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Invisibleburgerbrain
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Posts: 962
Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #22410924 - 10/20/15 07:50 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Sorry, Bernie — Scandinavia is no socialist paradise after all
http://nypost.com/2015/10/19/sorry-bernie-scandinavia-is-no-socialist-paradise-after-all/


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #22411725 - 10/20/15 11:19 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
drivers licenses? and guess what? california just enacted a law that automatically registers you to vote when... wait for it... keep waiting... you get your drivers license! that state is fucked



Wrong again.

Quote:

licenses granted to undocumented immigrants under a new program in the state are "specially marked licenses, which do not entitle them to vote or board airplanes."  The law was implemented "to provide licenses to immigrants so they could legally drive to work and school and to improve traffic safety by requiring them to pass the driver's license test and get insurance."

California Law Makes Clear That Only U.S. Citizens Are Eligible To Vote. According to California state law, one must be "a United States citizen" in order to be eligible to vote




Lesson - NEVER trust Fox for news.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Invisibleburgerbrain
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #22411770 - 10/20/15 11:38 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
drivers licenses? and guess what? california just enacted a law that automatically registers you to vote when... wait for it... keep waiting... you get your drivers license! that state is fucked



Wrong again.

Quote:

licenses granted to undocumented immigrants under a new program in the state are "specially marked licenses, which do not entitle them to vote or board airplanes."  The law was implemented "to provide licenses to immigrants so they could legally drive to work and school and to improve traffic safety by requiring them to pass the driver's license test and get insurance."

California Law Makes Clear That Only U.S. Citizens Are Eligible To Vote. According to California state law, one must be "a United States citizen" in order to be eligible to vote




Lesson - NEVER trust Fox for news.





Mediamatters.org? HAHAHAHAHAHA Super left wing libnut code-pink welfare whackjob garbage. You read that drivel site?


WASHINGTON — The Supreme Court ruled on Monday in a 7-to-2 decision that Arizona may not require documentary proof of citizenship from people seeking to vote in federal elections there.
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/18/us/justices-reject-arizona-voting-law-requiring-proof-of-citizenship.html?_r=0

Democrats Want Illegals To Vote Because They Vote Democrat
Read More At Investor's Business Daily: http://news.investors.com/ibd-editorials/052915-754980-rasmussen-poll-on-illegals-voting-reveals-political-motivation.htm#ixzz3pB67Dk00


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: burgerbrain]
    #22411852 - 10/21/15 12:10 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

can you provide any evidence for widespread voter fraud by illegals?


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Invisibleburgerbrain
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: ballsalsa]
    #22412043 - 10/21/15 01:00 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
can you provide any evidence for widespread voter fraud by illegals?





Use google, man.

"A poll by John McLaughlin confirms again we may have a significant problem with noncitizens participating illegally in our elections. Based on a sample survey of 800 Hispanics in 2013, McLaughlin found that of foreign-born respondents who were registered voters, 13 percent admitted they were not United States citizens.

In our 2012 book on voter fraud, John Fund and I noted numerous cases of noncitizen registration and voting all over the country. Only a month ago, the Board of Immigration Appeals of the Executive Office for Immigration Review at the Justice Department held that a Peruvian citizen who illegally registered and voted in the 2006 congressional election could be deported for violating federal law. The only reason she was caught is because she applied for naturalization in 2007 and admitted in the INS interview that she had voted in an American election.

In 2014, a study released by three professors at Old Dominion University and George Mason University, based on survey data from the Cooperative Congressional Election Study, estimated 6.4 percent of noncitizens voted illegally in the 2008 presidential election"


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Edited by burgerbrain (10/21/15 01:06 AM)


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: burgerbrain]
    #22412061 - 10/21/15 01:08 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

burgerbrain said:
Mediamatters.org? HAHAHAHAHAHA Super left wing libnut code-pink welfare whackjob garbage.



I don't judge new sources based on how left or rightwing they are, but by how much of what they print is factual.  Mediamatters is correct.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Invisibleburgerbrain
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #22412068 - 10/21/15 01:11 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

burgerbrain said:
Mediamatters.org? HAHAHAHAHAHA Super left wing libnut code-pink welfare whackjob garbage.



I don't judge new sources based on how left or rightwing they are, but by how much of what they print is factual.  Mediamatters is correct.




Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Lesson - NEVER trust Fox for news.




:loldongs: Media matters is never correct. Fox news is about 100x more accurate than Mediatardmatters


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: burgerbrain]
    #22412069 - 10/21/15 01:13 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

yeah, i read the whole first page of google,(where you found that article) before i made my last post. All of that cites the same few studies, all of which are disputed and based on extrapolations from small sample sizes. 

Example:
Quote:

Based on a sample survey of 800 Hispanics in 2013




If you want to convince me, you'll have to do better.
I assume that thats what we're all doing here right? trying to convince each other of things?


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Invisibleburgerbrain
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: ballsalsa]
    #22412072 - 10/21/15 01:14 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
yeah, i read the whole first page of google,(where you found that article) before i made my last post. All of that cites the same few studies, all of which are disputed and based on extrapolations from small sample sizes. 

Example:
Quote:

Based on a sample survey of 800 Hispanics in 2013




If you want to convince me, you'll have to do better.
I assume that thats what we're all doing here right? trying to convince each other of things?




Nah they weren't disputed. Do you know what a link is?

Do you know that with surveys-they can't call every person in America right?

I guess I won't be responding to you unless you can back up your BS statements.

Correct me if I'm wrong: ANY illegals voting is a problem.


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: burgerbrain]
    #22412099 - 10/21/15 01:29 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Look, bro, respond to me or not at your own discretion.  I had your back when you first showed up around here, because i respected your willingness to defend you position against a mountain of opposition.  I gave you a good rating figuring that i would be encouraging another person to enter the debate on this forum.  I did that in good faith, assuming that you cared enough about the issues, to attack them, and maybe through that process, we could influence each others' opinions in positive ways.  That is the purpose of debate sir.  To do our best to approximate the truth of things through a sharing of informed viewpoint.  But if you aren't willing to question your worldview, debate is pointless.  It becomes mere sport.

Quote:


Nah they weren't disputed. Do you know what a link is?




Are you seriously questioning my ability to provide sources?
Be honest, in your experience, have i made claims without numerous sources to back them up?  just go back to the google search page, and read the first 5 articles.  they should all mention your cited studies and mention dispute by colleagues

edit: yes, any illegal voting is bad, the question is: How bad?  Is it worse than discouraging citizens from voting? Is that even an issue? Has anyone done the math?  these are some of the questions that must be asked before we can begin to tackle the subject of voter fraud by illegals.


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Edited by ballsalsa (10/21/15 01:41 AM)


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Invisibleburgerbrain
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: ballsalsa]
    #22412130 - 10/21/15 01:48 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
Look, bro, respond to me or not at your own discretion.  I had your back when you first showed up around here, because i respected your willingness to defend you position against a mountain of opposition.  I gave you a good rating figuring that i would be encouraging another person to enter the debate on this forum.  I did that in good faith, assuming that you cared enough about the issues, to attack them, and maybe through that process, we could influence each others' opinions in positive ways.  That is the purpose of debate sir.  To do our best to approximate the truth of things through a sharing of informed viewpoint.  But if you aren't willing to question your worldview, debate is pointless.  It becomes mere sport.

Quote:


Nah they weren't disputed. Do you know what a link is?




Are you seriously questioning my ability to provide sources?
Be honest, in your experience, have i made claims without numerous sources to back them up?  just go back to the google search page, and read the first 5 articles.  they should all mention your cited studies and mention dispute by colleagues

edit: yes, any illegal voting is bad, the question is: How bad?  Is it worse than discouraging citizens from voting? Is that even an issue? Has anyone done the math?  these are some of the questions that must be asked before we can begin to tackle the subject of voter fraud by illegals.






You didn't give me a good rating, wtf are you talking about.

Please back up your claims by posting links. Otherwise my studies stand. Post the google articles if you have them. I posted 3 studies and you just keep saying "disputed!" with no evidence.

Illegals voting is a travesty; it subverts the voting system and disenfranchises millions of LEGAL voters.
For how much you liberals claim to want to protect voting in America- Libs are fucking it over by not enforcing the law that "only LEGAL citizens can vote"


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: burgerbrain]
    #22412143 - 10/21/15 01:57 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

You didn't give me a good rating, wtf are you talking about.

Please back up your claims by posting links. Otherwise my studies stand. Post the google articles if you have them. I posted 3 studies and you just keep saying "disputed!" with no evidence.




I did give you a good rating, 5 shroomies.

I don't have to post links to material you have already read.  I am not here to "win" a debate.  Whether your studies "stand" or not, is irrelevant. I know, that if you bothered to read just one google page of articles, you wouldn't bother to question whether your studies have been disputed.  As i explained before, i'm not in the debate for the sport of it, i'm here for the exchange of ideas. I've rejected your cited studies. I implore you again sir, convince me.


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Invisiblepaperbackwriter
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: ballsalsa]
    #22412502 - 10/21/15 07:48 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
Quote:

You didn't give me a good rating, wtf are you talking about.

Please back up your claims by posting links. Otherwise my studies stand. Post the google articles if you have them. I posted 3 studies and you just keep saying "disputed!" with no evidence.




I did give you a good rating, 5 shroomies.

I don't have to post links to material you have already read.  I am not here to "win" a debate.  Whether your studies "stand" or not, is irrelevant. I know, that if you bothered to read just one google page of articles, you wouldn't bother to question whether your studies have been disputed.  As i explained before, i'm not in the debate for the sport of it, i'm here for the exchange of ideas. I've rejected your cited studies. I implore you again sir, convince me.




His response to your 5 was to call you a retard.


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Invisibleburgerbrain
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: ballsalsa]
    #22412755 - 10/21/15 09:04 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
Quote:

You didn't give me a good rating, wtf are you talking about.

Please back up your claims by posting links. Otherwise my studies stand. Post the google articles if you have them. I posted 3 studies and you just keep saying "disputed!" with no evidence.




I did give you a good rating, 5 shroomies.

I don't have to post links to material you have already read.  I am not here to "win" a debate.  Whether your studies "stand" or not, is irrelevant. I know, that if you bothered to read just one google page of articles, you wouldn't bother to question whether your studies have been disputed.  As i explained before, i'm not in the debate for the sport of it, i'm here for the exchange of ideas. I've rejected your cited studies. I implore you again sir, convince me.





You "win" debates by citing relevant information. You didn't cite anything just said "look at google"..

Those studies have not been disputed, there you go again making claims that you can't back up.

As you can see, I posted the fact that illegal alien voting is a travesty and you couldn't refute it. It seems I've already convinced you. I've won the debate.


--------------------


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Offlineqman
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: Stonehenge]
    #22412775 - 10/21/15 09:08 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
>US citizens are eligible for subsidies, yes.
Illegal aliens are not.

Illegals get drivers licenses now in cali. Whats to stop them from getting subsidies? What law stops them and is it enforced?

>Yeah, the ACA is kinda crappy. Obama and the Dems sold us all out to the insurance companies when they had majorities in both houses and they could have given us single payer.

No kidding. Obumble and the dems sold us down the river and Bernie and the dems will do it again. I'm slowly losing enthusiasm for bern-out after learning he wants open borders and keeping illegals plus putting them on obumblecare. He is a poor second or third choice, the hold your nose candidate if all others are worse.





"keeping illegals plus putting them on obumblecare"

That's why his plans for a utopia are unrealistic, you can't provide all of these free things without getting rid of the dysfunctional cultures.


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: burgerbrain]
    #22412935 - 10/21/15 09:41 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

burgerbrain said:
You "win" debates by citing relevant information. You didn't cite anything just said "look at google"..

Those studies have not been disputed, there you go again making claims that you can't back up.

As you can see, I posted the fact that illegal alien voting is a travesty and you couldn't refute it. It seems I've already convinced you. I've won the debate.





Quote:

burgerbrain said:
Quote:

ballsalsa said:
can you provide any evidence for widespread voter fraud by illegals?





Use google, man.





Now that that is settled, lets move on to the disputed studies.

Quote:

MYTH: Study Shows Huge Percentages Of Undocumented Immigrants Illegally Cast Votes

Fox Host Hyped Questionable Study To Stoke Fears That "Illegals Voted Between Two And Six Percent The Last Two Elections." Fox & Friends co-host Brian Kilmeade claimed a recent study found that "illegals voted between two and six percent over the last two elections," and said it "reveals a significant number of noncitizens casting votes alongside real citizens right here in the United States come election day." Fox guest Rachel Campos-Duffy of the Libre Initiative, a Koch-funded non-profit that targets Latino voters, speculated that non-citizen voting could have "national implications." [Fox News, Fox & Friends, 10/27/14]

FACT: Experts Have Cast Doubt On The Study's Methodology And Conclusion

Experts Raised Doubts About The Study's Methodology And Conclusion. Brown University political scientist Michael Tesler questioned the study's "methodological challenges," noting the possibility that non-citizens may have misreported their citizenship status. He pointed out that many self-reported non-citizens in 2012 reported being citizens in 2010, indicating a high rate of response error "which raises important doubts about their conclusions" Tesler also noted that a "number of academics and commentators have already expressed skepticism about that paper's assumptions and conclusions" which seem to be "tenuous at best." [The Washington Post, Monkey Cage, 10/27/14]

The Study's Authors Outlined The Limitations Of Their Findings. In a October 24 blog post in The Washington Post, Jessie Richman and David Earnest, two authors of the study, admitted that their "extrapolation to specific state-level or district-level election outcomes is fraught with substantial uncertainty." The authors noted that the non-citizen sample they examined was "modest" and relied on self-reporting, which can create errors, and attempts to verify the accuracy of the self-reporting was imperfect and supplemented by estimates. [The Washington Post, Monkey Cage, 10/27/14]




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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: burgerbrain]
    #22413550 - 10/21/15 12:31 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

burgerbrain said:
Quote:

Facon91Wolvrn03 said:
Wrong again.
Quote:

licenses granted to undocumented immigrants under a new program in the state are "specially marked licenses, which do not entitle them to vote or board airplanes."  The law was implemented "to provide licenses to immigrants so they could legally drive to work and school and to improve traffic safety by requiring them to pass the driver's license test and get insurance."

California Law Makes Clear That Only U.S. Citizens Are Eligible To Vote. According to California state law, one must be "a United States citizen" in order to be eligible to vote






:loldongs: Media matters is never correct. Fox news is about 100x more accurate than Mediatardmatters



Unfortunately for you, liberals generally require better proof that a laughing gif.  Sorry.  :shrug:


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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InvisibleStonehenge
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: burgerbrain] * 1
    #22414326 - 10/21/15 04:04 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Burg, you won the illegal voting aliens argument. The libs always fall apart and go straight to personal attacks when they know they lost. No matter what the law says they will cheat anyway. Why should they get licenses? Why should they get anything?


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“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: Stonehenge]
    #22414817 - 10/21/15 05:55 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
Burg, you won the illegal voting aliens argument. The libs always fall apart and go straight to personal attacks when they know they lost. No matter what the law says they will cheat anyway. Why should they get licenses? Why should they get anything?




Exactly, the simple fact theyre here illegally entitles them to nothing,


But don't forget, just like immigration, if it's just a "few" theyre irrelevant and it's pointless to deport them, until there is many, then there's too many and it pointless to deport them

I've recently heard this same argument with illegal voting, it's just a few so who cares, right?


--------------------
http://www.countdowntotrump.com





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Offlineqman
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Re: Remember when Bernie said the USA should be more like Norway? [Re: Stonehenge]
    #22414842 - 10/21/15 06:03 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
Burg, you won the illegal voting aliens argument. The libs always fall apart and go straight to personal attacks when they know they lost. No matter what the law says they will cheat anyway. Why should they get licenses? Why should they get anything?




They shouldn't get anything other than deportation.  Drivers licenses so they can drive back to their homelands, they can also bring their anchor babies with them.


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