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OfflineBlue Helix
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: mullugh] * 4
    #25543417 - 10/16/18 11:19 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Ok, now THIS is what I was after for the overlay-crazed Pan Cyans Jamaicans floating around!  That is, this is a lot closer to what I'd call a normal run for me - not the best ever by any means but good.  This is the first flush, and I have no doubt the second will be good too.



So what did it and helped these not overlay like the other attempts?  Well, I think with an overlay-tending Pan Cyan strain like this--something I was not aware even existed until these--you sort of have to make sure that the original substrate is very well colonized before you lay the trays.  You don't want any signaling that it's time to chomp down on casing material. 

1) Let the bags colonize for a full week after you normally would for this Ryche Jam strain.

2) Lay the substrate in the trays and casing VERY evenly (get the rolling pin out if you have to) and compress a little.  I tried two substrate depths but think I liked the 1.75" the substrate depth pin sets better than the 1.25" ones.  On the other hand, if you are doing just one flush, you probably would get better yields off the thinner substrate with more surface area.  I didn't notice any reduction in fruiting size with the thinner substrate, so I think it's thick enough.

3) Now since overlay is really all about the casing, here's how I managed to get this one to not overlay: the casing was 50/50 pH-balanced to 7.8 with a tiny bit of calcium hydroxide (aka "pickling" lime) and mostly agricultural lime (aks oyster shell flour or powdered calcium carbonate).  I added maybe 10% per volume aragonite chips like you get in a pet store for tank gravel or marine tanks (make sure it's crushed coral).  I went with about 1/3" to 1/2" depth on the casing, again making sure it's light and very even.  With this strain at 78F, you have 4 to maybe almost 5 days of growth from the time you put on the casing until growth suddenly halts and pinning begins within 48 hours, so plan the casing depth accordingly.  The reason you want that much casing is that this strain can and easily does overlay when it reaches the surface whereas none of the others I'd worked with do (and usually, except this strain, you want the casing to colonize throughout, including on the surface).

The rest of the grow was typical.  I incubate at 78F with nearly fog-like conditions--including some fogging periods overnight to water the casing--until the pins are maybe 1/4" or so then cut back to 95% to 97% RH for the fruit out. 

PS - As an aside--and I doubt this has anything to do with this success--I went ahead and bought dimmable 5k (full-spectrum) LED tubes with a dimmer.  3 tubes each $12 and the $20 dimmer was kind of extravagant to be honest, but I figure they'll last for life, are water resistant, give off a very beautiful 5K a great full-spectrum of light (87 CRI no less - incredibly accurate color!), run cool, are fully dimmable to very low levels, and make for very well-lit and balanced picture taking.  It might seem like a lot to spend on light when mushrooms don't even need much light, but in 15 or 20 years I doubt most of you would miss the cash and really enjoy the light still.  Plus, since I grow many edibles too, I like having this full spectrum light as some care more about light than these do.


Edited by Blue Helix (10/17/18 04:49 AM)


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OfflineV.L
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Blue Helix]
    #25543496 - 10/17/18 12:30 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Really impressive!!!


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OfflineGhostveil25
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: V.L]
    #25543643 - 10/17/18 02:59 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Well, ive been having trouble with my Pan Bisporus. None of my trays will pin but two out of 15 trays. Well, the first little pan popped up and i figured id try a clone just for the hell of it. It seems to have worked!! I did 3 petris of clone from this Pan and 2 contaminated.

The other germinated and appears to be on its way. It is spreading out very, very fsst. What do yall think?
Thanks, Ghost


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InvisibleIts All Energy
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Blue Helix]
    #25544477 - 10/17/18 12:00 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Blue Helix said:not the best ever by any means but good.





This is the best Pan grow I've ever seen period. The sheer coverage, scale, and robustness of the fruits is insane. Even the commercial Pan grows in Amsterdam(?) look like dogshit compared to this. How could this even be better? Maybe an even thicker sub?

Could you give more details on how you control temp, air flow, and humidity? I have a humidity controller but never used it because I got lazy and discouraged at the fact that you have to replace the sensor every couple months supposedly. Plus, I grow in my bedroom so excess humidity makes me wheezy. The best I can do right now is a modified PMP style 90qt tote with a 10 gallon air pump submerged.


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InvisibleNimph
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Blue Helix]
    #25544781 - 10/17/18 01:52 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Can we see some healthy plates for reference?


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Offlinespace_shrooms

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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Nimph]
    #25544938 - 10/17/18 02:54 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

:dealwithwhat:


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OfflineAsuraS
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: space_shrooms]
    #25545383 - 10/17/18 06:22 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

The master has returned!

:vibin:


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OfflineAusMush
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Asura]
    #25545385 - 10/17/18 06:24 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)



Relatively healthy pan cyan mycelium (minus the contams on the right hand side :mad2:)


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Offline99.99
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Blue Helix]
    #25545444 - 10/17/18 06:44 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Blue helix may we please have a photo of the sub right before you case it so we can all see what it should look like without the fruits and the casing


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Invisibled0urd3n
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Asura]
    #25545593 - 10/17/18 07:46 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Asura said:
The master has returned!

:vibin:




:awepreciation:


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OfflineBlue Helix
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: 99.99]
    #25545734 - 10/17/18 09:00 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

I did not get a picture of those casings, but I can show you about what it looked like below.  As I was describing, a little growth in patches on the top will happen with this one.


About how the casing of these Jamacians looked:



For comparison this is a more typical pan cyan casing that doesn't have the ability to overlay (the mycellium is just too whispy):



My advice is to pay attention to details when you lay the substrate and casing, which for me means no mary jane, for example.  You want the substrate lightly compressed and as flat as possible.  Like I said, I got out a rolling pin.  As for the casing you want it light and airy and also even, but do not compress the casing with a rolling pin (you'll ruin the tray if you do that).


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OfflineWing
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Blue Helix]
    #25545848 - 10/17/18 10:10 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Blue Helix said:






:emotionalmoment:


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My Old Grow Logs



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OfflineRomeoPapa
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Wing]
    #25545864 - 10/17/18 10:22 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Wing said:
Quote:

Blue Helix said:






:emotionalmoment:




Damn Son! Well done! Beautiful...:kaneclap:


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OfflineGhostveil25
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Blue Helix]
    #25546153 - 10/18/18 03:01 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Judging by your substrate ive been doing this terribly wrong. No wonder its not working. First off, my sub trays are way too small. Im not putting enough horse manure to my trays. In other words, it looks like a bunch of bird seeds that basically falls apart with any movement.

Im going deeper with my sub and bigger. 3 inch sub in larger containers placed in my enormous sgfc.


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OfflineBlue Helix
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Ghostveil25]
    #25547201 - 10/18/18 11:45 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Ghostveil25 said:
Judging by your substrate ive been doing this terribly wrong. No wonder its not working. First off, my sub trays are way too small. Im not putting enough horse manure to my trays. In other words, it looks like a bunch of bird seeds that basically falls apart with any movement.

Im going deeper with my sub and bigger. 3 inch sub in larger containers placed in my enormous sgfc.




3 inches?  No, that is too deep.  You want about 1.75" or maybe 2".  If you go 3" it won't help.  It might even make it not fruit.  These are petite mushrooms (most of those were less than 2" tall), so they need a petite substrate and fairly thin casing.  Using only birdseed isn't a very good idea either.  I'm not even sure birdseed helps, but I do use it.  But look how little I use!  Here was the formula for that substrate:

1) Dried horse manure      80 oz
2) WBS                      45 oz
3) water                  205 oz  (~1.48 gallon)
4) vermiculite              3 L
Note: should be 65% water per weight

I've used half that amount of WBS too and it worked just as well.  Like I said, don't go overboard on the birdseed.  It doesn't hold enough moisture alone to fruit these well and these are dung-lovers, not birdseed-loving.  You can easily do a test to see if you got the water right with a microwave.  Measure out 20g and microwave it until it dries completely out but before it carbonizes (or starts smoking).  Then reweigh.  It should be 7g if you got 65% water.


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OfflineElViajero
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Blue Helix]
    #25547567 - 10/18/18 02:08 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

:takingnotes:

Amazing stuf... thanks for the tips man


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OfflineGhostveil25
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Blue Helix]
    #25547957 - 10/18/18 04:54 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Thanks man, yeah 2 inches sounds better and more surface area. I dont think my depth is off as much as my surface area. Thr small trays make it hard to figure ratios and ive been ending up with shit.

These next jars are going to he treated exactly like all of my very successful Cubensis grows. Only a couple changes as far as depth and sub. Ill use a 2 inch sub of horse manure and maybe coir or verm.

Ill put that to a lined monotub and use the entire surface to spawn to. This way i can use a 2 to 1 sub/spawn ratio. Tyvek the holes and wait for colonization. Then case and put back to tyvek for a few days. Then light, polyfil and patience. May even wait for pins like i do with cubes before i fruit them.


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InvisibleIts All Energy
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Ghostveil25]
    #25548854 - 10/18/18 11:08 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Anyone here think Bisporus gives significantly more horrific nausea than Cyanescens? I've always been able to puke out Cyanescens when I took them and be able to fully enjoy the trip, but I'm new to Bisporus and both times I took them I got horrific nausea and couldn't vomit no matter what, ie sticking my fingers down my throat and putting my face in the spit and piss of my puke tote. All I could do was ride it out. Even when I took a mix of Cyans and Bis, I could puke some, but not enough and the nausea was just so bad, probably the worst I've ever gotten from mushrooms, on par with super high dose Cubensis (28-45g dry in tea).

I plan to make tea and get some ipecacuanha just in case, but I'm still scared. It kinda sucks too because I'm out of Cyan spawn but have a lot of Bisporus spawn. I might just toss them if I can't puke the next trip with ipecachuana, which I want to avoid anyway since it can be dangerous and even fatal. They have excellent potency and are every bit as profound and "next level" as Cyans, but the nausea is really something else. It's quite a shame because so far they're fruiting extremely well, maybe a bit better than my Jamaican Cyans.


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OfflineGhostveil25
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Its All Energy]
    #25549053 - 10/19/18 02:02 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Thats odd that it happened twice. When i get up enough for a dose ill see if they make me sick. Maybe its why Bisporus isnt very popular. It would be nice if anyone who has taken Bisporus to chime in.

Also, Dramamine is a miracle when it comes to nausea. Perhaps next time you can eat a couple Dramamine and you can enjoy your trip. How many grams are you taking and what method? Im very curious to know if its the Bisporus. So, in the name of scienxe i will take them and see what happens. Got a couple 100ug hits of acid i was gonna drop this weekend, but ill take the Bisporus instead. Ill have around .8 grams by Saturday


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InvisibleIts All Energy
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Ghostveil25]
    #25549116 - 10/19/18 03:16 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

If it makes you less nervous, I took about 10-11g dry worth of Cyans and Bis the first time. About 3.5g dry were Bis. Some of the dose was wet.

Took 35g wet of mostly Bisporus the second time, maybe 28g was Bis and the rest Cyans. Gonna try tea of only Bisporus and will report back. Both times were simple, very well blended smoothies with some citric acid and sugar added, all mushroom solids remained and consumed. I really doubt dramamine would help, I think the solids need to be purged once "They" "jump ship."

I think they're not popular simply because of availability and consumer awareness. Cyanescens are just the most popular Pan to grow and for vendors to stock in the largest quantities.


Edited by Its All Energy (10/19/18 03:22 AM)


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