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OnlineCHeifM4sterDiezL
Chief Globerts


Registered: 07/28/10
Posts: 22,542
Loc: United States Flag
Last seen: 3 minutes, 22 seconds
Re: Well, the US economy just went to shit. [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #22336746 - 10/05/15 12:23 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

yeh but you have to admit that he intends to pay for it by stealing it from rich people who already pay for everything neway. I mean fuck how much do you pay in taxes?


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OfflinePatlal
You ask too many questions
Male User Gallery


Registered: 10/09/10
Posts: 44,797
Loc: Ottawa Flag
Last seen: 6 hours, 42 minutes
Re: Well, the US economy just went to shit. [Re: Webster10]
    #22336764 - 10/05/15 12:29 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Webster10 said:
Quote:

Patlal said:
Quote:

Webster10 said:
A deal was reached on the TPP. The poor man's messiah, Obama, just sold out the american worker in favor of the 1%. It's not just Republicans that pander to big money.




It hasn't been approved by congress or any other of the 12 countries involved.

Then again, from canada, I'm totally biased because we are an exporting nation and the TPP is amazing for us



It's good for the top 1% of canadians, bad for everyone else.




Yeah, the labor force is gonna take a few hits here and there, but hopefully consumer prices will go down.


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OnlineThe Ecstatic
Chilldog Extraordinaire


Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 33,369
Loc: 'Merica Flag
Last seen: 1 minute, 13 seconds
Re: Well, the US economy just went to shit. [Re: CHeifM4sterDiezL]
    #22336767 - 10/05/15 12:29 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

CHeifM4sterDiezL said:
yeh but you have to admit that he intends to pay for it by stealing it from rich people who already pay for everything neway. I mean fuck how much do you pay in taxes?




The rich now pay for far less than they have in the past.

And Bernie's proposals aren't going to cost anything substantially more than what we already spend, in some cases we'll save money. Would you rather fork out $5000 a year for a private sector service or $3000 for a public sector service?

People are freaking out because he wants to erase profits in places like healthcare and prisons. Why should we be forking over extra money so a few rich guys can profit off of Americans' suffering?


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OnlineCHeifM4sterDiezL
Chief Globerts


Registered: 07/28/10
Posts: 22,542
Loc: United States Flag
Last seen: 3 minutes, 22 seconds
Re: Well, the US economy just went to shit. [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #22336818 - 10/05/15 12:50 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

increase taxes on everyone. rich people actually pay more than their fair share. when the government takes millions of your dollars you can start to complain about taxes. I wonder how youd feel about welfare and free college then huh? i mean put yourself in someone elses shoes. everyone always thinks they pay too high of taxes well heres a news flash unless ur in like the top 2% tax bracke or the even shittier upper middle class or something you prob get more from the government than you pay for.


Edited by CHeifM4sterDiezL (10/05/15 12:51 PM)


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InvisibleStonehenge
Alt Center
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Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 14,850
Loc: S.E.
Re: Well, the US economy just went to shit. [Re: Webster10]
    #22336859 - 10/05/15 01:05 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

The left is against kicking out the illegals even though that will raise wages and provide jobs for americans. Why are they against it? Because the dems and the media tell them to be against it, illegals vote too you know. The only answer the left has including bernout is to raise the min which will of course result in fewer jobs and more industries going overseas. At this rate we will be left with only jobs like walmart greeter and burger flipper.

And yet when things get worse they will try to blame bush, Reagan, anyone but fumbling obumble. Trump is our only hope.


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755


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OnlineCHeifM4sterDiezL
Chief Globerts


Registered: 07/28/10
Posts: 22,542
Loc: United States Flag
Last seen: 3 minutes, 22 seconds
Re: Well, the US economy just went to shit. [Re: Stonehenge]
    #22336884 - 10/05/15 01:12 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

your rediclous your not even thinking stright ur jus spewing talking points out of your mouth like they are real problems that matter think for yourself dewd.


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OfflineShortknight
Male


Registered: 02/25/13
Posts: 2,164
Last seen: 6 years, 5 months
Re: Well, the US economy just went to shit. [Re: Patlal]
    #22337031 - 10/05/15 02:00 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Patlal said:
Quote:

Webster10 said:
Quote:

Patlal said:
Quote:

Webster10 said:
A deal was reached on the TPP. The poor man's messiah, Obama, just sold out the american worker in favor of the 1%. It's not just Republicans that pander to big money.




It hasn't been approved by congress or any other of the 12 countries involved.

Then again, from canada, I'm totally biased because we are an exporting nation and the TPP is amazing for us



It's good for the top 1% of canadians, bad for everyone else.




Yeah, the labor force is gonna take a few hits here and there, but hopefully consumer prices will go down.




Its sad, yes thats what it will do. Small businesses over time will suffer, creating less good jobs for the small towns and average folk everywhere. Creating more dependency on others, giving in to a bigger monopoly for the big corporations to wave their big dicks around and slap them where they like. Cause they got the money. :peace: Ohh I have to day dream to get bye.:yinyang: I suppose thats no different than anytime though.

Shorty:fishing:


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Did I say it too loud? Big heart? Or a little misleading!:musicnote:


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Invisiblesh4d0ws
LSx
I'm a teapot User Gallery

Registered: 02/26/08
Posts: 12,086
Re: Well, the US economy just went to shit. [Re: Patlal]
    #22337051 - 10/05/15 02:06 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Patlal said:
Quote:

Webster10 said:
A deal was reached on the TPP. The poor man's messiah, Obama, just sold out the american worker in favor of the 1%. It's not just Republicans that pander to big money.




It hasn't been approved by congress or any other of the 12 countries involved.

Then again, from canada, I'm totally biased because we are an exporting nation and the TPP is amazing for us






Do you constantly make shit up? You just said a few weeks ago or even more recently how the TPP would be horrible for us and negatively affect our auto industry. If I remember correctly, you said it would kill our auto industry. Maybe I'm mistaking you for someone else but I really don't think so.

Now that Harpers signed the deal and all for it you're totally in love with the idea?

Are you a troll?

:shrug:


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OfflineShortknight
Male


Registered: 02/25/13
Posts: 2,164
Last seen: 6 years, 5 months
Re: Well, the US economy just went to shit. [Re: sh4d0ws]
    #22337080 - 10/05/15 02:17 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Heard the radio just say that the deals not signed yet. But theyre hanging out down in Hawaii right now trying to figure it all out:earth: Good trade deals must be settled in Hawaii haha


--------------------
Did I say it too loud? Big heart? Or a little misleading!:musicnote:


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InvisibleLe_Canard
The Duk Abides


Registered: 05/16/03
Posts: 94,392
Loc: Earthfarm 1 Flag
Re: Well, the US economy just went to shit. [Re: Webster10]
    #22337126 - 10/05/15 02:30 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Webster10 said:
Yes, because everyone on foodstamps works two jobs.




I'm sure there aren't many, but a lot DO work a job. People on Food Stamps aren't all the lazy bums the right keeps portraying them as. I'm sure there are a lot who are gaming the system, but the vast majority are not and actually need Food Stamps.


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Invisible404
error
 User Gallery

Registered: 08/20/10
Posts: 14,539
Re: Well, the US economy just went to shit. [Re: Webster10]
    #22337332 - 10/05/15 03:18 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Webster10 said:
:lol: what? How drunk are you?

Sadly, the people to blame in this situation are the Republicans in Congress and Obama. Democrats in Congress were the only ones that fell on the right side of this issue. No newspaper will report this as a failure though. Even the ultra liberal NYT is reporting this as a "policy victory" for Obama in his "magnificent shift" to incorporate pacific countries more into his agenda. I guess when a liberal president utilizes Republican economics, it's a "milestone."

FUCK the TPP, fuck Obama, fuck the repubs in congress.





sup OP? can you give someone like me information on why the TPP is bad? i hate sifting through the internet and finding threads like this that don't really explain the situation very well in any detail.

i am genuinely curious as to why people are up in arms about this deal? i have heard a lot, but at the same time not much at all.


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InvisibleAsante
Mage
Male User Gallery

Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,796
Re: Well, the US economy just went to shit. [Re: 404]
    #22337411 - 10/05/15 03:38 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

404 said:

sup OP? can you give someone like me information on why the TPP is bad?







--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
higher knowledge starts here


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Invisible404
error
 User Gallery

Registered: 08/20/10
Posts: 14,539
Re: Well, the US economy just went to shit. [Re: Asante]
    #22337464 - 10/05/15 03:52 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

>> the powers of this treaty could circumvent democracies everywhere

how? doesn't really give a whole lot of info on it. about a minute in, it didn't really say much of anything either.


ok, so i finished it. corporations can sue sovereign nations. i still feel like there's a whole lot more to this that i am missing.


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OfflinePatlal
You ask too many questions
Male User Gallery


Registered: 10/09/10
Posts: 44,797
Loc: Ottawa Flag
Last seen: 6 hours, 42 minutes
Re: Well, the US economy just went to shit. [Re: sh4d0ws]
    #22337477 - 10/05/15 03:54 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

sh4d0ws said:
Quote:

Patlal said:
Quote:

Webster10 said:
A deal was reached on the TPP. The poor man's messiah, Obama, just sold out the american worker in favor of the 1%. It's not just Republicans that pander to big money.




It hasn't been approved by congress or any other of the 12 countries involved.

Then again, from canada, I'm totally biased because we are an exporting nation and the TPP is amazing for us






Do you constantly make shit up? You just said a few weeks ago or even more recently how the TPP would be horrible for us and negatively affect our auto industry. If I remember correctly, you said it would kill our auto industry. Maybe I'm mistaking you for someone else but I really don't think so.

Now that Harpers signed the deal and all for it you're totally in love with the idea?

Are you a troll?

:shrug:




I will hurt the auto industry no doubt. It'll put Ontario in a very rough position. I did say that.

But I have read up more about the deal and the benefits outweighs the consequences. There's more to Canada than the Ontario auto industry.


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Invisible404
error
 User Gallery

Registered: 08/20/10
Posts: 14,539
Re: Well, the US economy just went to shit. [Re: Patlal]
    #22337482 - 10/05/15 03:55 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

it will hurt it how? why is no one explaining why exactly this is bad? maybe i missed a post or something?


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InvisibleStonehenge
Alt Center
Male User Gallery
Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 14,850
Loc: S.E.
Re: Well, the US economy just went to shit. [Re: Patlal]
    #22337562 - 10/05/15 04:28 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Canada makes cars? who knew? What are they called, the maple leaf, ice mobiles, or wind chill factors?


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755


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OfflineWebster10
Up like Trump
Male

Registered: 12/03/13
Posts: 9,966
Loc: Strawberry Fields Flag
Last seen: 6 years, 3 months
Re: Well, the US economy just went to shit. [Re: 404]
    #22337579 - 10/05/15 04:33 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

404 said:
it will hurt it how? why is no one explaining why exactly this is bad? maybe i missed a post or something?



It tears down tariffs that will in turn result in countless American jobs being shipped to countries with cheaper labor. Free trade hurts the american worker but is great for the 1%.


--------------------
:leaf: :usa:


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Invisible404
error
 User Gallery

Registered: 08/20/10
Posts: 14,539
Re: Well, the US economy just went to shit. [Re: Stonehenge]
    #22337581 - 10/05/15 04:34 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

I thought everyone traveled by dog sled up there?? Learn something new everyday.


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OfflinePatlal
You ask too many questions
Male User Gallery


Registered: 10/09/10
Posts: 44,797
Loc: Ottawa Flag
Last seen: 6 hours, 42 minutes
Re: Well, the US economy just went to shit. [Re: Stonehenge]
    #22337667 - 10/05/15 05:01 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
Canada makes cars? who knew? What are they called, the maple leaf, ice mobiles, or wind chill factors?




No actually they are called Ford and GM. They moved to Canada due to higher competence and lower taxes.


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OfflinePatlal
You ask too many questions
Male User Gallery


Registered: 10/09/10
Posts: 44,797
Loc: Ottawa Flag
Last seen: 6 hours, 42 minutes
Re: Well, the US economy just went to shit. [Re: 404]
    #22337715 - 10/05/15 05:17 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

404 said:
it will hurt it how? why is no one explaining why exactly this is bad? maybe i missed a post or something?




Alright, so, car part are manufactured in Canada. With the TPP, foreign countries with lower salaries will now be able to produce it and ship the parts here. Essentially that's the gist of it. But there are more things than that.

We have a roughly 6% tariff on car imports which will be phased out. Therefore foreign car will come in 6% cheaper. In order to avoid tariffs, 45% of a the car parts used to build it must come from a TPP country. In the case of Japan and Vietnam, that should not be a problem at all. Therefore tariffs are almost certainly eliminated. Under NAFTA its 60% in order to be duty free. So it makes a difference. WTF with the percentage of car part in a car you ask? It was to encourage builders to buy 60% from north america instead of going to China. Sure it kept prices higher, but at least we knew the quality was safe and that it was built at home. Now "home" means any TPP countries. Which means Canada and the US will not compete on car part.

Speaking of NAFTA. Since the TPP is the newst agreement. all trade mentioned in the TPP will overrule NAFTA (technically seaking of course. Historically, newer deals replace the old) and everything that isnt touched by TPP will remain protected under NAFTA. therefore Mexico... But NAFTA casts a wider net than the TPP for now.

This treaty truly is world changing when it comes to the countries included. South Korea wants to join... If accepted, fuck it, we stop building cars altogether...

There is exemptions on the TPP for the "buy local" items. So the deal doesn't just go and wipe out everything in its way. Its an accepted form of protectionism under the deal.

Also, state controlled businesses (The CBC) is also protected. But that clause was put in there in case china wanted to come in. Everything is state controlled for them so it would have fucked up everything.

New important and useful rule under TPP. No government can interefere with the data flow of the Internet in any way. So if passed, that will take away the US government's power to control the internet or whatever.

Hence why every country must bring this deal to parliament or the house and each individually approve of it otherwise it wont pass.

Also, Every country has specifics unique to them included in the deal so its complicated as fuck


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