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Invisibleairclay
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #22237511 - 09/14/15 04:42 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Bigbadwooof said:
Quote:

psilynut said:
Quote:



Do you have any idea what they do to public school systems?  How do they handle 1/3 of their students not able to speak English?  They can't even pass basic tests, who pays for this?





  My little girl just started her first day public school 2 weeks ago and guess what ? Everyone speaks the English . 
  I live in California . We have allot of illegals .  I'm not seeing this destruction your talking about . I'm watching home builders build and sell million dollar houses as fast as humanly possible . I'm surrounded by illegals right now as I type this. The only reason they have jobs is because contractors can't get spoiled kids who were born here to get out of bed at 4 am and commute for 2 hrs to work a shovel and a hammer all day .
    So once again show me the destruction .




Plenty of American kids are just as tough as any other people's kids. They just want to be paid adequately for their labor. They pay minimum wage for hard physical labor around here. Construction work pays less than factory work. My only complaint against illegals is that they drive our wages down.

Don't tell me that Americans can't or wont do the work. They can, and they will, for the right price. If you can't afford to pay people right, then you shouldn't be in business. Cheap Mexican labor is a service to the wealthy who want to buy those multimillion dollar houses, not to the common man or American carpenter trying to feed his family.

This is one conservative point that I see clearly. We have every right to filter who comes in to our country, just like the rest of the fucking world. I like Mexicans. They are good people. This isn't about race, it's about economics. Saying they destroy communities and public school systems is a certainpy an embellishment, and I wish people would stick to the facts. This is one situation where conservatives dont need to make shit up to have valid arguments, and ironically enough its an economic issue!

Right wingers getting riled up and murdering people is nothing new. Like that kid in S Carolina. They are hateful war hungry people. I think football culture is very destructive in America also. It always seems to be these guys who played football in highschool, and think they're big and tough. They get out, realize what losers they are, incapable of doing anything with their lives in the real world, but theyz big n strong, and they can beat people up!

If we're going to talk about destructive forces in public education, lets tslk about the money wasted on football to raise wave after wave of assholes. That story is really sad, ppw.




I wouldn't blame them personally for the wage issues. I'd blame the war on unions and others workers rights. I'd blame the companies that do hire and the laws that allow them to at those wages.

Other than that, yeah spot on.


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Offlinepsilynut
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #22237527 - 09/14/15 04:46 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:



Don't tell me that Americans can't or wont do the work. They can, and they will, for the right price. If you can't afford to pay people right, then you shouldn't be in business. Cheap Mexican labor is a service to the wealthy who want to buy those multimillion dollar houses, not to the common man or American carpenter trying to feed his family.





 
    I've been doing commercial and residential , union and non for 15 years . I'm self employed.  I don't have any employees. I  didn't say Americans can't . I just said they don't show up and the illegals aren't being paid less than minimum wage .  I'm saying this because this is what I've seen .  These million dollar houses being built employ a shitload of people , mostly legal . If your a nationwide home builder your whole operation depends on these houses being finished and sold . All the secretaries , middle management people , job site supers who are almost always legal hope to god these houses get finished by anyone and sold .
    Their job and everyone else's legal or not depends on it . Shit can't just stop and wait for hardworking Americans you speak of to show up .  There building allot of way cheaper houses also , not just million dollar ones .
 


Quote:



If we're going to talk about destructive forces in public education, lets tslk about the money wasted on football to raise wave after wave of assholes. That story is really sad, ppw.



  Yes fucking football is stupid . I agree. Car racing is the only sport for me . Takes real big nuts .
 
     
Quote:

I wouldn't blame them personally for the wage issues. I'd blame the war on unions and others workers rights. I'd blame the companies that do hire and the laws that allow them to at those wages.

Other than that, yeah spot on.



  There's a law that allows people to pay less than minimum wage ?


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OfflineJimmyK
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: Stonehenge]
    #22237585 - 09/14/15 05:03 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
How about you stay out of my threads? I have no use for idiots or trolls.



Considering I am neither, I'll stick around.
You meet every troll requirement.
I'm just speaking my mind, as well as that of others, apparently.
Sorry to hurt you with fact.  When you have some facts let's chat.  I'd enjoy it.
Be well man.


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OfflineWAN
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: Enlil] * 1
    #22237723 - 09/14/15 05:35 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

qman said:
If it's broken English, they're aren't function in the public school.





The irony is almost too much to bear.




That was very obviously a typo.  You have been on the boards longer than I have, I am sure you must have argued against him/qman and you should have known that he speaks English fine.  For you to say something like this, this feels like a very cheap shot.  Then again, coming from you, it doesn't surprise me.


Edited by WAN (09/14/15 05:42 PM)


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OfflineWAN
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: psilynut]
    #22237751 - 09/14/15 05:40 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

psilynut said:
Quote:



Don't tell me that Americans can't or wont do the work. They can, and they will, for the right price. If you can't afford to pay people right, then you shouldn't be in business. Cheap Mexican labor is a service to the wealthy who want to buy those multimillion dollar houses, not to the common man or American carpenter trying to feed his family.





 
    I've been doing commercial and residential , union and non for 15 years . I'm self employed.  I don't have any employees. I  didn't say Americans can't . I just said they don't show up and the illegals aren't being paid less than minimum wage .  I'm saying this because this is what I've seen .  These million dollar houses being built employ a shitload of people , mostly legal . If your a nationwide home builder your whole operation depends on these houses being finished and sold . All the secretaries , middle management people , job site supers who are almost always legal hope to god these houses get finished by anyone and sold .
    Their job and everyone else's legal or not depends on it . Shit can't just stop and wait for hardworking Americans you speak of to show up .  There building allot of way cheaper houses also , not just million dollar ones .
 





If you expect back-breaking labor positions to be filled, you should be paying very competitive wages so that people would show up.

Business owners like you like illegal immigrants because they (the latter) are willing to take shit pay (not necessarily minimum wage) for hard work.


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Offlinepsilynut
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: WAN]
    #22237902 - 09/14/15 06:09 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Business owners like you like illegal immigrants because they (the latter) are willing to take shit pay (not necessarily minimum wage) for hard work.



 
    Liking people who are willing to work for less is not unique to contractors like me .
  If sub contractors are going to pay more that means the home builder is going to have to sell the house at a higher cost . They can only sell it for the market rate . How is anyone involved in the process going to pay more to attract legal workers ?
  Home builders like the lowest bids . If your a contractor your competing against all the other contractors who also have no choice but to hire illegals .
  A whole shitload of the jobs in residential construction I see around me are piecework jobs . Tile , drywall, painting , and even scaffolding can all be paid on a piece rate . The whole hourly thing doesn't even apply .  None of you know what the fuck you are talking about .  I'm not working at Walmart . 
    If the home builder I  work for can't get shit finished and put on the market and sold , my job goes by by too .


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: WAN] * 2
    #22238128 - 09/14/15 07:01 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

WAN said:
Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

qman said:
If it's broken English, they're aren't function in the public school.





The irony is almost too much to bear.




That was very obviously a typo.  You have been on the boards longer than I have, I am sure you must have argued against him/qman and you should have known that he speaks English fine.  For you to say something like this, this feels like a very cheap shot.  Then again, coming from you, it doesn't surprise me.



Which is why I chose the word "irony" instead of "hypocrisy".  I'm confident that qman knows that I'm poking fun at his unintentionally ironic post and not making some veiled criticism of his intelligence.

Get over the butthurt, son.


--------------------
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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Registered: 11/11/09
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: Patlal]
    #22238318 - 09/14/15 07:47 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Patlal said:
Let's see.

10000 Syrian refugees

9900 of them completely innocent

100 of them are agents planted by ISIS hoping to take advantage of the chaos and fly under the radar

10 of them might be able to pull something off

1 of them will pull something big causing many casualties.

It's a numbers game in the end right?




Its a variables game that youve assigned arbitrary numbers to, yes.


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OfflineWAN
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: Enlil]
    #22238333 - 09/14/15 07:51 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

WAN said:
Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

qman said:
If it's broken English, they're aren't function in the public school.





The irony is almost too much to bear.




That was very obviously a typo.  You have been on the boards longer than I have, I am sure you must have argued against him/qman and you should have known that he speaks English fine.  For you to say something like this, this feels like a very cheap shot.  Then again, coming from you, it doesn't surprise me.



Which is why I chose the word "irony" instead of "hypocrisy".  I'm confident that qman knows that I'm poking fun at his unintentionally ironic post and not making some veiled criticism of his intelligence.

Get over the butthurt, son.



I can assure you there is/was no "butthurt" involved.  I only said what I said because what you posted sounded very disrespectful.


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Offlineqman
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #22238391 - 09/14/15 08:05 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Bigbadwooof said:
Quote:

psilynut said:
Quote:



Do you have any idea what they do to public school systems?  How do they handle 1/3 of their students not able to speak English?  They can't even pass basic tests, who pays for this?





  My little girl just started her first day public school 2 weeks ago and guess what ? Everyone speaks the English . 
  I live in California . We have allot of illegals .  I'm not seeing this destruction your talking about . I'm watching home builders build and sell million dollar houses as fast as humanly possible . I'm surrounded by illegals right now as I type this. The only reason they have jobs is because contractors can't get spoiled kids who were born here to get out of bed at 4 am and commute for 2 hrs to work a shovel and a hammer all day .
    So once again show me the destruction .




Plenty of American kids are just as tough as any other people's kids. They just want to be paid adequately for their labor. They pay minimum wage for hard physical labor around here. Construction work pays less than factory work. My only complaint against illegals is that they drive our wages down.

Don't tell me that Americans can't or wont do the work. They can, and they will, for the right price. If you can't afford to pay people right, then you shouldn't be in business. Cheap Mexican labor is a service to the wealthy who want to buy those multimillion dollar houses, not to the common man or American carpenter trying to feed his family.

This is one conservative point that I see clearly. We have every right to filter who comes in to our country, just like the rest of the fucking world. I like Mexicans. They are good people. This isn't about race, it's about economics. Saying they destroy communities and public school systems is a certainpy an embellishment, and I wish people would stick to the facts. This is one situation where conservatives dont need to make shit up to have valid arguments, and ironically enough its an economic issue!






:thumbup:  Good post.

The argument that no American can replace an illegals job tomorrow isn't a valid one, of course employers don't want to pay the higher wage, but that doesn't mean the company goes out of business, that line of reasoning is plain BS.

Also, it's a fact that illegals do burden both public school system and the health care system.

http://www.fairus.org/site/DocServer/healthcare_09.pdf?docID=3521


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: qman]
    #22238436 - 09/14/15 08:16 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

>they do jobs Americans won't do

Bullshit, I work in the oilfield and there are plenty of illegals here too, at a lease a few weeks we had to put up signs for the truckers that didn't speak English... These aren't jobs Americans won't do, these are good paying jobs, fuck the illegals... Trump 2016


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #22238458 - 09/14/15 08:20 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Why are you so afraid to compete with undocumented workers?  Maybe you'll have to work a bit harder to prove your worth, but so what?  The cream will rise to the top.


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Offlinepsilynut
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: Enlil]
    #22239157 - 09/14/15 11:07 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

I've never had a problem with it . I can think of at least 5 different landscaping companies right off the top of my head who would be thrilled to have any of you guys apply for one of their wonderful jobs digging holes by hand for 10 dollars an hr .  They would kick an illegal to the curb in a heartbeat for you . You don't have to compete . Hiring illegals is a risk . Not really worth it if you can get legal workers just by paying a little more .


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: psilynut]
    #22239245 - 09/14/15 11:39 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

psilynut said:
There's a law that allows people to pay less than minimum wage ?




http://webapps.dol.gov/elaws/whd/flsa/screen75.asp
Quote:

Farmworkers employed on small farms are exempt from both the minimum wage and overtime pay provisions of the FLSA. You may also wish to review the specific regulation. Young workers employed on small farms, with parental consent, are also exempt from the child labor provisions of the FLSA. For more information on exemptions from the child labor provisions of the FLSA in agriculture, click the underlined text. Other farmworkers are exempt from the FLSA's overtime provisions. You may also wish to review the specific regulation.




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OfflineBigbadwooof
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: Enlil]
    #22239291 - 09/14/15 11:57 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Why are you so afraid to compete with undocumented workers?  Maybe you'll have to work a bit harder to prove your worth, but so what?  The cream will rise to the top.




That is true, but if the labor market tightens up they will have to pull the 'cream' to the top. It won't be so automatic. We have an oversaturated labor market. In our capitalist system labor is a commodity subject to the laws of supply and demand just like any other.

I believe there are bigger fish to fry, but this is certainly worthy of attention. There's no reason not to control immigration. I can't just move to Denmark or Sweden, and for good reason. They don't need my skillset, and I don't have loads of money to inject into their economy, so they don't want me.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
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InvisibleAstral Pain
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: psilynut]
    #22239338 - 09/15/15 12:12 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

The fact that 72% of the refugees that just flooded into Europe were men, there would likely be an increase to the already horrible rape epidemic happening in Europe. Foreigners who are not necessarily welcome being forced upon the people makes for a volatile situation across the board. They're portraying these events on TV as some sort of sweet Hallmark Christmas card moment, but it's going to be an unfortunate brutal reality for some. Many. I would imagine this notion has been covered in an article...

Yep

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2015/09/horror-muslim-migrant-in-europe-brutally-rapes-7-year-old-white-girl-video/

http://gatesofvienna.net/2015/09/germany-the-new-rape-capital-of-europe/

http://pamelageller.com/2015/09/document-muslim-migrants-raping-women-and-children-in-camp-in-germany.html/


--------------------
"I don't mean to sound bitter, cold, or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out"               
                -Bill Hicks-

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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: Enlil]
    #22239354 - 09/15/15 12:17 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Why are you so afraid to compete with undocumented workers?  Maybe you'll have to work a bit harder to prove your worth, but so what?  The cream will rise to the top.




If only that were the case.  In construction at least, it's the turds that rise to the top. like in a septic tank.  The problem is that the customer can't tell the difference between a shitty job and a good one when he writes the check. Its a year or two later that issues arise. This means that whoever gives the lowest bid gets the job. Especially with investment properties.


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Offlinepsilynut
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Registered: 10/22/09
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: ballsalsa]
    #22239967 - 09/15/15 07:32 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

If only that were the case.  In construction at least, it's the turds that rise to the top. like in a septic tank.  The problem is that the customer can't tell the difference between a shitty job and a good one when he writes the check. Its a year or two later that issues arise. This means that whoever gives the lowest bid gets the job. Especially with investment properties.





No one gets away with doing a shitty job . Everything gets inspected . Everything that has to pass a building code gets inspected by a city inspector . then they write a report about it . Then there's this other thing called a warranty . Consumer doesn't have much to worry about .
  When I built public works stuff I had an inspector looking over my shoulder all day . Lowest bid doesn't always mean you will get the job . Sometimes people just give jobs to contractors they have a good relationship with. It's s trust thing .


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OfflineArctic W. Fox
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: psilynut]
    #22240009 - 09/15/15 07:43 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

psilynut said:
No one gets away with doing a shitty job . Everything gets inspected .





Uh huh.





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Offlinepsilynut
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: Arctic W. Fox]
    #22240538 - 09/15/15 09:57 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

I'm talking about residential construction . I don't see how that's relavent .  Have  you ever bought a brand new house and had problems because of underpaid illegal workers?


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