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Bigbadwooof
Trumps Bone Spurs




Registered: 12/07/13
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: qman] 1
#22246702 - 09/16/15 03:59 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
qman said:
Quote:
Bigbadwooof said: So you think that if Bernie was president he would have invaded Libya? How about Jill Stein? If she managed to become the president do you think she would have invaded Libya?
The way i see it, the president has many advisers, but at the end of the day, he makes the decision.
The president most certainly does have power. People don't run for president for the money. Hillary, Trump, and Jeb have plenty of money. They want power. The media doesn't attempt to pick the winners and losers for no reason.
You have a very apathetic, cynical view of the world, and I suppose you have many reasons to feel that way, but I think your views are a misrepresentation of reality. Yes, I do think a black, Harvard and Columbia educated, Senator from Illinois is in control of our military.
Obama was bought and paid for, of course he follows the instruction he's given. If a president were to be elected without "big money" behind them, then you might have a case.
Does Obama also have influence of economic policies? If so, why did the greatest wealth and income inequality in over 80 years take place on his watch the past 6 years? I thought Obama was suppose to change that trend, not ACCELERATE IT!! 
I don't think changing things was really part of Obama's agenda at all. I do agree that campaign finance has a powerful impact, and that's why I will only support someone who is not financed by wealthy interests.
-------------------- "It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti FARTS "There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin Every one of you should see this video. "If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy
 
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ballsalsa
Universally Loathed and Reviled



Registered: 03/11/15
Posts: 20,870
Loc: Foreign Lands
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: qman]
#22246973 - 09/16/15 05:01 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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A brief History lesson on the Middle East since WW1.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Partitioning_of_the_Ottoman_Empire
Quote:
The partitioning of the Ottoman Empire (30 October 1918 – 1 November 1922) was a political event that occurred after World War I. The huge conglomeration of territories and peoples that formerly comprised the Ottoman Empire was divided into several new states.[1] The partitioning brought the creation of the modern Arab world and the Republic of Turkey. The League of Nations granted France mandates over Syria and Lebanon and granted the United Kingdom mandates over Mesopotamia (later Iraq) and Palestine (later divided into Palestine and Transjordan). The Ottoman Empire's possessions in the Arabian Peninsula became the Kingdom of Hejaz which was annexed by the Sultanate of Nejd (today Saudi Arabia), the Mutawakkilite Kingdom of Yemen, while the Empire's possessions on the western shores of the Persian Gulf were variously annexed by Saudi Arabia (Alahsa and Qatif), or remained British protectorates (Kuwait, Bahrain, and Qatar) and became the Arab States of the Persian Gulf.
After the occupation of Constantinople by British, French and Italian troops in November 1918, the Ottoman government collapsed completely and signed the Treaty of Sèvres in 1920. However, the Turkish War of Independence forced the former Allies to return to the negotiating table before the treaty could be ratified. The Allies and the Grand National Assembly of Turkey signed and ratified the new Treaty of Lausanne in 1923, superseding the Treaty of Sèvres and solidifying most of the territorial issues. One unresolved issue, the dispute between the Kingdom of Iraq and the Republic of Turkey over the former province of Mosul was later negotiated under the League of Nations in 1926. The British and French partitioned the eastern part of the Middle East (also called "Greater Syria") between them with the Sykes–Picot Agreement. Other secret agreements were concluded with Italy and Russia.[2] The Balfour Declaration encouraged the international Zionist movement to push for a Jewish homeland in Palestine. The Tsarist regime had also had wartime agreements with the Triple Entente on the partitioning of the Ottoman Empire but after the Russian Revolutions, Russia did not participate in the actual partitioning. The Treaty of Sèvres formally acknowledged the new League of Nations mandates in the region, the independence of Yemen, and British sovereignty over Cyprus.
The Ottoman Empire had been the leading Islamic state in geopolitical, cultural and ideological terms. The partitioning of the Ottoman Empire led to the rise in the "Middle East" of Western powers, such as Britain and France. Resistance to the influence of these powers came from the Turkish national movement and became more widespread in the post-Ottoman states after World War II.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_Revolt#Aftermath
Quote:
The United Kingdom agreed in the Hussein-McMahon Correspondence that it would support Arab independence if they revolted against the Ottomans. The two sides had different interpretations of this agreement. In the event, the United Kingdom and France reneged on the original deal and divided up the area in ways that the Arabs felt was unfavourable to them under the 1916 Sykes-Picot Agreement. Further confusing the issue was the Balfour Declaration of 1917, which promised support for a Jewish "national home" in Palestine. The Hedjaz region of western Arabia became an independent state under Hussein's control, until 1925, when, abandoned and isolated by the British policy–which had shifted support to the al Saud family–it was conquered by bin Saud, leading to the creation of Saudi Arabia.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_Declaration_of_Independence
Quote:
After World War I, the United Kingdom was given a mandate for Palestine, which it had conquered from the Ottomans during the war. In 1937 the Peel Commission suggested partitioning Mandate Palestine into an Arab state and a Jewish state, though the proposal was rejected as unworkable by the government and was at least partially to blame for the renewal of the 1936–39 Arab revolt. The UN partition plan
In the face of increasing violence after World War II, the British handed the issue over to the recently established United Nations. The result was Resolution 181(II), a plan to partition Palestine into Independent Arab and Jewish States and the Special International Regime for the City of Jerusalem. The Jewish state was to receive around 56% of the land area of Mandate Palestine, encompassing 82% of the Jewish population, though it would be separated from Jerusalem. The plan was accepted by most of the Jewish population, but rejected by much of the Arab populace.Quote:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammad_Reza_Pahlavi#Criticism_of_reign_and_causes_of_his_overthrow
Explanations for why Mohammad Reza was overthrown include that he was a dictator put in place by a non-Muslim Western power, the United States,[54][55] whose foreign culture was seen as influencing that of Iran. Additional contributing factors included reports of oppression, brutality,[56][57] corruption, and extravagance.[56][58] Basic functional failures of the regime have also been blamed – economic bottlenecks, shortages and inflation; the regime's over-ambitious economic program;[59] the failure of its security forces to deal with protest and demonstration;[60] the overly centralized royal power structure.[61] International policies pursued by the Shah in order to increase national income by remarkable increases of the price of oil through his leading role in the Organization of the Oil Producing Countries (OPEC) have been stressed as a major cause for a shift of Western interests and priorities and for an actual reduction of their support for him reflected in a critical position of Western politicians and media, especially of the administration of U.S. President Jimmy Carter, regarding the question of human rights in Iran, and in strengthened economic ties between the United States of America and Saudi Arabia in the 1970s
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran%E2%80%93Contra_affair
Quote:
The Iran–Contra affair (Persian: ایران-کنترا, Spanish: caso Irán-Contra), also referred to as Irangate,[1] Contragate[2] or the Iran–Contra scandal, was a political scandal in the United States that occurred during the second term of the Reagan Administration. Senior administration officials secretly facilitated the sale of arms to Iran, which was the subject of an arms embargo.[3] They hoped thereby to secure the release of several US hostages, and to fund the Contras in Nicaragua. Under the Boland Amendment, further funding of the Contras by the government had been prohibited by Congress.
The scandal began as an operation to free the seven American hostages being held in Lebanon by a group with Iranian ties connected to the Army of the Guardians of the Islamic Revolution. It was planned that Israel would ship weapons to Iran, and then the United States would resupply Israel and receive the Israeli payment. The Iranian recipients promised to do everything in their power to achieve the release of the U.S. hostages. The plan deteriorated into an arms-for-hostages scheme, in which members of the executive branch sold weapons to Iran in exchange for the release of the American hostages.[4][5] Large modifications to the plan were devised by Lieutenant Colonel Oliver North of the National Security Council in late 1985, in which a portion of the proceeds from the weapon sales was diverted to fund anti-Sandinista and anti-communist rebels, or Contras, in Nicaragua.[6]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran%E2%80%93Iraq_War
Quote:
The Iran–Iraq War was an armed conflict between the Islamic Republic of Iran and the Republic of Iraq lasting from September 1980 to August 1988, making it the 20th century's longest conventional war.[38][39]
United States, alongside regional and international powers, supported Iraq with loans, military equipment and satellite imagery during Iraqi attacks against Iranian targets.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_Arab%E2%80%93Israeli_War#Background
Quote:
The Yishuv managed to clandestinely amass arms and military equipment abroad for transfer to Palestine once the British blockade was lifted. In the United States, Yishuv agents purchased three B-17 bombers, one of which bombed Cairo in July 1948, some C-46 transport planes, and dozens of half-tracks, which were repainted and defined as "agricultural equipment". In Western Europe, Haganah agents amassed fifty 65mm French mountain guns, twelve 120mm mortars, ten H-35 light tanks, and a large number of half-tracks.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six-Day_War#Background
Quote:
With the exception of Jordan, the Arabs relied principally on Soviet weaponry. Jordan's army was equipped with American weaponry, and its air force was composed of British aircraft.
Egypt had by far the largest and the most modern of all the Arab air forces, consisting of about 420 combat aircraft,[51] all of them Soviet-built and with a heavy quota of top-of-the line MiG-21s. Of particular concern to the Israelis were the 30 Tu-16 "Badger" medium bombers, capable of inflicting heavy damage on Israeli military and civilian centers.[52]
Israeli weapons were mainly of Western origin. Its air force was composed principally of French aircraft while its armoured units were mostly of British and American design and manufacture. Some infantry weapons, including the ubiquitous Uzi, were of Israeli origin.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ibn_Saud#Rise_to_power
Quote:
The British Foreign Office had previously begun to support Sharif Hussein bin Ali, Emir of the Hejaz by sending T.E. Lawrence (a.k.a. Lawrence of Arabia) to him in 1915. The Saudi Ikhwan began to conflict with Hussein, Sharif of Mecca also in 1917 just as his sons Abdullah and Faisal entered Damascus. The Treaty of Darin remained in effect until superseded by the Jeddah conference of 1927 and the Dammam conference of 1952 during both of which Ibn Saud extended his boundaries past the Anglo-Ottoman Blue Line. After Darin, he stockpiled the weapons and supplies which the British provided him, including a 'tribute' of £5,000 per month.[17] After World War I, he received further support from the British, including a glut of surplus munitions. He launched his campaign against the Al Rashidi in 1920; by 1922 they had been all but destroyed.
The defeat of the Al Rashidi doubled the size of Saudi territory because after the war of Ha'il, Ibn Saud sent his army to occupy Al-Jouf and the army led by Eqab bin Mohaya, the head of Talhah tribe. This allowed Ibn Saud the leverage to negotiate a new and more favorable treaty with the British. Their treaty, signed at Uqair in 1922, saw Britain recognize many of his territorial gains. In exchange, Ibn Saud agreed to recognize British territories in the area, particularly along the Persian Gulf coast and in Iraq. The former of these were vital to the British, as merchant traffic between British India and United Kingdom depended upon coaling stations on the approach to the Suez Canal.
etc. etc. you get the idea. sorry those weren't in order, i just looked em up as they came to me. The point is that Western Europe and the U.S. have constantly directly influenced the stability of borders in the Middle East since the advent of the Middle East.
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The Ecstatic
Chilldog Extraordinaire


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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: Bigbadwooof] 1
#22246993 - 09/16/15 05:04 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Which is why Bernie is the only sensible option.
"Wait, but Trump isnt owned by corporations either.." Trump IS is the fucking corporation!
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hostileuniverse
Stranger



Registered: 05/14/15
Posts: 8,602
Loc: 'Merica
Last seen: 6 years, 7 months
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Quote:
The Ecstatic said: Which is why Bernie is the only sensible option.
he votes solidly democrat... he's a much bigger fraud than obama was, I think your kind will be disappointed...
https://votesmart.org/candidate/key-votes/27110/bernie-sanders#.Vfn5YbS4mgQ
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airclay
Morbid and Wrong




Registered: 05/13/11
Posts: 2,788
Loc: Texas
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Bernie voted for the Kosovo war in 1999 and also the 2001 resolution which was a blank check for war in Afghanistan. He supported multiple appropriations bills to fund the occupation of both Afghanistan and Iraq. This last summer he supported both the Israel war w Lebanon and imposed sanctions on Palestinian authority to destabilize a democratically elected government. And supported HR 282 the Iran Freedom Support Act which has similar framework to the war in Iraq, it calls for the US to support democratic change in the country establishing pretexts for a war on Iran.
This isn't the record of someone who will stay out off the mid east.
http://www.ontheissues.org/International/Bernie_Sanders_War_+_Peace.htm
edit: that link was another open tab and is cherry picked votes a little more complete : https://votesmart.org/bill/19227/usa-freedom-act-of-2014
the .gov is down otherwise I'd link the full voting history.
Also he voted for bombing Kosovo but against sending troops.
-------------------- Give no fucks, take no orders, smash the prisons and the borders. Circle that A motherfucker!
Edited by airclay (09/16/15 06:01 PM)
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The Ecstatic
Chilldog Extraordinaire


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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: airclay]
#22248348 - 09/16/15 09:13 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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What Israel war with Lebanon?
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
Stranger



Registered: 03/16/05
Posts: 32,557
Loc: California, US
Last seen: 4 months, 22 days
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Quote:
starfire_xes said: I was looking at the pictures of thousands of refugees streaming into Hungary the other day. Wow! Lots of young, healthy looking males. i wonder how many sleeper radical terrorists ISIS is inserting into these European Countries? 
Let the rape and be-headings begin!!!
The Republican party has always been the party of chicken-shits, who get scared without any facts to support their fears.
- Oh no! Iran's gonna get us with their weapons of mass destruction!!! - Oh no! Obama's gonna take our guns away!!! - Oh no! The economy will tank under Obama!!! - Oh no! Obama won't stop the Ebola crisis!!! - Oh no! Obamacare will bankrupt the country!!! - Oh no! The refugees we help are gonna come get us!!!
I wonder: can republicans claim any "I told you so"s???
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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Bigbadwooof
Trumps Bone Spurs




Registered: 12/07/13
Posts: 13,347
Last seen: 3 hours, 5 minutes
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Quote:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said: I wonder: can republicans claim any "I told you so"s???
Not since Eisenhower.
-------------------- "It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti FARTS "There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin Every one of you should see this video. "If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy
 
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ballsalsa
Universally Loathed and Reviled



Registered: 03/11/15
Posts: 20,870
Loc: Foreign Lands
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: Bigbadwooof]
#22249124 - 09/17/15 01:01 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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--------------------
Like cannabis topics? Read my cannabis blog here
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airclay
Morbid and Wrong




Registered: 05/13/11
Posts: 2,788
Loc: Texas
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Quote:
The Ecstatic said: What Israel war with Lebanon?
I was fkn stoned that post is a mess, but it's true.
The Israel/Lebanese war was around 05/06 not last summer.
also Sanders claims to oppose the death penalty, but he voted for Bill Clinton's 1996 Anti-Terrorism and Effective Death Penalty Act broadening the scope of the federal death penalty and laid the foundation for Bush's war on terror.
-------------------- Give no fucks, take no orders, smash the prisons and the borders. Circle that A motherfucker!
Edited by airclay (09/17/15 06:14 AM)
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paperbackwriter
Edward Lear


Registered: 03/31/14
Posts: 1,888
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: airclay]
#22249877 - 09/17/15 08:10 AM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Here's some perspective on Bernie's apparent pro-war voting record.
Quote:
The Bush administration, backed by a Republican-controlled House and Senate, made a nasty habit of funding its disastrous occupation of Iraq on an emergency basis in order to minimize Congressional scrutiny, circumvent legal limits on the federal government’s debt ceiling, and understate the true cost of the war. The first time Sanders voted ‘yea’ to an Iraq war spending bill came in 2006 when the bill included funding for Hurricane Katrina relief efforts. The second time he voted ‘yea’ was when an amendment he inserted into the bill giving a $1 million grant to the Vermont Department of Veterans Affairs (the VA) to help returning veterans cope with their health care and mental health needs upon returning home. The third time he voted ‘yea’ was when the legislation incorporated a massive expansion of G.I. Bill benefits that Sanders co-sponsored and the Bush administration opposed guaranteeing full scholarships to veterans, including activated National Guard troops and reservists, with three years of service attending any public, in-state university and expanded benefits for students at private colleges and for graduate schools. The last time he voted ‘yea’ was when he gave his consent, along with the rest of the entire Senate, funding the Iraq war’s end as President Barack Obama removed all U.S. troops from the country.
https://pplswar.wordpress.com/2015/07/09/why-did-bernie-sanders-vote-to-fund-the-iraq-war/
-------------------- Why should we strive with cynic frown To knock their fairy castles down? ~ Eliza Cook It's rather embarrassing to have given one's entire life to pondering the human predicament and to find that in the end one has little more to say than, 'Try to be a little kinder.' ~Aldous Huxley
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paperbackwriter
Edward Lear


Registered: 03/31/14
Posts: 1,888
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Politics is really nuanced. As I eluded too in my last post looking at yay, nay votes alone doesn't give us much information without the larger context. That said, it can still be helpful to look at someone's overall voting record to try to glean an understanding of where they stand.
Here's how Bernie's crime votes overall look.
Voted YES on reinstating $1.15 billion funding for the COPS Program. (Mar 2007) Voted YES on funding for alternative sentencing instead of more prisons. (Jun 2000) Voted NO on more prosecution and sentencing for juvenile crime. (Jun 1999) Voted YES on maintaining right of habeas corpus in Death Penalty Appeals. (Mar 1996) Voted NO on making federal death penalty appeals harder. (Feb 1995) Voted YES on replacing death penalty with life imprisonment. (Apr 1994) Rated 78% by CURE, indicating pro-rehabilitation crime votes. (Dec 2000) More funding and stricter sentencing for hate crimes. (Apr 2001) Require DNA testing for all federal executions. (Mar 2001) Increase funding for "COPS ON THE BEAT" program. (Jan 2007) Reduce recidivism by giving offenders a Second Chance. (Mar 2007)
Drugs (since this relates to crime I'll include it).
Voted NO on military border patrols to battle drugs & terrorism. (Sep 2001) Voted NO on subjecting federal employees to random drug tests. (Sep 1998) Legalize medical marijuana. (Jul 2001) Exclude industrial hemp from definition of marijuana. (Aug 2012) Exempt industrial hemp from marijuana laws. (Mar 2013)
War and Peace
Get Saudis & regional powers involved with fighting ISIS. (Oct 2014) Arm the Peshmerga against ISIS, as international effort. (Oct 2014) 1983 war against Nicaragua was illegal and immoral. (Jun 1997) 1990: Opposed authorizing all-out war in Kuwait with Iraq. (Jun 1997) 1991: instead of Persian Gulf War, spend on America. (Jun 1997) Voted YES on redeploying non-essential US troops out of Iraq in 9 months. (Dec 2007) Voted NO on designating Iran's Revolutionary Guards as terrorists. (Sep 2007) Voted YES on redeploying US troops out of Iraq by March 2008. (Mar 2007) Voted NO on declaring Iraq part of War on Terror with no exit date. (Jun 2006) Voted NO on approving removal of Saddam & valiant service of US troops. (Mar 2004) Voted NO on authorizing military force in Iraq. (Oct 2002) Voted YES on disallowing the invasion of Kosovo. (May 1999) Condemns anti-Muslim bigotry in name of anti-terrorism. (Oct 2001) Require Congress' approval before military action in Iran. (Oct 2007)
http://www.ontheissues.org/Bernie_Sanders.htm
Some of this doesn't line up with what you posted airclay.
Quote:
airclay said: Bernie voted for the Kosovo war in 1999 and also the 2001 resolution which was a blank check for war in Afghanistan.
Your link. Note that's an amendment to the act that disallows the invasion of Kosovo.
Quote:
Voted YES on disallowing the invasion of Kosovo.
Vote on an amendment to the "Kosovo and Southwest Asia Emergency Supplemental Appropriations Act" which would prohibit the use of funds for any invasion of Yugoslavia with U.S. ground forces except in time of war.
Quote:
He supported multiple appropriations bills to fund the occupation of both Afghanistan and Iraq.
Addressed this in my last post.
Quote:
This last summer he supported both the Israel war w Lebanon and imposed sanctions on Palestinian authority to destabilize a democratically elected government. And supported HR 282 the Iran Freedom Support Act which has similar framework to the war in Iraq, it calls for the US to support democratic change in the country establishing pretexts for a war on Iran.
This isn't the record of someone who will stay out off the mid east.
You quoted this almost verbatim from this article.
http://socialistworker.org/2006-2/610/610_11_BernieSanders.shtml
Here's an excellent criticism of Ashley Smith's "A Socialist in the Senate?" Read pplswar's two posts. I'm not going to quote because it's pretty long and I've cloged the thread up enough already.
https://www.reddit.com/r/SandersForPresident/comments/3aus4p/so_i_havent_been_in_the_loop_for_a_bit/
We have a few active Bernie threads. I'd love to talk more about this stuff in any of them but this one would probably be the best place.
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22082190
-------------------- Why should we strive with cynic frown To knock their fairy castles down? ~ Eliza Cook It's rather embarrassing to have given one's entire life to pondering the human predicament and to find that in the end one has little more to say than, 'Try to be a little kinder.' ~Aldous Huxley
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airclay
Morbid and Wrong




Registered: 05/13/11
Posts: 2,788
Loc: Texas
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Quote:
paperbackwriter said: Politics is really nuanced. As I eluded too in my last post looking at yay, nay votes alone doesn't give us much information without the larger context. That said, it can still be helpful to look at someone's overall voting record to try to glean an understanding of where they stand.
Here's how Bernie's crime votes overall look.
Voted YES on reinstating $1.15 billion funding for the COPS Program. (Mar 2007) Voted YES on funding for alternative sentencing instead of more prisons. (Jun 2000) Voted NO on more prosecution and sentencing for juvenile crime. (Jun 1999) Voted YES on maintaining right of habeas corpus in Death Penalty Appeals. (Mar 1996) Voted NO on making federal death penalty appeals harder. (Feb 1995) Voted YES on replacing death penalty with life imprisonment. (Apr 1994) Rated 78% by CURE, indicating pro-rehabilitation crime votes. (Dec 2000) More funding and stricter sentencing for hate crimes. (Apr 2001) Require DNA testing for all federal executions. (Mar 2001) Increase funding for "COPS ON THE BEAT" program. (Jan 2007) Reduce recidivism by giving offenders a Second Chance. (Mar 2007)
Drugs (since this relates to crime I'll include it).
Voted NO on military border patrols to battle drugs & terrorism. (Sep 2001) Voted NO on subjecting federal employees to random drug tests. (Sep 1998) Legalize medical marijuana. (Jul 2001) Exclude industrial hemp from definition of marijuana. (Aug 2012) Exempt industrial hemp from marijuana laws. (Mar 2013)
War and Peace
Get Saudis & regional powers involved with fighting ISIS. (Oct 2014) Arm the Peshmerga against ISIS, as international effort. (Oct 2014) 1983 war against Nicaragua was illegal and immoral. (Jun 1997) 1990: Opposed authorizing all-out war in Kuwait with Iraq. (Jun 1997) 1991: instead of Persian Gulf War, spend on America. (Jun 1997) Voted YES on redeploying non-essential US troops out of Iraq in 9 months. (Dec 2007) Voted NO on designating Iran's Revolutionary Guards as terrorists. (Sep 2007) Voted YES on redeploying US troops out of Iraq by March 2008. (Mar 2007) Voted NO on declaring Iraq part of War on Terror with no exit date. (Jun 2006) Voted NO on approving removal of Saddam & valiant service of US troops. (Mar 2004) Voted NO on authorizing military force in Iraq. (Oct 2002) Voted YES on disallowing the invasion of Kosovo. (May 1999) Condemns anti-Muslim bigotry in name of anti-terrorism. (Oct 2001) Require Congress' approval before military action in Iran. (Oct 2007)
http://www.ontheissues.org/Bernie_Sanders.htm
Some of this doesn't line up with what you posted airclay.
Quote:
airclay said: Bernie voted for the Kosovo war in 1999 and also the 2001 resolution which was a blank check for war in Afghanistan.
Your link. Note that's an amendment to the act that disallows the invasion of Kosovo.
Quote:
Voted YES on disallowing the invasion of Kosovo.
Vote on an amendment to the "Kosovo and Southwest Asia Emergency Supplemental Appropriations Act" which would prohibit the use of funds for any invasion of Yugoslavia with U.S. ground forces except in time of war.
Quote:
He supported multiple appropriations bills to fund the occupation of both Afghanistan and Iraq.
Addressed this in my last post.
Quote:
This last summer he supported both the Israel war w Lebanon and imposed sanctions on Palestinian authority to destabilize a democratically elected government. And supported HR 282 the Iran Freedom Support Act which has similar framework to the war in Iraq, it calls for the US to support democratic change in the country establishing pretexts for a war on Iran.
This isn't the record of someone who will stay out off the mid east.
You quoted this almost verbatim from this article.
http://socialistworker.org/2006-2/610/610_11_BernieSanders.shtml
Here's an excellent criticism of Ashley Smith's "A Socialist in the Senate?" Read pplswar's two posts. I'm not going to quote because it's pretty long and I've cloged the thread up enough already.
https://www.reddit.com/r/SandersForPresident/comments/3aus4p/so_i_havent_been_in_the_loop_for_a_bit/
We have a few active Bernie threads. I'd love to talk more about this stuff in any of them but this one would probably be the best place.
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22082190
Yeah some hash oil got the better of me on that one. I did cut n paste those although from dissident voice.
He indeed voted for air measures in Kosovo but not ground troops. I don't like that on the issues site as the votes seem to be cherry picked. When I'm not at work I'll gather a better response.
-------------------- Give no fucks, take no orders, smash the prisons and the borders. Circle that A motherfucker!
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The Ecstatic
Chilldog Extraordinaire


Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 33,369
Loc: 'Merica
Last seen: 43 minutes, 13 seconds
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Quote:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:
starfire_xes said: I was looking at the pictures of thousands of refugees streaming into Hungary the other day. Wow! Lots of young, healthy looking males. i wonder how many sleeper radical terrorists ISIS is inserting into these European Countries? 
Let the rape and be-headings begin!!!
The Republican party has always been the party of chicken-shits, who get scared without any facts to support their fears.
- Oh no! Iran's gonna get us with their weapons of mass destruction!!! - Oh no! Obama's gonna take our guns away!!! - Oh no! The economy will tank under Obama!!! - Oh no! Obama won't stop the Ebola crisis!!! - Oh no! Obamacare will bankrupt the country!!! - Oh no! The refugees we help are gonna come get us!!!
I wonder: can republicans claim any "I told you so"s???
Don't forget about the impending Voltron of gay agenda, sharia law, and academia on the verge of enslaving humanity.
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Bigbadwooof
Trumps Bone Spurs




Registered: 12/07/13
Posts: 13,347
Last seen: 3 hours, 5 minutes
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 Good post.
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Bigbadwooof
Trumps Bone Spurs




Registered: 12/07/13
Posts: 13,347
Last seen: 3 hours, 5 minutes
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Quote:
The Ecstatic said:
Quote:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:
starfire_xes said: I was looking at the pictures of thousands of refugees streaming into Hungary the other day. Wow! Lots of young, healthy looking males. i wonder how many sleeper radical terrorists ISIS is inserting into these European Countries? 
Let the rape and be-headings begin!!!
The Republican party has always been the party of chicken-shits, who get scared without any facts to support their fears.
- Oh no! Iran's gonna get us with their weapons of mass destruction!!! - Oh no! Obama's gonna take our guns away!!! - Oh no! The economy will tank under Obama!!! - Oh no! Obama won't stop the Ebola crisis!!! - Oh no! Obamacare will bankrupt the country!!! - Oh no! The refugees we help are gonna come get us!!!
I wonder: can republicans claim any "I told you so"s???
Don't forget about the impending Voltron of gay agenda, sharia law, and academia on the verge of enslaving humanity.
Yeah, how many states have these fools passed laws against Shariah Law now? Lmao
Sharia Law would already fall outside the legal bounds of the Constitution, as does Christian law, but they don't seem to pay that little detail very much mind.
-------------------- "It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti FARTS "There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin Every one of you should see this video. "If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy
 
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Stonehenge
Alt Center


Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 14,850
Loc: S.E.
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So he voted for bad bills funding war because they contained a scrap for something he liked. Sounds like politics as usual.
-------------------- “A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835) Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755
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Bigbadwooof
Trumps Bone Spurs




Registered: 12/07/13
Posts: 13,347
Last seen: 3 hours, 5 minutes
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: Stonehenge] 1
#22251125 - 09/17/15 12:58 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Stonehenge said: So he voted for bad bills funding war because they contained a scrap for something he liked. Sounds like politics as usual.
He inserted good legislation into bills that he already knew were going to pass, and then voted for them to further an agenda for the people.
-------------------- "It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti FARTS "There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin Every one of you should see this video. "If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy
 
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The Ecstatic
Chilldog Extraordinaire


Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 33,369
Loc: 'Merica
Last seen: 43 minutes, 13 seconds
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Re: Idiot lets in more refugees [Re: airclay]
#22251277 - 09/17/15 01:33 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
airclay said:
Quote:
The Ecstatic said: What Israel war with Lebanon?
I was fkn stoned that post is a mess, but it's true.
The Israel/Lebanese war was around 05/06 not last summer.
also Sanders claims to oppose the death penalty, but he voted for Bill Clinton's 1996 Anti-Terrorism and Effective Death Penalty Act broadening the scope of the federal death penalty and laid the foundation for Bush's war on terror.
I'm with you, but some of these votes could be a lesser evil type situation, or a vote needed to secure votes for his own legislation. I don't think Bernie's record is anything to be suspicious of, especially compared to every other candidate.
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starfire_xes
I Am 'They'



Registered: 10/24/09
Posts: 21,590
Loc: Dallas with all the assho...
Last seen: 7 months, 2 days
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With respect to all the comments on the middle east, the fact is that the US is CLUELESS about foreign policy.
They don't think like us, they don't have the same values, they don't want the same things we do. the us government FAILS because of politicians that don't know what the fuck they are doing.
Maybe if there were fewer politiicians and they didn't have so much fucking slush fund money stolen from taxpayers they would focus on the reAL problems we have.
And what is the answer i always hear: 'NO LETS MAKE GOVERMENT BIGGER AND TAX PEOPLE MORE. THAT'LL FIX 'ER'
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