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Anonymous

Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq
    #2234785 - 01/11/04 03:24 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq
Mortars thought to hold blister agent left over from war with Iran
Sunday, January 11, 2004 Posted: 12:15 AM EST (0515 GMT)


The Danish army says it found these mortar shells in southern Iraq.




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BAGHDAD, Iraq (CNN) -- Danish troops have found suspicious mortar shells in southern Iraq that officials believe contain blister agents, the United States and Denmark announced Saturday.

Brig. Gen. Mark Kimmitt, a U.S. Army spokesman, said Saturday that the 120 mm mortars were filled with liquid.

The shells are at least 10 years old, and a U.S. Army official said he suspects the ordnance was surplus from the Iran-Iraq war in the mid-1980s. Blister agents are used in chemical weapons.

A release on the Danish army operational command Web site said that in a routine collection of old ammunition, the 36 heavy mortar grenades were found in a dried-up marsh Friday. They were buried and packed in plastic.

"Most were wrapped in plastic bags, and some were leaking," Kimmitt said.

The shells were found 20 kilometers (12 miles) north of the city of Qurnah by Danish engineers and Icelandic munitions experts.

Several hundred Danish soldiers are working with a British-led multinational force responsible for security in southern Iraq.

Both the U.S. and British governments cited the threat of illicit weapons of mass destruction as a main reason for launching the Iraq war. However, no such weapons have been found so far.

The U.S. pulled 400 weapons-disposal experts from Iraq this month in what The New York Times called "a sign that [the] administration might have lowered its sights." The move raised suspicions that weapons are unlikely to be found.

The White House played down the move, saying the group focused on hunting weapons was remaining in Iraq.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/01/10/sprj.irq.chemicals/index.html


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OfflineLearyfan
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Re: Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq [Re: ]
    #2234857 - 01/11/04 04:20 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I guess the war was justified after all.  :smirk:




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Anonymous

Re: Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq [Re: Learyfan]
    #2234883 - 01/11/04 04:32 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

:smirk:

if they weren't buried next to hundreds of thousands of murdered iraqis, maybe your sarcasm would be warranted.


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OfflineSquattingMarmot
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Re: Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq [Re: ]
    #2234962 - 01/11/04 05:13 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I wonder if they have "Made in the USA" stamped on them.


--------------------
"In the United States anybody can be president. Thats the problem."

"The gray-haired douche bag, Barbara Bush, has a slogan: "Encourage your child to read every day." What she should be is encouraging children to question what they read every day."

- George Carlin


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InvisibleXochitl
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Re: Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq [Re: ]
    #2235111 - 01/11/04 06:45 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

wow, those detoriating and unusable shells sure are a threat to us in the United States.


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As we know, there are known knowns. There are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns. That is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns, the ones we don't know we don't know.

-Donald Rumsfeld 2/2/02 Pentagon


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Invisiblephreakyzen
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Re: Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq [Re: ]
    #2235550 - 01/11/04 11:03 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)



Real menacing looking stuff there. I hope the Danes wore gloves that rust could cut your hand up pretty bad.


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InvisibleXlea321
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Re: Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq [Re: ]
    #2235917 - 01/12/04 02:05 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

They were buried at least 10 years ago.


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Invisiblecarbonhoots
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Re: Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq [Re: ]
    #2236149 - 01/12/04 03:24 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Suspicious Shells Found In Iraq?

How are they suspicious? We all know there was an Iran/Iraq war, and we all know Iraq used chemical weapons...I thought we all figured every last chemical weapon that Iraq had probably wasn't used in that war...therefore this old, junked stockpile shouldn't be suspicious, it should be expected.

I remember pinksharkmark, in a recent thread, loading a question with something to the effect of "Oh, yeah? well where did all the unaccounted-for-chemical-weapons go then?..." Is this part of your answer, buddy?

I can almost see it now...

I guess the liberal-media wanted to get the "suspicious-shells-found-in-Iraq" headline out...cuz they can't find any substance to the WMD claims, they can still write whatever headline they want, then at least there is a presence of ideas supporting Bush out there...you with me so far?

That darned liberal-media, playing these angles..


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Offlinemonoamine
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Re: Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq [Re: ]
    #2239803 - 01/13/04 06:39 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

We could have all gotten some nasty blisters.(Assuming they had a way to deploy them to the U.S. and they were in usable condition) The war was justified after all!


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People think that if you just say the word "hallucinations" it explains everything you want it to explain and eventually whatever it is you can't explain will just go away.It's just a word,it doesn't explain anything...
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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq [Re: ]
    #2242548 - 01/14/04 09:17 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)



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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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OfflineGranola
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Re: Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq [Re: carbonhoots]
    #2243557 - 01/15/04 10:38 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

carbonhoots said:
Suspicious Shells Found In Iraq?

I thought we all figured every last chemical weapon that Iraq had probably wasn't used in that war...therefore this old, junked stockpile shouldn't be suspicious, it should be expected.





if it were a stickpile it would mean that they would have been found in a building in storage, those were burried so what they dound was a dump. Look at what america does with weapons like that, stick them in old mines and close the entrance.

I'm reasonably sure that the shells were not just laying about on the ground like the photos would imply

A U.S. official said the tests suggest the munitions may not contain blister agents, as initial field tests had indicated.

"The Iraqi Survey Group has never encountered this type of shells before," the Danish military said. "They will therefore take a shell for closer investigation," including a look into why the four initial tests gave a positive result


so now that the Danish military have them we should invade Denmark, yes?

** edit ** Michelsen said the Danes have unearthed 50 shells so far and at least 50 more are believed still buried. Villagers told the troops that they had found about 400 or more some years ago and threw them in the Tigris River, Michelsen said.

now that should really help the people of Iraq, maybe that are all like Sadam, "hey, lets posion the water and see how many fish we catch"


Edited by Granola (01/15/04 10:44 AM)


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Invisibledaussaulit
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Re: Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq [Re: ]
    #2243975 - 01/15/04 02:08 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Looks like the blister gas actually turned out to be NOTHING.

No Chemical Agent in Iraq Mortar Shells
Quote:

CAMP EDEN, Iraq - Tests by Danish and American experts indicate there is no chemical warfare agent in mortar shells unearthed in southern Iraq (news - web sites), but conclusive word will only come from a lab in Idaho. Earlier examinations had indicated a blister agent was in the shells, which apparently date to the Iran-Iraq war of the 1980s.

The U.S.-led Iraq Survey Group conducted tests on five of 36 shells found Friday and all came up negative, the Danish army said Wednesday in a statement from Copenhagen. Those results contradicted Danish and British field tests that were positive for a blister agent.

"Based on the tests, the experts conclude that none of the shells contain chemical warfare agents," the Danish army statement said, adding that more studies are needed for final confirmation.

The earliest results may have been positive because tests by troops in the field are designed to favor a positive reading, erring on the side of caution to protect soldiers.

A U.S. official, speaking Wednesday on condition of anonymity, said chemicals such as phosphorous used in some munitions can produce false positives. The official said "there is no doubt" that Saddam Hussein (news - web sites) had blister agents in the early to mid-1990s, but it's not clear where they are now.

Danish troops found the 120mm shells outside a village near Qurnah in southern Iraq, 250 miles southeast of the capital Baghdad. Villagers there had reported fighting during the 1980-88 Iran-Iraq war that could have included the use of chemical weapons.

"This was a stash. They were stacked and ordered and wrapped in plastic. They weren't just lying in the ground," Capt. Kim Vibe Michelsen, the spokesman of the Danish army's Camp Eden in southern Iraq, told The Associated Press. He said they must have been buried at least 10 years ago.

Before invading Iraq, the United States asserted that Saddam's regime had stockpiles of mustard gas, a World War I-era blister agent that is stored in liquid form. The chemical burns the skin, eyes and lungs.

U.S. intelligence officials also claimed Iraq had failed to destroy stocks of sarin, cyclosarin and VX in violation of U.N. resolutions. Nine months after Saddam's regime collapsed, no such materials have been found.

The U.S. official said the latest test results aren't definitive, but "it seems to be turning away from being a blister agent."

The Danish statement said the results of the tests will be sent to the U.S. Department of Energy (news - web sites)'s Idaho National Engineering and Environmental Laboratory, and the final verdict will be available in three to five days.

"There is a certain relief that the shells do not represent a threat for the safety of the local population," the statement said, adding that soldiers expressed "some disappointment" because the hunt for chemical weapons was one of their top priorities.

Michelsen said the Danish troops have dug up 50 shells so far and at least 50 more are believed to be underground. Villagers told the troops that they found 400 or more several years ago and threw them in the Tigris River, Michelsen said.

The flat, muddy area where the shells were found was the scene of intense fighting during the Iran-Iraq war. The villagers told the Danes that one battle in the area lasted for seven days in 1984.

The villagers said they fled and returned after the battle to find all their cattle dead and the area littered with human bodies, Michelsen said. He quoted the villagers as saying that none of the carcasses or bodies had gunshot wounds, but all were bleeding from mouth and nose.

"This is a clear indication of chemical weapons use," he said.

Saddam was known to have used chemical weapons against Iran and Iraqi Kurds. Michelsen said the shells, which have no markings indicating where they were made, "don't look like any known" mortars in the Iraqi arsenal.

Since the war ended, the U.S.-led coalition has found several caches that tested positive for mustard gas but later turned out to contain missile fuel or other chemicals.



http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&c...ls_13&printer=1


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InvisibleXlea321
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Re: Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq [Re: daussaulit]
    #2244017 - 01/15/04 02:25 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Same as it ever was.

I guess the main thing is blowing enough smoke out their ass to make sure the story gets out there in the first place. Everyone will have heard the story that "chemical weapons were found", how many will hear it was a load of shit?

It's an old propaganda maxim - "The lie is halfway around the world while the truth is getting it's boots on."


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InvisibleinfidelGOD
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Re: Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq [Re: Xlea321]
    #2244435 - 01/15/04 05:28 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Everyone will have heard the story that "chemical weapons were found", how many will hear it was a load of shit?

I'm sure fox news is scrambling to run retractions.
I didn't hear much of this in the mainstream press, like the nightly news on the networks, or major news websites. it was kinda buried. I guess it's the liberal media at work...


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Invisibledaussaulit
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Re: Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq [Re: infidelGOD]
    #2244451 - 01/15/04 05:42 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Thats because the mainstream press is conservative. Is Associated Press Liberal?


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InvisibleinfidelGOD
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Re: Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq [Re: daussaulit]
    #2244466 - 01/15/04 05:46 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

my point exactly. most of the major news outlets in America are owned by corporate interests.


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Anonymous

Re: Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq [Re: infidelGOD]
    #2244488 - 01/15/04 06:02 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

most of the major news outlets in America are owned by corporate interests.

that doesn't keep them from churning out left-leaning newspapers, magazines, and broadcasts. i'll give you fox news. with the exception of that, all of the major news outlets are left of center.


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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq [Re: ]
    #2244515 - 01/15/04 06:15 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

that doesn't keep them from churning out left-leaning newspapers, magazines, and broadcasts. i'll give you fox news. with the exception of that, all of the major news outlets are left of center.



How do you mean, exactly? If you mean that the journalists who write articles and broadcast news tend to be left of center, then I'll agree. However, their editors tend to be more conservative, and thus keep the left-leaning journalists in check.


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Anonymous

Re: Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq [Re: silversoul7]
    #2244535 - 01/15/04 06:21 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

How do you mean, exactly? If you mean that the journalists who write articles and broadcast news tend to be left of center, then I'll agree. However, their editors tend to be more conservative, and thus keep the left-leaning journalists in check.

poll after poll has shown that both writers and editors are much more likely to characterize themselves as liberals, vote democrat, and be registered members of the democratic party than the general population. the media is particularly left-leaning on abortion and gun control.


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InvisibleXlea321
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Re: Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq [Re: ]
    #2245281 - 01/16/04 02:12 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

So why did they run this bullshit story without a big warning saying "CAUTION:THIS IS MORE THAN LIKELY ANOTHER LOAD OF BULLSHIT PROPAGANDA"? Or treat it with the same caution they treat Osama Bin Laden tapes?

Once the story is out there the media have served their purpose.


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