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tahoe
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How long does one pc an xl grow bag?
#22312202 - 09/30/15 02:25 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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I searched for this topic and surprisingly didn't come up with anything. I ordered a dozen xl grow bags. Anyone use them? I am hoping to get 20+ cups of grain in it. How long are you guys pc'ing these and how much material will fit in one? Thanks.
-------------------- Stop experimenting half way through your first grow. Grow it to maturity, watch it, learn from it. Do this a few times then experiment with different ideas and figure out what works best for you.
My Legacy https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22140987#22140987 Teh=The I need to proofread
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Mad Season
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: tahoe]
#22312224 - 09/30/15 02:33 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Generally I see bags do 4-6 qts, and get pc'd a minimum of 2.5 hours. I'd do 3 at 20ish psi just to be safe
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micro
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: tahoe]
#22312233 - 09/30/15 02:36 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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The amount of material that will fit depends on the pressure cooker or canner you have. A tiny one might hold up to a quart and a large All-American one can hold like 8 good-sized bags, maybe more. As far as the time, I was looking at the info from the FAQ. It says 45-60 minutes at 15psi but for some reason I think we used an hour and a half. Whatever, more is generally better, but if you do it for two long it will mess up the water content of the substrate. If this is the case, you can usually tell by just looking at it.*
Also, you are in this thread: 
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/7957503#7957503
* We were using parboiled rice as a substrate, cooked with 3/4 of the water.
-------------------- Any research paper or book for free (Avatar is Maxxy, a character by Mizzyam, RIP)
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tahoe
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: Mad Season]
#22312235 - 09/30/15 02:40 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Gotcha. Right now I am using the medium sized bags. I get a solid ten cups in there, probably more. I go for 2 inches below the filter. I am most likely over filling them. I think I will fill one of these xl bags to the max. Cook it over night then hit it with ten cc of mycelium/water.
Anyone have a pic of a properly filled bag?
-------------------- Stop experimenting half way through your first grow. Grow it to maturity, watch it, learn from it. Do this a few times then experiment with different ideas and figure out what works best for you.
My Legacy https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22140987#22140987 Teh=The I need to proofread
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tahoe
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: tahoe]
#22312241 - 09/30/15 02:48 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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I kind of remember that thread. I think we were mainly talking jars in that thread. Plus all the cook times have been revised since then.
I am curious of these 9.5"x5.5"x24" bags. They are dam near as big as a plastic grocery bag. I might cook it twice. Cook it for six hours. Shake it up a bit and cook again
-------------------- Stop experimenting half way through your first grow. Grow it to maturity, watch it, learn from it. Do this a few times then experiment with different ideas and figure out what works best for you.
My Legacy https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22140987#22140987 Teh=The I need to proofread
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micro
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: tahoe]
#22312249 - 09/30/15 02:56 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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I definitely didn't fill them that close to the filter. it was probably the bottom fifth of the bag. I'm not sure if that makes a huge difference; I think the idea was to keep a good amount of air in them, but these were the ones with the filter patch, anyway.
6 hours seems like a lot and overnight seems kind of insane XD
The thread was talking about jars, but RR mentioned bags in that post.
One thing you could do to test it out is bury something like a piece of plastic that isn't a good thermal conductor with autoclavable tape in the center of the substrate. When it is done you could break the rice (or whatever) up a bit to get it back out and make sure the color indicates sterile.
-------------------- Any research paper or book for free (Avatar is Maxxy, a character by Mizzyam, RIP)
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blindingleaf
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: micro]
#22312515 - 09/30/15 05:41 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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3 hours at 15PSI is fine. 3 hours at higher than 15PSI, awesome
-------------------- A few thoughts on cultivation MICROBIAL HUSBANDRY!!!! The whole is greater than the sum of its parts
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tahoe
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: blindingleaf]
#22337580 - 10/05/15 04:33 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Here she is. 25+ cups of wbs. I will set the timer for 5 hours.
-------------------- Stop experimenting half way through your first grow. Grow it to maturity, watch it, learn from it. Do this a few times then experiment with different ideas and figure out what works best for you.
My Legacy https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22140987#22140987 Teh=The I need to proofread
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tahoe
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: tahoe]
#22339274 - 10/06/15 12:06 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Still cooking.
-------------------- Stop experimenting half way through your first grow. Grow it to maturity, watch it, learn from it. Do this a few times then experiment with different ideas and figure out what works best for you.
My Legacy https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22140987#22140987 Teh=The I need to proofread
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blindingleaf
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: tahoe]
#22339591 - 10/06/15 03:00 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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tahoe, u can honestly go a lot shorter man. i do 6x 8.5 lb bags for 3.5 hours at 15 PSI. now, since i did the stop cock thing, i only do 3 hours at 25PSI.
 
for just one bag, i would do maybe 2.5 hours.
-------------------- A few thoughts on cultivation MICROBIAL HUSBANDRY!!!! The whole is greater than the sum of its parts
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dreadhed

Registered: 01/21/11
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: blindingleaf]
#22340367 - 10/06/15 09:56 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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I usually do 2-3 hrs depending on how much I put in the bag.
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tahoe
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: dreadhed]
#22340419 - 10/06/15 10:13 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Thanks blinding leaf. What are you using to separate the two layers of bags?
-------------------- Stop experimenting half way through your first grow. Grow it to maturity, watch it, learn from it. Do this a few times then experiment with different ideas and figure out what works best for you.
My Legacy https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22140987#22140987 Teh=The I need to proofread
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blindingleaf
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: tahoe]
#22340458 - 10/06/15 10:23 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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in the middle of the two stacks, nothing. i lay them in a triangle pattern, and then the top layer, i rest the bags where the gaps are btw the bottom ones, so looking down, it would kind of be a six sided hexagon if that makes sense? i lay a plate or trivet on top stack though

recently, ill use foil along the walls where the bags touch the PC. I think using jar lid spacers is a better option because it will help steam to penetrate more evenly, but depending on how much the PC is packed, its hard to get them in there.
-------------------- A few thoughts on cultivation MICROBIAL HUSBANDRY!!!! The whole is greater than the sum of its parts
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Juiceh
Dabbing All Day



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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: blindingleaf]
#22344848 - 10/07/15 11:08 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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I've PCd quite a few XL bags of grains. Not exactly sure how many qts I put in them. But I typically fill them by weight with 10lbs to 15lbs of grain. Do 3 hours at 20psi. I have gotten away with 2 hours at 20psi, but I've had a couple fail that were run for 2 hours. They colonized and looked good, but when I went to use them I noticed a small patch of green on the top of the block of grains. So to be safe do 3 hours at 20psi.
Blindingleaf, what size bags are those? I can only seem to fit 2 medium sized(8" X 4.8" X 19") mycobags per level in my 921. Are those (5" X 4" X 18") medium bags?
When I do bigass XL(24" X 9.5" X 5") bags I only put one in my 921. LoL! I can stack 2 in the 930 and 941 tho.
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mushpunx
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: tahoe]
#22345111 - 10/07/15 12:24 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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 Quote:
tahoe said: Here she is. 25+ cups of wbs. I will set the timer for 5 hours.

How many quarts would that be? Like six?
I do my bags the same it looks like, between 5 and 6 quarts. I can only fit 4 in my PC, I do those for 2.5 to 3 hours.
Leaf how are you setting up your bags? Theyre taped down? That's tyvek though yea?
--------------------
 Amateur Mycologists United AMU Q&A
Edited by mushpunx (10/07/15 12:28 PM)
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blindingleaf
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: mushpunx]
#22345176 - 10/07/15 12:36 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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J-they are the unicorn 3T bags (8x5x19) with the 921, i can only fit 4 bags, or six if i do 4 qts each. i don't ever fill more than 9 lbs (about 6-7 qts soaked) pre PC because I'm going to use as receivers for g2g. any more than 9 lbs, and i get freaked out by weight of mass pushing on seal.
Mush- if I'm cooking with stop cock, i don't use tyvek insert, but i do use tyvek square btw the filter and bag, where they are folded together and touching. this is to prevent the filter from sticking to the bag and slightly peeling off when i go to unfold and inoculate. u can use a small piece of tin foil instead too.

if I'm cooking with jigglier weight, i do use tyvek insert. i just don't really like using them as much because the tyvek has a tendency to collect and hold water during and after the cycle, making it difficult to impulse seal correctly (the residual moisture stays along the top of bag when tyvek is pulled out). doesn't happen all the time, but enough that it was annoying to me.
with smaller volume bags, i could use zip tie, but with larger volume of grain, i think the impulse seal leaves more of a plenum of air.
but its really preference.
-------------------- A few thoughts on cultivation MICROBIAL HUSBANDRY!!!! The whole is greater than the sum of its parts
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Pastywhyte
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: blindingleaf]
#22345228 - 10/07/15 12:49 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
blindingleaf said: J-they are the unicorn 3T bags (8x5x19) with the 921, i can only fit 4 bags, or six if i do 4 qts each. i don't ever fill more than 9 lbs (about 6-7 qts soaked) pre PC because I'm going to use as receivers for g2g. any more than 9 lbs, and i get freaked out by weight of mass pushing on seal.
Mush- if I'm cooking with stop cock, i don't use tyvek insert, but i do use tyvek square btw the filter and bag, where they are folded together and touching. this is to prevent the filter from sticking to the bag and slightly peeling off when i go to unfold and inoculate. u can use a small piece of tin foil instead too.

if I'm cooking with jigglier weight, i do use tyvek insert. i just don't really like using them as much because the tyvek has a tendency to collect and hold water during and after the cycle, making it difficult to impulse seal correctly (the residual moisture stays along the top of bag when tyvek is pulled out). doesn't happen all the time, but enough that it was annoying to me.
with smaller volume bags, i could use zip tie, but with larger volume of grain, i think the impulse seal leaves more of a plenum of air.
but its really preference.
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mushpunx
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: blindingleaf]
#22345239 - 10/07/15 12:51 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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What exactly is a stop cock man? You said you were getting higher PSI too . Does it turn it into a sterilized or something? That's just a regular 921 like mine?
Yea I know what you mean man about the tyvek. And grain always sticks to it always flies all over when I pull the sleeve out  Lately I stopped impulse sealing and that was part of the reason! But yea I can see how much more room you get inside, with zip ties I always have to tie right above the filter which doesn't leave much of a plenum if its full up of grain
--------------------
 Amateur Mycologists United AMU Q&A
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blindingleaf
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: mushpunx]
#22345294 - 10/07/15 01:00 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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when i use sleeves, i cut them in half or thirds for insert. no need to use a full sleeve. that way it won't touch the grains. mine go in maybe 4", and come out of bag about 1".
the stop cock conversion is LEGIT dude. search "tahoes" main threads, and you will find it. its like an $18 piece (plus red plug is a few bucks) from "everything Mushrooms" and u get a much higher PSI (which is especially useful for larger loads with bags), much less water loss during cycle (which means less water needed=faster heat up and venting), and no need to use inserts because u can break the vacuum in front of hood. definitely a worthwhile purchase, check it out if u have some time!
-------------------- A few thoughts on cultivation MICROBIAL HUSBANDRY!!!! The whole is greater than the sum of its parts
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tahoe
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: blindingleaf]
#22345359 - 10/07/15 01:16 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Mush punx, listen to blinding leaf. He knows What he is talking about ;-) .
The thread is probably on page 5-6 now. How to safely upgrade your all American pc.
Check the gauge in mine and juiced sigs. You too can been cooking in the high twenties.
The bag weighs 12 pounds after cooking. It was 25 heaping cups of wbs.
-------------------- Stop experimenting half way through your first grow. Grow it to maturity, watch it, learn from it. Do this a few times then experiment with different ideas and figure out what works best for you.
My Legacy https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22140987#22140987 Teh=The I need to proofread
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blindingleaf
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: tahoe]
#22345404 - 10/07/15 01:22 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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nice! i need to take a pic of my gauge when its high. why does the shroomery auto correct "jiggler" with "jigglier" WTF fucking spell checkers man
-------------------- A few thoughts on cultivation MICROBIAL HUSBANDRY!!!! The whole is greater than the sum of its parts
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mushpunx
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: blindingleaf]
#22345458 - 10/07/15 01:30 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Oh god damn! What Ze hell man! How did I miss that?? And the inside of the PC stays sterile? I can just open it in front of my hood?
Yep. Buying the parts. Right now haha
--------------------
 Amateur Mycologists United AMU Q&A
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blindingleaf
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: mushpunx]
#22345483 - 10/07/15 01:35 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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yea, its pretty convenient for bags! get the anti seize grease tahoe mentions in the write up too. i think it helps ensure the threads screw in where they are supposed to. its like $2.18 @ home depot i think.
i messed up my first one, and had to order another stop cock
-------------------- A few thoughts on cultivation MICROBIAL HUSBANDRY!!!! The whole is greater than the sum of its parts
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mushpunx
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: blindingleaf]
#22345524 - 10/07/15 01:43 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Ah dude that's so awesome. Thanks Tahoe! I just bought my parts 
I hate that freaking jiggling noise
--------------------
 Amateur Mycologists United AMU Q&A
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tahoe
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: mushpunx]
#22345573 - 10/07/15 01:50 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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You are welcome. The jiggler noise and the hissing drives me nuts. It's so nice to do the upgrade
-------------------- Stop experimenting half way through your first grow. Grow it to maturity, watch it, learn from it. Do this a few times then experiment with different ideas and figure out what works best for you.
My Legacy https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22140987#22140987 Teh=The I need to proofread
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Gr0wer
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: tahoe]
#22375312 - 10/13/15 07:39 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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]http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21726343/page/5
Use large or medium bags. The XL are for pasteurized subs. If you get it to work good for you!
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Juiceh
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: Gr0wer]
#22376250 - 10/13/15 10:37 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Gr0wer said: The XL are for pasteurized subs.
Wrong.
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tahoe
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: Gr0wer]
#22376353 - 10/13/15 10:57 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Gr0wer said: ]http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21726343/page/5
Use large or medium bags. The XL are for pasteurized subs.
I would hate to play a game of telephone with you. Mr Fox says that he bets the bags are for bulk subs in the previous thread. You say that they are, in fact, for bulk in this thread. Repeating non facts as facts. Shame on you.
-------------------- Stop experimenting half way through your first grow. Grow it to maturity, watch it, learn from it. Do this a few times then experiment with different ideas and figure out what works best for you.
My Legacy https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22140987#22140987 Teh=The I need to proofread
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Pastywhyte
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: tahoe]
#22376371 - 10/13/15 11:01 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Its not the size of the bag, its the type of filter. 0.5 micron is regarded by many as being for sterilizing sawdust, tho I have done grains in them without mold becoming an issue, as have many people. I suspect that a high sporeload could compromise them tho.
But for pasteurizing I cannot imagine why anyone would bother to waste a filter patch bag for something that could be done in an oven bag, or even a trash bag just as well.
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Gr0wer
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: Pastywhyte]
#22380986 - 10/14/15 09:31 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Trash bags are not food grade and oven bags are not as rugged. I use XL bags for stuffing pasteurized straw since my chamber is too small for tubes. I can fit 12-13 lbs of sub into one bag. 50 cents a bag is nothing compared to the $20-40 worth of mushrooms i can harvest off it. I do plan to swap to tubes for my larger walk in room.
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Pastywhyte
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: Gr0wer]
#22381551 - 10/15/15 12:16 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Umm why does the bag need to be "food grade"? Are you eating the bag? I never heard of a food grade laundry basket or 5 gallon bucket but people spawn oysters to them all the time. A spawn run can be done in anything that won't break down from the metabolites or contam.
At any rate you could still pasteurize in anything (jars, trash bags, oil drum) and spawn to the XL bag which oddly enough would still achieve the same results.
Edited by Pastywhyte (10/15/15 12:24 AM)
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poofterFroth
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: blindingleaf]
#22383349 - 10/15/15 12:52 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
blindingleaf said: tahoe, u can honestly go a lot shorter man. i do 6x 8.5 lb bags for 3.5 hours at 15 PSI. now, since i did the stop cock thing, i only do 3 hours at 25PSI.
 
for just one bag, i would do maybe 2.5 hours.
Question for blindineaf:
Are these bags pictured only soaked and mostly hydrated - to finish hydration in the cooker? It appears that way, so I'm just curious since I've started using a similar rye grain prep method recently.
Also, whats your reasoning behind the tape, does it help avoid bags inflating? I've been using bag clamps when pc'ing grain spawn because I've yet to grow the balls to try a stopcock on my 930. I like the clamps but definetly have issues with inflating bags.
-------------------------------------------
To sorta get back on topic - I've successfully increased my pc times to 3 hours @ 15psi, running large(8"x4.8"x19") bags sized at .2 micron. I can get away with using .5's for grains if needed but there's always a dry patch around the filter.
...I've never used an xl bag for spawn yet.
--------------------
Edited by poofterFroth (10/15/15 09:06 PM)
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Gr0wer
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: Pastywhyte]
#22389598 - 10/16/15 05:47 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Pastywhyte said: Umm why does the bag need to be "food grade"? Are you eating the bag? I never heard of a food grade laundry basket or 5 gallon bucket but people spawn oysters to them all the time. A spawn run can be done in anything that won't break down from the metabolites or contam.
At any rate you could still pasteurize in anything (jars, trash bags, oil drum) and spawn to the XL bag which oddly enough would still achieve the same results.

plastic leaching
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Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: Gr0wer]
#22389915 - 10/16/15 06:58 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Oh please. You should read the damn links you just posted if you don't want to look like an idiot. Half of those are disagreeing with the potential harms of bpa while others recommend people steer clear of polycarbonate plastics and some polypropelenes. Some even recommend polyethylene (the plastic garbage bags are made from) as the safe bpa free alternative. Meanwhile the mycobags you say you use actually are made from polypropelene.
Edited by Pastywhyte (10/16/15 07:10 PM)
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blindingleaf
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: Pastywhyte]
#22390342 - 10/16/15 08:24 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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PVC out gasses, and is approved for use in organic farms as a "generic material".
organic oyster farms use "polyethylene" tubing for both substrate and FAE systems regularly.
-------------------- A few thoughts on cultivation MICROBIAL HUSBANDRY!!!! The whole is greater than the sum of its parts
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Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: blindingleaf]
#22390356 - 10/16/15 08:28 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
blindingleaf said: PVC out gasses, and is approved for use in organic farms as a "generic material".
organic oyster farms use "polyethylene" tubing for both substrate and FAE systems regularly.
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Juiceh
Dabbing All Day



Registered: 09/25/12
Posts: 3,208
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: Pastywhyte]
#22390475 - 10/16/15 08:46 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Pastywhyte said: I never heard of a food grade laundry basket or 5 gallon bucket but people spawn oysters to them all the time.
http://www.lowes.com/pd_356492-1152-50640_0__?productId=3694238
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blindingleaf
blue collar underworld


Registered: 07/19/13
Posts: 22,008
Loc: sub-surface unseen
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: Juiceh]
#22390493 - 10/16/15 08:48 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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soy sauce buckets, tofu buckets, pickle buckets….all food safe.
trash night FTW
-------------------- A few thoughts on cultivation MICROBIAL HUSBANDRY!!!! The whole is greater than the sum of its parts
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tahoe
Noob Slayer



Registered: 11/26/03
Posts: 6,274
Loc: N38.93829W119.98108
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Re: How long does one pc an xl grow bag? [Re: blindingleaf]
#22391233 - 10/16/15 11:00 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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I drank out of a vinyl hose today. And I kept all my old nalgene bottles because I like bpa. The whole plastic thing was just another attack on the oil folks.
As for my big bags. I ended up doing two of them. Neither are showing signs of growth yet.
-------------------- Stop experimenting half way through your first grow. Grow it to maturity, watch it, learn from it. Do this a few times then experiment with different ideas and figure out what works best for you.
My Legacy https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22140987#22140987 Teh=The I need to proofread
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