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OfflineCoincidentiaoppositorum
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the secret gate to the garden of eden
    #22218441 - 09/10/15 07:43 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

www.youtube.com/watch?v=-TndLzFZI9A

I know generally when I post something involving a video the response is minimal, but this particular documentary was very intriguing, I think these are also the secrets of freemasonry, but that's just speculation, regardless it's a fascinating exploration of the coincidentia oppositorum from the view of sexuality.

It isn't what you think it will be, and if you give it a chance, there really are some most fascinating perspectives expressed, specially regarding spirituality through history, it's a detailed outline and exploration of several traditions and philosophies through out history.


Though this is the first time I have heard these ideas related to sexuality, I can understand where their comming from, but I don't think it's the whole picture, and there is a higher union than the life bringing union between man and woman, being the union of man with God, the union of the physical and the spiritual.

This is amazing stuff though, and I fully agree that sexuality is a sacred and divine life brining union, the deepest physical expression of the coincidentia oppositorum and should not be taken lightly or abused.


...if anybody actually watches this please feel free to share your thoughts...

-E. Borodin


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OfflineCoincidentiaoppositorum
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Re: the secret gate to the garden of eden [Re: Coincidentiaoppositorum]
    #22218456 - 09/10/15 07:46 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

...I can't help but think these are the secrets of freemasonry, or at least the freemasons know and possibly practice the philosophy discussed, though I have no grounds other than my minimal research into freemasonry for these views.


-E. Borodin


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InvisibleRahz
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Re: the secret gate to the garden of eden [Re: Coincidentiaoppositorum]
    #22219046 - 09/10/15 09:57 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Can you describe the topic in greater detail? I'm not watching the vid and you haven't provided enough info to start a discussion.


--------------------
rahz

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"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


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Re: the secret gate to the garden of eden [Re: Coincidentiaoppositorum]
    #22220743 - 09/11/15 08:33 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Thelema begins where Freemasonry ends and has refreshments.


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OfflineCoincidentiaoppositorum
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Re: the secret gate to the garden of eden [Re: Rahz]
    #22221396 - 09/11/15 11:14 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Rahz said:
Can you describe the topic in greater detail? I'm not watching the vid and you haven't provided enough info to start a discussion.




...I suppose I could, but there is so much back information and context that needs to be provided...

I did not expect many responses here anyway.

Not everybody will have to watch the video, some may be educated on the great arcanum, and the union of male and female being the deepest physical expression of the coincidentia oppositorum.

Perhaps if your not willing to watch the video, and have no prior knowledge of the topics discussed therein, than you would not be interested anyway.

I actually stated the entire theme of the concept in my initial post, and I know I can be demanding in the sense that I expect people to either know things or be willing to teach themselves through independent research...

but I'm really looking for people who are already well versed in the topics at hand, I want to be the student not the teacher, I'm looking for people who know more than me, not an opportunity to review what I already know by explaining it to others.




-E. Borodin


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OfflineCoincidentiaoppositorum
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Re: the secret gate to the garden of eden [Re: Middleman]
    #22221467 - 09/11/15 11:27 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Rev. Morton said:
Thelema begins where Freemasonry ends and has refreshments.





It's funny that you bring that up, because I've been recently researching Aleister Crowley and just recently stumbled upon this very topic, though I don't know much about it yet ... 



-E. Borodin


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OfflineCoincidentiaoppositorum
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Re: the secret gate to the garden of eden [Re: Coincidentiaoppositorum]
    #22221639 - 09/11/15 11:59 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Though I have always associated Crowley with negativity...

---------



There's so many intelligent people out there that have come up with so many far out philosophies and ideas,...and I want to research them all...

---------


The film above claims that sexual energy is the great arcanum and that the union of male and female is the highest expression of spirituality. they say it was suppressed, and hidden in images of androgynous gods, or United oppisites of other kinds as well as in symbols and texts and this hidden philosophy and imagery is scattered through out history in many cultures...

That's the best I can do...

-E. Borodin


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Re: the secret gate to the garden of eden [Re: Coincidentiaoppositorum]
    #22227888 - 09/12/15 04:40 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Dude that video is straight up cult stuff and I highly recommend not getting into it.
It's based on the teachings of Samael Aun Weor...the dude literally thought the key to life was never blowing your load. He has like 80 books on the topic, all of which basically tell the reader that orgasms are evil and turn you into some kind of fallen demon-human.

He throws alot of male/female union and basic spiritual symbols in there to make his stuff seem legitimate but make no mistake--his shit is pure dogma at the core. Stay far away from this dude's Kool Aid man. 


--------------------


Edited by resonant111 (09/12/15 04:51 PM)


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OfflineCoincidentiaoppositorum
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Re: the secret gate to the garden of eden [Re: resonant111]
    #22229841 - 09/13/15 02:43 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

I would never get into these things, I just want to hear what all these people have to say and actually think, I could never base my personel beliefs off of anything but my personal experiance.

I was reminded of the freemasons for what ever reason.

I randomaly found this while watching "top 10 mysterious objects in hidtory" list on youtube it was in one of the suggestions...

I thought it was a trip, something I had not heard before, but I would never buy into that stuff.

-E. Borodin


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OfflineCoincidentiaoppositorum
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Re: the secret gate to the garden of eden [Re: Coincidentiaoppositorum]
    #22235756 - 09/14/15 09:26 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

I should have included my personal veiws to.avoid confusion, I research philosophy of all kind, but I take 99% of it with a grain of salt, I'm trying to understand what these people actually believe, just like in my college philosophy coarse we discussed every thing from Buddha to Hitler, the full spectrum, negative to positive from grounded to insane.

The stuff above I only posted because I had never heard it before, and I instantly thought that this is what the freemasons must believe, I always thought the freemasons were obsessed with the coincedentia oppositorum of union of the physical and non-pbysical, I thought they were secretly DMT users, and that at solomans temple they found ancient ayahuasca analogue recipes....now I see that it was the union of male and female that they were probably speaking of, it actually makes sense now, I asked a mason about the DMT thing and he looked at me like I was crazy, this has to be what these guys secretly believe....but then again I have not put much research into the masons, I read a bunch of their philosophy online, but its hard to filter out all the conspiracy stuff from the actual mason stuff.


Spirituality can get into some strange places, but I  like to hear everybodys ideas on it, as far as taking these peoples words, I take it with a grain of salt, its a discussion on interesting ways to see the world that perhaps you may have not considered, but I only believe what I have experianced first hand, I try to find wisdom in all that I can, but I never seek beliefe in the words of others.

Anybody who claims to have the answers should be veiwed as highly suspect.

I believe like Thomas the doubter you must put your hand in the wound of Christ before you will believe , it must be proven to you by the spiritual forces themselves (this is a metaphor, I'm not "preaching" Christianity...I better post the lecture from which this reference was derived to prevent confusion:

Real mysteries, you don't have to believe. You don't have to have been initiated. You don't haveto haveyour aura cleared, or your mantras in order. Real mysteries operate and you get to touch.

My favorite story in the Gospel is the story of Thomas the Doubter because, remember, he wasn't present when Christ came to the upper room the first time, after the Crucifixion. And so Thomas came a couple days later and the apostles said to him, "the master was here, he was here," and he said, 'you guys have been smoking too many of these little brown cigarettes from Lebanon, we saw him crucified!" Well, so then Christ came a second time and Thomas was present and he said, "unless I put my hand into the wound, I will not believe it." So Christ said to Thomas, "come forward, put your hand into my wound," and he did.

Now my interpretation for that Gospel story is that ALONE, of all the apostles, it was Thomas the Doubter who touchedthe resurrection body because he was the only one who had his shit  together enough to DOUBT! And so if you doubt, they will actually let you put your hand in the wound; if you don't doubt, they will give you any kind of cr@p and send you happily on your way.

Doubting doesn't get rid of the real stuff, becuase the real stuff is REAL. You need a crap detector to get you past all the phony baloney because you know people have been working miracles in the marketplace for millennia - that's just part of what does on in the marketplace - shell games, levitation, rope tricks, regurgitation of objects, it's just ho-hum.-Terence mckenna*
---------
I had an experiance on DMT that was equivalent to standing with my hand in the wound of Christ, and all it confirms is that conscious being continues after death, that lack of a physical body in now way is an impediment to conscious being and since death is the only thing we know will happen, understanding and preparing for it has become a fascination for me.

What happened to me on DMT was equivalent to reaching the bardo in Tibetan buddhism. The only difference between DMT and actual death is that with DMT your returned to your body before you can transcend the bardo, so what happens after the bardo? Do you reincarnate? Do you enter another state of existance in which you must spend a designated ammount of time before you "die" again and move on to some other conscious state? Do you enter eternal bliss or suffering based on your karma as the Christians believe?....
Who knows...because with DMT you only reach the bardo, but reaching the bardo was conformation of conscious being after death... **bardo definition


Ive looked into just about every philosophy out there, (of coarse if there's some thing out there I have not heard yet nothing would enjoy me mord than to spend an afternoon researching it)



** (in Tibetan Buddhism) a state of existence between death and rebirth, varying in length according to a person's conduct in life and manner of, or age at, death- google)

E. borodin


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InvisibleRahz
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Re: the secret gate to the garden of eden [Re: Coincidentiaoppositorum]
    #22235839 - 09/14/15 09:58 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Another difference between DMT and actual death is the death part...


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: the secret gate to the garden of eden [Re: Rahz]
    #22235923 - 09/14/15 10:23 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Now you are just getting technical.

:doggull:


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OfflineCoincidentiaoppositorum
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Re: the secret gate to the garden of eden [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #22238222 - 09/14/15 07:21 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Which is actually what I said, it allows you to experiance death without having to die.

-E. Borodin


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InvisibleRahz
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Re: the secret gate to the garden of eden [Re: Coincidentiaoppositorum]
    #22238336 - 09/14/15 07:52 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

My guess is that being dead and being "half dead" are very different circumstances.


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


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OfflineCoincidentiaoppositorum
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Re: the secret gate to the garden of eden [Re: Rahz]
    #22238544 - 09/14/15 08:37 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Rahz said:
My guess is that being dead and being "half dead" are very different circumstances.




The only difference is at death you transcend the bardo and are unable to ever return to your body....the first time I smoked DMT knowing this made no difference, I was dead and unsure if I would ever make it back....

There's a good deal of speculation in this post, so I'm sure you'll have fun with this, though I'm aware how much of this post is entirley subjective, so that may not need to be pointed out...

Death can happen in a fraction of a second, and *snap* just like that your your in the bardo, its just you and the other, your life and this world seem like a distant and hard to recall dream, you think "oh fuck! This is serious! I'm dead" and in comming to terms with this if your not prepared can be traumatizing....

A DMT User who has fully grasped the implications of the experiance should no longer be questioning if there is conscious existence after the body dies, and with this experiance and realization all the fear, and anxiety, and uncertainty about death should melt away...

At birth you are transported from one mode of being to another, just as you are at death, a death and a birth may be the same event, you probably leave the bardo to reincarnate, your probably reborn after only being in the bardo for a short time, unless you have attained enlightenment and are free from samsara....the the bodhisattva vow requires you re-enter samsara to help others, but maybe the bardo is Nirvana, and just realizing the bardo is Nirvana keeps you from going into a panic and jumping into another incarnation...

I think that at death your physical body is no longer able to support your conscious being and the two seperate, I also believe that you can seperate the two in an identicle manner without killing the body.

When your body dies a signal goes out telling all your other organs "ok, its time to die" and the otherwise healthy organs die as well, some speculate that DMT plays a role in this process, and claim that when you smoke DMT you are mimicking the chemistry of death, only without the other signalling mechanism which actually kill you.


In Quechua "aya" means "dead" or "ghost" and "huasca" means "vine", even the natives reconized that when you take ayahuasca it induces a conscious state identicle to.actual death...

When you read the Tibetan book of the dead, it reads like a guide for DMT use....could it be that death and DMT are identicle as far as conscious experiance goes?

Dr. Rick strassman says yes, and "DMT: the spirit molecule" is a basic exploration of being able to induce states of death or mystical experiance ...


..but none of this is where I formed my views on DMT and death from, when I smoked DMT I experianced death, I knew it was death, I didn't have to think "is this death?" I KNEW, and I knew that I had been there many times before, I was overwhelmed, but I still knew EXACTLY what was going on....

I personally experianced full seperation of my conscious being from my physical body and entered the bardo.

I'm not in a hurry to convince anybody else of this, I would not believe anybody else and I don't expect you to believe me, but as far as I'm concerned this os what's going on here..

.and when you tell a shaman "my God I was dead! And there were beings there!" He will laugh and say "OF COARSE you died, and those are the ancestors"....if you can grasp the implications of this you can quickly figure out that he basically told you that these are dead people, and that yes, this stuff allows you to pass through the door through which the dead pass daily.

Its so easy for a person to say "nonsense, when I do DMT its not like that" yet every time I have given a person 150-200mgs DMT in a single hit, they come back more shaken up than I have ever seen them and they can no longer laugh at the notion that yes, this is in fact a door way to death. Its only in conversation where the option of proof is not available that I hear protest to this idea...

But again, I'm not here to convince you of anything, its completley cool if you don't believe me.

-E. Borodin


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InvisibleRahz
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Re: the secret gate to the garden of eden [Re: Coincidentiaoppositorum]
    #22238597 - 09/14/15 08:51 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

I suspect you and the shaman are having living experience you attribute to death. The brain isn't a singular process so unusual variations in throughput could seem other worldly. I think a more traditional usage of bardo would be a state of existence in which a person's personal evolution is at a standstill due to karmic reasons. No physical death required. The concept of a trans-migratory soul is a misinterpretation of the types of little deaths that occur in the context of a single lifetime, and why the state of bardo might be associated with being dead, perhaps experienced most intensely when other faculties are in distress.

The civil disagreement is appreciated :smile:


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


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OfflineCoincidentiaoppositorum
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Re: the secret gate to the garden of eden [Re: Rahz]
    #22240345 - 09/15/15 09:09 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Rahz said:
I suspect you and the shaman are having living experience you attribute to death. The brain isn't a singular process so unusual variations in throughput could seem other worldly. I think a more traditional usage of bardo would be a state of existence in which a person's personal evolution is at a standstill due to karmic reasons. No physical death required. The concept of a trans-migratory soul is a misinterpretation of the types of little deaths that occur in the context of a single lifetime, and why the state of bardo might be associated with being dead, perhaps experienced most intensely when other faculties are in distress.

The civil disagreement is appreciated :smile:





And that makes sense, and the psychedelic experiance has that incorporated into it, I don't experiance death every time I take a psychedelic, but that is an option and does happen, ive only experianced death from psilocybin once, but it was mild, and I experianced it from DMT once, but it was the most intense thing I have ever gone through...other than that my psychedelia is fairly standard, loss of ego, visuals, psychological introspection, and so on...

Again its really not my place to convince you of anything, it was my experiance, and for another person to interpret your experiance is madness, but i know i interpreted it correctly, which is why I say that you must actually have the experiance, its fairly impossible to communicate whet happened to others...

It took weeks before I could actually say anything about that experiance, its still difficult, so its very easy for others to misinterpret the story I tell about it, the truth is that human language cant describe the experiance of death, and metaphores of Buddhism or other religious experiance can help, but don't do it justice.

Its actually better that you don't believe me, I think everybody will come to know death before it actually occurs....something this big and this bizzare couldn't just be waiting after life with out some part of it slithering across the barriers to inform you of its existance.

...that's just my take on it though, for me to tell you about your experiance or what can and cant happen in that experiance would be madness as well, so if you want to hear what I think ill talk all day, if you want to know truth for yourself you must experiance it yourself, which makes anything I can tell you about as valuable as a grain of salt, which is what you should take these ideas with until you have seen it for yourself.

You make excellent points though, and are obviously an intellegent person, I'm sure whether I'm right or wrong, you will get you answers through your own life experiance.

-E. Borodin


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Re: the secret gate to the garden of eden [Re: Coincidentiaoppositorum]
    #22241446 - 09/15/15 01:37 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

are obviously an intellegent person




*cough* intelligent *cough*


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InvisibleRahz
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Re: the secret gate to the garden of eden [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #22241874 - 09/15/15 03:39 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

I'll have you know I was in the top 90% of my class. :crankey:


--------------------
rahz

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"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


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OfflineCoincidentiaoppositorum
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Re: the secret gate to the garden of eden [Re: Rahz]
    #22242130 - 09/15/15 04:46 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

I went to a hippie school that did not have grades, they had couches in the classroom, you called the teachers by their first names and the students made the rules, we went on a lot of road trips, camping trips, I even had ultimate frisbey and skateboarding as classes instead of gym...before the open (alternitive) school I did terrible in school, almost never even went to class...I'm guessing I'm not all that smart, ive never had an IQ test or anything, I always tell people there's nothing complicated about anything I study, it just sounds that way because of the long chemical names and people not knowing procedural terms, you don't have to be smart to understand any of these things, you only have to be interested.



-E. Borodin


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Re: the secret gate to the garden of eden [Re: Coincidentiaoppositorum]
    #22242543 - 09/15/15 06:02 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Coincidentiaoppositorum said:
you don't have to be smart to understand any of these things, you only have to be interested.





An important point.  I agree.


--------------------
Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici


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