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tedoro
ToadStool Tender



Registered: 02/06/15
Posts: 2,206
Last seen: 19 hours, 57 minutes
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Help me troubleshoot contamination issues with franks monos
#22307590 - 09/29/15 11:12 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Hello,
This is awkwardly long, but I didn't know how else to write it. my apologies.
I'm a cubensis golden teacher, agar to rye berry myco bags, bucket/hot water pasteurization of coir, franks monotubs type of guy. Three years into this hobby, still have a ton to learn.
I am having troubles with what I believe to be trich (blueish green powdery mold) contaminating my monotubs after the first flush.
I remember reading a dialog between Frank and RR about frank choosing to pull his harvest instead of cutting, because he always got contams if he cut the fruit. RR pointed out that his agar work wasn't perfectly clean. Or at least thats how I remember the dialog going. As I was experiencing the same thing, I spent the last 5 months learning agar in hopes to lessen my problems. (I wasn't using agar prior to that)
Well I'm back at monotubs with what I believe to be clean agar work, and sure enough, I'm getting the same contams after the first flush.
I will list what I think I'm doing wrong, let me know if one of these sound like the culprit. (or simply all of them)
1) Maybe my agar work is harboring trich and I can't see it.
2) I grow in a closet, and I struggle with too high of temps. Currently the closet air is around 80 degrees... and to keep the humidity up, I fear I'm not introducing enough fresh air.
3) My air is 30%ish year round humidity... I try to use a humidifier to get it up around 60%, but even at 60%, I either get cracked caps, or fuzzy bases... there doesn't seem to be a healthy inbetween.
4) I think I am upsetting the monotub with my rehydration technique. I currently pour about 4 cups of water on the surface after first flush, and let it flow down the edges between the plastic bag and the substrate. After an hour or two I carefully turn the tub on edge, holding it delicately with my hand for a minute and let it drain. Then I put it back in fruiting conditions. I think I let it sit too wet, after the draining. The cut stumps seem to dislike the wet and get slimey.
5) I am not very sterile with anything after my grains are fully colonized. No gloves. my tubs are in a clean-ish closet, but on the floor. I've been sometimes using completely open top monotub holes. I sometimes don't clean my fiskar clippers.
Or maybe something else I'm doing to inadvertently create a good mold environment....
Advise?
T
-------------------- -------------------- Deep pour soft agar plates-->bags of WBS-->Low Profile Monos Clean spawn thread | Put a thermometer on your PC
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taGyo
Strainiac/AMU



Registered: 10/16/14
Posts: 18,802
Loc: Journal Land
Last seen: 5 years, 3 months
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Re: Help me troubleshoot contamination issues with franks monos [Re: tedoro]
#22307647 - 09/29/15 11:27 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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After the first flush sounds like weak spawn.
Cutting or pulling really doesn't make a difference if you have strong myc. Where it makes the most impact is whether you're leaving large holes in the substrate when you're pulling. That's when I'll opt to grab the scissors because those large holes often lead to poor second and third flush pinsets. If you damage the sub and stress it out while harvesting you're more prone to contam but RR was getting at that Frank didn't have a great culture to begin with, hence why I said weak or contamed spawn.
I would take whatever plate you have and transfer it two more times from the edge. Then transfer that once more to a clean plate. Since I don't see the plate I can't tell you where to take these from but if I run into ride-alongs the only thing you can really do is keep trying to transfer from what looks like clean sections.
If you had a pic of your jars or agar work I can confirm or deny.
80 is a little high but it's overall fine. if you can get it to 75 I bet you'd see less trich. Honestly anything above 77 should be avoided IMO, too tricky of an area.
Fuzzy bases means you need to loosen up your top holes. Some fuzzy base is genetic though, I'd need pics. House RH really matters very little if you can get that polyfill dialed in right: http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/17332777 Try a fan in that closet. A small personal one just to move air around.
You're basically doing the Tribunal Dunk Tek. It's fine. Look up tribunal dunk tek and do it like him exactly. IMO, after the first flush if your sub didn't pump out much weight or too many I'd just mist it down. The stumps revert to mycelium after being cut, that's why they're fuzzing up. If they're turning slimy that's not a good sign. I think you have a ride-along or a weak culture.
When you clip shrooms I recommend at least wiping the cutters with alcohol, just to avoid all that nastiness on weakened mycelium points.
I don't use gloves after full colonization either. Shit man, I don't even wash my hands when I work with coir. It's 99.99% probably not your coir and about 99.99% weak spawn.
-------------------- Gyo's Better Grows TNF Q&A AMU Q&A Dominus fortunae meae sum
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tedoro
ToadStool Tender



Registered: 02/06/15
Posts: 2,206
Last seen: 19 hours, 57 minutes
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Re: Help me troubleshoot contamination issues with franks monos [Re: taGyo]
#22307949 - 09/29/15 12:17 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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taGyo,
Much thanks for the time to consider my situation. I will focus on improving my spawn. There is a side of me that wishes I could run into a generous chap that has some personally honed cube strain. Because even after I figure this out... I'll need to start getting a good strain going. I have so much to work on. Thanks again for the advise.
T
-------------------- -------------------- Deep pour soft agar plates-->bags of WBS-->Low Profile Monos Clean spawn thread | Put a thermometer on your PC
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taGyo
Strainiac/AMU



Registered: 10/16/14
Posts: 18,802
Loc: Journal Land
Last seen: 5 years, 3 months
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Re: Help me troubleshoot contamination issues with franks monos [Re: tedoro]
#22307983 - 09/29/15 12:25 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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IMO make that strain ,
It feels so much better after it's your hard work and you have a rockin' clone. Prints are easy to come by and honestly a cube is a cube in growing preferences, find the ones you like to eat and grow 'em till you get an isolate that flushes a lb
-------------------- Gyo's Better Grows TNF Q&A AMU Q&A Dominus fortunae meae sum
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tedoro
ToadStool Tender



Registered: 02/06/15
Posts: 2,206
Last seen: 19 hours, 57 minutes
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Re: Help me troubleshoot contamination issues with franks monos [Re: taGyo]
#22308232 - 09/29/15 01:12 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Love it. Wish me luck.
-------------------- -------------------- Deep pour soft agar plates-->bags of WBS-->Low Profile Monos Clean spawn thread | Put a thermometer on your PC
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Kizzle
Misanthrope


Registered: 08/30/11
Posts: 9,855
Last seen: 20 hours, 9 minutes
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Re: Help me troubleshoot contamination issues with franks monos [Re: tedoro]
#22308314 - 09/29/15 01:27 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
3) My air is 30%ish year round humidity... I try to use a humidifier to get it up around 60%, but even at 60%, I either get cracked caps, or fuzzy bases... there doesn't seem to be a healthy inbetween.
In the tub or in the closet? If you have a closet and you're raising the humidity to 60% the building material of the closet is going to start growing mold.
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Mad Season
hookers and blackjack



Registered: 09/16/12
Posts: 12,666
Loc: Canada
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Re: Help me troubleshoot contamination issues with franks monos [Re: tedoro]
#22308342 - 09/29/15 01:32 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22020260
Check out this. It's imo the difference between doing agar, and utilizing agar.
Also bacteria in spawn can be from a high initial endospore count. I like to recommend 20 psi for 2 hours on qt jars. It works decently and only has minimal bacteria. Read my signature on what stamets says about bacteria. I'd also read the improve your sterile techniques link too
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tedoro
ToadStool Tender



Registered: 02/06/15
Posts: 2,206
Last seen: 19 hours, 57 minutes
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Re: Help me troubleshoot contamination issues with franks monos [Re: Kizzle]
#22308360 - 09/29/15 01:35 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Really? Thats very good to know. What is a safe level? 50%.
It seems fine at 60% concrete floors, plywood and fir 2x4's. Big 1 inch gaps all over to make it leaky. The times I've brought it up to 80%... now that felt like mold potential.
t
-------------------- -------------------- Deep pour soft agar plates-->bags of WBS-->Low Profile Monos Clean spawn thread | Put a thermometer on your PC
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tedoro
ToadStool Tender



Registered: 02/06/15
Posts: 2,206
Last seen: 19 hours, 57 minutes
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Re: Help me troubleshoot contamination issues with franks monos [Re: tedoro]
#22308371 - 09/29/15 01:37 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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So wait.... If I keep some polyfill in the upper holes, but get my fan to be stronger, does that keep more moisture in the tub than lower fan levels and no polyfill in the upper holes?
-------------------- -------------------- Deep pour soft agar plates-->bags of WBS-->Low Profile Monos Clean spawn thread | Put a thermometer on your PC
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