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OfflineUrist
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Simulating Sleep
    #22279481 - 09/23/15 04:03 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Ok so I have insomnia but I can eventually get to sleep most nights at some point (3am-6am) but sometimes nothing works and I just have to try again the next day because I usually need to function the next day, so I've been trying to find the best possible way to feel like I've gotten sleep.

The best combo I've come across so far is Dexedrine (10mg, repeated as needed), Adrafinil (600mg), Noopept (50mg, yes I know it's a lot), and Yerba Mate (150mg caffeine, but not just caffeine but this specific caffeinated beverage...idk why but it just works better for me). The only side effects I've noticed so far is slight chest tightness (pectoral not cardiac), reduced ability to think from normal but significantly better than how I am with any one of the drugs by themselves, practically unnoticeable eyelid heaviness, very slight hallucinations similar to a hit of good weed, complete appetite suppression and a kind of spacey head-feel.

In your guys experience what is the best way to feel normal (not tired but not overly stimulated) without any sleep?


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OfflineGorlax
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Urist]
    #22279567 - 09/23/15 04:24 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

I battled this all the time when I was in college. I finally moved most of my classes to later in the day.

I tried a lot of things. In all nothing can really replace sleep. Your brain just doesn't work properly without it. Caffeine for me will just keep me alert for 1 hour then crash harder. Vyvanse or addy seems to help you coast through it but with a brain fog.

I'm sure after taking your combo you aren't tired. If you are then you might want to work on getting to sleep earlier. I've resorted to doxyalamine which is over the counter sleep aide that is pretty damn sedating.


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OfflineUrist
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Gorlax]
    #22279643 - 09/23/15 04:43 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

I've tried every sleeping med (besides benzos for obvious reasons) and the only thing that works consistently consistently is weed....which is expensive for me since I haven't found a good hookup yet.


On an unrelated note, I just noticed a really significant feature of this stack. I'm not chewing on the inside of my lip. I do this constantly on stimulants and it's worse when I don't sleep but today I haven't felt the urge to skin my mouth in the slightest. I'm also not grinding my teeth or clicking my jaw...I mean I take a magnesium supplement but never noticed any change in this habit before, and if anything I should be doing it worse because of the extra stims and sleep deprivation.


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Urist] * 1
    #22279678 - 09/23/15 04:53 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Dexedrine (10mg, repeated as needed), Adrafinil (600mg), Noopept (50mg, yes I know it's a lot), and Yerba Mate (150mg caffeine





You're going to kill yourself man, thats a truckload of noopept in the mix with those other stims.

Maybe your stimulant use has something to do with the severity of your insomnia?


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OfflineUrist
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Asante]
    #22279936 - 09/23/15 06:01 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

It definitely does, but I almost never use Adrafinil or Caffeine. I can't stop taking the dex or even lower the dose if I want to stay in school. Gonna stop taking it for the most part when I graduate or drop out.


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InvisibleJvF
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Urist] * 1
    #22279972 - 09/23/15 06:11 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Stop doing drugs and youll be able to sleep. Stay away from stims and caffeine. Stay away from any nootropics, shits not helping you

I guarantee after 2 days of feeling like shit uoull have the best sleep youve ever had


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OfflineUrist
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: JvF]
    #22279980 - 09/23/15 06:13 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Yeah, dude, that isn't an option atm unfortunately.


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OfflineiSmkGrnBud
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Urist] * 1
    #22280018 - 09/23/15 06:22 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

How is that not an option?


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InvisibleFletcher
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Urist]
    #22280041 - 09/23/15 06:28 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

I have episodes of insomnia. Low lights and reading small printed books usually help. What are the obvious reasons you won't take benzos?


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InvisibleJvF
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: iSmkGrnBud]
    #22280070 - 09/23/15 06:34 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

iSmkGrnBud said:
How is that not an option?




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OfflineUrist
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Fletcher]
    #22281399 - 09/23/15 09:45 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

iSmkGrnBud said:
How is that not an option?




Because if I stop taking dexedrine my grades will take a dive, especially if I stop mid-semester. I'd like to avoid that.


Quote:

Fletcher said:
I have episodes of insomnia. Low lights and reading small printed books usually help. What are the obvious reasons you won't take benzos?




They're highly addictive, carry deadly withdrawals, can cause blackouts, can cause deadly behavioral toxicity and don't even help with sleep in the long run....so yeah that isn't much better than my current situation. Benzos shouldn't be prescribed for chronic insomnia...only acute insomnia and anxiety.


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Edited by Urist (09/23/15 09:53 PM)


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OfflineUrist
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Urist]
    #22284320 - 09/24/15 02:48 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

I'd like to note that the side effects of this combination become apparent later in the due to exhaustion and stress from prolonged stimulation. The most unpleasant side effect was Sleep Paralysis, as I was falling asleep I suddenly felt the sensation of not breathing followed by intense fear and a rush of adrenaline. I won't be using this combination again.


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Urist]
    #22284408 - 09/24/15 03:09 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Op your logic does not make sense to me...

You are taking drugs to help with school, which are clearly interfering with your sleep, which no doubt interferes with your school too.

But you can't stop taking the drugs or you will do worse in school? Yet:
Quote:

Urist said:
Gonna stop taking it for the most part when I graduate or drop out.




:strokebeard:

Seems counterproductive to me :shrug:


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You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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InvisibleMoonshoe
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Urist]
    #22284443 - 09/24/15 03:21 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

If you have insomnia you should cut out all stimulants. Exercise vigorously In Fresh Air and sunshine daily for a long time. Take valerian root an hour before bed and have some chamomile tea.

Go to bed at exactly the same time each night and go to bed early so you have time to fall asleep.

Make sure you have no screen time and just read or meditate before bed nothing stimulating .

Just lie in her eyes closed in perfect darkness and rest. Don't stress about falling asleep just know when your body is ready it will sleep. If you can't sleep just lie in bed eyes closed.


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OfflineiSmkGrnBud
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: musiclover420]
    #22284445 - 09/24/15 03:22 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

:whathesaid: Sounds like you just need to sober up for a couple of weeks and let your body and mind get back in the swing of things. Natural foods, exercise, and good sleep are some pretty potent drugs for a good work/school schedule.


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: iSmkGrnBud]
    #22284474 - 09/24/15 03:30 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Meditation and breathing exercises can help a ton too.

The other night I was laying in bed pretty restless and did some deep slow breathing exercises and immediately relaxed then passed out.


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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OfflineKbb70
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Urist] * 1
    #22284549 - 09/24/15 03:50 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

My advice bro , get a good hookup of weed , and go listen to tycho he is an amazing artist everyone should go give him a listen no lyrics just good stuff to trip and be stoned do , especially the past is prologue album :smile:


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OfflineUrist
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Kbb70]
    #22285093 - 09/24/15 05:45 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

musiclover420 said:
Op your logic does not make sense to me...

You are taking drugs to help with school, which are clearly interfering with your sleep, which no doubt interferes with your school too.

But you can't stop taking the drugs or you will do worse in school? Yet:
Quote:

Urist said:
Gonna stop taking it for the most part when I graduate or drop out.







:strokebeard:

Seems counterproductive to me :shrug:





I'm not going to flunk out, but I'm considering dropping out for other reasons.



Quote:

Kbb70 said:
My advice bro , get a good hookup of weed , and go listen to tycho he is an amazing artist everyone should go give him a listen no lyrics just good stuff to trip and be stoned do , especially the past is prologue album :smile:




Yeah I might have actually met someone who can hook me up yesterday, but in the mean time I'm getting 8g this monday and taking a break from my meds and just smoking pot.


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Urist]
    #22285152 - 09/24/15 05:57 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

:thumbup:

Good plan, that sounds like a good start. Let us know how it goes.

Quote:

I'm considering dropping out for other reasons.




My main point was if you are already considering dropping out that seems like all the more reason to take a break or get off meds you have been using for school.

I personally tend to be most motivated to learn sober or after positive psychedelic experiences.

Once I had a visualization of books and papers and knowledge flying into my head and it felt like the universe telling me to learn :lol:


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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OfflineUrist
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: musiclover420]
    #22285397 - 09/24/15 06:32 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

If I stop taking them completely I'll fail my classes, lose a bunch of money and end up homeless. It's almost happened before. So if/when I choose to drop out it will be a time where I have enough money to support myself while I make major changes to my life. All I have to do next week is a small paper and I write better after I've smoked a little. I also agree that tripping is amazing at motivating me in addition to being the only antidepressant that's worked for an extended period of time. Unfortunately, I haven't had the opportunity to trip lately....been siting on like 15g of Pan Subbs for like 2 months.


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OfflineiSmkGrnBud
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Urist]
    #22285415 - 09/24/15 06:36 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Urist said:
If I stop taking them completely I'll fail my classes, lose a bunch of money and end up homeless.




:dafuq:


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OfflineUrist
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: iSmkGrnBud]
    #22285571 - 09/24/15 06:58 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Yeah, not in a good situation. The meds help with that.


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Invisiblepirate-blues
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: iSmkGrnBud] * 1
    #22285622 - 09/24/15 07:07 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Think my heart would feel like it'd pop if I took all of that.

As far as stimulants Amphetamines are by far the most effective way to feel normal, but taking them  everyday has actually made me feel more exhausted or worn out in the past - like even after I get some sleep, there's always just this underlying feeling of dehydration and exhaustion if I take them more than 2-. days a week, if that.

But the healthiest way is to drink a lot of water, eat some breakfast that will give you a proper amount of energy and keep your blood sugar stable - caffiene lowers it and when you crash it's extra shitty. You want 14+ gs of proteins and some kind of preferably complex carbohydrate, because that is what will raise your blood sugar(but the protein is necessary to sustain it and avoid a crash). Orange juice is something I always drink in the morning to wake up a little, though I don't recommend drinking a ton of sugary/high fructose stuff all day in place of water. Get out and get some fresh air and light exercise, and if you want to use a stimulant..maybe just pick one at a time :uhoh:


You can't simulate sleep, and it's needed to survive. What your doing isn't good for your body - I've done similar, but it's not good, I don't know how old you are but I used to be able to get away with stuff like that up until semi-recently, but around when I was 22 I really, really could not function on that kind of schedule, mentally I just get incredibly loopy and all my interactions get really awkward because I'm so tired I can barely think of what words to use and really basic stuff like that. I've had insomnia for a long, long time and the only way to fix it is to actually have the discipline needed to change your habits. Most every insomniac is a night owl, I hate going to bed, my sleep schedule is rarely great.


btw, as someone who has terrible adhd(I've literally forgotten to turn my car off when getting out of it and just left it there running, if that gives you a vague idea), you're setting yourself up for failure when you go off the meds - they're not something that are supposed to allow you to function, they're something that should be used for you to implement changes and good habits so that eventually you can ideally go off of them if you wish to or at least not take them as often.


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Urist] * 1
    #22286719 - 09/25/15 12:18 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Urist said:
if/when I choose to drop out it will be a time where I have enough money to support myself while I make major changes to my life.




:thumbup: best of luck to you, I am sure you will find the time to trip when it is meant to be, things tend to work out like that IME.


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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InvisibleFletcher
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: musiclover420]
    #22286749 - 09/25/15 12:28 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

What does tripping have to do with anything?


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Fletcher] * 1
    #22286756 - 09/25/15 12:31 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

A lot of things. Sounds like OP is in a transitional period and is trying to decide what to really work towards. A nice positive trip could help him sort his goals and put his life in order so to speak. Also he said they work better as an antideppresant than anything else for him, so those longterm positive effects might help him get over his sleep issue somewhat.


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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InvisibleFletcher
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: musiclover420]
    #22286761 - 09/25/15 12:33 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Or, he could lay off the drugs for a while.


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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Fletcher]
    #22286783 - 09/25/15 12:44 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Wine tastes good.


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Fletcher]
    #22286792 - 09/25/15 12:53 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Fletcher said:
Or, he could lay off the drugs for a while.




:facepalm3:

He already has said he plans to stop everything and just smoke weed for a week or two at least.

Nothing wrong with a psych session for some cosmic guidance and support.

If anything that will probably motivate him to sober up more.

You could lay off being judgmental :wink:


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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InvisibleFletcher
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: musiclover420]
    #22286814 - 09/25/15 01:05 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

He can't balance drugs and education, and you're suggesting he take more drugs? I get it.


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OfflineUrist
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Fletcher]
    #22286849 - 09/25/15 01:32 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

It isn't really a matter of balancing drugs and education, it's a matter of balancing my health and education. You also cant compare really psychedelics to stimulants...


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Invisiblemicro
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Urist]
    #22286854 - 09/25/15 01:35 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

g + h + b = zzz


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InvisibleFletcher
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Urist]
    #22286855 - 09/25/15 01:35 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Sorry,... you can't balance drugs and your health. Drugs are drugs :shrug:


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Invisiblemicro
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Fletcher]
    #22286857 - 09/25/15 01:36 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

yeah those damn drugs

saving people's lives at hospitals and shit :v


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OfflineGorlax
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Urist]
    #22286871 - 09/25/15 01:44 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Dude PM pay for shipping and I'll send you 30 of the the capsules I have (10mg synephrine, 15mg Noopept, 100mg caffeine, and 100mg L-arginine).... tried to start a site to sell em but I'm over it so Idc. Shipping is like 2$ and they work.


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Fletcher]
    #22286884 - 09/25/15 01:53 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Fletcher said:
Sorry,... you can't balance drugs and your health. Drugs are drugs :shrug:




:rofldrunk:

That's like saying you can't balance food and nutrition :tongue2:

:notsureif:


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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InvisibleFletcher
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: musiclover420]
    #22286890 - 09/25/15 01:56 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Sorry, I meant he (Urist) can't balance them. I, personally, have no problem.


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Urist]
    #22286895 - 09/25/15 02:01 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Urist said:
It isn't really a matter of balancing drugs and education, it's a matter of balancing my health and education. You also cant compare really psychedelics to stimulants...




This is still true though :shrug: Especially the last part.


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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OfflineUrist
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Loc: A Dwarf Fortress
Last seen: 5 months, 17 days
Re: Simulating Sleep [Re: Gorlax]
    #22286950 - 09/25/15 02:36 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Gorlax said:
Dude PM pay for shipping and I'll send you 30 of the the capsules I have (10mg synephrine, 15mg Noopept, 100mg caffeine, and 100mg L-arginine).... tried to start a site to sell em but I'm over it so Idc. Shipping is like 2$ and they work.




Thank you for the offer, but I can't really take caffeine. The only way I can take it without anxiety and chest tightness is from drinking Yerba Mate for some reason, and even then I think that's what put me from awake to overstimulated towards the end of the day. But I really do appreciate the offer.


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