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Baba Yaga
♥ coir grower

Registered: 09/13/20
Posts: 3,958
Loc: Hyperspace Chicken Coop
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: TechniQue1] 3
#28354880 - 06/10/23 08:12 PM (7 months, 15 days ago) |
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Quote:
TechniQue1 said: There are different teks. There's modified pf tek that includes manure. I think most of what I've seen on here includes manure at some point in the grow. Whether it be in spawn or manure in the bulk substrate, it's there somewhere. I think primarily, it comes down to genetics and conditions. Im not 100 percent sure poo is necessary. I definitely plan to experiment once I nail down a few grows and see what's possible. I'll keep you posted. Goodluck to you. I'm loving all of this.
Here are the only two photos of a 100% coir sub I have from about 2 years ago. Fruits in the first image are about 4" tall and were grown in a 8 quart mini mono. Fruits in the the second one are from the same 100% coir substrate but 2nd flush which grew after I chucked it on the compost pile.

I did a few more but something went wrong with some and I also deleted a few more photos than I should have it seems. Always wanted to do more coir only runs but got stuck in playing with fruiting conditions.
Will be nice to see some experimentation
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trippleblack
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Baba Yaga] 9
#28354951 - 06/10/23 09:20 PM (7 months, 15 days ago) |
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I been growing out at least 15 spore isolations over the past few months, of exotics. any tips on maxing out an even pinset with pan bisporus? bvi don't need as much airflow for a canopy, what about bisporus?
btw bisprous is so amazing, i have isolated a white bisporus, two toned bisporus, and dark cap bisporus.. once you start swabbing your favorite tone a few times, the tub will start to lean towards either of the three variations in color.
 
Edited by trippleblack (06/10/23 09:20 PM)
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Genome794
Spore-Whore-der & Agar-Addict


Registered: 07/20/22
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: trippleblack]
#28355352 - 06/11/23 09:13 AM (7 months, 15 days ago) |
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Whoa, Tripleblack.
They are SOooo pretty.
Thanks for showing the possibilities.
The members here have been generous - though I am far out, so their gifts haven't arrived yet. I am looking forward to growing Bisporus.
And BVI and whatever else Pan that arrives.
(still suffering from cube-eyes and cannot quite tell good Pan mycelium properly yet but getting better)
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TechniQue1
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Baba Yaga]
#28355368 - 06/11/23 09:32 AM (7 months, 15 days ago) |
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I knew I wasn't crazy and saw coir only grows. Should've known it was you...lol. I didn't wanna give out bad info until I found the post. Def wanna do some coir grows, provided I get this one right first. My cambos that are running right now just started to consolidate the top of the sub. My tub conditions for all of my projects seem to be perfectly dialed in. Fingers crossed. I was actually just looking up liberty cap spawn to see what I need to get those going. I have a few theories on growing them in tubs that I'm dying to try. Otherwise, I plan to put most in a bed outdoors. From my intro to mushrooms, I've tried to avoid being hung up on difficult grows and dive right in. Following directions of others and what works in this hobby is half the battle and gives you a great foundation to build on. So I've noticed.
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Adas
Lonely Dreamer



Registered: 12/22/16
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: trippleblack] 2
#28355523 - 06/11/23 11:47 AM (7 months, 15 days ago) |
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Quote:
AspectOfTheCreator said: I just made 4 more. Now got 4 pan cambo and 4 BVI. Hoping to be able to spawn them straight to coir/verm. Skip the need to pasteurize and treat them like cubes.
Crossing my fingers.
Keep us up to date on how it goes.
Is there any solid info on using grain/manure as spawn? Tried to look and couldnt find anything concrete. Someone in the thread here recommended I try it. Seems solid.
Adding manure to your spawn does wonders. Especially for Bisporus but I imagine others love it as well.
Quote:
trippleblack said: I been growing out at least 15 spore isolations over the past few months, of exotics. any tips on maxing out an even pinset with pan bisporus? bvi don't need as much airflow for a canopy, what about bisporus?
btw bisprous is so amazing, i have isolated a white bisporus, two toned bisporus, and dark cap bisporus.. once you start swabbing your favorite tone a few times, the tub will start to lean towards either of the three variations in color.
 

The Bisporus colors are due to different level of hydration. At least from all I've seen.
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pesa



Registered: 06/13/20
Posts: 599
Last seen: 10 hours, 15 seconds
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Genome794]
#28355526 - 06/11/23 11:49 AM (7 months, 15 days ago) |
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Quote:
Genome794 said: Whoa, Tripleblack.
(still suffering from cube-eyes and cannot quite tell good Pan mycelium properly yet but getting better)
i am coming from cubes too
i blame the cube mycelium it ruined us now we are looking for the same stuff in every other mushroom culture.
this moldy looking thing is mycelium and you will get use to it, just don't over think it

 and best part if you are not sure ask around
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pesa



Registered: 06/13/20
Posts: 599
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Adas]
#28355532 - 06/11/23 11:53 AM (7 months, 15 days ago) |
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cube get there nitrogen from grain hence they can grow in any kind of substrate.
but when it comes to pan dude regarding manure its for nitrogen? or there is more stuff in manure?
also have you try adding Urea 45:0:0(urea that contains 45% nitrogen per gram with 0 carbon and phosphorus)? the same thing is use in button mushroom cultivation they are compost nitrogen loving mushroom too.
Edited by pesa (06/11/23 11:53 AM)
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kirkeng
Stranger


Registered: 02/14/21
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: trippleblack] 1
#28355534 - 06/11/23 11:54 AM (7 months, 15 days ago) |
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Quote:
trippleblack said: I been growing out at least 15 spore isolations over the past few months, of exotics. any tips on maxing out an even pinset with pan bisporus? bvi don't need as much airflow for a canopy, what about bisporus?
btw bisprous is so amazing, i have isolated a white bisporus, two toned bisporus, and dark cap bisporus.. once you start swabbing your favorite tone a few times, the tub will start to lean towards either of the three variations in color.
 

Well done mate! I haven’t yet gotten my pinsets for bisporus quite where I want them, but I have succeeded a few times with good coverage albeit a bit off on evenness at times. Some things I have noticed that seem to help. Beyond culture I’ve found slightly drier surface conditions help, still wet but not overly wet, just glistening with good evaporation cycles. Airflow also seems to matter, all my best tubs have been located in spaces in my office that have the best airflow, eg not spots nestled within a bunch of tubs, rather spots that have more open space around them. Slowly adjusting those factors has greatly improved my success over time with them, though I do suspect culture plays a large role as well, at least adapting one over generations to your environment.
I dunno hope that helped and bear in mind I’m not an expert either this is just what I’ve noticed has been improving my pin sets over time, I’m still striving for that full packed tub, maybe someday.
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Adas
Lonely Dreamer



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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: pesa] 1
#28355546 - 06/11/23 12:03 PM (7 months, 15 days ago) |
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Quote:
pesa said: cube get there nitrogen from grain hence they can grow in any kind of substrate.
but when it comes to pan dude regarding manure its for nitrogen? or there is more stuff in manure?
also have you try adding Urea 45:0:0(urea that contains 45% nitrogen per gram with 0 carbon and phosphorus)? the same thing is use in button mushroom cultivation they are compost nitrogen loving mushroom too.
Pans get nitrogen from grain too. There's more to it. The texture and the cellulose/lignin content being major possible factors. It makes Bisporus myc look very dense compared to the mold-like look on pure grain. Plus it recovers way better after spawning to bulk, even after sitting fully colonized for quite a long time.
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trippleblack
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: pesa]
#28355616 - 06/11/23 12:55 PM (7 months, 15 days ago) |
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it didn't seem that way.
I got tubs of all white bisporus.. and tubs of all dark brown bisporus. those are two different color phenotypes; it took a few generations to reach that point..
Edited by trippleblack (06/11/23 12:58 PM)
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Adas
Lonely Dreamer



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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: trippleblack]
#28355622 - 06/11/23 12:58 PM (7 months, 15 days ago) |
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Are you sure the white bisporus isn't actually a Cyan?
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trippleblack
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Adas] 1
#28355631 - 06/11/23 01:08 PM (7 months, 15 days ago) |
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i'm not specifically talking about the pictures above.
one is bvi .. the one that look dry is all white bisporus, the humidifier ran out of water so those cap look a little dry. i have other tubs not picture of all dark brown bisporus caps upon maturity. i'm still chasing a complete tub of two toned.
i try to grab single spore isolates for these bisporus not ms. the white ones can start off a bit brown if immature, they then grow into white caps/ silvery caps: like this one:
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Adas
Lonely Dreamer



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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: trippleblack]
#28355650 - 06/11/23 01:24 PM (7 months, 15 days ago) |
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I'm still not convinced you have anything out of the ordinary But others may chime in. Regardless, those are awesome Bisporus grows in any case. Great work mate.
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pesa



Registered: 06/13/20
Posts: 599
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Adas] 1
#28355667 - 06/11/23 01:33 PM (7 months, 15 days ago) |
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Quote:
Adas said:
Quote:
pesa said: cube get there nitrogen from grain hence they can grow in any kind of substrate.
but when it comes to pan dude regarding manure its for nitrogen? or there is more stuff in manure?
also have you try adding Urea 45:0:0(urea that contains 45% nitrogen per gram with 0 carbon and phosphorus)? the same thing is use in button mushroom cultivation they are compost nitrogen loving mushroom too.
it
Pans get nitrogen from grain too. There's more to it. The texture and the cellulose/lignin content being major possible factors. It makes Bisporus myc look very dense compared to the mold-like look on pure grain. Plus it recovers way better after spawning to bulk, even after sitting fully colonized for quite a long time.
honestly i thought its moldy looking mycelium all the way now am i am more excited to put spawn to substrate and getting dense mycelium thanx for the input
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psilocybist
All is One



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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: pesa] 1
#28355726 - 06/11/23 02:47 PM (7 months, 15 days ago) |
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I've added urea to my agar, lc, grain water, and my sub mix. My pan plates, and grain jars all stalled, but it wasn't because urea. Horse and cow manure contain urea, and pan colonizes it without any problems. Also, cube myc grows normal and quite well on agar with urea added. (Agar, lme, urea, ab) Don't know why all my pan cultures stalled actually, with and without urea, and with different nutrient levels.
I used to add sub-percent urea to everything I made for cubes, it didn't make any problem for the myc/fruit bodies.
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pesa



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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: psilocybist]
#28355774 - 06/11/23 03:31 PM (7 months, 15 days ago) |
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thanx for sharing urea info. i was so worried about nitrogen since they thrive on it, and i was about to buy urea but after reading Adas, baba yaga and many other people in this thread i think its not a necessary manure+coir enough to be a good substrate, and like Adas said small amount of manure goes long way.
i am using PDA(potato dextrose agar using potato and not the flakes) for every thing gourmet cubes,pan didnt gave me any problem so far every thing germinated and mycelium grew healthy.
growing cubes stall culture and jars was always either bacteria or mold.
post pics let some TC or some one else look at it.
i was reading up on mushroom nitrogen cycle and almost all mushroom need nitrogen, but when it comes to button mushrooms the thing needs urea so i will have to buy it any way
Edited by pesa (06/11/23 03:33 PM)
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Stipe-n Cap


Registered: 08/04/12
Posts: 7,623
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: pesa] 3
#28355784 - 06/11/23 03:38 PM (7 months, 15 days ago) |
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Quote:
psilocybist said: Horse and cow manure contain urea
Not after field aging/composting. Don't add urea.
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YoshiTrainer
Onion tied to belt



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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: pesa] 6
#28355824 - 06/11/23 03:56 PM (7 months, 15 days ago) |
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I picked the bisporus from here:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28353183#28353183
They came out to 8g fresh, .5g dry. It was so tempting to just eat them, unfortunately I have to plan my spontaneity.
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trippleblack
Stranger

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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: kirkeng]
#28355854 - 06/11/23 04:24 PM (7 months, 15 days ago) |
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Quote:
kirkeng said:
Quote:
trippleblack said:
Well done mate! I haven’t yet gotten my pinsets for bisporus quite where I want them, but I have succeeded a few times with good coverage albeit a bit off on evenness at times. Some things I have noticed that seem to help. Beyond culture I’ve found slightly drier surface conditions help, still wet but not overly wet, just glistening with good evaporation cycles. Airflow also seems to matter, all my best tubs have been located in spaces in my office that have the best airflow, eg not spots nestled within a bunch of tubs, rather spots that have more open space around them. Slowly adjusting those factors has greatly improved my success over time with them, though I do suspect culture plays a large role as well, at least adapting one over generations to your environment.
I dunno hope that helped and bear in mind I’m not an expert either this is just what I’ve noticed has been improving my pin sets over time, I’m still striving for that full packed tub, maybe someday.
Thanks. I thought i noticed a nicer pinset when i let it dry out.. Next run i'll try to open up the vent holes a bit more so the airflow can increase, luckily my next run is pinning right now.
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Adas
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: YoshiTrainer] 1
#28356756 - 06/12/23 09:14 AM (7 months, 14 days ago) |
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Quote:
YoshiTrainer said: I picked the bisporus from here:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28353183#28353183
They came out to 8g fresh, .5g dry. It was so tempting to just eat them, unfortunately I have to plan my spontaneity.

Beauties! 0.5g for 2 mushrooms is very decent.
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