???
Not when you can't see your doctor anymore because you can't pay the first $6,000, which forces an emergency room visit, which cost even more
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Please show me evidence of this. Premium growth slowed under Obamacare, and those whose went up substantially did so because their old coverage didn't meet the minimum requirements of Obamacare (in other words, their premiums went up because they got better coverage).
Yeah, show him your medical records! Get real Fail, this info is easily found, and the better plans, yeah, because every 50 year old needs maternity leave and birth control...
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I agree, it was foolish to keep private insurance companies in the mix. But they had too much lobbying power to be removed from the equation. If we get rid of them and move to single payer, prices should drop substantially.
That's been debunked many times, When you start price fixing, shortages are inevitable, so costs are less because people aren't being seen, old people are told to go die, yeah, great fucking plan
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: hostileuniverse]
#22423277 - 10/23/15 02:28 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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hostileuniverse said:
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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said: An $8000 deductible beats a $100,000 bill does it not???
Not when you can't see your doctor anymore because you can't pay the first $6,000, which forces an emergency room visit, which cost even more
No wonder you're against Obamacare - you know absolutely nothing about it. Preventative care is free under Obamacare.
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hostileuniverse said:
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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said: Please show me evidence of this. Premium growth slowed under Obamacare, and those whose went up substantially did so because their old coverage didn't meet the minimum requirements of Obamacare (in other words, their premiums went up because they got better coverage).
Yeah, show him your medical records! Get real Fail, this info is easily found, and the better plans, yeah, because every 50 year old needs maternity leave and birth control...
Maternity leave has nothing to do with Obamacare. 
And yes, having coverage is better than not having coverage.
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hostileuniverse said:
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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said: I agree, it was foolish to keep private insurance companies in the mix. But they had too much lobbying power to be removed from the equation. If we get rid of them and move to single payer, prices should drop substantially.
That's been debunked many times, When you start price fixing, shortages are inevitable, so costs are less because people aren't being seen, old people are told to go die, yeah, great fucking plan
It hasn't been debunked; just the opposite. Medicare has proven it works.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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hostileuniverse
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
#22423383 - 10/23/15 03:12 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Having coverage is not better than not having coverage when you still can't afford it, lol
Medicare is such a success? Why do doctors limit the number of Medicare patients they accept?
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: hostileuniverse]
#22423640 - 10/23/15 04:19 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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hostileuniverse said: Having coverage is not better than not having coverage when you still can't afford it, lol
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An $8000 deductible beats a $100,000 bill does it not???
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hostileuniverse said: Medicare is such a success? Why do doctors limit the number of Medicare patients they accept?
Most of these doctors are not just limiting Medicare patients, but any patients with health insurance. They simply don't want to deal with the insurance companies.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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hostileuniverse
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
#22423728 - 10/23/15 04:43 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
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hostileuniverse said: Having coverage is not better than not having coverage when you still can't afford it, lol
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An $8000 deductible beats a $100,000 bill does it not???
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hostileuniverse said: Medicare is such a success? Why do doctors limit the number of Medicare patients they accept?
Most of these doctors are not just limiting Medicare patients, but any patients with health insurance. They simply don't want to deal with the insurance companies.
Well they have to limit the number of patients they see because you know, only so many hours in a day, or maybe you don't, you do ride the magical socialism train... Anyway, they limit Medicare patients because the govt price fixes, and they can't make a fucking living off them! That's why singlepayer leads to shortages, waiting lists, death panels...
Have fun with that, in my later years, I'll be flying to hong Kong for my HC, if the socialists have their way, just like now the Canadians come here for healthcare, if they can afford it, lol
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: hostileuniverse]
#22423862 - 10/23/15 05:16 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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You once again ignored my point that many doctors are limiting ALL insurance claims for the same reason. If you can afford healthcare without insurance (like the Canadians that come here), good for you. But most people can't.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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hostileuniverse
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
#22423879 - 10/23/15 05:19 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said: You once again ignored my point that many doctors are limiting ALL insurance claims for the same reason. If you can afford healthcare without insurance (like the Canadians that come here), good for you. But most people can't.
You wrong, because insurance is a good bet for doctors, it always pays
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qman
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: Stonehenge]
#22424024 - 10/23/15 05:51 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Stonehenge said: Obumble helps the rich and steals from the poor, a reverse robin hood. Yet the deluded libs remember he is supposed to be on their side so they keep repeating the lies they were told.
The worst president ever.
The NY bankers on Wall Street didn't put him into office to enhance civil rights, they got exactly what they wanted.
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Stonehenge
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Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 14,850
Loc: S.E.
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
#22424146 - 10/23/15 06:20 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Health insurance has gone up under the aca, its a disaster. I'm surprised you keep defending it, must be your loyalty to obumble even after he stabbed everyone in the back.
-------------------- “A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835) Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: Stonehenge]
#22425561 - 10/24/15 01:15 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
hostileuniverse said:
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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said: You once again ignored my point that many doctors are limiting ALL insurance claims for the same reason. If you can afford healthcare without insurance (like the Canadians that come here), good for you. But most people can't.
You wrong, because insurance is a good bet for doctors, it always pays
Then why are so many doctors rejecting insurance?
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Stonehenge said: Health insurance has gone up under the aca, its a disaster. I'm surprised you keep defending it, must be your loyalty to obumble even after he stabbed everyone in the back.
I'm actually not defending it. It was stupid for Obamacare to allow private insurers to stay. I'm simply dispelling lies about it.
If you hate it, then say why you really hate it. Don't lie about it.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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hostileuniverse
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
#22425800 - 10/24/15 04:21 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:
hostileuniverse said:
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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said: You once again ignored my point that many doctors are limiting ALL insurance claims for the same reason. If you can afford healthcare without insurance (like the Canadians that come here), good for you. But most people can't.
You wrong, because insurance is a good bet for doctors, it always pays
Then why are so many doctors rejecting insurance?
Quote:
Stonehenge said: Health insurance has gone up under the aca, its a disaster. I'm surprised you keep defending it, must be your loyalty to obumble even after he stabbed everyone in the back.
I'm actually not defending it. It was stupid for Obamacare to allow private insurers to stay. I'm simply dispelling lies about it.
If you hate it, then say why you really hate it. Don't lie about it. 
Wow, did you even read the link you posted? It says right there that the high costs of processing claims is why, not becaus the insurers aren't paying, lol. It's quite a different story with Medicare, where they have the processing costs along with price fixing.
The other thing that article proves is what Ive been saying all along, The reason why healthcare is so expensive is because the provider is no longer paid by the patient, cut out the middleman, and prices come down, that's a great example of free market capitalism!
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
#22427625 - 10/24/15 02:54 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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hostileuniverse said: Wow, did you even read the link you posted? It says right there that the high costs of processing claims is why, not becaus the insurers aren't paying, lol.
I never said insurance doesn't pay. Let's follow the conversation:
hostileuniverse said: Why do doctors limit the number of Medicare patients they accept? Falcon91Wolvrn03 said: Most of these doctors are not just limiting Medicare patients, but any patients with health insurance. They simply don't want to deal with the insurance companies. hostileuniverse said: insurance is a good bet for doctors, it always pays Falcon91Wolvrn03 said: Then why are so many doctors rejecting insurance?" hostileuniverse said: Wow, did you even read the link you posted? It says right there that the high costs of processing claims is why, not becaus the insurers aren't paying, lol.
Which is what I told you in the first place (they don't want to deal with insurance companies).
Quote:
hostileuniverse said: The other thing that article proves is what Ive been saying all along, The reason why healthcare is so expensive is because the provider is no longer paid by the patient, cut out the middleman, and prices come down, that's a great example of free market capitalism!
That's what liberals here have been fighting for - single payer healthcare where you cut out the for profit insurance companies altogether. Even less cost than free market capitalism.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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hostileuniverse
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
#22427663 - 10/24/15 03:00 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Single payer is NOT cutting out the middleman, it's adding more.
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: hostileuniverse]
#22427721 - 10/24/15 03:12 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Eliminating for profit insurance companies is adding more? I don't follow your logic at all.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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hostileuniverse
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] 1
#22427741 - 10/24/15 03:17 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said: Eliminating for profit insurance companies is adding more? I don't follow your logic at all.
putting the govt in charge of healthcare, govt would be the middleman, and a huge bureaucracy would need to be created to run it, have you heard of the VA? thats single payer, its a fucking mess, thousands of soldiers dying on waiting lists for treatment
sound GOOD to you?
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: hostileuniverse]
#22427775 - 10/24/15 03:22 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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We already have Medicare. Just extend it to 'Medicare for All'. That would be FAR cheaper than giant for profit insurance companies.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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qman
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
#22427848 - 10/24/15 03:37 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said: We already have Medicare. Just extend it to 'Medicare for All'. That would be FAR cheaper than giant for profit insurance companies.
Insurance companies take 20% of heath care expenses to "control costs", with the average costs of heath care rising 11-12% annually for the past 25 years, they should be fired. How could the government do worse with 20% more revenue? They couldn't.
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