|
Some of these posts are very old and might contain outdated information. You may wish to search for newer posts instead.
|
Geinstein
Shroomery addict



Registered: 01/25/18
Posts: 1,784
Last seen: 2 years, 1 month
|
Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Brain Bulb]
#25699326 - 12/24/18 01:46 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Brain Bulb said:
Quote:
Geinstein said: Can someone point me to a tek?
What species?
Panaeolus cyanescens Jamaican and Hawaii
--------------------
Nothing breads nothing
|
rickyswamps
Bad Apple



Registered: 11/08/18
Posts: 1,192
|
|
Quote:
mary fairchild said:
Quote:
rickyswamps said: I'd love to get some experienced eyes on these agar plates. They are first transfers from spore germination plates. I've noticed that I'm getting 2-3 distance types of mycelium, do they all ok to use to inoculate grain?

Here are some close ups
 Numbers 2,3,6, and 9 are similar. Dense and fluffy

 4,5,7,8 are a lot different, whispy, but moving faster across agar
Any thoughts or experience with plates that look like these?
From the pics- pic 2 looks perfect, (esp. for 1st passage), pics 3 & 4 don't look right at all.
Mycelia normally should appear as strands radiating out from the center- it could just be that the pic is out of focus but that growth doesn't appear that way. I've seen that growth pattern before and I steer away from it. As far as more cottony vs more wispy, I wouldn't assume that the more cottony form is necessarily more likely to fruit well- if possible i'd take both forms downstream.
Thanks for input. I know cubes have some variation in mycelium ( rhizomorphic, tormotose). Have you found that in Pans? Wanting to learn what is what so I don't throw out anything good, and only use what has the best potential.
|
nube424


Registered: 12/03/17
Posts: 6,063
|
Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Geinstein]
#25699538 - 12/24/18 07:23 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
I have to say, this pan bisporus mycelium I have is beautiful. Very whispy, but very nice looking.
Edited by nube424 (12/24/18 08:13 AM)
|
J. Jack Flash
stranger than ever.

Registered: 11/20/13
Posts: 1,500
|
Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: rickyswamps]
#25699574 - 12/24/18 07:45 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
there's variation, and then there's different. pics two and three look like dryer lint. so uniform, it spreads out, but the stuff kinda points in every direction from every place. whereas you can see in pic one that the myc is radial, organized, and pointing straight out from the center.
just noticed, by 1,2 and 3 i mean of the individual plates. not counting the shot of many plates.
if you only keep what's best, you must by definition throw out some of what's merely good.
|
mary fairchild
Pantheist


Registered: 12/06/14
Posts: 777
|
Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: rickyswamps]
#25699994 - 12/24/18 10:23 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Quote:
rickyswamps said:
Quote:
mary fairchild said:
Quote:
rickyswamps said: I'd love to get some experienced eyes on these agar plates. They are first transfers from spore germination plates. I've noticed that I'm getting 2-3 distance types of mycelium, do they all ok to use to inoculate grain?

Here are some close ups
 Numbers 2,3,6, and 9 are similar. Dense and fluffy

 4,5,7,8 are a lot different, whispy, but moving faster across agar
Any thoughts or experience with plates that look like these?
From the pics- pic 2 looks perfect, (esp. for 1st passage), pics 3 & 4 don't look right at all.
Mycelia normally should appear as strands radiating out from the center- it could just be that the pic is out of focus but that growth doesn't appear that way. I've seen that growth pattern before and I steer away from it. As far as more cottony vs more wispy, I wouldn't assume that the more cottony form is necessarily more likely to fruit well- if possible i'd take both forms downstream.
Thanks for input. I know cubes have some variation in mycelium ( rhizomorphic, tormotose). Have you found that in Pans? Wanting to learn what is what so I don't throw out anything good, and only use what has the best potential.
Yes, you see variation in Pans as well but i've never seen true rhizomorphic form in Pans. For a while I tried to link growth form on agar to fruiting capability but I never really could. Also when I grew Aussies & Alabamas- it was from completely unselected mycelia, ie. multispore. So that's another way to try it.
|
nube424


Registered: 12/03/17
Posts: 6,063
|
|
I've actually been wondering about ms. I'm curious what the results would 've from doing a grow knocked up with an entire print.
I know this isn't the way, but I'm wondering if having so much genetic diversity would help with anything. I'll give it a try if I get prints and don't mind wasting one.
|
rickyswamps
Bad Apple



Registered: 11/08/18
Posts: 1,192
|
Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: nube424]
#25700250 - 12/24/18 12:34 PM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Great info here. So, I went back to see if it had anything to do with the variety of Pan Cyans that I transferred, and it did. Here is the back story to help understand. I bought 2 syringes from a sponsor, one Hawaiian and the other Jamaican. Both got put on agar for germination and transferred once. Here is a pic of all my Jamaican first transfers, looking pretty good, imo, from what you guys are saying.

Here are my Hawaiian transfers, which are all over the place.

So I grabbed the original Hawaiian germination plates, and definitely can see why, now that they are over grown. One has the war of the worlds going on and the other stalled out. My three others never even germinated.

I have pretty good success with agar and sterile techniques, so I don't think that is the issue. Everything else Ive done is pretty clean. Could this be just what happens with less that optimal or dirty spores, or could the Hawaiian variety really have this much going on?
Edited by rickyswamps (12/24/18 12:55 PM)
|
mary fairchild
Pantheist


Registered: 12/06/14
Posts: 777
|
Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: rickyswamps]
#25700674 - 12/24/18 04:17 PM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Christmas time grow- Pan cyan Brazoria,
  
Path: Agar selection->LC->sterile substrate->trays->GH.
Edited by mary fairchild (12/24/18 05:08 PM)
|
J. Jack Flash
stranger than ever.

Registered: 11/20/13
Posts: 1,500
|
|
jawdropping
|
Johnny Dont
500 Don'ts of Knife Safety


Registered: 04/24/14
Posts: 1,830
|
|
Quote:
mary fairchild said: Christmas time grow- Pan cyan Brazoria,
  
Amazing!!! What is your secret??? Plz tell me your taking prints of these.
-------------------- I have left life and loves behind me, to be blown about as the sea desires, to have the freedom of the open air, and to be witness to the making of the world.
|
mary fairchild
Pantheist


Registered: 12/06/14
Posts: 777
|
Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Johnny Dont] 1
#25700737 - 12/24/18 05:07 PM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
No secret, its not exactly the easiest way to do a grow but it works for Pans. I wouldn't suggest doing it this way if you just want to dabble in Pans but if you want to focus on them there are some pretty detailed protocols in signature below.
I'm setting up to make prints as I type this.
|
Its All Energy
Stranger

Registered: 02/20/18
Posts: 118
|
|
Quote:
mary fairchild said: Christmas time grow- Pan cyan Brazoria,
  
Path: Agar selection->LC->sterile substrate->trays->GH.
Holy fuck, Mary. I hope one day I can get grows like that. Makes me think I should start using bags and liquid cultures/innoculant. Do you reuse spore syringes for LCs, or do you use fresh, unused ones? Are they the standard gauge needle?
Also, is your humidity controller used as you bought it? I heard from a youtuber (I think Myer's Mushrooms) that they require a separate sensor attachment that connects to the end of the controller, otherwise the controller's end will wear out. Even the sensor will wear out eventually according to him. Anyway, I hope you don't mind me reposting your detailed setup when you showed me, as I know a lot of people are interested.
Quote:
mary fairchild said: Nothing special about my GH, its just one of those indoor orchid growing mini greenhouses. Not as dialed in as i'd like and relatively low tek compared to most of them. Here's a pic of the bottom part of it:
 So on the bottom left is a Sunbeam wicking humidifier- got it at Walmart that is on all the time- it blows humid air (~85%RH) from below thru the GH. On the right is an ultrasonic I got from Amazon that ups the humidity to ~99%. The US is slaved to a humidity controller (Inkbird brand). So theres constant air flow from the wicking humidifier and high humidity from the ultrasonic. Temperature is mostly controlled from a couple of seedling heat mats. Its all in a closet. Air from below is probably not the best way to go & I mean to make changes at some point but its worked ok for me anyway. Blue Helix has the best setup and is the best source for info- he's got things dialed in better than anyone else.
Bisporus is different from say, cyans- Leave the PF tek jars for ~25 days after they reach 100% colonization, then case em and go to fruiting. I think Bis may be tertiary decomposers (normally live on a depleted substrate)- they may need more time to eat that relatively rich substrate to give a better yield. The times I got nauseated was when I waited too long to harvest the shrooms- I had the same thing happen to me with bis not sure but if it was the bis itself of if I let them start to rot before I harvested.
And you say nothing special with grows like that...
|
mary fairchild
Pantheist


Registered: 12/06/14
Posts: 777
|
Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Its All Energy] 1
#25701343 - 12/25/18 12:05 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Hi IAE, Nowadays I dont trust vendor spore syringes much. Seems like the quality of spore syringes used to be better. They're either contaminated or the spores are no longer viable. I won't say i'll never inoculate a LC with a vendor spore syringe- sometimes I'll take the risk. I usually inoculate a LC either with a small agar wedge or a swab directly from a print. Under aseptic conditions just unscrew the lid and inoculate. I have never used a self healing injection port (SHIP) to inoculate a LC; I only use the SHIP when drawing from the LC and a 14g needle. 16g (the standard) is too narrow- clogs too easily for this purpose.
Regarding the humidity controller- no doubt what he says is true, that said I use the controller as it is. I'm on my 2nd controller right now. My whole GH setup has its limitations, at some point if I stay interested enough I will scale it up.
BTW- I was just looking over the info on Bisporus- "Leave the PF tek jars for ~25days after they reach 100% colonization". IDK why I said that? Meant to say leave PF tek jars for a TOTAL of 25 to 30 days after INOCULATION.
Edited by mary fairchild (12/25/18 12:37 AM)
|
Its All Energy
Stranger

Registered: 02/20/18
Posts: 118
|
|
Quote:
mary fairchild said: Hi IAE, Nowadays I dont trust vendor spore syringes much. Seems like the quality of spore syringes used to be better. They're either contaminated or the spores are no longer viable. I won't say i'll never inoculate a LC with a vendor spore syringe- sometimes I'll take the risk. I usually inoculate a LC either with a small agar wedge or a swab directly from a print. Under aseptic conditions just unscrew the lid and inoculate. I have never used a self healing injection port (SHIP) to inoculate a LC; I only use the SHIP when drawing from the LC and a 14g needle. 16g (the standard) is too narrow- clogs too easily for this purpose.
Regarding the humidity controller- no doubt what he says is true, that said I use the controller as it is. I'm on my 2nd controller right now. My whole GH setup has its limitations, at some point if I stay interested enough I will scale it up.
BTW- I was just looking over the info on Bisporus- "Leave the PF tek jars for ~25days after they reach 100% colonization". IDK why I said that? Meant to say leave PF tek jars for a TOTAL of 25 to 30 days after INOCULATION.
Yeah, I had all 4 Panaeolus syringes I ordered be unusable for, uh, microscopy. Oddly enough, 2 Cubensis and 2 Sclerotia syringes from the same vendor were quite viable and satisfactory. After that it's prints and agar testing/transferring or bust for me.
Why do you say "if" you stay interested? If it's the nausea, I recently discovered chugging water until I'm bloated makes puking sooo much easier. No need to use fingers either, it just sort of comes out when you assume the position. It's a VERY thorough purge and with that method I've never felt more cleansed and pure. Last night I had to chug 5 liters to puke multiple times because I stupidly decided to dose with a huge, throat burning amount of citric acid, but the first time I did it I only had to chug about 1L. Both times were very cleansing and thorough. Give it a shot the next time you trip as soon as the nausea becomes unbearable.
Edit: If you're not puking, you didn't chug enough
Edited by Its All Energy (12/25/18 01:52 AM)
|
nube424


Registered: 12/03/17
Posts: 6,063
|
|
I thought pans caused less nausea than cubes?..
|
Its All Energy
Stranger

Registered: 02/20/18
Posts: 118
|
Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: nube424]
#25701448 - 12/25/18 01:45 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Quote:
nube424 said: I thought pans caused less nausea than cubes?..
That's what I used to think but maybe my body chemistry changed. Or it could be because I tend to dose pretty hard nowadays. It used to just come out relatively easily on it's own, but the past few months it'd been so fucking hard to puke until I discovered chugging water until I'm bloated makes puking easy and thorough. I would often fail to puke after much painful effort, admit my defeat, and just resign myself to riding it out and enduring horrible pain for a few hours. I'd looked into mustard powder, ipecac, boofing, home rigged stomach pumps, and huffing a used toilet or trashcan with rancid meat, but all I ever needed to do was chug water. It's so mind blowingly amazing, simple, and best of all, safe end thoroughly effective.
|
Hobbyist
Citizen


Registered: 08/15/10
Posts: 805
|
Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Its All Energy] 1
#25701673 - 12/25/18 07:18 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Its All Energy said:
Quote:
mary fairchild said: Hi IAE, Nowadays I dont trust vendor spore syringes much. Seems like the quality of spore syringes used to be better. They're either contaminated or the spores are no longer viable. I won't say i'll never inoculate a LC with a vendor spore syringe- sometimes I'll take the risk. I usually inoculate a LC either with a small agar wedge or a swab directly from a print. Under aseptic conditions just unscrew the lid and inoculate. I have never used a self healing injection port (SHIP) to inoculate a LC; I only use the SHIP when drawing from the LC and a 14g needle. 16g (the standard) is too narrow- clogs too easily for this purpose.
Regarding the humidity controller- no doubt what he says is true, that said I use the controller as it is. I'm on my 2nd controller right now. My whole GH setup has its limitations, at some point if I stay interested enough I will scale it up.
BTW- I was just looking over the info on Bisporus- "Leave the PF tek jars for ~25days after they reach 100% colonization". IDK why I said that? Meant to say leave PF tek jars for a TOTAL of 25 to 30 days after INOCULATION.
Yeah, I had all 4 Panaeolus syringes I ordered be unusable for, uh, microscopy. Oddly enough, 2 Cubensis and 2 Sclerotia syringes from the same vendor were quite viable and satisfactory. After that it's prints and agar testing/transferring or bust for me.
Why do you say "if" you stay interested? If it's the nausea, I recently discovered chugging water until I'm bloated makes puking sooo much easier. No need to use fingers either, it just sort of comes out when you assume the position. It's a VERY thorough purge and with that method I've never felt more cleansed and pure. Last night I had to chug 5 liters to puke multiple times because I stupidly decided to dose with a huge, throat burning amount of citric acid, but the first time I did it I only had to chug about 1L. Both times were very cleansing and thorough. Give it a shot the next time you trip as soon as the nausea becomes unbearable.
Edit: If you're not puking, you didn't chug enough
Quote:
Its All Energy said:
Quote:
nube424 said: I thought pans caused less nausea than cubes?..
That's what I used to think but maybe my body chemistry changed. Or it could be because I tend to dose pretty hard nowadays. It used to just come out relatively easily on it's own, but the past few months it'd been so fucking hard to puke until I discovered chugging water until I'm bloated makes puking easy and thorough. I would often fail to puke after much painful effort, admit my defeat, and just resign myself to riding it out and enduring horrible pain for a few hours. I'd looked into mustard powder, ipecac, boofing, home rigged stomach pumps, and huffing a used toilet or trashcan with rancid meat, but all I ever needed to do was chug water. It's so mind blowingly amazing, simple, and best of all, safe end thoroughly effective.
Please be aware, you can die from drinking too much water. 5 liters of water at once is way too much water. If you are sure you're gonna puke it up, it's probably alright, but can you be certain you're making a fair assessment of the risk when you're tripping?
Too much water can upset the balance of electrolytes in your body and cause death.
I'm not trying to be rude and this may be a good solution for some, but for harm reduction I think the potential dangers of this need to be pointed out.
-------------------- Everything i say is completely hypothetical...
|
Its All Energy
Stranger

Registered: 02/20/18
Posts: 118
|
Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Hobbyist]
#25701716 - 12/25/18 07:42 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Please be aware, you can die from drinking too much water. 5 liters of water at once is way too much water. If you are sure you're gonna puke it up, it's probably alright, but can you be certain you're making a fair assessment of the risk when you're tripping?
Too much water can upset the balance of electrolytes in your body and cause death.
I'm not trying to be rude and this may be a good solution for some, but for harm reduction I think the potential dangers of this need to be pointed out.
It was definitely not at once. I chugged and puked about 4X. Maybe 12-20 gulps between each puke, about .5-.75 liters each time. My internal balance was already very fucked up due to ingesting so much citric acid that I think I was puking up stomach lining. The previous trip I did this to puke, I only needed about a liter or so since I didn't take so much citric acid.
The body can only hold so much water, for me well under a liter at the most before I'm completely full. It's just that I needed to puke so much and multiple times from all the citric acid. I definitely needed to. My throat is still sore from being acid burned from trying to puke the concentrated citric acid solution before I started chugging water.
|
shroomms
Mr. Shrooms
Registered: 07/27/14
Posts: 202
Last seen: 1 month, 6 days
|
Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread *DELETED* [Re: Its All Energy]
#25701936 - 12/25/18 10:19 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Post deleted by shroomms
Reason for deletion: I wanted to! Thank-You!
|
Nimph
Im Unclecaptainblue!!!!

Registered: 08/12/18
Posts: 1,605
Loc: The dirty
|
Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: shroomms]
#25702224 - 12/25/18 02:36 PM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Put it as close to your sub surface as you can. I find feel to better cause you cant unlearn easy like forgetting.
Thats what i love about horsie poo it still looks like straw lol.
--------------------
  Hunters save your exotic prints to trade! https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/25617539
|
|