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super fruit vision
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Registered: 09/25/15
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bluish green spots?
#22286870 - 09/25/15 01:44 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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ok just the other day I noticed some blue green spots on one cake and a little on another. I read that if it rubs off on a q tip its contam if it doesn't its bruising. I checked with a q tip and nothing came off so im just wandering ur guys opinion cus im a first time grower and need help really hope they are good and not contaminated
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micro
bunbun has a gungun



Registered: 05/09/03
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i think you answered your own question :v
it is most likely bruising
-------------------- Any research paper or book for free (Avatar is Maxxy, a character by Mizzyam, RIP)
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super fruit vision
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Re: bluish green spots? [Re: micro]
#22286898 - 09/25/15 02:03 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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thanks I can also post pictures tomorrow and u cud check them out just really trying to get good grow and not a contaminated grow lol
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super fruit vision
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I also had to go out of town for a few days and left someone to take care of them I guess the didn't fan the fc out but they did open it and mist the sides. could that be the reason for the bruising and could that have made them no good to eat or could just them opening and misting been good enough to let the co2 out?
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Mad Season
hookers and blackjack



Registered: 09/16/12
Posts: 12,666
Loc: Canada
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Bruising is almost always due to dryness. It seems like this could definitely be plausible since you're supposed to be misting the cakes and perlite directly. Misting the walls is outdated, it really won't give them the hydration they need, and tbh I've never misted a wall or fanned a chamber. Generally fanning is meant to help evaporate off the moisture you just misted onto it. Thus fanning is always done after misting. It won't exchange air. That's what the holes in the chamber are for. The air should be naturally exchanging 24/7.
Basically mist directly until they're shimmering/damp/glistening with absolutely no pooling water. Mist again when they're not shimmering/glistening
Edited by Mad Season (09/25/15 08:23 AM)
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super fruit vision
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ok thanks so do I mist the cakes even with the fruits on it the water on the mushrooms wont hurt them?
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Mad Season
hookers and blackjack



Registered: 09/16/12
Posts: 12,666
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Yeah mist them with fruits. Still water on caps can cause bacterial blotches, so make sure you fan after misting to help it evaporate off the caps if you're worried. But there should be enough fae to evaporate it for you. They get rained on outside. They can take some light misting
Edited by Mad Season (09/25/15 02:30 PM)
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micro
bunbun has a gungun



Registered: 05/09/03
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Loc: Brick City
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Quote:
Mad Season said: Bruising is almost always due to dryness.
or messing with the myc
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Misting the walls is outdated, it really won't give them the hydration they need, and tbh I've never misted a wall or fanned a chamber.
If you have an actual mister then yeah, mist it. lol
If you don't, you can use a regular spray bottle but you'd want to mist the sides.
That does give enough moisture. It evaporates and stuff :v
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Generally fanning is meant to help evaporate off the moisture you just misted onto it.
Not in fifteen seconds :|
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Thus fanning is always done after misting. It won't exchange air.
wat o.o
Of course it will, but you won't need it as much if you already have gas exchange.
If you don't, CO2 will build up and other gaseous waste and you can smell it after a while.
Fanning is supposed to get rid of that. Via gas exchange.
In your case I'd be more concerned about humidity. H2O(g) can easily get by a .2um filter.
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That's what the holes in the chamber are for. The air should be naturally exchanging 24/7.
There's more than one way to do things...
You don't need gas exchange 24/7. It can't hurt, assuming humidity stays high enough.
It was recommended to fan 3x a day but ime only once is absolutely necessary.
I was pretty ghetto about things though...
Plastic tubs, case with peat / lime, cover with plastic and fan/mist min. once a day.
It worked out really well.
-------------------- Any research paper or book for free (Avatar is Maxxy, a character by Mizzyam, RIP)
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Mad Season
hookers and blackjack



Registered: 09/16/12
Posts: 12,666
Loc: Canada
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Re: bluish green spots? [Re: micro]
#22292220 - 09/26/15 08:33 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Ah the thing that is outdated is the need of humidity. All you need is a spray bottle, and the eyes to tell when it needs a misting. Our chambers these days are made for max fae. The holes in the chambers will have a constant fresh air exchange. Such a great amount of air exchange that I've not fanned a chamber for a long long time. Mushrooms can grow very easily. You said it yourself. But if you want ideal fruiting conditions, give them a co2 ppm of under 1000.
In a chamber like a bag with a filter, you can fan 10 times a day. It may get some exchanges, but won't be a constant exchange of air. That's why when I use bags i poke 20-40 holes with a pen. With holes it's something like the air gets exchanged a bunch of times every hour. The TCs these days say you'd have to fan every 5-10 minutes if you wanted to replace fae.
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Mad Season said: http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21288129
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The thing to remember(which is something i find misunderstood) is that the most important humidity you have is surface humidity, in other words it really doesn't matter if your fc has a rh of 40% or 99% as long as there is room for evaporation to take place the humidity that is important sits on the surface.
This is our goal with every fruiting chamber we use is surface humidity, with our monotubs we dial them in to achieve this, with our sgfc's we mist as needed to achieve this, with our gh's we (depending on your set up)use something like an ultrasonic humidifier as a timed mister to achieve this because once we have this we can focus on fae which is a great tool for everything your substrate wants for many reasons, the more the better
The reason we grow in a high humidity environment is simple, mushrooms have no skin and lose moisture to the environment very easily and if they lose more then is being pumped in they simply die. This is an easy fix just simply misting your fruits.
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22105120
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This is proof that what's needed is max fae, as well as proper hydration through misting. Noobs shouldn't worry about humidity in a chamber made for max fae. They just have to keep the substrate glistening wet. Mist when it isn't glistening. No pooling water!!
Give this a read. It's the chamber everyone uses for pf tek: http://www.shroomery.org/forums/remlinker.php?Cat=&Entry=149248&F_Board=2&Thread=20195542&Main=20195542
Edited by Mad Season (09/26/15 08:53 AM)
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micro
bunbun has a gungun



Registered: 05/09/03
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Loc: Brick City
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oiy...
No, humidity is not outdated.
You don't mist with a spray bottle.
Pokin holes in the bag will make it dry out.
Even if that one event was successful it doesn't mean that is what you should do.
10% is *really* extreme; that's like nosebleed conditions.
Even if the house is that humidity it doesnt mean the plastic bin is, as well.
Casing holds moisture in; if it is out in the open however it'll dry out...
Unless you are constantly misting it; you even stated it wasn't a great flush:
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Mad Season said: So I've noticed cron has done a bunch of open air work (No fruiting chamber) it really inspired me to try it out. If I didn't neglect them so much, and misted them more in my dry ass under 10% humidity climate I could have seen more.
So why would you tell people to do something that didn't even work out for yourself?
In a relatively closed system like that, chances are it won't dry out anyway.
Still, this is all stating the obvious and is really simple 9th grade Physics.
You stated fanning the thing dried it off at an extraterrestrial rate.
Now you are saying its fine and nothing drys out at 10%.
How does that make sense ???
PS - you don't need filters or constant air exchange either =P
-------------------- Any research paper or book for free (Avatar is Maxxy, a character by Mizzyam, RIP)
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Mad Season
hookers and blackjack



Registered: 09/16/12
Posts: 12,666
Loc: Canada
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Re: bluish green spots? [Re: micro]
#22292815 - 09/26/15 10:46 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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I've been misting with a cheap windex bottle since the beginning. Just mist about a foot above the substrate. It works just fine man.
This is the main point of humidity: The reason we grow in a high humidity environment is simple, mushrooms have no skin and lose moisture to the environment very easily and if they lose more then is being pumped in they simply die. This is an easy fix just simply misting your fruits.
I also didn't say anything about fanning to dry it off at extremely high rates. I just said I don't do it. This is because I don't have to. This is purely out of laziness. You can fan 10-50 times a day and be fine. But what I was saying is, it just brings dry air in, promoting quicker evaporation (pinning). Also it'll help evaporate shit off the caps. You just literally need to mist when they need it.. If you can keep up the misting to fan 50 times a day, you'll see some great shit .
The main point is you don't need humidity (just surface humidity) but you do need fae. You can easily fix stuff with no humidity by misting more. In that link, if you read further i say I misted once a day, if even. Some days I didn't mist. This was really out of laziness. They were extremely bacterial, I didn't want them in my fruiting room, and it was a complete neglect tek. I honestly wanted to see if they'd even grow in such a low humidity. Which they can. I can say if I did them clean, and misted twice a day, it'd have been much better. But you gotta wait for next time :P.
Stuff with too high humidity, and not enough fae gets bacterial, really nasty long skinny fruits, and a bad odor, like you said. Thus the chambers these days go for more fae than humidity, and rely on the user to get good at telling what the mushrooms need. (Mist when needed)
You have to understand that increasing humidity and restricting fae is really just for our convenience, so we don't have to baby them so much. But to them they'd like to constantly be damp/wet and outside. This is why outdoor grows ROCK.
Really the best chambers will aim for more fae. Although I may have implied that humidity isn't needed, it'll make our lives easier by not having to mist as much.
So in terms of indoor cultivation, it's best to have a balance between the two
Edited by Mad Season (09/26/15 11:15 AM)
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micro
bunbun has a gungun



Registered: 05/09/03
Posts: 7,532
Loc: Brick City
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Quote:
Mad Season said: I've been misting with a cheap windex bottle since the beginning. Just mist about a foot above the substrate. It works just fine man.
You are contradicting yourself:
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Mad Season said: Still water on caps can cause bacterial blotches, so make sure you fan after misting to help it evaporate off the caps if you're worried. But there should be enough fae to evaporate it for you. They get rained on outside. They can take some light misting 
light misting is not a foot away with a spray bottlle
that isn't even misting
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Mad Season said: Generally fanning is meant to help evaporate off the moisture you just misted onto it.
So which one is it?
Also, if you are getting still water on the caps shooting them with a spray bottle that is doing it wrong.
Seeing how you claim you should have misted more to bring the humidity up, that's probably the last thing you want :v But then in your post you say humidity doesn't matter. Then you go on explaining why you should have good humidity...
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It won't exchange air.
COME ON
Think McFly, think!!!
Wow, twice in the same post!
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This is the main point of humidity: The reason we grow in a high humidity environment is simple
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The main point is you don't need humidity

Quote:
Stuff with too high humidity, and not enough fae gets bacterial, really nasty long skinny fruits, and a bad odor, like you said. Thus the chambers these days go for more fae than humidity, and rely on the user to get good at telling what the mushrooms need.
uhh... no
if so you are doing it wrong
the bad odor i was describing is when you dont fan it
so, the obvious sollution is to fan it
or air exchange, whatever, as long as gases can dissipate
Honestly, this is just getting silly.
If it weren't for all the blantant contradictions I'd almost think you are serious :v
-------------------- Any research paper or book for free (Avatar is Maxxy, a character by Mizzyam, RIP)
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Mad Season
hookers and blackjack



Registered: 09/16/12
Posts: 12,666
Loc: Canada
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Re: bluish green spots? [Re: micro]
#22292980 - 09/26/15 11:20 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Ugh I'm really trying hard to explain it to you. That humidity is for our convenience. Not the mushrooms. If you wanted ideal fruits you'd aim for more fae than humidity, and misted to compensate. And yeah misting a foot away to make them glisten with no pooling water is still misting.... in a high fae chamber there won't be still water on caps. It'd evaporate so quickly you don't even need to fan. Get it yet? I normally only have to do like 2-3 spurts anyways. That's why I said mist it lightly.
Edited by Mad Season (09/26/15 11:43 AM)
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Mad Season
hookers and blackjack



Registered: 09/16/12
Posts: 12,666
Loc: Canada
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Quote:
You have to understand that increasing humidity and restricting fae is really just for our convenience, so we don't have to baby them so much. But to them they'd like to constantly be damp/wet and outside. This is why outdoor grows ROCK.
Really the best chambers will aim for more fae. Although I may have implied that humidity isn't needed, it'll make our lives easier by not having to mist as much.
So in terms of indoor cultivation, it's best to have a balance between the two
I'd like to add to it by saying that since it's a pretty fine line for a proper balance, you'd still aim for more fae and mist to compensate.
With a sgfc, all that a noob has to worry about is to mist when needed
Edited by Mad Season (09/26/15 11:32 AM)
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confuzzed
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Registered: 05/22/06
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Lol... Yes everyone mist the cakes directly these days...
I too remember the days of "only mist the sides noob!" It seems things have changed since I got back on here.
Micro have you checked out the shotgun fruiting chambers? These have literally knocked out the cobweb mold problems my friend was having with his aquarium grows.
Once he switched to sgfc he hasn't had one cobweb casing yet! Now he has 5 aquariums 250 gallons a piece he doesn't know what to do with 
He seems a bit mad at me for helping him... Oh well what can you do?
The "boomery" actually has much more quality information now than I remember. Not so many trolls and/or inaccurate information!
I like where it has gone
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micro
bunbun has a gungun



Registered: 05/09/03
Posts: 7,532
Loc: Brick City
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Re: bluish green spots? [Re: confuzzed]
#22293879 - 09/26/15 02:16 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
confuzzed said: Lol... Yes everyone mist the cakes directly these days...
I too remember the days of "only mist the sides noob!" It seems things have changed since I got back on here.
With a spray bottle? Do you know what misting means?
I hate to be a broken record so please see my other posts.
I already went into this. Misting them is fine.
Spray bottle directly into it, not so much.
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Micro have you checked out the shotgun fruiting chambers? These have literally knocked out the cobweb mold problems my friend was having with his aquarium grows.
Nope, but glad your friend solved his problems :v
I was always a peat and lime type of guy, then again it grows a hell of a lot more so why not.
Why would I use a fruiting chamber o.O?
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Once he switched to sgfc he hasn't had one cobweb casing yet! Now he has 5 aquariums 250 gallons a piece he doesn't know what to do with 
... that's nice *yawn*
I haven't gotten cobweb ever, except maybe when I was starting out.
My roommate did though.
Upon closer inspection there was organic material in the peat.
There is an explanation for everything.
Well, exccept why you'd buy a 250 gallon aquarium...
I assume you mean fish aquarium.
I mean sure, or take that same money and buy enough plastic shit to grow 10x that much.
Put the rest in the bank 
Also, I assume with an aquarium you are still growing cakes. :|
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He seems a bit mad at me for helping him... Oh well what can you do?
Get online and post about it on a bulletin board because I think people will be impressed?
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The "boomery" actually has much more quality information now than I remember. Not so many trolls and/or inaccurate information!
I like where it has gone 
I haven't seen any so please, enlighten me.
I mean, I see plenty of smart people here but there are certain forums that make me wanna gag.
I just don't like conjecture maqurading as fact.
Especially from people who are still using jars and fruiting chambers, PF style :V
PS - just to add because I don't want to sound like a *complete* ass...
re: the fruiting chamber you were telling me about
it is a box that helps keep moisture in. it isnt rocket science
so it isn't a lack of curiosity on my part; i just don't care because it wouldn't do anything for me
cheap plastic bin and saran wrap works fine
if you want to spend time and money to come up with something fancier, by all means
i used to grow a lot though; it would have been a giant pain in the ass back then
-------------------- Any research paper or book for free (Avatar is Maxxy, a character by Mizzyam, RIP)
Edited by micro (09/26/15 02:30 PM)
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confuzzed
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Re: bluish green spots? [Re: micro]
#22293923 - 09/26/15 02:31 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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It's not about impressing. It's about learning!
Forgive me, you must already know everything, and do things perfectly.... Good luck to you!
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micro
bunbun has a gungun



Registered: 05/09/03
Posts: 7,532
Loc: Brick City
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Re: bluish green spots? [Re: confuzzed]
#22293936 - 09/26/15 02:34 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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i know people, too
this isn't trying to learn:
Quote:
He seems a bit mad at me for helping him... Oh well what can you do?
oh, hahaha! i get it :|
and i don't know everything but a lot of the stuff in this thread makes absolutely no sense
like fanning doesn't help gas exchange
however, it causes loss of water vapour
when water vapour is... wait - o my god! it's a gas
wtf really?
-------------------- Any research paper or book for free (Avatar is Maxxy, a character by Mizzyam, RIP)
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Mad Season
hookers and blackjack



Registered: 09/16/12
Posts: 12,666
Loc: Canada
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Re: bluish green spots? [Re: micro]
#22293999 - 09/26/15 02:50 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
PussyFart said: Well, we do not fan for FAE, the chamber usually gets that constantly from the holes we drill..so your question is invalid.
You would have to fan multiple times per hour....and even then the chamber would not function correctly.
Drill 1/4" holes every 2" on all 6 sides in a grid pattern according to the tek and also mist/fan the chamber manually.
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PussyFart said: We do not fan for FAE, so not sure what you mean.....the chamber should be getting constant FAE regardless.....
What kind of FC do you have?
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cronicr said:
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taGyo said:
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Not_A_Hobo said: cronicr: are you saying i need more air based on the 7-day progress? I am fanning 2-3 times a day. What should i increase this to?
You need more FAE, not fanning. Your terrarium may not be built to spec or fine grade perlite is clogging some holes or it's not in a place where it can receive adequate air movement.
we dopn't use fanning for fae , this should be a constant and passive motion whic is why we have adjustable holes in mono's and use sgfc's
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RogerRabbit said:
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so i wouldn't have to fan and mist it every day.
Air exchange is the number one pinning trigger. Humidity is farther down the list. Perhaps the number 2 pinning trigger is a loss of moisture from the substrate. If you try to avoid misting by constantly pumping in wet air, you don't have a loss of moisture from the substrate and performance is poor.
You want constant air exchange, and then as the cake or other substrate dries out, you mist to replace the lost moisture. This dry-wet cycle is a MAJOR pinning trigger. There is no automated system that can replace your eyeballs and mister. I'm an electrical engineer by profession with a specialty in automation, so believe me when I say if the whole process could be automated, I'd have done it years ago. RR
All TCs. You can't replace fae with fanning! But fae can replace fanning. Like I said, fanning these days is only used to help promote evaporation. It might exchange the air once. But it'll get saturated with co2 pretty damn fast. You want it to be exchanged constantly.
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Inocuole
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