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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
Loc: Onypeirophóros
Last seen: 4 years, 1 month
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Re: Are you a feminist? (this question is for the dudes) [Re: Capers]
#22230236 - 09/13/15 07:43 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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you make enough demands, you may get what you're asking for. feminism, the idea, i support. what some feminists see as "necessary" are not, though. but i'm not getting into the details here.
what's sensible it just that, and what isn't isn't.
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Patlal
You ask too many questions



Registered: 10/09/10
Posts: 44,797
Loc: Ottawa
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Re: Are you a feminist? (this question is for the dudes) [Re: akira_akuma]
#22230246 - 09/13/15 07:45 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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I am. Just to the point before it becomes a terror movement.
You know, I'll tolerate the topless walks.
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Mescalean
Burke is love, burke is life.


Registered: 01/18/12
Posts: 6,755
Last seen: 6 years, 10 months
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Re: Are you a feminist? (this question is for the dudes) [Re: Patlal]
#22230274 - 09/13/15 07:53 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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If feminism is about equality then why do so many refer to the men as the weaker sex? Also this just makes me wonder if they are just plain fucking stupid.
-------------------- FREE BURKE
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moonrockmushy
High on Spite



Registered: 07/01/05
Posts: 19,067
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Re: Are you a feminist? (this question is for the dudes) [Re: Mescalean] 1
#22230337 - 09/13/15 08:08 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Idunno maybe because people are smart-asses, and everyone likes to take jabs at eachother at every opportunity.
Does that hurt your feelings when they say that about men? You find that offensive?
I think in terms of increasing male emotional sensitivity, feminism has been a wild success, as is evident on the shroomery.
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pachoo
Witchakookoo



Registered: 09/10/10
Posts: 7,135
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Re: Are you a feminist? (this question is for the dudes) [Re: Mescalean]
#22230341 - 09/13/15 08:08 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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I've known plenty of feminists and I can't really say I enjoyed talking to them... at all. The outlook they have is pretty stomach-curling to me and alot of times they bashed men in ridiculous and nonsensical ways.
I'm for equality. I believe everyone should be paid the same for certain jobs. I recognize the fact that sometimes men are better in some fields, and women are better in others. Honestly I would rather see a base pay for everyone and see raises in the people who do a better job, or more for experience. That's where the money-split should be between. Just common sense stuff I guess.
I don't know... mostly I never really look at gender. It's about the person. So I go by the person, not if they are male or female. People should get equal rights in my eyes.
I see lazy people. I see hardworking people. I see shitheads. I see awesome people.
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qman
Stranger

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Re: Are you a feminist? (this question is for the dudes) [Re: moonrockmushy]
#22230365 - 09/13/15 08:15 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
moonrockmushy said: Idunno maybe because people are smart-asses, and everyone likes to take jabs at eachother at every opportunity.
Does that hurt your feelings when they say that about men? You find that offensive?
I think in terms of increasing male emotional sensitivity, feminism has been a wild success, as is evident on the shroomery. 
If you want to call of bunch of young men turning into feminized males a success, mission accomplished.
These are the same men that will never get the respect from a woman, these are the same men that will have to learn every lesson about relationships the hard way, they are the same men that will kick themselves in the ass when they get old for being so fucking stupid when they were younger.
Edited by qman (09/13/15 08:22 AM)
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TrippyDog18
Eater of Cat

Registered: 12/18/14
Posts: 20
Loc: Great Lakes
Last seen: 8 years, 4 months
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Re: Are you a feminist? (this question is for the dudes) [Re: pachoo]
#22230375 - 09/13/15 08:18 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Men and women have their place. Men should be dominant over women. Sadly, dominance has become synonymous with aggression which isn't true. People cannot even dominate their dogs properly so it is a long shot for men to do so to people. Balanced dominant men should make women feel safe. I feel this crazy feminist movement came from women taking on men's role because so many have become pussies who do too much too late(tantrums, violent explosions, etc) instead of keeping control with small, well timed input.
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Mescalean
Burke is love, burke is life.


Registered: 01/18/12
Posts: 6,755
Last seen: 6 years, 10 months
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Re: Are you a feminist? (this question is for the dudes) [Re: moonrockmushy]
#22230416 - 09/13/15 08:31 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
moonrockmushy said: Idunno maybe because people are smart-asses, and everyone likes to take jabs at eachother at every opportunity.
Does that hurt your feelings when they say that about men? You find that offensive?
I think in terms of increasing male emotional sensitivity, feminism has been a wild success, as is evident on the shroomery. 
No, plain stupid as in it completely goes against biology/science. You just love white knighting for the feminists dude. See it in every thread. I'm all for equality. I fucking haaaaattttteee hypocrisy though which is why I can't stand feminism. Realy deja vuish feeling we've had this same covno before too, you and i. Same reason I hate most politicians man. I can't respect the ideology whatsoever. Ever feminist I have met thus far in live has played victim yet loves any idea related to having the upper hand on the opposite sex. Keep in mind also this doesnt pertain to 3rd world countries or any of that craziness. I'm talking the privileged white women who live in america who have had everything provided to them by most likely (excluding the "broken home" scenerio") by father. I know plenty of feminists who claim women are oppressed yet think of men as subordinates.
Can we talk about the rape thing? Why is it that if both a woman and i are drunk the whole consent thing sides with her? Why can't I be a rape victim? I'm shit faced too. waaaaa i cant make decisions for myself wwwwwwaaaaa
-------------------- FREE BURKE
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qman
Stranger

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Re: Are you a feminist? (this question is for the dudes) [Re: moonrockmushy] 1
#22230447 - 09/13/15 08:37 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
moonrockmushy said: Well when I go to a dictionary, that is what I see. I don't see the point in demonizing it, it's not really that bad. Like when people compare feminists to Nazis I have to roll my eyes. I consider myself a feminist because I'm more into social equality than the average person. Not that I think I'm better at it, but it is something I think about alot and the really thoughtful people who have made an impression on me in the subject of gender equality have been feminists.
When it comes to what goes on the internet, sometimes I worry that people are losing touch with that thoughtful side. I just do not see it with MRAs, no offense to any here, but that is my impression. At best they're clever, but it always comes across as conniving to me, like it relies on people just understanding from the start that feminists are usually obnoxious or whatever, which may be true, but being someone who takes it seriously I would prefer to see that argument presented in a logical manner.
When it comes to feminists you can say the same thing. Some of it is very misguided, but to pretend that is something men have figured out just now is totally ignorant of the ongoing discussions and differences within feminism. There is plenty of feminism I disagree with, but I can reconcile being a feminist with having disagreements with other feminists knowing that it is more of a general idea based on shared values than an organized group.
"I'm more into social equality than the average person"

No, you're just more into self righteousness than the average person.
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moonrockmushy
High on Spite



Registered: 07/01/05
Posts: 19,067
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Re: Are you a feminist? (this question is for the dudes) [Re: TrippyDog18] 1
#22230456 - 09/13/15 08:40 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Are you comparing the role of women to that of dogs?
I can say you are definitely not a feminist. Some people I think are feminists but don't like certain connotations that come along with it, so they reject the label, but I appreciate that you just come out and say you are for something other than equality.
I feel like most men are pretty pathetic, and incapable of dominating women, so I can agree with you there, but that is nothing new. I think the harder they try, the more distance is put between them and what they seek to control, so it is a kinda damned if you do, damned if you don't situation to those who rely on a sense of superiority and control over others for their own peace of mind.
Obviously if you were one who could fully control women with subtlety and timing, you would not be challenged by feminism. The fact is that men who seek to live like this are living in a society where they actually have to rely on their own merits rather than institutional and societal roles that existed in the past, and many find this frustrating. I can understand that, but those who preach a return to those values are just as crazy as feminists who choose to ignore reality. I can't help but feel that superior people shouldn't need society to provide the structure for control over others, only those that lack integrity and seek to exploit others benefit from that.
No we can't talk about the rape ting, that is already happening in another thread.
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hex_enduction
satta massa gana



Registered: 01/26/14
Posts: 12,051
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
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Re: Are you a feminist? (this question is for the dudes) [Re: moonrockmushy]
#22230508 - 09/13/15 08:52 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Yes, I'm a feminist. LSDreamer kinda summed up my thoughts on the issue.
To those who think feminism seeks "special privileges" for women, what privileges are you talking about?
--------------------
Connoisseur said: oh ive cried on drugs sunshine said: Tragic. I told the cop not to do it but he didn't listen.
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moonrockmushy
High on Spite



Registered: 07/01/05
Posts: 19,067
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Re: Are you a feminist? (this question is for the dudes) [Re: Mescalean]
#22230550 - 09/13/15 09:04 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
You just love white knighting for the feminists dude. See it in every thread.
You're sure that I'm not just, say, a feminist? It's not a big deal to me, and of course I support feminism, because I believe in what feminism is.
Quote:
I'm all for equality. I fucking haaaaattttteee hypocrisy though which is why I can't stand feminism.
Ok lets address this, and first lets see if we can agree on some terms. It may seem obvious to you but just humor me.
feminism - the advocacy of women's rights on the grounds of political, social, and economic equality to men.
hypocrite - a person who pretends to have virtues, moral or religious beliefs, principles, etc., that he or she does not actually possess.
Ok?
So would it make sense, that someone who says they believe in equality, but not feminism, is at least in some sense a hypocrite, if you are going by how words are defined in dictionaries?
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Almond Flour
...get off my lawn!



Registered: 12/26/08
Posts: 11,340
Last seen: 8 years, 4 months
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Re: Are you a feminist? (this question is for the dudes) [Re: Bitter Cactus]
#22230565 - 09/13/15 09:08 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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No. I am a firm believer a man has his place in life and a women has hers. Im not saying hers is in the kitchen, but I am a firm believer in gender roles to an extent. Fuck the progressives
-------------------- Hippies and Liberals love Pope Francis, so why dont I quote him for you guys. "There is NO SALVATION outside the Catholic Church"
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DieCommie

Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
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Re: Are you a feminist? (this question is for the dudes) [Re: Bitter Cactus]
#22230995 - 09/13/15 10:42 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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No, I am not. Its not that I disagree with what an old dictionary calls feminism, its that I disagree with the ideas expressed by self proclaimed feminists.
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moonrockmushy
High on Spite



Registered: 07/01/05
Posts: 19,067
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Re: Are you a feminist? (this question is for the dudes) [Re: DieCommie]
#22231061 - 09/13/15 10:57 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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I guess I can kinda understand. Sometimes I think I am actually conservative, but I would not identify as a conservative because I think they're all hypocrites I never really thought of it like that.
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xbloodwhipx

Registered: 02/24/12
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Re: Are you a feminist? (this question is for the dudes) [Re: moonrockmushy]
#22231077 - 09/13/15 10:59 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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STAL, because i dont give one single fuck either way. Just like i dont give a single fuck about gay marriage, or racism. Im not going to worry myself about stuff that doesnt concern me.
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Bitter Cactus
reformed bad boy



Registered: 01/26/12
Posts: 11,773
Loc: Alberta, Canada
Last seen: 8 years, 4 months
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Re: Are you a feminist? (this question is for the dudes) [Re: moonrockmushy]
#22231097 - 09/13/15 11:04 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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The reason guys make more then girls is because men are much stronger then women and just as smart.
If you are doing a trade like roofing or whatever and have to carry 80 pound bundles around of course the women are gonna suck dick at the job. To act like they are just as capable on the work site as a man is laughable.
Women are better at taking notes and using highlighters but on the actual job site it is the men that do more of the work and ask for raises.
-------------------- Taking acid and thinking you are a better man is a lot different then actually becoming a better man.
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millzy


Registered: 05/12/10
Posts: 12,404
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Re: Are you a feminist? (this question is for the dudes) [Re: Capers]
#22231152 - 09/13/15 11:14 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Capers said: I thought I was a feminist, back when I thought it simply meant that women should have equal rights. But then I got to know some hardcore feminists and realized how psycho they are. They don't just want equal rights, they want to force their lifestyle and worldview on everyone. You can't even explain something to a hardcore feminist. They will get offended. They call it "man-splaining". And you can't say "men and women" you have to say "male and female-bodied".
morons come in all flavors. i don't think your unfortunate experience with someone who claimed to be feminist is a fair representation of feminism or its tenets. the problems feminism attempts to explore are worthy of study and discussion. it seems to me that most people associate the term with what is called "second wave feminism", or the "man-hating" variety, with its seminal (no pun) work being betty friedman's 1962 book the feminine mystique. here is an excerpt from an excellent writeup on a liberal iranian website that discusses second wave feminism and friedman's contribution.
Quote:
The 38 percent of American women who worked in 1960 were largely limited to jobs as teacher, nurse, or secretary. Women were generally unwelcome in professional programs; as one medical school dean declared, "Hell yes, we have a quota...We do keep women out, when we can. We don't want them here — and they don't want them elsewhere, either, whether or not they'll admit it." As a result, in 1960, women accounted for six percent of American doctors, three percent of lawyers, and less than one percent of engineers. Working women were routinely paid lower salaries than men and denied opportunities to advance, as employers assumed they would soon become pregnant and quit their jobs, and that, unlike men, they did not have families to support.
In 1962, Betty Friedan's book The Feminine Mystique captured the frustration and even the despair of a generation of college-educated housewives who felt trapped and unfulfilled. As one said, "I'm desperate. I begin to feel I have no personality. I'm a server of food and a putter-on of pants and a bedmaker, somebody who can be called on when you want something. But who am I?" Friedan stunned the nation by contradicting the accepted wisdom that housewives were content to serve their families and by calling on women to seek fulfillment in work outside the home. While Friedan's writing largely spoke to an audience of educated, upper-middle-class white women, her work had such an impact that it is credited with sparking the "second wave" of the American feminist movement. Decades earlier, the "first wave" had pushed for women's suffrage, culminating with the passage of the 19th Amendment that gave women the right to vote in 1920. Now a new generation would take up the call for equality beyond the law and into women's lives.
source
as an american movement, feminism has long progressed past the second wave, and people here who emulate the ideas from this period are simply living in the past. i can think of a slew of other antiquated worldviews along with this strain of feminism that are just as, if not more, obnoxious.
and then there's also the thorny problem of constructing your identity around one worldview's set of ideas versus agreeing with a few ideas from a particular worldview. i would consider myself feminist, but that doesn't mean that i agree with all feminists' views.
-------------------- I'm up to my ears in unwritten words. - J.D. Salinger
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zappaisgod
horrid asshole


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Posts: 81,741
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Re: Are you a feminist? (this question is for the dudes) [Re: millzy]
#22231185 - 09/13/15 11:20 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Like I said in my earlier post there are as many definitions of what is a feminist as there are people. Not every person who would be considered a feminist is as batshit crazy as Andrea Dworkin.
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Mescalean
Burke is love, burke is life.


Registered: 01/18/12
Posts: 6,755
Last seen: 6 years, 10 months
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Re: Are you a feminist? (this question is for the dudes) [Re: moonrockmushy]
#22231313 - 09/13/15 11:47 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
moonrockmushy said:
Quote:
You just love white knighting for the feminists dude. See it in every thread.
You're sure that I'm not just, say, a feminist? It's not a big deal to me, and of course I support feminism, because I believe in what feminism is.
Quote:
I'm all for equality. I fucking haaaaattttteee hypocrisy though which is why I can't stand feminism.
Ok lets address this, and first lets see if we can agree on some terms. It may seem obvious to you but just humor me.
feminism - the advocacy of women's rights on the grounds of political, social, and economic equality to men.
hypocrite - a person who pretends to have virtues, moral or religious beliefs, principles, etc., that he or she does not actually possess.
Ok?
So would it make sense, that someone who says they believe in equality, but not feminism, is at least in some sense a hypocrite, if you are going by how words are defined in dictionaries?
By definition it does make sense because while preaching equality they accept every opportunity they have over men and don't mention at all the inequality when the sides are flipped. Like I said we've had this convo before and you have no swayed my views the last 2-3 times. Could be that I have not been coddled by women my entire life and have seen the ugliest side of the "fairer sex". Like women using the "rape lie" to completely fuck a buddy of mine over who was selling OC. He decided to not give her the free drugs she expected from fucking him so she called raped. I testified against her. Another trial coming up so I hope my friend doesn't get fucked over. Bitch is bat shit insane. She claims to be a feminist too btw.
Ill say this, extend an olive branch. I believe in same pay same opportunity, which those "statistics for fair pay are HIGHLY flawed as been stated over and over and over since they emerged. I believe everyone whether race creed or sex should have the same opportunities to be happy in life. However I'm sick and tired of hearing bitching about inequality from 1st world women who go shopping with their mans credit card. I'm not saying all women are like this either, I've dated a few really cool chicks who understand equality means equality not manipulation. But alot of modern day feminists just looooooove that small legal upper hand. I don't want to hear bitching until some divorce laws are fixed too.
I marry a woman, buy a house, pay for that house, she fucks my neighbor, and gets to stay in said house while my ass stays on a futon? While she's still fucking the neighbor? Divorce laws straight up fucks men financially. Most men. Sometimes there is a judge that sees past the whole "women are victims" mentality.
-------------------- FREE BURKE
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