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bennylava
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How to promote responsibility in the media? 1
#22291548 - 09/26/15 01:45 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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I was looking back through some old Timothy Leary interviews from the early 80's. Watching them on youtube. And I noticed, that even in that time, the media is basically just completely unhinged. I guess they have been for a long time now. In the U.S at least, and I'm assuming throughout much of the rest of the world. They basically just say and do whatever they damn well please, in the name of 'freedom of the press'. The U.S may have the constitution making this possible, but its a highly regarded ideal in many other countries as well.
I mean its really disgusting, and its pretty much the reason I just don't participate in the media at all. I actually use forums (not unlike this one) to get my news, because there's nearly always someone who knows more of the story, and points out how the media is either wrong, or lying once again.
Its like they simply don't care. They don't give a rip what the consequences of their actions are. Just look at how they treat any form or fashion of racial tension. Instead of blaming individual criminals, they focus on how that person must have been a victim of racism, just because they were of a particular race when they were finally busted and then proceeded to act in a manner which got them killed. Instead of just doing the smart thing and going to jail and hiring a lawyer. Another thing they love to do is ruin someone's life completely, and not even mention it when it turns out they were completely innocent. Shit like that. They've got a whole host of very bad habits (for society) like the aforementioned two.
It doesn't matter the outlet, journalism is not only dead, its now so far gone that even its tombstone is no longer standing due to the natural forces of gradual erosion. That's how long gone, journalism is. Impartial journalism. Where they really do just report, and let you decide. Without any opinion or bias of any kind. That's dust in the wind.
I'm convinced that they're nothing but evil propaganda slingers now. And that's it, nothing more. Oh yeah, they'll tell you about traffic jams, and the weather. But beyond that, I can't find a reason why they should still exist. They're trash, and their ratings actually reflect that. Probably why they need to receive money from the government, so they can stay afloat. Which is also yet another reason they're completely and utterly compromised.
So, all that said, I think that just about everyone realizes there is a problem. But how do you force them to be responsible, once again? Like they used to be, in days gone by? How do you give them something to fear, without also trampling on "freedom of the press"? I think they need a few new rules, but what should they be?
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burgerbrain
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: bennylava]
#22291571 - 09/26/15 01:52 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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All the big networks are frauds, only trust alternative media sources (IE. Internet)
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bennylava
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: burgerbrain]
#22291614 - 09/26/15 02:09 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Yeah but the point is, what new rules should they have? They influence a lot of people that would otherwise not be such morons.
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burgerbrain
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: bennylava]
#22291626 - 09/26/15 02:13 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Good point, hard to do with the 1st Amendment.
My solution would be education, but apparently the sheeple won't give up the socialist education they have now.
Edited by burgerbrain (09/26/15 02:17 AM)
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The Ecstatic
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: burgerbrain]
#22292613 - 09/26/15 10:06 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
burgerbrain said: Good point, hard to do with the 1st Amendment.
My solution would be education, but apparently the sheeple won't give up the socialist education they have now.
What?
Are you saying that it's public education or that our education system teaches socialism?
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burgerbrain
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: The Ecstatic]
#22293143 - 09/26/15 11:53 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
The Ecstatic said:
Quote:
burgerbrain said: Good point, hard to do with the 1st Amendment.
My solution would be education, but apparently the sheeple won't give up the socialist education they have now.
What?
Are you saying that it's public education or that our education system teaches socialism?
Which one of those options is false and why?
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The Ecstatic
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: burgerbrain]
#22294191 - 09/26/15 03:35 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Already been explained in the other thread.
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burgerbrain
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: The Ecstatic]
#22294205 - 09/26/15 03:37 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
The Ecstatic said: Already been explained in the other thread.
Yes I understand that you like to call the Socialist School system "just another government service"
Do you know what the word "Semantics" means?
LOL
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Stonehenge
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: bennylava]
#22294367 - 09/26/15 04:11 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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>I'm convinced that they're nothing but evil propaganda slingers now
You got it. Plus they are paid to promote certain points of view and certain industries and people. Goebels would be proud to see his work carried out like this.
-------------------- “A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835) Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755
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bennylava
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: Stonehenge]
#22294543 - 09/26/15 04:42 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Well I've got 2 new rules for 'em, that wouldn't hamper their freedom.
1. If you run something negative about someone, and it turns out they're innocent or found not guilty, or otherwise cleared of blame, you have to run a report on that, in the same time slot, for the same length of time.
2. No consolidation of the media. Currently there are but a mere 6 main major media outlets, that control most of the media. They used to be in the hundreds. There are illegal monopolies that need to be broken up. So my new rule would be, that no media outlet in existence, can be in any way connected to another. No person, or group, can control more than 1 media outlet. I think this is a big one. It would throw them all into huge disarray, and they'd make each other look a hell of a lot more stupid with their reports. You'd have one reporting one thing, and another saying the opposite, in some cases. This would go a long way towards making them get their story straight. So clearchannel would be dead, along with a whole lot of others. Most media outlets would return to being mom and pop joints. Run by the little guy.
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The Ecstatic
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: burgerbrain]
#22294595 - 09/26/15 04:56 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
burgerbrain said:
Quote:
The Ecstatic said: Already been explained in the other thread.
Yes I understand that you like to call the Socialist School system "just another government service"
Do you know what the word "Semantics" means?
LOL
That was Enlil. You're confused again.
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Enlil
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: bennylava]
#22294637 - 09/26/15 05:08 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
bennylava said: Well I've got 2 new rules for 'em, that wouldn't hamper their freedom.
1. If you run something negative about someone, and it turns out they're innocent or found not guilty, or otherwise cleared of blame, you have to run a report on that, in the same time slot, for the same length of time.
Forcing people to speak is as repugnant to the 1st amendment as prohibiting them from speakingQuote:
2. No consolidation of the media. Currently there are but a mere 6 main major media outlets, that control most of the media. They used to be in the hundreds. There are illegal monopolies that need to be broken up. So my new rule would be, that no media outlet in existence, can be in any way connected to another. No person, or group, can control more than 1 media outlet. I think this is a big one. It would throw them all into huge disarray, and they'd make each other look a hell of a lot more stupid with their reports. You'd have one reporting one thing, and another saying the opposite, in some cases. This would go a long way towards making them get their story straight. So clearchannel would be dead, along with a whole lot of others. Most media outlets would return to being mom and pop joints. Run by the little guy.
It would be hard to do this without running afoul of the Constitution. Antitrust laws can be used to limit this somewhat, but your proposed solution would certainly be unconstitutional.
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Stonehenge
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: bennylava]
#22294912 - 09/26/15 06:10 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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And Rupert Murdoch needs to go!
-------------------- “A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835) Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755
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bennylava
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: Enlil] 1
#22295333 - 09/26/15 07:24 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said:
Quote:
bennylava said: Well I've got 2 new rules for 'em, that wouldn't hamper their freedom.
1. If you run something negative about someone, and it turns out they're innocent or found not guilty, or otherwise cleared of blame, you have to run a report on that, in the same time slot, for the same length of time.
Forcing people to speak is as repugnant to the 1st amendment as prohibiting them from speakingQuote:
2. No consolidation of the media. Currently there are but a mere 6 main major media outlets, that control most of the media. They used to be in the hundreds. There are illegal monopolies that need to be broken up. So my new rule would be, that no media outlet in existence, can be in any way connected to another. No person, or group, can control more than 1 media outlet. I think this is a big one. It would throw them all into huge disarray, and they'd make each other look a hell of a lot more stupid with their reports. You'd have one reporting one thing, and another saying the opposite, in some cases. This would go a long way towards making them get their story straight. So clearchannel would be dead, along with a whole lot of others. Most media outlets would return to being mom and pop joints. Run by the little guy.
It would be hard to do this without running afoul of the Constitution. Antitrust laws can be used to limit this somewhat, but your proposed solution would certainly be unconstitutional.
Well monopolies are illegal now, so technically if they wanted them broken up, they could. Just look at how much of the media is owned by disney. The alternative to not making them be responsible, is having them be a big thorn in your side. At this point they aren't "the press" that the constitution was protecting. I believe they were protecting actual journalism, and not these megacorps. So there is that.
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Enlil
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: bennylava]
#22296257 - 09/26/15 10:11 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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6 companies does not a monopoly make, and if you want the government deciding what does and doesn't qualify as the press for 1st amendment purposes, then why have a 1st amendment at all?
Also, monopolies aren't illegal.
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bennylava
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: Enlil] 1
#22296748 - 09/27/15 12:50 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Yes, they are. They've been broken up numerous times in the past. Look what happened to microsoft, as a recent example.
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Enlil
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: bennylava]
#22296754 - 09/27/15 12:53 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Thanks for your well-supported opinion, counselor, but unless you can cite a statute prohibiting monopolies, I'm going to have to call bullshit on your claim.
Antitrust laws exist, but a monopoly isn't illegal unless it was formed and/or maintained by some unlawful practice.
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bennylava
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: Enlil] 1
#22296901 - 09/27/15 02:02 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Again, see microsoft. Scroll down and see how illegal monopolies are formed. And if you don't think that runs rampant, then I really have no business arguing with you.
http://www.girardgibbs.com/antitrust-monopoly/
It might not be the wording you wanted for some reason, but these still had a "monopoly" and were broken up. By law.
http://www.consumer.ftc.gov/sites/default/files/games/off-site/youarehere/pages/pdf/FTC-Competition_Antitrust-Laws.pdf
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Enlil
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: bennylava]
#22297497 - 09/27/15 09:11 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Yeah, you really don't have any business arguing with me. Monopolies aren't illegal, and many exist naturally and by operation of law.
The bottom line here is that your idea would be unconstitutional.
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burgerbrain
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: Enlil]
#22297843 - 09/27/15 10:47 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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LOL it's pretty bad when a laymen knows more than some shitty "attorney"
"Monopolies aren't illegal"-Enlil
Freedictionary.com: U.S. law generally views monopolies as harmful because they obstruct the channels of free competition that determine the price and quality of products and services that are offered to the public. The owners of a monopoly have the power, as a group, to set prices, to exclude competitors, and to control the market in the relevant geographic area. U.S. antitrust laws prohibit monopolies and any other practices that unduly restrain competitive trade. These laws are based on the belief that equality of opportunity in the marketplace and the free interactions of competitive forces result in the best allocation of the economic resources of the nation. Moreover, it is assumed that competition enhances material progress in production and technology while preserving democratic, political, and social institutions.
FTC.gov: Monopolization Defined The antitrust laws prohibit conduct by a single firm that unreasonably restrains competition by creating or maintaining monopoly power. Most Section 2 claims involve the conduct of a firm with a leading market position, although Section 2 of the Sherman Act also bans attempts to monopolize and conspiracies to monopolize. As a first step, courts ask if the firm has "monopoly power" in any market. This requires in-depth study of the products sold by the leading firm, and any alternative products consumers may turn to if the firm attempted to raise prices. Then courts ask if that leading position was gained or maintained through improper conduct—that is, something other than merely having a better product, superior management or historic accident. Here courts evaluate the anticompetitive effects of the conduct and its procompetitive justifications.
Edited by burgerbrain (09/27/15 10:56 AM)
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Enlil
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: burgerbrain]
#22297882 - 09/27/15 10:56 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Cite a statute prohibiting monopolies or you're talking out of your ass.
Quote:
Enlil said: Antitrust laws exist, but a monopoly isn't illegal unless it was formed and/or maintained by some unlawful practice.
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burgerbrain
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: Enlil]
#22297891 - 09/27/15 10:58 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: Cite a statute prohibiting monopolies or you're talking out of your ass.
Quote:
Enlil said: Antitrust laws exist, but a monopoly isn't illegal unless it was formed and/or maintained by some unlawful practice.
Dude you're going to have to take it up with the Federal Trade Commission, because you're wrong.
FTC.gov: Monopolization Defined The antitrust laws prohibit conduct by a single firm that unreasonably restrains competition by creating or maintaining monopoly power. Most Section 2 claims involve the conduct of a firm with a leading market position, although Section 2 of the Sherman Act also bans attempts to monopolize and conspiracies to monopolize. As a first step, courts ask if the firm has "monopoly power" in any market. This requires in-depth study of the products sold by the leading firm, and any alternative products consumers may turn to if the firm attempted to raise prices. Then courts ask if that leading position was gained or maintained through improper conduct—that is, something other than merely having a better product, superior management or historic accident. Here courts evaluate the anticompetitive effects of the conduct and its procompetitive justifications.
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Enlil
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: Enlil]
#22297902 - 09/27/15 11:00 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Unable to cite a statute? Why doesn't that surprise me?
Also, your quoted section doesn't say monopolies are illegal. To quote YOUR SOURCE:
"Then courts ask if that leading position was gained or maintained through improper conduct—that is, something other than merely having a better product, superior management or historic accident" (emphasis mine)
As I said before:
Quote:
Enlil said: Antitrust laws exist, but a monopoly isn't illegal unless it was formed and/or maintained by some unlawful practice.
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burgerbrain
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: Enlil]
#22297913 - 09/27/15 11:02 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: Unable to cite a statute? Why doesn't that surprise me?
Also, your quoted section doesn't say monopolies are illegal. To quote YOUR SOURCE:
"Then courts ask if that leading position was gained or maintained through improper conduct—that is, something other than merely having a better product, superior management or historic accident"
As I said before:
Quote:
Enlil said: Antitrust laws exist, but a monopoly isn't illegal unless it was formed and/or maintained by some unlawful practice.
I cited the statute, kiddo. The Sherman Act. Need a few more?
Edited by burgerbrain (09/27/15 11:04 AM)
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Enlil
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: burgerbrain]
#22297924 - 09/27/15 11:03 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Just one will suffice. So far, you've only confirmed what I said yesterday...monopolies aren't illegal unless it is formed or maintained by some unlawful practice.
Got anything better? I already know the answer, but some people need to go through the process of an intellectual beatdown in order to learn something.
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burgerbrain
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: Enlil]
#22297948 - 09/27/15 11:09 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: Just one will suffice. So far, you've only confirmed what I said yesterday...monopolies aren't illegal unless it is formed or maintained by some unlawful practice.
Got anything better? I already know the answer, but some people need to go through the process of an intellectual beatdown in order to learn something.
So FTC.gov will not suffice for you, well then there's no pleasing some people.
Yes you need to learn something and get back to this thread.
Edited by burgerbrain (09/27/15 11:09 AM)
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Enlil
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: burgerbrain]
#22297981 - 09/27/15 11:16 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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FTC.gov doesn't support the claim that monopolies are illegal. Nowhere in your quoted portion does it say that monopolies are illegal. Your quote specifically supports my claim, however.
If you can't admit you're wrong, that's fine. I don't need your affirmations. I just want you to grow and learn. Feel free to claim victory...anyone with half a brain reading this thread already knows that I'm right and you're not. 
As far as monopolies, they are not only legal, but they are often government created/protected. For instance, patent law protects a person's right to be the sole manufacturer of a product. This is a monopoly. In addition, public utility commissions all over this country give monopolies to utility companies where it would be impractical for multiple companies to compete. Even the FCC licensing process is a monopoly of sorts allowing only one person to use a particular frequency in a particular area.
So, have you come up with a statute prohibiting monopolies yet? I didn't think so.
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burgerbrain
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: Enlil]
#22298010 - 09/27/15 11:22 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: FTC.gov doesn't support the claim that monopolies are illegal. Nowhere in your quoted portion does it say that monopolies are illegal. Your quote specifically supports my claim, however.
If you can't admit you're wrong, that's fine. I don't need your affirmations. I just want you to grow and learn. Feel free to claim victory...anyone with half a brain reading this thread already knows that I'm right and you're not. 
As far as monopolies, they are not only legal, but they are often government created/protected. For instance, patent law protects a person's right to be the sole manufacturer of a product. This is a monopoly. In addition, public utility commissions all over this country give monopolies to utility companies where it would be impractical for multiple companies to compete. Even the FCC licensing process is a monopoly of sorts allowing only one person to use a particular frequency in a particular area.
So, have you come up with a statute prohibiting monopolies yet? I didn't think so.
I guess you didn't read this part? "Most Section 2 claims involve the conduct of a firm with a leading market position, although Section 2 of the Sherman Act also bans attempts to monopolize and conspiracies to monopolize."
So your whole goal on shroomery is to "win" quibbles over word definitions to impress your digital friends. Hahaha nice.
Yes some monopolies are legal and some are illegal. What's your point again?
Edited by burgerbrain (09/27/15 11:28 AM)
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burgerbrain
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: burgerbrain]
#22298088 - 09/27/15 11:36 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Next Enlil will give us a lesson on how the libnut media is allowed to form a cartel.
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Enlil
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: burgerbrain]
#22298119 - 09/27/15 11:42 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
burgerbrain said:
Yes some monopolies are legal
See, even you can learn something. I'm proud of you, kid.
Quote:
What's your point again?
My point, which you clearly missed, is that Bennylava's suggestion that the government prohibit the ownership of more than one media outlet by a person wouldn't work because it'd be unconstitutional. I know you're in favor of the government controlling every facet of business and personal conduct, but the Constitution has limits.
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burgerbrain
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: Enlil]
#22298131 - 09/27/15 11:45 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said:
Quote:
burgerbrain said:
Yes some monopolies are legal and some are illegal. What's your point again?
See, even you can learn something. I'm proud of you, kid.
My point, which you clearly missed, is that Bennylava's suggestion that the government prohibit the ownership of more than one media outlet by a person wouldn't work because it'd be unconstitutional. I know you're in favor of the government controlling every facet of business and personal conduct, but the Constitution has limits.
I'm glad you can attempt to insult people as a mod, kiddo.
I never said all monopolies are illegal. If I did then post it.
Who's in favor of more gov' control? You are, without the government, you wouldn't have food on the table.
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Enlil
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: burgerbrain]
#22298145 - 09/27/15 11:47 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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No, you butted into a conversation wherein someone else said that monopolies are illegal, and you (unsuccessfully) tried to prove his claim.
I'm just glad to see that you can learn, though. This is a huge step up from the capacities you've shown previously.
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burgerbrain
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: Enlil]
#22298170 - 09/27/15 11:51 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: No, you butted into a conversation wherein someone else said that monopolies are illegal, and you tried to prove his claim.
I'm just glad to see that you can learn, though. This is a huge step up from the capacities you've shown previously.
Yes some monopolies are illegal-how does that disprove his claim? Think hard now.
Haha I learned you're a disinformation shill. See how you couldn't deny that more government control means more money in your bank account?
It's interesting that you people have worked so long at this disinformation game that you're now moderating the same forums you attack.
Edited by burgerbrain (09/27/15 11:53 AM)
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Enlil
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: burgerbrain]
#22298183 - 09/27/15 11:53 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Ah...the old "shill" move...nice one.
At least I can now dismiss you as a typical type.
Saying "monopolies are illegal" isn't the same as saying "some monopolies are illegal". If I said "guns are illegal", that'd be a false claim. If I said, "some guns are illegal" that would be a true claim.
See the difference? Think hard now.
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burgerbrain
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: Enlil]
#22298189 - 09/27/15 11:54 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: Ah...the old "shill" move...nice one.
At least I can now dismiss you as a typical type.
I noticed how you didn't say anything about this line:
See how you couldn't deny that more government control means more money in your bank account?
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burgerbrain
Freedom Lover


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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: burgerbrain]
#22298195 - 09/27/15 11:55 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
burgerbrain said:
Quote:
Enlil said: Ah...the old "shill" move...nice one.
At least I can now dismiss you as a typical type.
I noticed how you didn't say anything about this line:
See how you couldn't deny that more government control means more money in your bank account?
Enlil exposed, again.
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Enlil
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: burgerbrain]
#22298202 - 09/27/15 11:57 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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I make my living primarily by suing the government. More government misconduct means more money in my bank account. More government control means that less conduct by the government constitutes misconduct. See where this is going?
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burgerbrain
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: Enlil]
#22298210 - 09/27/15 11:58 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: I make my living primarily by suing the government. More government misconduct means more money in my bank account. More government control means that less conduct by the government constitutes misconduct. See where this is going?
Sure you do. Any recent specifics? LOL
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Enlil
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: burgerbrain]
#22298218 - 09/27/15 12:00 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Yeah, bro. I'm going to reveal my identity on a drug site in order to appease a puppet.
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burgerbrain
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: Enlil]
#22298242 - 09/27/15 12:06 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: Yeah, bro. I'm going to reveal my identity on a drug site in order to appease a puppet.
I'm not going to take your word for it that "I make my living primarily by suing the government."
You most likely make your living by representing the masses that have been arrested via bullshit laws. More government bullshit laws, the more money in your bank account.
Edited by burgerbrain (09/27/15 12:06 PM)
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Enlil
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: burgerbrain]
#22298254 - 09/27/15 12:10 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Luckily, what I do for a living is irrelevant to this discussion. As a result, you can assume I'm a "shill" or whatever you want, and it doesn't matter. This is, of course, why I initially ignored your silly little attempt to claim bias based on how I earn my living.
So, to recap: Bennylava's suggestion wouldn't be legal. Monopolies are legal, and 6 companies controlling the media isn't a monopoly anyway.
Any other suggestions about how one can promote responsibility in the media?
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starfire_xes
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: burgerbrain]
#22298271 - 09/27/15 12:14 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
burgerbrain said:
Quote:
Enlil said: Cite a statute prohibiting monopolies or you're talking out of your ass.
Quote:
Enlil said: Antitrust laws exist, but a monopoly isn't illegal unless it was formed and/or maintained by some unlawful practice.
Dude you're going to have to take it up with the Federal Trade Commission, because you're wrong.
FTC.gov: Monopolization Defined The antitrust laws prohibit conduct by a single firm that unreasonably restrains competition by creating or maintaining monopoly power. Most Section 2 claims involve the conduct of a firm with a leading market position, although Section 2 of the Sherman Act also bans attempts to monopolize and conspiracies to monopolize. (1)As a first step, courts ask if the firm has "monopoly power" in any market. This requires in-depth study of the products sold by the leading firm, and any alternative products consumers may turn to if the firm attempted to raise prices. (2)Then courts ask if that leading position was gained or maintained through improper conduct—that is, something other than merely having a better product, superior management or historic accident. Here courts evaluate the anticompetitive effects of the conduct and its procompetitive justifications.
those 2 things are what the government has to do just to determine if there might be monopolistic behavior. Then the company would have to have some done pretty blatantly improper to get charged AND convicted of some law with those vague and arbitrary conditions.
That looks like a procedure a butt-hurt little uncompetitive company would use to blood-suck off a big successful one.
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bennylava
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: Enlil] 1
#22299654 - 09/27/15 05:37 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: Yeah, you really don't have any business arguing with me. Monopolies aren't illegal, and many exist naturally and by operation of law.
The bottom line here is that your idea would be unconstitutional.
Do you know what the definition of a monopoly is? I'm really having to ask this right now, cause I'm starting to have my doubts. Even if its unconstitutional, since this thread is about ideas to promote responsibility in the media, I could always just suggest that a constitutional amendment be made. Then it would be constitutional.
Quote:
Enlil said: Just one will suffice. So far, you've only confirmed what I said yesterday...monopolies aren't illegal unless it is formed or maintained by some unlawful practice.
You've long since lost the argument. What do you consider some unlawful practice? Oh hmm... I don't know... maybe its... BREAKING THE LAW??
And "some monopolies are illegal"? Which ones did you think I was talking about?
Edited by bennylava (09/27/15 05:44 PM)
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Enlil
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: bennylava]
#22299687 - 09/27/15 05:45 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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You didn't say some...you said "monopolies are illegal now". Some food is illegal. Some cars are illegal. You didn't mean that some monopolies are illegal, and you didn't say that. You claimed that monopolies are illegal. You were wrong then and you're wrong now.
I'm still waiting for someone to cite a statute that prohibits monopolies.
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bennylava
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: Enlil] 1
#22299707 - 09/27/15 05:49 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: You didn't say some...you said "monopolies are illegal now". Some food is illegal. Some cars are illegal. You didn't mean that some monopolies are illegal, and you didn't say that. You claimed that monopolies are illegal. You were wrong then and you're wrong now.
You've been wrong throughout this whole thread. Everything you've said has been wrong. You really think a judge is a brainless idiot who isn't going to put two and two together, if the "monopoly" ever went that far? You're really saying he's going to be like "Hmm, these guys have a monopoly, and they're violating this set of laws. They're price fixing, and they're unreasonably restraining competition, by creating and maintaining monopoly power. Well screw it, case dismissed".
Cause that's what you're saying. If its not what you're saying, then you should be more clear.
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Enlil
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: bennylava]
#22299733 - 09/27/15 05:57 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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What would it matter what a judge thought? Judges don't decide such things.
Also, price fixing is illegal. Unreasonably restraining competition is illegal. Having a monopoly isn't. If you wanted to say that the two former examples of antitrust violations are illegal, you should have said that instead of making the ludicrous and idiotic claim that monopolies are illegal.
The best part, however, is the way that you...like the other puppet...are unable to admit when you're wrong even though neither of you have been able to provide a single legal authority to support your ridiculous claims.
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The Ecstatic
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: Enlil]
#22299847 - 09/27/15 06:27 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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I never thought I'd see the day where I longed for the logical wherewithal of qman and starfire.
Does anybody here really think it's coincidence that 3 hardline conservative trolls registered within a week of each other?
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hostileuniverse
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: The Ecstatic] 1
#22299945 - 09/27/15 06:48 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
The Ecstatic said:
Does anybody here really think it's coincidence that 3 hardline conservative trolls registered within a week of each other? 
So you're liberal logic tells you they're all the same person... And when you're proven wrong, then what?
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Enlil
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: hostileuniverse]
#22299951 - 09/27/15 06:49 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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*your
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The Ecstatic
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: hostileuniverse]
#22300048 - 09/27/15 07:13 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
hostileuniverse said: liberal logic
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bennylava
Bad example


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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: Enlil]
#22300375 - 09/27/15 08:23 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: What would it matter what a judge thought? Judges don't decide such things.
Also, price fixing is illegal. Unreasonably restraining competition is illegal. Having a monopoly isn't. If you wanted to say that the two former examples of antitrust violations are illegal, you should have said that instead of making the ludicrous and idiotic claim that monopolies are illegal.
The best part, however, is the way that you...like the other puppet...are unable to admit when you're wrong even though neither of you have been able to provide a single legal authority to support your ridiculous claims.
So, you're blind. Refusing to look at his posts where he cited specifically, that those things are illegal. You're also blind to the fact that monopolies almost invariably do those things. I get it now. I'm talking to a blind man. It all makes sense now. Carry on.
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Stonehenge
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: bennylava] 1
#22302161 - 09/28/15 10:37 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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He is just trolling as usual. He always goes against what anyone says, never in favor. He snipes, quibbles, splits hairs, and plays word games. Ignore the troll in hopes he will go away.
-------------------- “A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835) Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755
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starfire_xes
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: bennylava]
#22306286 - 09/29/15 01:50 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
bennylava said: this thread is about ideas to promote responsibility in the media, I could always just suggest that a constitutional amendment be made. Then it would be constitutional.
oh boy! Is this going to be another epic thread that lasts six months, like the one Falcon did on making up a set of campaign finance reforms that would selectively violate certain people's freedom of speech and still be constitutional?
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bennylava
Bad example


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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: starfire_xes]
#22306544 - 09/29/15 04:34 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
starfire_xes said:
Quote:
bennylava said: this thread is about ideas to promote responsibility in the media, I could always just suggest that a constitutional amendment be made. Then it would be constitutional.
oh boy! Is this going to be another epic thread that lasts six months, like the one Falcon did on making up a set of campaign finance reforms that would selectively violate certain people's freedom of speech and still be constitutional? 
Straight up bribe money, against the 4rth amendment. Technically, you can't take campaign contributions. If we're going by the constitution, which we damn well should be.
Also thanks stonehenge, I didn't know the nature of the troll. Thought I was actually arguing with someone valid. I'll go straight to the ignore list and add him. Much appreciated!
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Enlil
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Re: How to promote responsibility in the media? [Re: bennylava]
#22306998 - 09/29/15 08:00 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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What does the 4th amendment have to do with it? Where in the Constitution does it say that candidates can't take campaign contributions?
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