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OnlineBigbadwooof
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Re: Capitalism at work [Re: pretzelking]
    #22324772 - 10/02/15 05:22 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

pretzelking said:
If we ended the USPS private mail carriers would refuse to deliver mail to certain areas. I met a USPS regional manager once and he explained to me that UPS and Fedex actually contract them to deliver THEIR packages in certain rural areas because it isn't profitable for them to. So if we didn't have a publicly funded not for profit mail delivery system certain citizens would be disenfranchised from that service.




That's true. This touches on a bigger aspect of the situation. Government programs are not designed to make a profit. They are designed to serve a purpose that society requires, and they will take a loss in certain occasions to meet that requirement.

The post office isn't meant to be a profitable business. There are more measures of success than dollars.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
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Every one of you should see this video.
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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Capitalism at work [Re: Bigbadwooof] * 1
    #22324937 - 10/02/15 05:54 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Bigbadwooof said:
Quote:

pretzelking said:
If we ended the USPS private mail carriers would refuse to deliver mail to certain areas. I met a USPS regional manager once and he explained to me that UPS and Fedex actually contract them to deliver THEIR packages in certain rural areas because it isn't profitable for them to. So if we didn't have a publicly funded not for profit mail delivery system certain citizens would be disenfranchised from that service.




That's true. This touches on a bigger aspect of the situation. Government programs are not designed to make a profit. They are designed to serve a purpose that society requires, and they will take a loss in certain occasions to meet that requirement.

The post office isn't meant to be a profitable business. There are more measures of success than dollars.




Well it's a damn good thing they aren't trying to be profitable, because CLEARY they are not...

Oh, and the rural wilds of Alaska where people only get their mail every few months, why isn't the PO required to deliver it daily??? Fact is, it would be similar to that if the USPS was to go away, personally, I'd be fine with only getting mail once or twice a month...


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Re: Capitalism at work [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #22325261 - 10/02/15 07:06 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Bigbadwooof said:

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
If you are so interested in fiscal responsibility, why do you seem to want to gloss over the fact that since 2006, the federal government has been forcing the USPS to loan billions to the treasury each year?






Apparently you haven't read any of he posts regarding why the post office is doing just fine.





OH, I got it!  The government has forced the post office to fork over 5 billion a year and that has put them in the red, right?  So it is like taxing a private company 5 billion dollars, right?

Got it, thanks Bigbad. 

But wait, I'm confused...Isn't it a good thing for the government to regulate and tax?  I thought that was supposed to make things fair?  So are you know saying that the government forcing business to give them money is a bad thing?

Gee, isn't that a republican talking point? :tard: :smile:


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Capitalism at work [Re: starfire_xes]
    #22325313 - 10/02/15 07:15 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

^^^LMFAO! Good one star! Their hypocrisy is stunning!


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OnlineBigbadwooof
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Re: Capitalism at work [Re: starfire_xes]
    #22325533 - 10/02/15 07:45 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

starfire_xes said:
Quote:

Bigbadwooof said:

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
If you are so interested in fiscal responsibility, why do you seem to want to gloss over the fact that since 2006, the federal government has been forcing the USPS to loan billions to the treasury each year?






Apparently you haven't read any of he posts regarding why the post office is doing just fine.





OH, I got it!  The government has forced the post office to fork over 5 billion a year and that has put them in the red, right?  So it is like taxing a private company 5 billion dollars, right?

Got it, thanks Bigbad. 

But wait, I'm confused...Isn't it a good thing for the government to regulate and tax?  I thought that was supposed to make things fair?  So are you know saying that the government forcing business to give them money is a bad thing?

Gee, isn't that a republican talking point? :tard: :smile:




Boy, Fedex sure pays a lot in taxes! >.<

Quote:

    Between 2008 and 2012, FedEx reported $9.381 billion in US pretax income, and paid just $395 million in current federal income taxes. This computes to a 4.2 percent effective tax rate over this period.
    In two years during this period, 2008 and 2011, the company actually didn’t pay a dime in federal income taxes, instead enjoying tax rebates of $38 million in 2008 and $135 million in 2011.




http://ctj.org/ctjreports/2013/09/fedex_paid_42_federal_tax_rate_over_5_years.php

This is not like taxing a company based on it's income. You see, income taxes always leave a net profit, because you are taxed based on earnings. Furthermore, when you target one company within an industry, it is cronyism, and not a single person here is advocating that. You really just don't understand any of this, do you?


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


Edited by Bigbadwooof (10/02/15 07:47 PM)


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Offlinestarfire_xes
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Re: Capitalism at work [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #22326154 - 10/02/15 10:13 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

So, the government gets to pick the winners and losers?  Like the PO?  I dont care about FED EX, Im talking about the PO.  They are broke?  Or do you want me to keep ripping you a new asshole?

Is it good for the government to regulate and make companies responsible?


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OnlineBigbadwooof
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Re: Capitalism at work [Re: starfire_xes]
    #22326258 - 10/02/15 10:44 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

starfire_xes said:
So, the government gets to pick the winners and losers?  Like the PO?  I dont care about FED EX, Im talking about the PO.  They are broke?  Or do you want me to keep ripping you a new asshole?

Is it good for the government to regulate and make companies responsible?




Keep ripping me a new asshole? :lmafo:

You look at the world like a fucking 5 year old dude.

This has nothing to do with making the post office responsible. You just can't seem to grasp the situation, and I really don't have time to keep breaking things down for such astonishingly simple "adult" minds.

You probably don't even understand why I brought up Fedex, do you?


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


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OnlineBigbadwooof
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Re: Capitalism at work [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #22326270 - 10/02/15 10:48 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Nobody would argue that government has the potential to fuck shit up, and do horrible or corrupt things. What is happening here is a blatant intentional fuck up, on behalf of Republicans, so that they can say 'look, government doesn't work!'.

If I work for a company that I want to make out to be incompetent, I will make a piss poor product. It is the same principle.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: Capitalism at work [Re: bennylava]
    #22326353 - 10/02/15 11:16 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

bennylava said:
Quote:

ballsalsa said:
If you are so interested in fiscal responsibility, why do you seem to want to gloss over the fact that since 2006, the federal government has been forcing the USPS to loan billions to the treasury each year?





Proof? Not aware of it, but it wouldn't surprise me at all if I can poke a hole in it that leads back to more bureaucratic nonsense, government waste, corruption, etc. If its going on, then I'm sure it shouldn't be. We'll see what you come up with.






i keep trying to give it to you people but you won't bother to read it. (or don't understand it?)

let's try again shall we?

Postal Accountability and Enhancement Act

Section(s) 801-805

https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/109/hr6407/text


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: Capitalism at work [Re: starfire_xes]
    #22326364 - 10/02/15 11:20 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

starfire_xes said:
Quote:

Bigbadwooof said:

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
If you are so interested in fiscal responsibility, why do you seem to want to gloss over the fact that since 2006, the federal government has been forcing the USPS to loan billions to the treasury each year?






Apparently you haven't read any of he posts regarding why the post office is doing just fine.





OH, I got it!  The government has forced the post office to fork over 5 billion a year and that has put them in the red, right?  So it is like taxing a private company 5 billion dollars, right?

Got it, thanks Bigbad. 

But wait, I'm confused...Isn't it a good thing for the government to regulate and tax?  I thought that was supposed to make things fair?  So are you know saying that the government forcing business to give them money is a bad thing?

Gee, isn't that a republican talking point? :tard: :smile:




So are you saying that you would like private business to be forced to fund their retirement obligations in the same way as the USPS?  Because that would be interesting to see actually.


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Offlinebennylava
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Re: Capitalism at work [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #22326520 - 10/03/15 12:15 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Bigbadwooof said:
Nobody would argue that government has the potential to fuck shit up, and do horrible or corrupt things.




No, what we would argue, is that they constantly DO fuck shit up, and do horrible or corrupt things. Along with being incredibly inept.


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OnlineBigbadwooof
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Re: Capitalism at work [Re: bennylava]
    #22326618 - 10/03/15 01:03 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

bennylava said:
Quote:

Bigbadwooof said:
Nobody would argue that government has the potential to fuck shit up, and do horrible or corrupt things.




No, what we would argue, is that they constantly DO fuck shit up, and do horrible or corrupt things. Along with being incredibly inept.




That's why you vote for people who aren't bought and paid for, like Bernie Sanders. The truth is, we the people have the capability to radically change our government, and we choose apathy and ignorance. The internet is changing that though. People are beginning to feel much more empowered. Which is why Republicans want to kill net neutrality.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


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Offlinestarfire_xes
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Re: Capitalism at work [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #22327161 - 10/03/15 07:56 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

nobody is choosing apathy and ignorance.  The ignorance is your saying that its republicans fault that the post office runs in the red because they are being regulated by them.
'
Going back to the point of the topic.  You said the PO is doing fine.  I say it is in the red.  YOu say it is because of them having to pay the 5 billion a year.  iF it is  That is an operating expense FORCED ON THEM BY YOUR BELOVED REGULATING GOVERNMENT.  THEREFORE, THEY ARE IN THE RED.

If this happens to a private company they 1) raise prices or 2) go out of business.  What makes the post office special?


--------------------


Edited by starfire_xes (10/03/15 07:59 AM)


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Capitalism at work [Re: starfire_xes]
    #22327186 - 10/03/15 08:20 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

starfire_xes said:
nobody is choosing apathy and ignorance.  The ignorance is your saying that its republicans fault that the post office runs in the red because they are being regulated by them.
'
Going back to the point of the topic.  You said the PO is doing fine.  I say it is in the red.  YOu say it is because of them having to pay the 5 billion a year.  iF it is  That is an operating expense FORCED ON THEM BY YOUR BELOVED REGULATING GOVERNMENT.  THEREFORE, THEY ARE IN THE RED.

If this happens to a private company they 1) raise prices or 2) go out of business.  What makes the post office special?




The postal service serves an essential function in our society.

Public schools don't turn a profit, either.


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Offlinebennylava
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Re: Capitalism at work [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #22327334 - 10/03/15 09:25 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Quote:

starfire_xes said:
nobody is choosing apathy and ignorance.  The ignorance is your saying that its republicans fault that the post office runs in the red because they are being regulated by them.
'
Going back to the point of the topic.  You said the PO is doing fine.  I say it is in the red.  YOu say it is because of them having to pay the 5 billion a year.  iF it is  That is an operating expense FORCED ON THEM BY YOUR BELOVED REGULATING GOVERNMENT.  THEREFORE, THEY ARE IN THE RED.

If this happens to a private company they 1) raise prices or 2) go out of business.  What makes the post office special?




The postal service serves an essential function in our society.

Public schools don't turn a profit, either.




You don't learn. No its not. UPS, DHL, FEDex, the list goes on. They could take over. Easy. They've already said it. They're barred from doing so by law, so that the zombie post office can continue to lurch forth. Them there's what we call facts, son. That law is on the books, and it just sits there, proving you wrong. Its been proving you wrong since we started this conversation. As long as that law is there, you have no point.


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Capitalism at work [Re: bennylava]
    #22327398 - 10/03/15 09:49 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Just because there's legislation that keeps the USPS in existence doesn't make your point any more or less valid.


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Offlinestarfire_xes
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Re: Capitalism at work [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #22327912 - 10/03/15 12:13 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Just because there's legislation that keeps the USPS in existence doesn't make your point any more or less valid.





Yes it does.  The post office is not required to run a profit, but they are required to be 'revenue neutral' which means they are not supposed to run at a loss. They must be self-sustaining.


So now that you socialists see the damage the government does regulating, I'll keep that in mind to remind you state the need for more regulation and taxes.

REGULATIONS AND TAXES CAN PUT GOOD BUSINESSES OUT OF BUSINESS AND CAUSE JOB LOSSES.


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Offlinestarfire_xes
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Re: Capitalism at work [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #22327918 - 10/03/15 12:15 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Just because there's legislation that keeps the USPS in existence doesn't make your point any more or less valid.




By the way, does this mean you like the government picking the winners and losers? :popcorn:


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Capitalism at work [Re: starfire_xes]
    #22328036 - 10/03/15 12:44 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

I'm not gonna keep discussing the USPS, every point you've brought up has been addressed multiple times.


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Offlinestarfire_xes
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Re: Capitalism at work [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #22328247 - 10/03/15 01:23 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
I'm not gonna keep discussing the USPS, every point you've brought up has been addressed multiple times.




In other words, you cant answer why regulating the post office is bad but regulating businesses you DONT like is good. 

GAME OVER.


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